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[Kafel]

This thread has gone real stupid.

Worship another developer and stop being disrepectful to others' tastes.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

This thread has gone real stupid.

Worship another developer and stop being disrepectful to others' tastes.

Rare fans are the new Sonic fans.

 

[Sydle]

This is what I don't get and pisses me off. You find it 'disheartening' that they won't return to their old franchises, but you will 'be there day one' to buy a shitty game? You are giving them more reason NOT to return to the old games!


EDIT: And you consider Kinect Sports an innovation? It's a blatant ripoff of every other generically-titled sports game!

Kinect Sports is not shitty. It one-ups Wii Sports in every way and achieves that certain Rare charm. I enjoyed it a lot. Looks like Kinect Sports 2 is just getting better, so, yeah, I'll be there day one.

Oh, and I also enjoyed Kameo, Viva Pinata, and Banjo N&B. I'd like to see them revisit those, but that doesn't seem likely, so I'm moving on. Kthx.

 

[Sydle]

Why do people always forget that a majority of Rare's great staff moved over to now-defunct Free Radical!!!!!. That was before they were making games for Microsoft. I always see that as the turning point for Rare.

Regardless Nuts & Bolts and Viva Pinata are still amazing gems no matter the hate that Rare gets.

Because it's been grossly exaggerated for years. IIRC, it was a total of 6 people that left, 4 went to FR, and the other two went to startups.

 

[Shiggy]

Because it's been grossly exaggerated for years. IIRC, it was a total of 6 people that left, 4 went to FR, and the other two went to startups.

This is true. The majority of staff only left in 2009 when they started to focus on Kinect and then last year after they decided to hand the studio directly to Microsoft management. Most were replaced by cheap contractors who've just left university.

 

[InaudibleWhispa]

Kinect Sports is not shitty. It one-ups Wii Sports in every way and achieves that certain Rare charm. I enjoyed it a lot. Looks like Kinect Sports 2 is just getting better, so, yeah, I'll be there day one.

Yeah, I still think Kinect Sports is the best motion controlled sports collection on the market. They could have done a pretty basic Wii Sports clone, but they added in a ton of content, features and polish. Party mode, online play, over 20 events including the mini-gamnes (which are often more fun than the actual sports). The presentation with the awesome (and awesomely timed) soundtrack, mascots and little touches like crowd control...

It's easy to pass it off as "just another crappy sports mini-game collection", but it's easily at the top of its game. It might not be a genre you give a shit about, but Rare do give a shit, and that is what makes it shine. Ubisoft's MotionSports... now that is "just another crappy sports mini-game collection".

 

[Shiggy]

If anyone's interested, these are the only employees who worked on or tested a Rare title published before 2005 and who were listed in the Kinect Sports credits. A few additional people worked on a Rare game before 2005 and are now only contracted, but I only list those that have a steady job there.

Brendan Gunn
Steve Horsburgh
Paul Mountain
David Pashute
John Pegg

Gavin Flint
Steve Mayles
Ryan Stevenson

George Andreas
Gregg Mayles
Shaun Read
Gary Richards
Luke Munton

Louise Ridgeway

Robin Beanland
Jamie Hughes
Martin Penny
Shawn Pile

Richard Cousins
Chris Sutherland

Chris Marlow

Paul Cunningham
Peter Hentze
Stephen McFarlane
Keith Rabbette

Dale Murchie
Gavin Price
David Rose

Steven Brand
Nick Burton
Leigh Loveday

Chris Allcock
Paul Machacek
Anthony Salway
Stephen Stamper
Mark Stevenson
James Thomas
Andrew Wilson

Simon Farmer
Salvatore Fileccia
Lee Musgrave
Lee Schuneman


That's probably another reason why they cannot return to their old franchises. Losing more than 50 % of your staff within only a few years is really amazing, especially when some of them stayed there for over 10 years.

 

[Sydle]

Yeah, I still think Kinect Sports is the best motion controlled sports collection on the market. They could have done a pretty basic Wii Sports clone, but they added in a ton of content, features and polish. Party mode, online play, over 20 events including the mini-gamnes (which are often more fun than the actual sports). The presentation with the awesome (and awesomely timed) soundtrack, mascots and little touches like crowd control...

It's easy to pass it off as "just another crappy sports mini-game collection", but it's easily at the top of its game. It might not be a genre you give a shit about, but Rare do give a shit, and that is what makes it shine. Ubisoft's MotionSports... now that is "just another crappy sports mini-game collection".

