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The Dark Knight Rises (Batman 3) - No Riddler

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Linkzg said:
So how about that Batman?

Just to add to part of the several ongoings here:
-Darren Aronofsky is great. The Fountain and The Wrestler were both fantastic and Black Swan looks to be too. But Requiem For a Dream is garbage and made me doubt him enough to pass on The Fountain until after I watched The Wrestler. The jump from Requiem to The Fountain was no smaller than putting a man on the moon.
-Shutter Island was a pretty good movie
-Academy awards suck. Zodiac was robbed before it was able to get robbed.
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Seen Pi? Second to The Fountain to me (not see Black Swan yet of course).
 
Snowman Prophet of Doom said:
I calls 'em like I sees 'em, man. If I think that a film or an artist is bad, I will say it unapologetically. From watching his films, I have come to the conclusion that Spielberg is a director with a high technical sense but a low artistic/storytelling sense, save for the two films that I mentioned (Jaws and Raiders). If that's so offensively elitist to you and is one of my "exercises in film sophistry," then so be it, but considering the high praise that I have given to decidedly non-elitist fare (such as the effusive praise that I, in fact, just finished giving to T2 in the Avatar thread, or my love of Aliens, or my belief that Step Brothers is hilarious, or my love of Spider-Man 2, or my love of so many Pixar films, or my love of It's a Wonderful Life, etc.), I think you'd have a long way to go to convince me. It's not as though I don't back up my opinions with objective analysis, and it's not as though I'm pulling opinions out of my asshole; I get my beliefs by watching and analyzing films, the way that anybody else does. If you think that my opinions are wrong, say so, but this constant tactic of calling me an asshole/elitist/whatever is tiresome and a cheap deflection away from any actual argument.

Edit: Also, Memento, The Prestige, and Batman Begins are far and away the best Nolan movies, and of them, Memento is far and away his best and could probably contend itself as being a great movie. I actually sort of had a reverse-from-typical arc on that one; I walked away slightly unimpressed but have grown more fond of it as time has gone on, as I've come to appreciate, especially in the last few months, just how well it integrates its mechanisms into the story instead of leaving them bare bones and out in the open like, say, Inception.

Double Edit: Minority Report is pretty good as well, up until the third act, and Munich has its moments though it could probably stand a bit more subtlety overall.
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You know what? Fair enough. But I will be more inclined to ask you to explain yourself from now on. What exactly did you find unsubtle about Munich? Perhaps Spielberg's most mature and most restrained film.
 
I guess I might be the odd man out but I never felt like I was being spoon fed when watching Inception. I must not have that critical eye because I remember having one of the best experiences in a movie theater even though someone had spoiled the ending somewhat for me (I fucking want to kill this person till this day). To me it flowed perfectly and it felt like it was setting up for a big conclusion which it led to. I mean how else was it supposed to be done? I was never bored or thinking OMG THEY ARE EXPLAINING TOO MUCH SOMEONE HELP!
 
Discotheque said:
Shutter Island had one of the most offensive endings I've seen. He literally, fucking LITERALLY pointed to a blackboard and showed the audience exactly what was happening from the start..
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:lol I had forgotten about that. How can anyone argue SI had respect for the audience's intelligence is beyond me.

And yeah, Aronofsky FTMFW.
 
Puddles said:
It really blows my mind that anyone could watch Inception and not call it one of the top ten achievements in movie-making in the last eleven years, but I'm reading posts by multiple haters on this forum, and I know a few people in real life (who have friends!) who didn't like it. Granted they're a very small minority, but still. Utterly baffling.

Edit: Holy fuck, Shutter Island better than Inception, you guys are too much. :lol
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For one, what weird distinction to make. 11 years? Ok....

Two, I LOVED Inception and I have zero issues with you even thinking that it's the best film EVER made, but seriously, that's such fucking hyperbole that it blows your mind that others didn't like it as much as you. Boo hoo.

And then you edit and laugh at people for liking Shutter Island more than Inception? Ok...
 
Just this weekend we watched Batman Begins and TDK and I forgot how truly incredible the soundtrack is in TDK. Especially the scene with Dent at the end with Gordon's son. Good lord the chills that scene evokes.

None of you raving about Shutter Island actually read the book right?
 
I've got to say-- congrats to everyone-- despite the ridiculously varying degrees of opinions being tossed around, things haven't once gotten out of hand.

If this were a Zelda topic...
 
brandonh83 said:
I've got to say-- congrats to everyone-- despite the ridiculously varying degrees of opinions being tossed around, things haven't once gotten out of hand.

If this were a Zelda topic...
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Someone would probably be dead.
 
