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The original Super Mario Bros. didn't age well

I really want to look at this objectively, but every time I try to I just end up thinking Super Mario Bros. is more and more brilliant and timeless.

Am I......am I insane?
 
Yeah I guess it's just remembered as the game that started the true gaming revolution. But I kinda disagree because it still feels great to play it to this day, not any close to the perfect gameplay of SMB3 but still. Levels on SMB1 are kinda bland by today standars but that's why we have SMB2 aka, The Lost Levels aka one of the most difficult games ever. Mario Maker will have more Mario artstyle pixels, it was confirmed during E3 week so I'm 99.99998% sure they will include SMB3 artstyle and who knows what else.
 
Man Puncher said:
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Yeah...not saying you're wrong OP, but in my opinion, I can't call you right.
 
Disagree, strongly. It's still an excellent game, even by today's platforming standards.

Also, the graphics, music, sound effects ... all still charming.
 
Why the hell are there not more people agreeing? Allow me to one of them, because anyone with an understanding of acceleration physics should not be commending this game.


Mario SIGNIFICANTLY improved in later iterations by not being so reliant on acceleration. He feels less like a racecar and more like a person (read: natural platformer) in later games, which allows for a more natural and intuitive navigation of platform-heavy levels. The best proof of how unintuitive Mario's acceleration is in SMB1 is the transition from backwards jumping (i.e. to get a missed item) to forward movement, which can give him an awkward transition to max speed in a very quick and unintended way.

SMB1 is a classic that had an incredible influence on gaming as we know it, but that doesn't mean we have to suck its metaphorical cock every time it's mentioned. Titles like SMB3 have definitely aged better, and it's absolutely ignorant for us to pretend that this isn't the case because we owe some kind of unconditional love to SMB1.

edit: I wasn't the only person agreeing. I shouldn't skim topics so fast. Apologies. Edited first sentence.
 
If I were to pick one and only one game for title of best aged game - SMB1 is it. It's exactly as good as it's always been and there's definitely no other game I've taken the time to go back to as much as SMB1.

Of course that doesn't make it "best game ever", that's a completely different question. There's just no component of the game that feels aged or worse in any way at all since it came out.
 
Revisionists...

SMB1 was very hard to play after SMB2 (USA) and SMB3/SMW were around.

SMB1 is a pretty stiff game compared to it's sequels.
 
The only problems I have with it are the dumb mazes and the recycled levels. And the cloudbush. Those are all relics of old 8-bit design and technical limitations. Otherwise this game is still a joy to play, the controls are perfect to this day. I hope the physics are exactly the same in Mario Maker because new levels with these mechanics will be awesome, they've lost nothing.
 
I think that SMB holds up very well. In my opinion the game's greatest weakness in these times is the relatively limited move set/power ups. However, the levels were designed with the limited power ups in mind so it isn't an issue.

I do think SMB3 was a much better game though.

For the record, I have and play SMB on my 3DS and Wii U. Man, back in the day I had the NES Deluxe Set which came with Duck Hunt and Gyromite. I actually had to go and buy Super Mario Bros from my allowance money.
 
Arabian Mage said:
While I played far worse platmormers on NES, I agree that it didn't age all that well.

SMB3 and SMW have far since surpassed it by a huge margin.
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Just because better games have come out it doesnt affect how well a games aged. Smb1 has aged fine. The fundamentals are simple and the game is easy for anyone to pick up today and play and enjoy. People seem to misunderstand what aging poorly really means.
 
Never played much SMB in the old days. I liked it but wasn't good at it. SMB 2 USA, SMB 3, SMW I played plenty of, but never finished SMB more than once.

So I was worried when I went to play NES Remix and SMB 1 was featured heavily. Surprisingly, it was easy to control, fun to play, with perfectly tight controls, and well designed levels. Even the sprite work was still visually entertaining.

So, no, I don't agree it aged badly. Visually, 2d sprites age fine, even sprites as primitive as SMB 1. And a game being old doesn't mean it has to play badly. SMB plays well, as do many other games from the 80s, even games from the early 80s like Donkey Kong and Galaga.

