Nightengale
Member
Edit : Typed Wrongly
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The Kiseki / Trails (of the Sky/Zero/Ao/Sen/Etc) Community Thread: SPOILERTAGS OR DIE
- Thread starter Bebpo
- Start date
Thanks. I'll play it on normal then. I can't wait to see where the story goes with the ending of FC. It's eating me alive
Just so I can temper my expectations how big of a cliffhanger is the ending of SC ? Since we don't know if we will get the third game.
SC isn't bad. It wraps up most everything specific to FC/SC, but there are series-wide plot threads left dangling. There is a stinger ending, too, that is left unexplained.
I don't know... (adding to the spoiler)
If you take bond scene with Elie in Ao, it does bring it back up again. Lloyd outright apologizes for never having the chance to finish what started in that scene in Zero- and I didn't even have him picked for my Zero scene when I saw it. (I had Randy picked in Zero.)
'Wrong?' What? I'm not sure I understand this response here, also. Context, please? lol
Nightengale
Member
Btw, I didn't want to see that spoiler, since I never played Ao ( as with every Kiseki game, I do spoil myself a bit here and there and watch the first hour or two of a playthrough ), but quoting it kinda revealed it lol. 
Oops, should've been [Edit : Sorry, typed wrongly]
=P
I guess considering Ellie and Lloyd's personality, not too surprising if that's what happens.
Oops, should've been [Edit : Sorry, typed wrongly]
=P
I am of the opinion that "what if" scenarios are completely stupid in JRPGs. I really just don't like them because I feel it cheapens the story for me. World-building can be done without the harem, self-insert choose your waifu/husbando to spend time with gimmick.
I don't think I've ever had this much hate and love for the Persona series before (I've heard the guys at Falcom were inspired by Persona, so that's why I'm ousting it specifically). Damn you Atlus!
But anyway, that's enough complaining. I need to finish the game. Thanks for the tip about Emma, will keep her in mind for the final dungeon.
I've never seen it like a 'select your waifu/husbando' in the Kiseki series, however. The relationship scenes in all of the games typically show a different sort of relationship between characters.
It's not so much 'what if' at that point, I think all of the scenes are 100% possible, and may have even happened at some point off camera to a degree- but the game chooses to show you the ones you should see based on the relationship you have forged in the game.
Vague Ao no Kiseki Spoilers:
Let me use the earlier example again. That wasn't a 'what if' scenario. The events that the character talked about in the one I brought up earlier still happened, and the later things he talked about to Lloyd still happened to another degree as well. You just don't see the scene and don't learn the character's background at all, because you never see him tell it to Lloyd otherwise.
To me, the bond events have always been more about learning about the character you're more interested in as a player than anything else, and rewarding you with more information on that character- and perhaps even more series-wide lore as a result.
I guess my problem is how the relationship scenes never involve anyone else. When you say between characters in this context, the only thing that comes to mind is MC x someone, not someone x someone. When I come into a JRPG with a colorful looking cast, I'm looking for a dynamic between all the characters, not just everyone converging on one special character who gets all the attention. Even worse when all the female characters within his vicinity have the hots for him for whatever contrived reason they may have.
The one time Millium popped up in Jusis' hide-and-seek scene in Yumir after you get him to join your party? I appreciated the hell out of that.
Also, in CS1,
the bonding event where Elliot has that recital with his club at the church and no one but Rean shows up? Really? I find that hard to believe.
In that regard, I think Tales kind of wins, though that series has its own set of problems I could nitpick about as well.
I am not a fan of Persona social links (then again I don't hate them). But what Zero/Ao have is completely different. You don't choose who to romance, you choose who to partner up with during specific events. Personally I find Ellie too plain and by the book, so I am glad I can switch her in some scenes for Tio, who for me is much more fun to watch.
A single pairing does make the story stronger as you can build on it and devote more content to that paring, but if player does not like the main heroine it's super nice to have choices.
Sen (and later Xanadu) on the other hand take social links and do them the wrong way. Persona at least had a time management aspect and the links were arranged into stories. Free time is just a choice between "Watch scene A" and "Watch scene B". There is no conceivable reason why the game could not show you both A and B. In fact many players will just watch A then reload and watch B. The choice does not add anything to the story, it just forces player to do more work and waste time.
A single pairing does make the story stronger as you can build on it and devote more content to that paring, but if player does not like the main heroine it's super nice to have choices.