This is where Rare shines. DKC from Mario World, Banjo from Mario 64, DKR from Mario Kart, Kinect Sports from Wii Sports -- Rare is strongest when they have strong game play concepts to follow, not when they try to lead (Banjo N&B, VP).

I am still baffled that, in all these years, we haven't seen Rare revisit a third-person action game (like JFG) to simply make more cash. It seems like such a no-brainer to make a 4-player co-op game that melds game play concepts from Ratchet & Clank, Mass Effect, and Gears of War in a campaign built for replays (think score attacks) and a host of other multi-player modes. Leverage all that talent at 343i to help design the game's blueprints, then let Rare work their wizardy on the presentation, online code (PDZ is still amazing), and technical aspects. Seems like a type of game you could make a sequel to every 2-3 years and rake in cash to support more art-house type projects (XBLA games, Viva Pinata, Banjo, Kameo, etc.).

I still think it's worth revisiting Perfect Dark as well to make another FPS money machine, but it would be better if they hired professional writers and got some help from 343i on design and story guidelines (campy and cliche can be fine, but there's a goddamn limit, Rare).

I just want to see them survive. I hope Scott and Craig have something else in mind than just Kinect Sports Season 3 to carry them through 2012.

That's probably another reason why they cannot return to their old franchises. Losing more than 50 % of your staff within only a few years is really amazing, especially when some of them stayed there for over 10 years.

It probably has more to do with the fact that those people didn't know what to do with their franchises. Seeing and hearing about all the different looks and concepts for PDZ was nuts, and then recently all the ideas that Chris had for another PD made my head spin. How many times did Kameo change in its 5 year development? Why did they stray so far from Banjo's core game play? What were they thinking with GbtG? Viva Pinata is great, but it's not a mass-market title to keep the studio afloat. There was a lack of direction and focus, and they needed a shake up.

 

[Shiggy]

.

 

[[Nintex]]

@shaolindave00 You have never worked for a company where even a prototype needs almost beta quality artwork or management wouldn't look at it?

Rare management still manages to amaze me to this day.

 

[Shiggy]

Shintaro Kanaoya is no longer Head of Business Strategy and Development but Director of Franchise Strategy. (franchise referring to Kinect Sports)

 

[Mael]

Well that's good that they provide gears to go with their other products.
they provided the laxative now they're promoting toilet paper.

Yeah and people wondered why I didn't like the MSFT takeover....I still can't believe they shelved so many stuffs...
And that they required a product to be post beta to even consider it alpha too, I mean no wonder their product felt that polished.

 

[Shiggy]

David Wise is producing the music for Nyamyam's first iPad title!
http://nyamyam.com/75/news/introducing-david-wise

Crispin Hands says he's now audio director at both BigPark and Rare Ltd.:
http://www.linkedin.com/profile/vie...p_/vincent*5piras/0/954/b55&trk=ppro_viewmore

Amir should be more active in here

 

[WillyFive]

Here's footage of the beta for Diddy Kong Pilot (a build from February 19, 2003).

It's almost identical to what became Banjo Pilot.

 

[[Nintex]]

David Wise is producing the music for Nyamyam's first iPad title!
http://nyamyam.com/75/news/introducing-david-wise

Crispin Hands says he's now audio director at both BigPark and Rare Ltd.:
http://www.linkedin.com/profile/vie...p_/vincent*5piras/0/954/b55&trk=ppro_viewmore

Amir should be more active in here

Wait wat wait

Where's Robin Beanland??????

 

[IOnEI Falcon]

Wait wat wait

Where's Robin Beanland??????

Haha!

Edmundree Ed Bryan
@TheRealBeano Neogaf is wondering where you've gone ...

 

[Shiggy]

So there was a Kinect Sports Season 2 preview event. Has anyone seen some actual developers there? I only saw Scott Henson.
Here's another video from that preview event ("we don't care about that game or the studio, but the office looks nice"): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CSoA_OKQZM

As the future of the Twycross location is depending on the success of Kinect Sports Season 2, Henson is already looking for a few other jobs:

"I'll shut this down"

"Then I'll run over to..."

"... Lionhead, Peter!"

"And I'll shut that down!"

 

[[Nintex]]

Haha!

Edmundree Ed Bryan
@TheRealBeano Neogaf is wondering where you've gone ...