One of the things I most disliked about SI is the 'twist', I knew it about forty seconds into the film when he was on the boat and it flashed to the wrist restraints. It got less subtle from there, and then they have the arrogance to give it a big reveal as if they haven't made it blatantly clear throughout the film.
 
StuBurns said:
One of the things I must disliked about SI is the 'twist', I knew it about forty seconds into the film when he was on the boat and it flashed to the wrist restraints. It got less subtle from there, and then they have the arrogance to give it a big reveal as if they haven't made it blatantly clear throughout the film.
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Exactly. The more I think about that movie the more I remember how terrible it was. What really pisses me off is all the people that saw that shitty film without getting the chance to read the book instead.

brandonh83 said:
Best case scenario.
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:lol True
 
effzee said:
I guess I might be the odd man out but I never felt like I was being spoon fed when watching Inception. I must not have that critical eye because I remember having one of the best experiences in a movie theater even though someone had spoiled the ending somewhat for me (I fucking want to kill this person till this day). To me it flowed perfectly and it felt like it was setting up for a big conclusion which it led to. I mean how else was it supposed to be done? I was never bored or thinking OMG THEY ARE EXPLAINING TOO MUCH SOMEONE HELP!
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The more GAFfers discuss things, the bigger the problems blow up under the microscope. I just don't see this exposition problem as a big deal at all. It wasn't clunky, it wasn't contrived - it flowed smoothly and through the characters naturally. And the movie even opens with a big set piece that explains next to nothing, thrusting the concept right into the audience's face in a way that makes'em say "please tell me what the fuck just happened". It's exposition, of course, you can't call it otherwise, but I don't see anything wrong with well done exposition.
 
brandonh83 said:
I've got to say-- congrats to everyone-- despite the ridiculously varying degrees of opinions being tossed around, things haven't once gotten out of hand.

If this were a Zelda topic...
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Zelda fanboys are crazy! I know, I used to be one of them.

Also this being the Off Topic and all, it's supposedly more civilized over here.
 
BruceLeeRoy said:
Exactly. The more I think about that movie the more I remember how terrible it was. What really pisses me off is all the people that saw that shitty film without getting the chance to read the book instead.
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I was amongst them.
 
StuBurns said:
One of the things I must disliked about SI is the 'twist', I knew it about forty seconds into the film when he was on the boat and it flashed to the wrist restraints. It got less subtle from there, and then they have the arrogance to give it a big reveal as if they haven't made it blatantly clear throughout the film.
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Hm. I felt the film was mostly about explaining it and developing Leo's character. At least that's what I got from it. Yeah you have scenes that spell it out. But for me it's making all the connections and how the twist affects every other scene.

I've seen people claim that they guessed the twist in Silent Hill 2, but that game was about you, the player, gradually getting all the clues and pieces to the puzzle. It also had a few scenes where they practically tell you what's going on, like when Laura yells "you never loved Mary anyway!" Not to mention all the blatant symbolism going on like Pyramid Head raping mannequins, Maria, who not-so-coincidentally looks exactly like Mary and dies multiple times before his eyes, and so on.

But like Shutter Island, what I dig is the details and how the twist retroactively makes the entire story cooler and gives everything more depth and meaning. It's not so much the twist itself or how obvious they make it.
 
SpeedingUptoStop said:
The more GAFfers discuss things, the bigger the problems blow up under the microscope. I just don't see this exposition problem as a big deal at all. It wasn't clunky, it wasn't contrived - it flowed smoothly and through the characters naturally. And the movie even opens with a big set piece that explains next to nothing, thrusting the concept right into the audience's face in a way that makes'em say "please tell me what the fuck just happened". It's exposition, of course, you can't call it otherwise, but I don't see anything wrong with well done exposition.
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Yeah and I don't think intention was to keep the people in dark about the concept, the movie was more about Cobb and his obsession with the only "confusing" bit being how Nolan told the story with the end scene first and up in the air ending.

And I don't want to turn this into a big Inception debate but it irritates me so much that people seem to think just because a movie deals with dreams it has to resemble, mimic, or ape movies like Eternal Sunshine. Yeah other better directors might have done the movie more justice OR a different kind of justice but that was never Nolan's goal to begin with. Its not like he set out to make Eternal Sunshine and failed.
 
SpeedingUptoStop said:
no, good sir, Hendricks has SAVED THIS COMMUNITY!!!

LET'S FITE
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But could she save our community?

7UuV3.png
 
JayDubya said:
DKR had Joker and Superman as the chief antagonists, though. So... Yeah.
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:lol True, but I was thinking more along the lines of Batman being out of the spotlight for years, all of the TV interviews where people are fighting about whether he's a menace or a hero...that stuff...but...Yeah. :lol

But good to see you back. You been absent for a while!
 