- the variety of scenarios and situations is barebones: levels slowly add more elements that are repeated over and over again with small variations

- you can't go back in the levels: this automatically halves the potential of the game design,
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The first is a poor criticism. This is the crux of most game design. Introduce mechanics, make the player master them, then challenge them with harder levels. The second is applicable to many modern games. It isn't a good criteria for something being "old feeling". Nor does it in any way stop a game from being fun.

I won't even bother with further comments, tbqh.
 
SJS said:
SMB1 is a classic that had an incredible influence on gaming as we know it, but that doesn't mean we have to suck its metaphorical cock every time it's mentioned. Titles like SMB3 have definitely aged better, and it's absolutely ignorant for us to pretend that this isn't the case because we owe some kind of unconditional love to SMB1.
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I find SMB1 more fun to play than most of the later Mario games, honestly. I actually really like it's physics and controls. It just feels good.
 
I agree that SMB2 and 3 have aged better but 1 is still a great game and fun to play. It has aged really well IMO compared to most NES games.
 
It's one of the few games you can always play. Short levels, tight physics, and a decent amount of pure, no gimmicks challenge thrown in for good measure. So I'd have to disagree, it's aged exceptionally well in my opinion.

This coming from someone who barely played it until just a few years back.
 
I have to disagree, OP. It's controls are tight and its levels are fun. Sure, it's a bit simplistic and it's not as fun to go back to as 3 or World, but compared to games from 1985 it has aged very, very well.
 
Went back and read some more posts; is it weird that I prefer 1 over 3 or World? The controls always felt looser in those two, and some of the levels can drag on a bit. That and the newer power-up systems really diminish a lot of the games' level design. You can just not use them, but then you're passing up on a different part of the game.

Still like all three of them, but 1 has always been the one I return to.
 
SJS said:
Why the hell are there not more people agreeing? Allow me to one of them, because anyone with an understanding of acceleration physics should not be commending this game.


Mario SIGNIFICANTLY improved in later iterations by not being so reliant on acceleration. He feels less like a racecar and more like a person (read: natural platformer) in later games, which allows for a more natural and intuitive navigation of platform-heavy levels. The best proof of how unintuitive Mario's acceleration is in SMB1 is the transition from backwards jumping (i.e. to get a missed item) to forward movement, which can give him an awkward transition to max speed in a very quick and unintended way.

SMB1 is a classic that had an incredible influence on gaming as we know it, but that doesn't mean we have to suck its metaphorical cock every time it's mentioned. Titles like SMB3 have definitely aged better, and it's absolutely ignorant for us to pretend that this isn't the case because we owe some kind of unconditional love to SMB1.

edit: I wasn't the only person agreeing. I shouldn't skim topics so fast. Apologies. Edited first sentence.
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Arguing about "intuitiveness" in a video game usually smacks of pseudo-intellectualism. I think it's a pretty empty word.

When I first played Super Mario Bros at 4 years of age, you know what I would have thought would have been intuitive? Jumping by pressing up on the D-pad. I distinctly remember it taking me a while to cope with a dedicated jump button. But I got used to it, and eventually I realized that there's a pretty good reason why the controls work the way that they do.

The obstacles, levels, challenges, etc. in Super Mario Bros are designed precisely around the way Mario controls. It doesn't matter whether they're "intuitive" or not.

ChrisD said:
Went back and read some more posts; is it weird that I prefer 1 over 3 or World? The controls always felt looser in those two, and some of the levels can drag on a bit. That and the newer power-up systems really diminish a lot of the games' level design. You can just not use them, but then you're passing up on a different part of the game.

Still like all three of them, but 1 has always been the one I return to.
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I like SMB1 and SMB3 for different reasons, and I don't really have a strong preference between the two. I think they're pretty good at accomplishing the things that they set out to do.

I could go on forever about how much SMW just feels like aimless busywork, though.
 
I'd have to say you didn't age well (not in an insulting way at all), but there's nothing wrong with that. I had the same issue. Then I took a while and kinda dialed back to when I was a kid and sat down continuously playing the game. I fell in love with it all over again when I kinda found my childhood wonder again.

It's not the best Mario, but it's still a great game with some fun challenge.