TheRealBeano Robin Beanland

@Edmundree I'm sat here having a cup of tea


TheRealBeano Robin Beanland

:'-(

:'(

 

[Shiggy]

:'(

Scott Henson also commented on that.

 

[[Nintex]]

Scott Henson also commented on that.

 

[Shiggy]

That one's great, isn't it?
He's actually a great guy for such images.

 

[ii Stryker]

I feel bad for those effected but how many staff members does it really take to make avatar clothing and Wii clones?

 

[Shiggy]

Now take that Ed, we are also watching your activities


The project manager bitching continues:

Kieran HJ Connell: Back when a team of < 20 people could make a game and we didn't have a "producer" either.

Ed Bryan: LOL. Now every team has >20 producers ...

Will Bryan: &#8206;+20 PM's.

Grant Kirkhope: &#8206;20 PJM's ...... Noooooooooo!!!!!!

 

[[Nintex]]

Now take that Ed, we are also watching your activities


The project manager bitching continues:

It's kinda funny how the political correct Microsoft Studios marketing machine just keeps on running despite all that. Former Rare employees might as well vomit on stage at E3 and throw prototypes around and the press would still go: "Yeah, Rare! great guys over there, can't wait to see what the Conker guys are secretly up to!"

 

[Shiggy]

It's kinda funny how the political correct Microsoft Studios marketing machine just keeps on running despite all that. Former Rare employees might as well vomit on stage at E3 and throw prototypes around and the press would still go: "Yeah, Rare! great guys over there, can't wait to see what the Conker guys are secretly up to!"

I'm surprised that Scotty knows that Rare has existed for 25 years already.

 

[[Nintex]]

I'm surprised that Scotty knows that Rare has existed for 25 years already.

Well, he had to carve it into the gravestone.

 

[Shiggy]

Well, he had to carve it into the gravestone.

That guy's great, I think.

 

[[Nintex]]

Remember that Mark Betteridge remained around as an advisor when Henson came in? Whatever happened to that?

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Remember that Mark Betteridge remained around as an advisor when Henson came in? Whatever happened to that?

Shuffled out the door when they brought in Craig Duncan earlier this year, perhaps?

 

[Shiggy]

Remember that Mark Betteridge remained around as an advisor when Henson came in? Whatever happened to that?

As he was removed from his position, I think that story was only a way for him not to lose face.
Can't see him here either: http://twitpic.com/60bmmq

 

[Shiggy]

Some more for our Scott "I stab Rare to death" Henson fans:

A Scott for everyone, special thanks to Scott Henson for providing us with such great material.

 

[IOnEI Falcon]

Some really cool information was just released on purerarity regarding Quest. Mark Edmonds interestingly enough was the source.

http://www.purerarity.com/2011/09/19/a-cascade-of-information/

 

[Ocean_Voyager]

I know that this is slightly off-topic but I wanted to help spread the word as much as possible. We're trying to get a single unified Twitter campaign going to let Rare and Microsoft see that there is enough demand for a return to the Killer Instinct series. If we all tweet the hash tag #killerinstinctxbla then hopefully they'll take notice. Sometimes to get something you've just got to try and get it done yourself. Include @RareLtd @Microsoft @Xbox in your tweet too so that they all see it. Thanks, let's hope it gets some attention! Please try to go easy on me if what I've just done is not cool, I'm just trying to get everyone behind one big concerted effort!

 

[Shiggy]

I know that this is slightly off-topic but I wanted to help spread the word as much as possible. We're trying to get a single unified Twitter campaign going to let Rare and Microsoft see that there is enough demand for a return to the Killer Instinct series. If we all tweet the hash tag #killerinstinctxbla then hopefully they'll take notice. Sometimes to get something you've just got to try and get it done yourself. Include @RareLtd @Microsoft @Xbox in your tweet too so that they all see it. Thanks, let's hope it gets some attention! Please try to go easy on me if what I've just done is not cool, I'm just trying to get everyone behind one big concerted effort!

That's outright stupid. There are a million better things to do - e.g. praying that Microsoft won't shut down Rare after Kinect Sport 2 or handing the KI franchise to the original developers or a different studio. But asking Rare to do another KI? lol

(Sounds harder than it is meant. The KI developers all left by now and Microsoft will not return to old franchises of Rare, they are Kinect-only now)

 

[Ocean_Voyager]

I know you didn't meant that to be harsh but I don't think it's that stupid an idea. There's nothing wrong with letting Microsoft know that there's a huge demand for it. Sometimes that's the only way the people at the top realise how badly this game is wanted by some. Point taken about staff leaving but you don't need the old staff to port it over. Someone like 4J could handle it just fine I feel; the core gameplay doesn't need to change, just jazz up the graphics a bit. Ultimately this exercise is to consolidate all the mumurings about bringing KI back into one campaign rather than separate, less effective ones.

