That's how it looks on all my capture cards which I use weekly since 2014 for youtube and such. I have to deinterlace it to make it look acceptable.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
The Nintendo GameCube Appreciation and Collecting Thread.
- Thread starter Seik
- Start date
Same here on capture cards I had back in the day. I dunno why it looks so bad on them.
I don't like it on a CRT but it's definitely better than anything else I've seen.
Wow, is this for real? 480i really looks like shit here.
It's because it's only using 240 lines at once thus giving it that look since the other 240 lines aren't used and don't produce fast enough for a clear image like 240p, 480p and basically anything progressive even.
Is that not true of anything displayed 480i though? Or is it that capture cards aren't as fast as, say, a CRT?
hmm, what editor do you recommend for that?
Pretty much, capture cards show the real flaw of 480i when it comes to direct capture, CRTs just do a good job hiding it besides maybe the text, though I heard about flickering. The fact that this happens only with 480i and 1080i and not progressive scan res like 240p, 480p, 720p, 1080p and such says a lot about the res itself. That's why deinterlacing exist. Every game I deinterlace looks so much better in motion.
Funny enough I don't use editors, I just use my deinterlacer IN1402.
Yeah, any good handling of 480i requires a big enough frame buffer. Which in turn requires more memory. Which in turn means that the mod would have to be more expensive.
The saving grace is that every GC game can be forced into 480p via Swiss. So dealing with 480i is really a non-issue for the well initiated to Swiss... Ehem... You're welcome CubeGAF.
Plus Swiss can also force anisotropic filtering. That's a feature lacking in nintendont, which means an HDMI GC is back to being the best way to play GC games.
Technically the other 240 lines are used in line doubling. It's just that each field of a 480i frame is filled in with duplicate line data and presented as one frame. The end result is pretty ugly though. Also, technically the third image is a crude form deinterlacing. It's just that temporally separated motion compensation hasn't been applied to the total 480 frame.
It's the opposite actually. These crude forms of deinterlacing can probably be just as fast as a CRT... But as you can see, there's a heavy price to PQ.
Motion adaptive deinterlacing (which the process you want if your main goal is PQ) requires external hardware that can apply the aforementioned process.
Again though, all this is moot. Every GC game can be forced into 480p. So deinterlacing and line doubling is not necessary at all on this console. If you're relying on the features of the GCVideo, you are seriously doing it wrong.
Yeah, any good handling of 480i requires a big enough frame buffer. Which in turn requires more memory. Which in turn means that the mod would have to be more expensive.
The saving grace is that every GC game can be forced into 480p via Swiss. So dealing with 480i is really a non-issue for the well initiated to Swiss... Ehem... You're welcome CubeGAF.
Plus Swiss can also force anisotropic filtering. That's a feature lacking in nintendont, which means an HDMI GC is back to being the best way to play GC games.
And what is this?
Texture filtering, here's an example of unfiltered textures on a PS4 game. The console struggle with AF due to lack of CPU overhead.
I need proof of this.The saving grace is that every GC game can be forced into 480p via Swiss. So dealing with 480i is really a non-issue for the well initiated to Swiss... Ehem... You're welcome CubeGAF.
You don't know what anisotropic filtering is???=O
If you don't play on PC, then there is a large chance you never heard of the setting.
As cool as it is to have anisotropic filtering for old console games I think that's changing the graphics a bit since they didn't originally look like that. Don't get me wrong, it's a fine feature, but I rather stick with the original graphics at the best video quality output(which is HDMI for now) than add anisotropic filtering, anti-aliasing and such. It's also why I don't use emulators for 3D consoles, I mean, I'll mess around with them, but not use them seriously until they are perfect for emulating the original look.
Grief got you. But to elaborate, textures at certain angles get blurry. Enabling AF can reduce the blur at low levels and eliminate all visible blurring to the eye at high
levels. It can vastly improve texture detail, especially ground textures.
Proof of what exactly? That Swiss works? Every game I tried it on works. You can even force 240p for arcade/Sega compilations.
Your reasoning seems kinda... lame. As nice as I can put it. Emulation =/= real hardware. Real hardware + AF is only better. Better texture filtering is just better. It's not "changing" the look of textures. Quite the opposite, it maintains the look and quality of the original textures. Nothing more.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
Didn't work with Tales of Symphonia when I tried it a few months ago so it definitely doesn't work with everything.
Edit: http://www.gc-forever.com/wiki/index.php?title=Swiss/Forced_Progressive_Compatibility_List
ToS is listed as "works" so either it was fixed in a more recent build or I was doing something wrong.
Edit2: Maybe this is why: https://github.com/AdmiralCurtiss/swiss-gc/issues/109
I didn't want to disc swap.
I read a list that some games have issues with it. But what I want to know is how do you get it to work, hope it's not difficult.
Some games are a bit touchy if they are running off disc or the SD card. Either way, Swiss is constantly being smoothed out. It's far from a static program and there are "nightly builds" that most people here don't seem to be aware of that are improved over the main releases.
Anyway, it's not difficult at all. SD media launcher + non SDHC card + Swiss = profit
That easy.
I need instructions.=p
Like this one?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/TOPRAM-4GB-4G-SD-Card-non-HC-V1-1-Secure-Digital-Memory-Card-for-older-devices-/330795797666
Also that SD Media Launcher is sold out.