Sen (and later Xanadu) on the other hand take social links and do them the wrong way. Persona at least had a time management aspect and the links were arranged into stories. Free time is just a choice between "Watch scene A" and "Watch scene B". There is no conceivable reason why the game could not show you both A and B. In fact many players will just watch A then reload and watch B. The choice does not add anything to the story, it just forces player to do more work and waste time.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Edit: Nvm
Double edit: So this isn't a waste of a post, who's everyone's favorite "badass" character (for lack of a better term)? You know, the person who's infinitely more capable and certainly cooler than any of the main protagonists. Cassius, Arios and Claire probably fit these bills the most, if I were to pick one from each series of games.
I haven't played Zero/Ao, but from the brief mention he gets in Cold Steel and his amazing visual design, Arios MacLaine definitely wins for me. He's like a 60's cop version of Dias Flac from Star Ocean. Call it shallow reasoning, since he's a character I know very little about, but the sense of mystique only adds to his appeal.
Double edit: So this isn't a waste of a post, who's everyone's favorite "badass" character (for lack of a better term)? You know, the person who's infinitely more capable and certainly cooler than any of the main protagonists. Cassius, Arios and Claire probably fit these bills the most, if I were to pick one from each series of games.
I haven't played Zero/Ao, but from the brief mention he gets in Cold Steel and his amazing visual design, Arios MacLaine definitely wins for me. He's like a 60's cop version of Dias Flac from Star Ocean. Call it shallow reasoning, since he's a character I know very little about, but the sense of mystique only adds to his appeal.
Personally I've never really been charmed by Arios' coolness as a bracer, although that might stem from the way he is introduced in Zero. I liked him better as a father, including his more humane struggles of raising his daughter.
As my avatar probably gave away, my favourite is Ein Selnert, also known as Carnelia. She's (exact rank/The 3rd spoiler)
and therefore the Grand Master of the Gralsritter. The reason why I'm fascinated by her is that, very much like Cassius, she's present in all games without actually showing up. We closest we've got to meeting her was visiting the Sankt District in Heimdallr, but since the presence of the Grand Cathedral was represented only by its bells, we still haven't had the chance to meet her face-to-face. Ein knows a lot and makes her moves accordingly.
And while I find the discussion on 'Who's the strongest?' tiring, Ein is certainly not outside Zemuria's top 3. But she rather not lifts a finger -- unless it's to lit her cigarettes.
As my avatar probably gave away, my favourite is Ein Selnert, also known as Carnelia. She's (exact rank/The 3rd spoiler)
the First Dominion
And while I find the discussion on 'Who's the strongest?' tiring, Ein is certainly not outside Zemuria's top 3. But she rather not lifts a finger -- unless it's to lit her cigarettes.
Nightengale
Member
There's a
3rd?
I thought the only ones indicated at having power levels above the
Sword Emperor/Divine Blade class
7th Anguis and 1st Dominion
The third one is
Legion No. I
I think, in Cold Steel, it's partly an issue that came about from how the game goes visual novel style, as well. I know they basically ran headlong into the deadline for Sen to go gold. Thus the fact that the game had an issue that seriously needed to be patched on launch in Japan. I could imagine that some of these were an issue of time/resources, since there were definitely a number of issues that were caused by this.
In Zero and Ao, if you see the events that can trigger bond points (invisible in those games), you may have multiple people involved. They're definitely a lot more 'open' in terms of people. Sometimes, they're one on one and sometimes they have more cast members involved in them.
But in Zero and Ao, the actual endgame bond event ends up being one on one. Lloyd and the individual. This is most definitely the same with the endgame event in Cold Steel.
AledyHauser
Member
Anyone know where to get an Japanese save file for cold steel one
Sorry if this isn't the on topic
Sorry if this isn't the on topic
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
Just wondering does Cold Steel 2
end on a cliff hanger like Cold Steel 1? Or is there an conclusion.
hmm.
Not entirely. It ends, definitely, but there are so many dangling plot threads left... It was enough that even Kondo has commented that another game in Erebonia (thus Sen III) would be needed.
On the other hand, it makes sense to end it how they did.
Sen 2 ends in a way that left most people thinking "whaaat," but at the same time, it felt like an ending. There was absolutely more to see, and it left the audience wanting to know just what was going to happen with what happens at the end, but there's a conclusion. That's why I always said that I felt they could've moved on and concluded the stuff on the side in future games rather than focusing on Rean and co. again. It really could've gone either way.
AbortedWalrusFetus
Member
I'm at the very end of Trails in the Sky SC. Probably 2-3 hours left. Excited for the end.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
Gotcha. Thanks. As much as I want to ask, I will just wait till Cold Steel 2 is release in year. Hopefully Xseed will mention something regarding Cold Steel 3.
