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The murder of Iryna Zarutska
- Thread starter EviLore
- Start date
StreetsofBeige
Member
Yup.
And that's why most downtowns have a lot of grubby people. The congregate there since it'll probably have a lot of drug clinics, rehab centres and homeless shelters. And since downtowns always have lots of people roaming around, they need to be there no matter what for sake of begging for money from all the walkers. A nice suburb might have zero walkers and just cars that blow by them. And when you got troubled folks, in comes the crime and drug dealers making it worse. So instead of a street with normal people who got evicted last night, it becomes a street of said people who are also now high and passed out all day.
And then when the problem festers big, what band of beat cops or city officials wants to tackle that giant mob? It might be a tent city now. So it gets to a point, they just dont bother.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
I've been the only black guy in a subway car in Atlanta, before. Not uncommon to be once in a while (definitely rare to be the only one every time, tho).
I've only seen 2 acts of violence on the train in the 17 years I lived in Atlanta... Once, me and others in the car protected a girl from being hit by an older man who was yelling at her... The other, I was the only one who came to a young man's aide when he was being beaten by two dudes. I've also seen some crazy AF things like a woman (so unattractive) getting naked at a bus stop and someone (not homeless) crapping at the bus stop. I was so grossed out!
We get panhandlers out in the burbs where I live. They are dropped off by car or take the bus, have their backpacks of supplies, that obligatory ripped cardboard sign written in black sharpie (always with a "God Bless" at the end), and set up shop on the same corner for YEARS. I've seen the EXACT SAME GUY at the exact same corner, for 3+ YEARS, at least when the weather is tolerable. It's so obviously a (semi) organized racket, I'm not sure why anyone gives anything to these folks nor why the police tolerate it at all. What happened to all the anti-vagrant laws we used to have? Some how we just accepted that folks can sleep on the streets, shit and shoot up anywhere, beg for money no matter what, all that crap.
Yeah, never had an issue on the Atlanta MARTA, though I only used it during the day.
Had a crazy guy muttering to himself and walking up and down the car in Portland though, not sure how he even go on to the train. I like rail as a transportation option, but it does need to be more policed because they seem to attract crazy folks.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
I used it day and night. Pretty much every day. I felt safer in Atlanta than I do here in Mississippi and that's due to no sidewalks in my area (some folks think less traffic is a sign to drive like NASCAR).
I miss the train and bus to get around on my own. Nothing like that here.
Worst thing about Atlanta were those damned electric scooter things EVERYWHERE. Dammit, just get on the train!
I'll be curious if robotaxis eventually kill off most public transportation, especially busses. I like trains as they have dedicated lines and over time the infrastructure supports them, but busses are annoying if the streets don't have spots for them to stop without impeding traffic flow. In suburban areas there are rarely more than a few folks at each stop so a smaller robot vehicle would probably be more efficient.
My niece lives in DC and she won't use the subway after dark. Don't blame her one bit but I'm not sure taking an uber as a single female is statistically much safer, really. I wish she could carry a .38 to center punch any bad guys but she's stuck with pepper spray there.
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
I blame Christians. Seriously, whenever I check Nextdoor where I live there is someone complaining about beggars (usually they park themselves in the median at lights with a left hand turn) and there are always a bunch of self identified Christians who say they give them money.
Worst was some woman waxing lyrical about a violin player in the target parking lot and how she was happy to donate to help nurture his talent. Someone had to point out that it was all a scam and they were pretending to play along to a recording.
The musicians I'm kinda ok with. Or hot girls advertising car washes. A certain type of solicitation
It's not common where I live, but getting approached for the "I need gas money" at gas stations used to be super common. I think the general transition away from using cash for stuff has hurt these types of scams. Helps I try to shop at places where they have security to usher out folks begging for money INSIDE the store.
StreetsofBeige
Member
Even with anti-vagrant laws, I dont see how it's possible to solve it long term unless the city wants to literally lock them up in homeless shelters and cant leave. Even if the gov offered all of them jobs and built tons of shelters, many cant or wont do it anyway. They prefer being vagrants stumbling about outside where busy streets for begging and park benches for drugs are fav spots.
You can tell the gov has given up when they dont even enforce it on gov property. When I went to university downtown way back, there's all the panhandler guys on the busy streets roaming around or at the same spot. But, you'd also get them in subway stations. Always the busy downtown stations too. Never at the stations farther out where I'd get on/off at. And it's not even just a guy asking for change, sometimes you'd get people playing a musical instrument with his guitar case open for people to toss in coins you'd see every day. Transit workers never cared and never saw cops ever tell them to leave. Granted, they are different than a homeless guy whose passed out. But still beggars, just tidied up and not drunk. And gov never cared.
In some spots, they'd be clever too. They'd be in a spot that is not gov property. But it's a spot connected to the subway where I guess it's commercial/landlord property. So if perhaps the city cant do anything about, they picked that spot as I guess the property managers of the spot dont care.