1. Buy this
2. Get an old 2GB or smaller non SDHC card. Sometimes a 4GB works, but that's rare.
3. Download the latest Swiss nightly build
4. Put Swiss on the card.
5. Put the SD media launcher disc in the GC and the SD card w/ adapter in the memory slot
6. Load the SD Media launcher software and launch Swiss. At this point you have options. You can configure a real game disc or you can swap out the nonSDHC card for a bigger SDHC card with game ISOs on it. SDML and Swiss must always be launched from the nonSDHC card, but once it is launched it runs in internal memory and the card can be swapped.
1st link says it's sold out.=O
It wasn't displaying well on my tablet for some reason so I didn't see that. They might start making more, but if that's out of the picture for good, then I guess the only other option is a mod chip. Peagles knows all about that.
Edit: try contacting Code Junkies. The SDML is featured on their home page. So it may just be a matter of time when they get more in stock.
Ouch, yeh hopefully it's just temporary.
You can run all this stuff with something like a XenoGC but most people prefer to use this because it doesn't require modding. I can help with a modchip if you decide to go that route, Timu, just get in touch. Also I'd be tempted to go with a reliable brand SD card (Sandisk, Samsung, etc) rather than the one you linked, though it might be that I've just not heard of that one.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
Oh man it finally happened.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
How many frames of input lag does the default GBP software have? Is it better to use a wired controller over a WaveBird or a GBA with a GC-GBA link cable?
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
http://www.ebay.com/itm/361619106641
Is this a good S-Video cable to get for the GC/N64/SNES? I remember reading that if the cables had multiple video options (yellow + s-video) then the S-Video wasn't true S-Video or something?
Is this a good S-Video cable to get for the GC/N64/SNES? I remember reading that if the cables had multiple video options (yellow + s-video) then the S-Video wasn't true S-Video or something?
That seems like some rumor that a bunch of kids on the playground will make up.
The electrical connection occurs between the s-video and your TV, and the yellow video line is a dead cable.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
There's interference from the composite line when you have both on the same cable without shielding. It makes the s-video image look a lot worse.
I'd go with an OEM cable, but that one should be fine.
Yes.
Are they wired in series? What would cause that?
PumpkinSpice
Banned
Electromagnetic interferance
It's a thing you need to consider with analog signals especially -- you'll hear it with analog audio cables. Don't run your cables too close to outlet power strips either or you'll end up with garbage on your screen.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
I remember reading that the multi-cables could result in a checkerboard pattern to appear on the screen when using S-Video.
Also, as an HDTV is my only option, is S-Video a significant improvement over composite on an HDTV for the GC, N64, and SNES?
Oh electromagnetic would make sense, thanks.
Massive difference.
The step up from composite to S-Video is more apparent than going from S-Video to full RGB.
Yes.
From Experience: YES, no, yes.
GC with S-Video is a delight, at least when compared to composite. If you have an NTSC console without mod/Component it's the best bet and for 480i games it's pretty damn close to component.
Strangely, I've used an S video cable that produced amazing results on a GC and then used it on an N64. The difference was unnoticeable. I then bought another S video cable. Still shite. I've heard randomly that the monster S video cables are an improvement, but I cannot comment. From what I've seen with 2 seperate S video cables, the N64's S-video just straight up blows, perhaps even worse than composite because it can introduce a crosshatching effect.
SNES is a huge step up, like the GC, but unlike the GC there is a cheapish, better alternative in RGB. Obviously if your setup doesn't support RGB you're out of luck and S-Video still looks good.
That's weird, I never got that with my svideo cable on N64. And besides, svideo on N64 is still an improvement since it doesn't have composite flaws like rainbow banding, dot crawl and fuzzier image.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
How is it with the Super Game Boy?
Also, is there an appreciable difference between playing GC games on a GC with S-Video versus on a Wii with component? Can the GC actually use progressive scan through a Wii?
yep, without any modification as long as you use component cables. It's the cheapest way to get progressive scan through gamecube games.
you can also force 480p on PAL games via homebrew, and force 240p on all games too.
dancrane212
Member
Yes to both. S-video limits you to 480i which is noticeably worse than 480p. Cube component video is superior to the Wii but, IMO, it's not really noticeable even when side by side (at least between GC-video and Wii; I don't have actual Cube component cables to check against).
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
If I install Nintendont on my Wii can I launch GC games with a GC controller? Honestly the biggest reason I don't play GC games on my Wii is the inconvenience of needing to use a Wiimote to launch games.
Yep. Install priiloader and you can boot into the homebrew menu, bypassing the system menu entirely and Nintendont can be accessed from there - with a GameCube controller.
You can also disable the health and safety warning at the start. And then after Nintendo loads you can sync up other controllers such as a dualshock.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
S-video just comes down to the quality of the cable. A lot of composite + s-video cables are just really low quality junk which is why they are bad. But a cable with both connections can be fine, and a cable with just s-video can suck.
I have the Monoprice Wii cable with both and it works fine, though I'm using a good HDMI adapter instead now.
I have the Monoprice Wii cable with both and it works fine, though I'm using a good HDMI adapter instead now.
shanafan
Member
I do agree on this, having to hook up my classic controller to a Wiimote just to launch a GCN game is tedious. But, I do like going through the Wii's menus because of pure 2006 nostalgia
That weather channel music.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYFTSh5MRg4
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
Hot damn, I'm doing this. My friend is dropping off his copy of Lego Batman today and I dug out an ancient 2gb SD card from an ancient digital camera.
Make sure you install retroarch too! Plays all consoles up to SNES a treat and can be forced to display in native res 240p