Wish I waited till both games were out atleast before playing Cold Steel 1. O well.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Digging through the old Sen no Kiseki OT made me realize that
the entire Lianne Sandlot thing was foreshadowed in Zero/Ao... with a character claiming to be a valkyrie of the empire... AND THAT WAS HER IN CHAPTER 5! AHHHHH, I'm geeking out so hard right now. That's such an awesome way to bounce storytelling back and forth between games.
There's actually a little bit more than that about the character.
But you will also see lots of other Crossbell things bouncing back and forth through all of Cold Steel.
It was pretty good to play SC and Cold Steel 1 back to back. I beat 3 out of 7 of the Zemurian games released so far. Not bad.
While I enjoyed Cold Steel 1 I felt it was the weakest games of the 3 I played. I don't enjoy the school simulation aspect anymore probably because I'm getting older and it seemed they kept all the good reveals for the last 2 hours. The last 2 hours of the game felt like SC's Chapter 5 to the ending compressed in 2 hours. It was really great but it came really late. I did love that all my guesses were correct and I believe this is the result of good writing. Nothing really happen out of the blue and you have hints all the way through to figure it out.
It didn't help the game runs poorly. It was turning me off from exploring and talking to NPC in some areas. In the last area with enemies the loading time after battles was so long that I used the free shining pom DLC thing to get +5 level and make a dash to the end.
Cliffhanger ending is a bit annoying considering we will probably have to wait 1 year for the sequel.
Soundtrack was amazing though, so much I might consider buying it. For some reasons some songs remind me a lot of Wild Arms like the song playing on the
and Atrocious raid.
One thing that bugged me is that they really expect you to have played Zero and Azure. They keep referencing some big events and characters from Crossbell that I believe happen in those games like
. And I don't feel I will get the chance to play these anytime soon.
While I enjoyed Cold Steel 1 I felt it was the weakest games of the 3 I played. I don't enjoy the school simulation aspect anymore probably because I'm getting older and it seemed they kept all the good reveals for the last 2 hours. The last 2 hours of the game felt like SC's Chapter 5 to the ending compressed in 2 hours. It was really great but it came really late. I did love that all my guesses were correct and I believe this is the result of good writing. Nothing really happen out of the blue and you have hints all the way through to figure it out.
It didn't help the game runs poorly. It was turning me off from exploring and talking to NPC in some areas. In the last area with enemies the loading time after battles was so long that I used the free shining pom DLC thing to get +5 level and make a dash to the end.
Cliffhanger ending is a bit annoying considering we will probably have to wait 1 year for the sequel.
Soundtrack was amazing though, so much I might consider buying it. For some reasons some songs remind me a lot of Wild Arms like the song playing on the
Nord Highlands
One thing that bugged me is that they really expect you to have played Zero and Azure. They keep referencing some big events and characters from Crossbell that I believe happen in those games like
the trade conference that Olivert and Osborne attend, the Crossbell dependence declaration, the destruction of Garrelia Fortress that is supposed to have been by Crossbell and everybody seems to be a fan of Rixia Mao/ Arc en Ciel and Mishy
Did you rike it?
A lot of people were very disappointed in Sen in Japan because it had the misfortune of being the game after Ao no Kiseki, which was an incredible game.
This is actually very much what it was like with the Japanese fans, too. It took Falcom a year to get the next game out.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Sky SC was also an incredible game, though.
I liked Cold Steel a lot. More than Sky FC. I can tell it's "Part 1 of 2" but it does a much better job selling its world and characters and setting up part 2 for greatness than FC did. FC felt a lot like you were planting daisies and meandering about at times, which also happens in Cold Steel to an extent but there's always an underlying main story thread. Chapter 3 especially does this well with
the attack on the Calvard lookout base, glimpse over into Calvard, the giant statue and the ominous golem monster, etc.
It certainly does seem like they expect you to know what's going on over in Crossbell, but I think it works just as well without that knowledge. Despite the constant references to
the trade conference
the giant shocker at the end that Garrelia is gone
Nightengale
Member
There was 3rd, and Zero was amazing as well.
Gaiden is around 1 hour and the epilogue is around 2-3 hours.
At the very least, you don't get much detail in those events specifically. So that when things go down in Crossbell, they will remain a surprise if/when you get the chance to play the games.