I really don't understand the Shutter Island hate here. Then again I don't understand a lot things on gaf.

Anyway, our boy Bruce should sprint back to the crime ridden Narrows in DKR. I've actually sort of came round to the title, drop the "the" and it's kind of cool I guess ... when abbreviated.

And if this is indeed Nolan's last Batman, then Batman 4 should be an R rated movie based on Arkham Asylum called "Arkham" and directed by David Lynch.
Not really, it would be kind of cool though.
 
EliCash said:
And if this is indeed Nolan's last Batman, then Batman 4 should be an R rated movie based on Arkham Asylum called "Arkham" and directed by David Lynch.
Not really, it would be kind of cool though.
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In all seriousness, it would probably be a Superman/Batman teamup.
 
Willy105 said:
In all seriousness, it would probably be a Superman/Batman teamup.
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And Batman goes back to being ass. The cycle starts anew.

Can't wait for Nolan to return to the Batman franchise 30+ years now trying to salvage it from its FUBAR status, Ridley Scott-style.
 
My guess for this movies storyline would be a no man's land inspired storline. So that gotham is torn to pieces by a force of nature (Probably a hurricane like "Kathrina"), and chaos and anarchy breaks loose. That plus the whole recession thing. Would be an appropriate ending for the triology. And a logical development after he struggle with his own sanity in the first , and in the second more with society itself. Plus wasn't there something liam nesson said about how all great societies ultimatievly fall?
 
A film based on No Man's Land would be cool but impossible. What made that story so good though was almost all the characters/villains were present - and they had already long been established obviously. So far in Nolan's batman universe we have Scarecrow who is no longer threatening, a dead Two Face and a Joker that can't be used again.
 
jett said:
Shutter Island is hugely overrated around these parts. That is one movie I don't get the praise for, for me it's easily the worst Scorsese movie of the DiCaprio-age. Maybe I need to see it again, but I doubt my opinion will change.
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That award goes to Gangs of New York. That movie fucking sucked. It's Scorsese's own Crystal Skull.

Solo said:
You could? I just remember flashing disco lights, pumping bass and a bunch of messy cuts back and forth from Roberts to Batman doing...something.
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I must be the exception to the rule because I've never had any trouble following the action in Nolan's films.

brandonh83 said:
Yeah I mean forget about all the fantastically creepy sequences, mindblowing atmospherics, awesome throwback score, the incredibly thick dream sequences with that haunting music, and the list goes on. Fuck all of that-- you guessed the twist. Nothing else matters, even though the twist plays into virtually every scene in the film in some capacity. He's a smore.
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Okay, we could also talk about the hokey dialogue, the extremely noticeable CG and greenscreens, the MAJOR EXPOSITION where the film's biggest plot points have to be explained and spoken directly to the audience (at least with Inception, there's a visual accompaniment to the exposition).

I liked Shutter Island, and agree that the appeal is in Leo's journey and not the twist (although the film so clearly thinks that the twist is some kind of surprise; it is not self-aware of how obvious it is), but it feels less than the sum of its parts to me. Something about the overall package didn't hit as hard it could have and should have.
 
So Tom Hardy's rumored to play Detective Harvey Bullock?

The thing is Tom Hardy could pull off any villain probably, even cat woman. The dude's so fucking versatile.
 
Blader5489 said:
Okay, we could also talk about the hokey dialogue, the extremely noticeable CG and greenscreens, the MAJOR EXPOSITION where the film's biggest plot points have to be explained and spoken directly to the audience (at least with Inception, there's a visual accompaniment to the exposition).
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yeah I mean if I let a couple of hokey lines and a couple of less than stellar CG shots here and there ruin things for me I would like maybe 2-3 movies per year.

I don't need every single thing about a product to be spit-shined in order to love it, especially when otherwise, there's a lot of great things about it that overshadow the flaws.
 
brandonh83 said:
Hm. I felt the film was mostly about explaining it and developing Leo's character. At least that's what I got from it. Yeah you have scenes that spell it out. But for me it's making all the connections and how the twist affects every other scene.

I've seen people claim that they guessed the twist in Silent Hill 2, but that game was about you, the player, gradually getting all the clues and pieces to the puzzle. It also had a few scenes where they practically tell you what's going on, like when Laura yells "you never loved Mary anyway!" Not to mention all the blatant symbolism going on like Pyramid Head raping mannequins, Maria, who not-so-coincidentally looks exactly like Mary and dies multiple times before his eyes, and so on.