Edit: sorry, I should have clarified that I'm talking about bringing either the SNES KI or N64 Killer Instinct Gold to XBLA as they did with Banjo-Kazooie, Banjo-Tooie and Perfect Dark - I'm not talking about an all-new KI. My bad, sorry.

 

[Hero of Legend]

At this point it's useless for anyone to even want Nintendo to buy Rare in its current form, unless Nintendo can magically recruit most of the key folks that left.

I think Grant and Dave would be first in line, considering Grant said that he'd pay MS all the money he made post-buyout to return Rare to its former glory IIRC. Chris Seavor seemed to wish he was making games that the Wii U controller as well.

 

[Yoshi]

If there are still a lot of staffers of the Nintendo times that would like to work with Nintendo, I'd agree, that it'd be best for us if Nintendo built a new studio with them and maybe buy a few of the old Rare franchises back from MS. If MS doesn't want to use them anyway, they might accept a reasonable offer.

 

[IOnEI Falcon]

I know you didn't meant that to be harsh but I don't think it's that stupid an idea. There's nothing wrong with letting Microsoft know that there's a huge demand for it. Sometimes that's the only way the people at the top realise how badly this game is wanted by some. Point taken about staff leaving but you don't need the old staff to port it over. Someone like 4J could handle it just fine I feel; the core gameplay doesn't need to change, just jazz up the graphics a bit. Ultimately this exercise is to consolidate all the mumurings about bringing KI back into one campaign rather than separate, less effective ones.

Edit: sorry, I should have clarified that I'm talking about bringing either the SNES KI or N64 Killer Instinct Gold to XBLA as they did with Banjo-Kazooie, Banjo-Tooie and Perfect Dark - I'm not talking about an all-new KI. My bad, sorry.

The GE XBLA petition has been around for ever now and has gained I believe around 30,000 signatures and nothing has happened. I don't think anything will be able to get as much support behind it as that and that couldn't do anything.

 

[Ocean_Voyager]

Yeah but the difference with GoldenEye is that it is mired in licencing issues which means it will likely never see the light of day. Killer Instinct does not have that problem.

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

New eurogamer interview?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...s-talk-killer-instinct-perfect-dark-interview

Ex rare staff talks about Rare and their games.

 

[cajunator]

This thread is pretty depressing.
If it weren't for nintendo studios and independent developers I would lose all hope for gaming.

 

[Rad-]

New eurogamer interview?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...s-talk-killer-instinct-perfect-dark-interview

Ex rare staff talks about Rare and their games.

Pretty interesting part:

All the games we've worked on, they've all made money, which ultimately, if you're a business, that's what you have to do. Perfect Dark Zero, from a development cost, made four times its money back.

 

[Shiggy]

Non-news of the day:

Another interesting fact he told me was that Chris Seavor and Chris Tilston do not get on.

http://www.purerarity.com/2002/06/28/divided-and-conkered/

Chris Seavor:
eurogamer.net/articles/2011-… here's what some old 'friends' of mine have been up to...

And stealth bash by Phil Dunne:

Eurogamer: There are over 500 people working on Call of Duty across seven studios.

Phil Dunne: How many of those people are managers? I bet it's a lot of them.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...killer-instinct-perfect-dark-interview?page=2

 

[[Nintex]]

 

[Shiggy]

Great

 

[IOnEI Falcon]

Over at RWC there is a Grunty's Revenge Beta Debug that is going to be released soon! You can check out a preview video now.

 

[IOnEI Falcon]

Over at RWC there is a Grunty's Revenge Beta Debug that is going to be released soon! You can check out a preview video now.

The ROM has now been released! w00t!

 

[Nuclear Muffin]

The ROM has now been released! w00t!

Hopefully we'll see more of those DKR/Banjo Pilot betas!

 

[Shiggy]

Hopefully we'll see more of those DKR/Banjo Pilot betas!

I wonder how many betas he's got!

 

[[Nintex]]

I wonder how many betas he's got!

It depends on who supplied them, if everyone chipped in it shoud be a whole lot. Probably the last remaining copies too because Rare Ltd. burned everything not Kinect Sports at Mt. Doom.