3rd is actually one of my favorites of the series. And it's also the game that sees the most replays due to the nature of the game, but I also find that everytime I play it, I see something new thanks to the context of the other games. I'm actually in the middle of a no-carry over Nightmare run of it. People have been taking predictions for how long it takes for me to ragequit on it.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
For cold steel? I skipped the credits for cold steel.
Cold Steel 2.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
I don't think I'll be seeing this extra scene for a while. Finishing up my first playthrough this weekend and then jumping back to the Sky series. That's, of course, after I get my fill of Genei Ibun Roku on the Wii U.
Is there any reason for me to not get the Evolution series?
Nightengale
Member
This thread is starting to feel very dangerous for a non Sen II player...
It cost money?
It cost money?
Not really. I would recommend the Steam version of FC and SC since its technically superior with outstanding localisation. I also thought that FC Evo made some changes that aren't improvements, like replacing the orbment system with what resembles Zero's.
Well, I meant as far as visuals and the experience are concerned. Importing both games is going to hurt though.
I'm not too particularly vested in the combat, to be honest (especially since I'll be backtracking from Cold Steel). More interested in the story as well as the voice acting, and I guess the arguably better character portraits. I heard the games were PSTV compatible too so that helps.
Nightengale
Member
I don't prefer the portraits, but personally the voice acting adds A LOT to the experience.
Looks like you pretty much set your mind on the Evolution games already.
I thought FC Evo was okay, but I really can't muster up the motivation to play SC Evo.
Edit:
By the way, my setup to one-shot the entire final dungeon in Sen II with Rean:
- Zemuria Ore forged weapon
- Equipment: 携帯格言集・葉隠 + 氷皇の円環
- Master Quarz: Murakumo
- Quartz: a lot of STR boosts and Dominator
Together these items form to a 100% critical rate, where Murakumo boosts the critical rate from 1.5 to 2.5, the equipment restores CP every turn and the Dominator quartz doubles the power of the first attack. Rean's first attacks were somewhere between 650.000-700.000, enough to take out all the bosses on Nightmare except for
the post-game final boss
As far as Sen 1 goes, it's not just that it's after Ao, it's that... it's after Ao. So like, Ao is really great. So was Zero. But after SC, Zero, and Ao, the series has basically established a formula... and when you get to Sen 1, it's like the epitome of that formula, which makes it feel less exciting and a bit stale. Add on top of that the school stuff, if you're like me and happen to dislike that in games in general, and it just left me really underwhelmed. It's the first and only Kiseki game to date that I actually took a break in the middle of.
And then Sen 2 came out and blew me away.
And then Sen 2 came out and blew me away.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
So is Sen/Cold Steel II less formulaic? Based on the ending of CS the story could go basically anywhere at this point. I was surprised to hear you end up mostly revisiting the same areas. I assume it's not like SC
I also heard that CSII has more overt references to the Crossbell games... will English only players be lost in that regard? I know
Or is it self contained like the first game despite making numerous references?
where they're mostly the same, because there's a huge war going on?
I also heard that CSII has more overt references to the Crossbell games... will English only players be lost in that regard? I know
Lloyd appears, for one.
Same. Love the VA but the old 2D portraits had a lot more personality to them. It's a shame that they use the 3D models for text bubbles, because the 2D portraits used in the status screen/battle menu are fantastic.
I haven't played the past games, including the Sky (only part of FC) series (which also makes me a Sen/Cold Steel-only pleb), but I didn't feel too lost. There's not really much to get confused about when it comes to a huge kingdom wanting to expand, anyway. I think it's still self-contained though playing the other games would probably help you connect the dots better.
But it does bum you out when you don't know what's going on over there. As for
Lloyd and the fact that you even get to play him
Aside from the crappy attempt to mimic Persona social links and hamfist every female into MC's personal harem when there's plenty of other guys around, the world-building and existence of a living world outside of MC and cheerleaders in Sen 2 are fantastic. That said, I'm still a few hours away from finishing the game entirely, so who knows... Pre-credits ending was a huge kick to the nads though, imo.
And yes, you do visit all the old areas.
Ao no Kiseki Evolution
Finished chapter 2 last night, at the
Finished chapter 2 last night, at the
Intermission
Was a lot more excited to write this post this morning when I got up, but after a day of work, now that I have a minute eh, I'll try to be excited, because the end of Ch.2 was pretty exciting!