Of course this is all opinion and you probably aged wonderfully :D
 
ChrisD said:
Went back and read some more posts; is it weird that I prefer 1 over 3 or World? The controls always felt looser in those two, and some of the levels can drag on a bit. That and the newer power-up systems really diminish a lot of the games' level design. You can just not use them, but then you're passing up on a different part of the game.

Still like all three of them, but 1 has always been the one I return to.
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Not weird at all. I'm the same way.
 
It's held up fine, it's good reputation is just ruined by the following games shitting on it with their superior reputations.
 
I remember when New SMB hit the DS, my friend and I were complaining about the slippery controls. I asked, "It's like SMB was, right?"

"No," he replied, "you need to play it again."

We popped SMB into the NES and yeah, there's a sense of acceleration and momentum that makes it different from the rest of the series, but it's done extremely well. It felt way better than NSMB DS.

Anyway, it's still a fantastic game. Popped it in to test my recent NES RGB mod and ended up playing through it, no warps. Feels great, lots of fun to play. I don't have the levels memorized in the slightest, I just don't suck at moving a character around the screen.
 
Super Mario World is the one that aged poorly for me, I just can't enjoy the physics and level design of that game any more, the experience isn't dense enough. But I still love playing the original Mario, the way momentum works means that every jumping challenge is based on how you tackled the previous section. In Mario World by contrast it is common that you can just sort of react to each obstacle by itself as it occurs which gets boring once you have completely learned how to play and remember the levels.

But I think New Super Luigi Bros. U is even better than the original Mario by this standard.
 
orborborb said:
Super Mario World is the one that aged poorly for me, I just can't enjoy the physics and level design of that game any more, the experience isn't dense enough. But I still love playing the original Mario, the way momentum works means that every jumping challenge is based on how you tackled the previous section. In Mario World by contrast it is common that you can just sort of react to each obstacle by itself as it occurs which gets boring once you have completely learned how to play and remember the levels.

But I think New Super Luigi Bros. is even better than the original Mario by this standard.
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Agreed. Somebody on this forum once described it as a 'put the key in the keyhole simulator'. A bit of an oversimplification perhaps, but not far from the truth.
 
JoeInky said:
It's one of the most perfectly designed games ever made, there's nothing that went into the design of the game that could be considered superfluous.
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This is how I feel, too. They accomplished so much with so little. Heck, it's the only game in the series where collecting coins is exciting because extra lives are genuinely rare.


edit: What makes World fun isn't its platforming challenge so much as how it's a big 2D sandbox where everything interacts with everything else. It's a very different type of game from the rest of the series.
 
You want to see something that didn't age well? Go play Pac-Land, an earlier example of scrolling platformer.
 
still plays better than Little Big Planet

on topic no, i don't agree. The mechanics and platforming physics are timeless and work just fine today. Put a new coat of paint on it and it'd work just as well.
 
SJS said:
Why the hell are there not more people agreeing? Allow me to one of them, because anyone with an understanding of acceleration physics should not be commending this game.


Mario SIGNIFICANTLY improved in later iterations by not being so reliant on acceleration. He feels less like a racecar and more like a person (read: natural platformer) in later games, which allows for a more natural and intuitive navigation of platform-heavy levels. The best proof of how unintuitive Mario's acceleration is in SMB1 is the transition from backwards jumping (i.e. to get a missed item) to forward movement, which can give him an awkward transition to max speed in a very quick and unintended way.

SMB1 is a classic that had an incredible influence on gaming as we know it, but that doesn't mean we have to suck its metaphorical cock every time it's mentioned. Titles like SMB3 have definitely aged better, and it's absolutely ignorant for us to pretend that this isn't the case because we owe some kind of unconditional love to SMB1.

edit: I wasn't the only person agreeing. I shouldn't skim topics so fast. Apologies. Edited first sentence.
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you act as if the way the physics/acceleration work in smb1 are objectively worse than the sequels
preference. how does it work?
 
SonicMegaDrive said:
Agreed. Somebody on this forum once described it as a 'put the key in the keyhole simulator'. A bit of an oversimplification perhaps, but not far from the truth.
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Super Mario World de-emphasized platform challenges in favor of exploration.