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I think for most of human history you could just move them away from your area, exile them, so to speak. Or winter dealt with them.
Places like socal or hawaii, with perpetual nice weather and 'generous' social programs, breed them like crazy. I doubt North Dakota has much of a homeless vagrant problem.
I'm all for restarting the mental health asylums, that was a bad call on Reagans part, no doubt. Problem now is the scale, it's grown so much, there would be MILLIONS to contain.
There is a culture around begging, "street vending" (aka selling stolen, thrown out, or otherwise 'acquired' stuff), and panhandling. I don't mind the music folks so long as they are playing culturally acceptable music for the space, its a talent. The infamous "window squeegee" racket though, that's not a talent NOR a public service. What you see in Mexico or increasingly in Europe, folks running up to you from all over, trying to sell some china made trinket or doing the bracelet scam, that shit isn't in line with our culture here in the States and I don't see why it is permitted as it leads to aggression, pickpocketing, mugging, or as cover for drug deals.
StreetsofBeige
Member
Toronto panhandling is different. Or at least "was" different as I'm barely downtown anymore. I'll assume Canada and US panhandling are similar. It was probably be 95% guys asking for change or sitting or passed out on the sidewalk with a cardboard tray, 4% musicians, and 1% random person trying to ask for money for something he wants to hand out like a bible thumper weirdo's scripture or some random dude giving out leaflets with some kind of propaganda.
I never saw young kids asking for money, at minimum older teens or college age. And never saw aggressive sales tactics selling junky trinkets. There was a wave of squeegee kids long time ago. Get off at a downtown highway ramp and you might get one. Never had an issue. They disappeared fast though. Last one I saw was probably 15 or 20 years ago.
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poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
I used to live in Oxford (UK) and so have heard and seen them all before, often multiple times from the same person day after day - they must really have trouble keeping hold of their bus tickets, money for gas, or car keys. There are some variations - the 'I just got out of jail and need gas money to get to a job interview' one has been pretty much unique to the US.The musicians I'm kinda ok with. Or hot girls advertising car washes. A certain type of solicitation
It's not common where I live, but getting approached for the "I need gas money" at gas stations used to be super common. I think the general transition away from using cash for stuff has hurt these types of scams. Helps I try to shop at places where they have security to usher out folks begging for money INSIDE the store.
I remember one in Oxford - a girl pushing a pram (baby carriage) had 'lost her bus ticket' and needed to get her baby home. Felt mildly bad about not helping out just in case she was legit. Didn't last long as she lost her bus ticket again the very next day - and also this time I looked in the pram and it was just a bunch of cans in there.
rm082e
Gold Member
Support for the death penalty in the US has been dropping over time, and younger generations are majority against it. We know it doesn't serve as a deterrent for crime, so it's just people's desire for vengeance.
As for fixing the problem with education and rehab, that's just not a realistic possibility. We already have a government budget that we can't pay for, which is why our debt is growing out of control. We know we're not going to give up our military, or social security, or Medicare/Medicaid. Those four things (plus the interest on our debt) are the vast majority of the federal budget. State and county taxes aren't anywhere near enough to pay for these sort of programs.
The number that sticks out in my head for all time is from a book called The Corner where the author did the math and counted 3 junkies for every local, state, and federal bed in all the hospitals, jails and treatment centers in the state of Maryland. The scale of the problem is a compounding problem on top of the problem.
GymWolf
Gold Member
Heavy work in a mine or something until they are too old to physically pick up a tool would be a much better use for some of these cunts.
Let them repay their debt to society instead of weighting on tax payers.
You renounce to your human rights when you decide to become a monster, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Death is a liberation for some of these people.
Let them repay their debt to society instead of weighting on tax payers.
You renounce to your human rights when you decide to become a monster, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Death is a liberation for some of these people.
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Dirk Benedict
Member
I don't normally get upset about many of these articles, but I did for her... she was minding her own God damned business, when this dude just sprang up like a fucking Death-Prop. Son of a bitch. I need a hit and go back to chillin' Between this and other stuff + 3i/Atlas... I'm mentally spent!
thefool
Member
White by Default: Systematic Bias in U.S. Criminal Racial Assignment
Misclassification Inflates White Rates 4-6%, Deflates Hispanic Rates 20-31%: Evidence from 1.5 Million Records
www.uncorrelated.xyz
Pejo
Gold Member
Certainly is a problem when these metrics are used for other purposes and to paint agendas, but I for one am not surprised by this too much. When I've filled out all sorts of official forms, even government stuff, plenty of times I've seen options like "Caucasian (Non-Hispanic)", and sometimes it's just "Caucasian" or "White." They make it needlessly particular and inconsistent, so it's probably the same for some prison systems, which leads to a lot of these discrepancies.