I think the political play setup in chapter 1/2 that all comes together in the finale, while not being college (or even Matsuno) level of high-brow/depth politics, is still really good and I'd say Ao no Kiseki just from these two chapters (and the parts of Zero that allowed these politics) is the most political rpg ever made. Which is cool. I love that the game's plot (so far) isn't about giant monsters, Ouroborus Experiments, Bell summoned demons, floating ancient magical cities or whatever,
...instead it's an rpg about a grounded political power play by the Empire and Calvard to encroach on the neutral zone/free state of Crossbell in furtherance of eventually taking it over and how Crossbell's politicians have anticipated that and are pushing for Crossbell to be recognized as it's own kingdom/country as a countermeasure and advancement of their own territory.
The way the two kingdoms (Empire & Calvard) twisted in Zero's happenings in the finale with the D:G group as an example of Crossbell's police force not being strong enough to take care of itself, especially when it's running a large economic bank and the neighboring countries residents and economies are at risk, and then set this huge badguy-ish political play to hire/allow terrorists to infiltrate Crossbell right as they make this point and then cover their asses by each hiring major mercenary groups to get rid of the terrorists so no one talks (and to be there in case they need protection)....it's a pretty grand layered up scheme that you don't see in games outside of the occasional Matsuno game, even if it's pretty straight forward and easy to figure out as it's happening.
Was fun though. The setup now for the 2nd half with the political issue of Crossbell's Independence vs. Erebonia/Calvard's encroachment + the followup to the supernatural/artifact side of the Ancient Bells of Crossbell, Demons, and 500 year old Kia, makes for a good combination that the 2nd half should be pretty exciting. Looking forward to it.
I think the political play setup in chapter 1/2 that all comes together in the finale, while not being college (or even Matsuno) level of high-brow/depth politics, is still really good and I'd say Ao no Kiseki just from these two chapters (and the parts of Zero that allowed these politics) is the most political rpg ever made. Which is cool. I love that the game's plot (so far) isn't about giant monsters, Ouroborus Experiments, Bell summoned demons, floating ancient magical cities or whatever,
...instead it's an rpg about a grounded political power play by the Empire and Calvard to encroach on the neutral zone/free state of Crossbell in furtherance of eventually taking it over and how Crossbell's politicians have anticipated that and are pushing for Crossbell to be recognized as it's own kingdom/country as a countermeasure and advancement of their own territory.
The way the two kingdoms (Empire & Calvard) twisted in Zero's happenings in the finale with the D:G group as an example of Crossbell's police force not being strong enough to take care of itself, especially when it's running a large economic bank and the neighboring countries residents and economies are at risk, and then set this huge badguy-ish political play to hire/allow terrorists to infiltrate Crossbell right as they make this point and then cover their asses by each hiring major mercenary groups to get rid of the terrorists so no one talks (and to be there in case they need protection)....it's a pretty grand layered up scheme that you don't see in games outside of the occasional Matsuno game, even if it's pretty straight forward and easy to figure out as it's happening.
Was fun though. The setup now for the 2nd half with the political issue of Crossbell's Independence vs. Erebonia/Calvard's encroachment + the followup to the supernatural/artifact side of the Ancient Bells of Crossbell, Demons, and 500 year old Kia, makes for a good combination that the 2nd half should be pretty exciting. Looking forward to it.
Someone translated Renne's backstory from Trails 3rd, because even if the game is ever released in English this might end up not in the release.
Massive spoilers, obviously, if you're still on SC.
Massive spoilers, obviously, if you're still on SC.
Eh, cross-post much?
Cold Steel II is rather formulaic within itself yet structured as a whole unlike any previous game. It does open up even more of east Erebonia, but you still don't get to go to the western half. And the reason you visited the same areas in SC as in FC is because there simply isn't more ground in Liberl to cover, unless (SC endgame spoiler)
apart from the Liber Ark, of course.
Regarding Crossbell. It's not that players will be lost any more than Rean and his classmates; whatever happens in Crossbell, they're left in wonder as much as a Trails player would wonder. Even Sara, (Cold Steel Chapter 4 spoiler)
with her network of bracers
About the Crossbell bit you censored: I'm afraid you will be completely lost during that segment.
_
I platinumed Sen II last night. *rolls over the floor, waiting for the sequel*
Yeah. It's relevant to both threads, and there might be some people over here that would like to see it that wouldn't be over there.
Nightengale
Member
Renne's backstory is pretty much why I feel that [general series spoiler, won't list what because that is a spoiler hint on its own]
Zero needs to be localised, even if Ao may never.It's the story with the closure to SC in a really personal way for those who likes Renne. That ending had me crying.
...You do know that her storyline isn't finished as of Zero and continues (at least) into Ao, right?