And I suppose there's nothing really wrong with that, but the thing is, though, that sense of discovery only exists on the first playthrough. And then it's gone forever. If you're not the nostalgic type, then I don't think that game has much lasting appeal compared to its predecessors. It feels so hollow, and all of those new powers they tossed in but never challenged you to master just feel like window dressing.

I can go back to pretty much any of the NES games and feel like there's more substance to be had in them. They require dexterity. Your actions have consequences. The Fire Flower is so dominant in SMB1, yet the penalty for taking a single hit is so severe that you still have to give your full attention at all times; it's not unlike power-up acquisition in a shmup. There's a real feeling of anxiety when you slip up a few too many times in a row and your lives count runs low, and a real feeling of accomplishment when you overcome that. It's a very engaging game for that reason, even after you're familiar with all the content. And when SMB3 tossed in some seriously powerful stuff like the Hammer Suit, it at least had the common decency to make it rare and impossible to farm, forcing you to earn the reward of being able to use it for extended periods of time.

SMW feels more like a game about searching for platforms than, well, a platformer.
 
What am I even reading here?

Super Mario Bros. didn't age well?
Seriously?

It's still an absolutely perfectly crafted gaming experience.

Although, my favorite game in the Mario series is
the US version of Super Mario Bros. 2 >.>


SonicMegaDrive said:
Agreed. Somebody on this forum once described it as a 'put the key in the keyhole simulator'. A bit of an oversimplification perhaps, but not far from the truth.
Click to expand...

Yeah, this thread has gone off the deep end.
 
orborborb said:
Super Mario World is the one that aged poorly for me, I just can't enjoy the physics and level design of that game any more, the experience isn't dense enough. But I still love playing the original Mario, the way momentum works means that every jumping challenge is based on how you tackled the previous section. In Mario World by contrast it is common that you can just sort of react to each obstacle by itself as it occurs which gets boring once you have completely learned how to play and remember the levels.

But I think New Super Luigi Bros. U is even better than the original Mario by this standard.
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I agree about Super Mario World, in fact I consider it inferior to SMB3.
 
Sixfortyfive said:
The thing is, though, that sense of discovery only exists on the first playthrough. And then it's gone forever. If you're not the nostalgic type, then I don't think that game has much lasting appeal compared to its predecessors. It feels so hollow, and all of those new powers they tossed in but never challenged you to master just feel like window dressing.
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Exactly. Now don't get me wrong, when I bought my launch SNES, I enjoyed Super Mario World immensely. It was one of the best launch titles ever. Discovering all those secrets and hidden exits was extremely satisfying and fun the first time through the game. SMW does what it does and it does it extremely well.

But once you have it all memorized, it does feel like a bit of a chore after a while.
 
Never played the games growing up as I was Sega at th time but been playing them on virtual console and all of the Mario games hold up so well. Smb1 put some new platform games to shame.
 
ExFalsoQuodlibet said:
- the physics are designed in a way that don't make you feel like you're constantly controlling your character in a tight way, but in a way that's basically equivalent to throwing your character around like a projectile, with the need to carefully consider the ballistics at every jump;
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You mean it controls more like real physics requiring skill on the part of the player?
 
I've played 1-1 and 1-2 a billion times but I can't even remember what 1-3 looks like. I probably just suck at the game.
 
SeventhSon said:
You mean it controls more like real physics requiring skill on the part of the player?
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It controls more like real physics, true. It isn't necessarily a good thing for a platformer, but I guess someone prefers that.

"requiring skill on the part of the player" doesn't imply or needs "real physics" in any way
 
eot said:
I've played 1-1 and 1-2 a billion times but I can't even remember what 1-3 looks like. I probably just suck at the game.
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Or you probably just always used the warps at the end of 1-2, likely going straight to 4-1.
And from 4-2, one can go straight to 8-1.

I always enjoy going through the entire game without using warps. Much more enjoyable that way.
 
ExFalsoQuodlibet said:
It controls more like real physics, true. It isn't necessarily a good thing for a platformer, but I guess someone prefers that.

"requiring skill on the part of the player" doesn't imply or needs "real physics" in any way
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Planning your jump ahead of time, understanding the momentum involved is inherently more skillful than having nearly full air control after a jump.
 
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