Goss Harag
Member
Trilobit
Absolutely Cozy
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DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
White by Default: Systematic Bias in U.S. Criminal Racial Assignment
Misclassification Inflates White Rates 4-6%, Deflates Hispanic Rates 20-31%: Evidence from 1.5 Million Records
Hispanic/latino isn't a race. All these are latinos.
Jinzo Prime
Member
In the United States, we always distinguish between Hispanic and non-Hispanic whites on most demogaphic forms and inquires, including the Census. So Hispanic is treated as a race here both casually and professionally.Hispanic/latino isn't a race. All these are latinos.
Dr.Guru of Peru
played the long game
No, that's ethnicity. The issue is obviously that US federal agencies have limited and sometimes inconsistent ways to categorize race. The federal bureau of prisons only seems to acknowledge four different races, for example:
BOP Statistics: Inmate Race
www.bop.gov
LegendOfKage
Member
Louis CK is another good example of this. While there are Hispanic people where you can be fairly sure of their heritage by looking at them, there are others where you can't tell. I don't think anyone is looking at Danny Trejo thinking "maybe he's Hispanic, but maybe he isn't," but Louis CK is Hispanic, and people generally didn't realize that until he talked about it.Hispanic/latino isn't a race. All these are latinos.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
Linda Carter, too.
A lot of Americans still don't know that Gina Torres and Zoe Saldana are both Latina despite their surnames
Unknown Soldier
Member
Ironbunny
Member
We are two civil as a society. We need eye for an eye with these crimes...
Embearded
Member
I am not sure about that, but i know for certain that some people could never be functional in our society. There is no punishment that would make them behave.
What do you do with those people?
Avid Reading Horse
Member
Embearded
Member
Killing criminals through the justice system will result in innocents dying sooner or later and it's not worth it.
Kill them, then they won't misbehave.
We just need to not let free this kind of people.
GladiusFrog
Member
Arrested 72 times.... how is this possible? SMDH...
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bitbydeath
Gold Member
If it's clear cut like this then the death penalty should be a no brainer. No innocents would ever die.
Avid Reading Horse
Member
Gross, you want to imprison people? Permanently? Doing that through the justice system will results in innocents dying in prison sooner or later and it's not worth it.
Crime is a social construct. No justice no peace!
Embearded
Member
It's a slippery slope.
An innocent imprisoned can always be free again. A dead one will never return to life.
You don't have to kill them, you only have to keep them locked.
Send them to Australia.
New Australia, I guess. Or do like the Russians and put them into a front line meat grinder war. Or hang 'em.
Lots of solutions really, and pretty easily implemented with a little more nutsac and a bit less (misplaced) empathy.
Avid Reading Horse
Member
Death row inmates have an appeals process and can be freed. And innocents have surely died in prison while serving life sentences, and even shorter sentences where they had fully expected to get out. But of course we're talking about a guy with 72 priors... what are the odds of him being innocent of all those things? 1 in the number of atoms in the universe? Probably worse?
Death penalty is a tricky one. You'd think with DNA and cameras it would be 100% safe to use, but AI will fake videos very soon and DNA is bollocks if the lab isn't checking it properly. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8dqp0g2737o 10,000 cases were dodgy but the police didn't have the money to look into it properly
bitbydeath
Gold Member
It's the best deterrent to prevent it from happening again in future.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
These fraudulent judges that are bought and paid for, need to be held accountable like a bartender.
Same for dereliction of duty "lawmakers" and DAs.
Only then will this change.
Same for dereliction of duty "lawmakers" and DAs.
Only then will this change.
SupaComputa
Member
About death penalty, there is a cost to not doing anything. How many victims are you willing to sacrifice to take the moral high ground in protecting monsters? I also don't think lifelong prison sentences (torture) is necessarily more moral than death penalty. If I am wrongly accused, I'd rather just die than being sent to prison for 25 years+.
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Avid Reading Horse
Member
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
That's the most backwards thinking on this subject I've seen in a long time.
It's like you don't know what justice actually is.
SupaComputa
Member
I clearly explained the caveats of no death penalty and you came back with nothing. "backwards" and "don't know what justice is". I know this is not the place for a debate, but if you are going to criticize, bring some meat next time.
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DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
If you're wrongly accused and prosecuted (which has happened many times now), instead of actually eventually proving your innocence, you wouldn't want justice to be done and free you? Innocent people have been executed in the US, often found that way after death, sometimes found that way before execution (because the governor was "tough on crime"). That's not justice.
And a long prison sentence isn't torture. I'm not sure where you thought that up (though it is a type of slavery, per the Constitution). At least with a long sentence, you're alive and can (if you're innocent) eventually gain your freedom. Even if you're there until you die, you can pass on the lessons of your life to others.
That's why I said what I said.
Funny thing about that stat is that women have almost 100% choice about who they have in their home. So their (lack of) safety is their own doing.As libs say: the most dangerous place for a woman is her own home.
So we have to do everything to change that.