But like Shutter Island, what I dig is the details and how the twist retroactively makes the entire story cooler and gives everything more depth and meaning. It's not so much the twist itself or how obvious they make it.
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I absolutely hated the ending of Shutter Island, but overall enjoyed the movie. Seemed like Scorsese had a lot of fun making it as weird as possible. And similar to The Prestige, one of the best things about it is that you want to BELIEVE there is something weird/eerie going on, you want to believe Teddy's plight. The twist almost ruins it, for me--fantastic up until that point.
 
brandonh83 said:
yeah I mean if I let a couple of hokey lines and a couple of less than stellar CG shots here and there ruin things for me I would like maybe 2-3 movies per year.
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It's not just "a couple hokey lines" and "some less than stellar CG" though. You're talking about how great the visuals are, I'm telling you the noticeably fake quality to a lot of those shots takes me out of it. You're talking about the storytelling, and the depiction of Teddy's psychological journey, and I'm telling you how completely on-the-nose and expository the writing is, dampening the whole audiovisual element of the film.

I'm not nitpicking, I'm addressing some of the topics you complained no one ever addressed.

And like I said, I did like the movie, I'm just not seeing this "near-perfect" psychological thriller that some people are touting it as.

I don't need every single thing about a product to be spit-shined in order to love it, especially when otherwise, there's a lot of great things about it that overshadow the flaws.
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Clearly :lol


anyway. Let's talk about Tom Hardy playing Harvey Bullock. That's cool.
 
Blader5489 said:
I'm not nitpicking, I'm addressing some of the topics you complained no one ever addressed.
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Those aren't the topics that I ever complained about people not addressing. I'm talking more about the storyline than anything.

Blader5489 said:
Clearly :lol
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There are few films out there that I would deem perfect in every category. Jurassic Park is one of my all-time favorites but if I had to I could point out some smaller flaws. I just choose not to let everything hamper my enjoyment of an overall good flick. If the flaws are in greater numbers, that's a problem, but I don't feel that way about Shutter Island.
 
I like the idea of Tom Hardy as Bullock. From what I understand Bullock would fit nicely into the Nolanverse and the only thing we know about DKR is that the police will be hunting Batman, so it seems like Hardy as Harvey Bullock is a huge possibility.
 
BruceLeeRoy said:
Exactly. The more I think about that movie the more I remember how terrible it was. What really pisses me off is all the people that saw that shitty film without getting the chance to read the book instead.
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The movie was better than the book. And I had read the book beforehand. There you go.

Anybody that compares the level of exposition in Shutter Island (5 minutes at the end, identical to Psycho, a very evident reference in a movie full of them) to the one in Inception (EVERY single conversation with that phony "architect" character), and doesn't come to the conclusion that Nolan's storytelling was clunky cannot be trusted to judge any screenplay, really. It's as simple as that. You can like whatever you want about Inception, and I will give you that "opinions" line, as long as you're not saying that the exposition was "needed" or done in a tasteful way. That's not an opinion here. It's a ratio between normal lines in a dialogue and exposition ones. Inception has the worst exposition-to-real-discussion ratio I've ever seen in any movie.
 
Blader5489 said:
That award goes to Gangs of New York. That movie fucking sucked. It's Scorsese's own Crystal Skull.
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that would mean it'd make scorsese look talentless, which it doesn't. i actually saw kotcs last night and i was blown away by just how plain fuckin' bad it was. a villain that's just... there. incredibly bland action sequences. giant ants. aliens.

without ddl, gony still wouldn't even come to close to being scorsese's kotcs.
 
bud said:
that would mean it'd make scorsese look talentless, which it doesn't. i actually saw kotcs last night and i was blown away by just how plain fuckin' bad it was. a villain that's just... there. incredibly bland action sequences. giant ants. aliens.

without ddl, gony still wouldn't even come to close to being scorsese's kotcs.
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bland action? oh come on. hate the effects style and monkeys all you want, but the jungle chase was awesomely staged with incredible music. also the chase scene through the college campus was well done. Spielberg can craft great action even in his lesser films. I mean it had swordfighting on top of moving vehicles and it was still shot very well.

I know there's this trend to shit on Spielberg and Cameron these days but they still do better action sequences than 99% of these pale imitators. hate the movies all you want, that's cool, but the action is great in both Avatar and Skull.
 
brandonh83 said:
bland action? oh come on. hate the effects style and monkeys all you want, but the jungle chase was awesomely staged with incredible music. also the chase scene through the college campus was well done. Spielberg can craft great action even in his lesser films. I mean it had swordfighting on top of moving vehicles and it was still shot very well.

I know there's this trend to shit on Spielberg and Cameron these days but they still do better action sequences than 99% of these pale imitators. hate the movies all you want, that's cool, but the action is great in both Avatar and Skull.
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No, I'm pretty sure KotCS fucking sucks actually.
 
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