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The REAL February NBA Thread - Accept No Substitute

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gat dayum

goaltend?

the world may never know.

and as good of a player as brad is, he needs to calm down and stop being such a whiney ass.

It was a great game but as I am a kings fan then it was obviously shit ;)
 
Cloudy said:
He should have been dunking that anyways...
Click to expand...

He should have dunked the earlier one he had on the fast break, but with time running out it's better to get the shot off than try to dunk it.

And is any team as refucked as the Kings and Pacers repeatidly are? Do we need more smog and prostitutes to get a damned call?
 
In the latest Sports Illustrated, Kobe was picked "most feared in the last second of the game."

227 nba players were polled and they voted kobe as the player they fear most when the ball is in his hands the last seconds of a game

he got 56 percent of the votes

iverson was next with 13 percent

miller got 9 percent

i dont remember the rest.It was in the new sports illustrated this week.

oh ya and tmac was next with only 7 percent.I think after tmac noone got more then 1 percent.Tim duncan only got 1 percent.
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Above the cylinder = goaltending...

Suns are Stern's team this year. I pity anyone playing close games with them in the playoffs :lol
 
Cloudy said:
Above the cylinder = goaltending...

Suns are Stern's team this year. I pity anyone playing close games with them in the playoffs :lol
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KOBEXPN.JPG


kobexprinciple.JPG


I take back that whole "there aren't any Suns Haters here" thing, but Kobex doesn't really count since, ultimately, he hates everything that is not Kobe.
 
Above the cylinder does = goaltending though. The odd thing is that on Sportscenter and on AP they referred to the block as "a clean block" which was never the issue. Do people not know of the above the cyliner rule?
 
"Charles Barkley was a great player, but his time has passed -- he's done," said Michelle Carter, Vince's mother. "I'm sure he was hired to be Charles Barkley, but there are others who speak much better. I know negativity sells, but that says a lot about not just the NBA and the media, but where our society has come.

"I was a teacher for 20 years, and I could easily be critical of Charles Barkley, because the man can't speak three sentences without destroying the language. It's an embarrassment as an African-American to listen to this supposedly college-educated man, and his grammar is so atrocious. Through all of the years of criticism, all of the garbage, we've had to become very thick-skinned."
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VC's mom unloading on Chuck :lol
 
Cloudy said:
proof1.bmp


proof2.bmp



ABOVE THE RIM = GOALTENDING!!!!
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snoophateradelogo.gif


Funny to see a supposed Lakers fan whining incessantly about a close call when you guys made so much fun of Kings fans for doing the same when they were much more in the right (and the situation was much more important) than you are now.

Which proves once again, the First Corollary of the Kobex Principle- you are not a Lakers fan, you are a KOBE fan!
 
AstroLad said:
Funny to see a supposed Lakers fan whining incessantly about a close call when you guys made so much fun of Kings fans for doing the same when they were much more in the right (and the situation was much more important) than you are now.

Which proves once again, the First Corollary of the Kobex Principle- you are not a Lakers fan, you are a KOBE fan!
Click to expand...

Whatever, dude. I'm a basketball fan first and foremost and the Kings CLEARLY got robbed. There is no rivalry anymore and I have no reason to "hate" the Kings. The current Lakers roster can't beat the Suns but I like their chances against the Kings in a first round matchup so I actually root for Sactown.

All that said, that was a fucking bogus call and you know it. When my team is helped by the refs, I can admit it :lol
 
Matlock said:
I was not aware it was racist, my apologies. :-|
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It isn't racist. Don't be brainwashed by the Jordaphiles.

Its beautiful! Sign me up! Em said I needed a "Jordan" avatar, that leaves enough wiggle room for me to get a Monkianesque Jordan pic!
 
Again, doesn't the ball have to be on a DOWNWARD path? it was hitting the apex when Amare swatted the shit out of it.

Let's not forget that Webber travelled... if you wan't to get into missing calls. ;)
 
Cloudy said:
Whatever, dude. I'm a basketball fan first and foremost and the Kings CLEARLY got robbed. There is no rivalry anymore and I have no reason to "hate" the Kings. The current Lakers roster can't beat the Suns but I like their chances against the Kings in a first round matchup so I actually root for Sactown.

All that said, that was a fucking bogus call and you know it. When my team is helped by the refs, I can admit it :lol
Click to expand...

Come on now....

Miguel said:
Again, doesn't the ball have to be on a DOWNWARD path? it was hitting the apex when Amare swatted the shit out of it.
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http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_11.html?nav=ArticleList

Section I-A Player Shall Not:
a. Touch the ball or the basket ring when the ball is using the basket ring as its lower base.
EXCEPTION: If a player near his own basket has his hand legally in contact with the ball, it is not a violation if his contact with the ball continues after the ball enters the cylinder, or if, in such action, he touches the basket.
b. Touch the ball when it is above the basket ring and within the imaginary cylinder.
c. For goaltending to occur, the ball, in the judgment of the official, must have a chance to score.
d. During a field goal attempt, touch a ball after it has touched any part of the backboard above ring level, whether the ball is considered on its upward or downward flight.
e. During a field goal attempt, touch a ball after it has touched the backboard below the ring level and while the ball is on its upward flight.
f. Trap the ball against the face of the backboard. (To be a trapped ball, three elements must exist simultaneously. The hand, the ball and the backboard must all occur at the same time. A batted ball against the backboard is not a trapped ball.)
g. Touch any live ball from within the playing area that is on its downward flight with an opportunity to touch the basket ring. This is considered to be a "field goal attempt" or trying for a goal.
h. Touch the ball at any time with a hand which is through the basket ring.
i. Vibrate the rim or backboard so as to cause the ball to make an unnatural bounce.
PENALTY: If the violation is at the opponent's basket, the offended team is awarded two points, if the attempt is from the two point zone and three points if it is from the three point zone. The crediting of the score and subsequent procedure is the same as if the awarded score has resulted from the ball having gone through the basket, except that the official shall hand the ball to a player of the team entitled to the throw-in. If the violation is at a team's own basket, no points can be scored and the ball is awarded to the offended team at the free throw line extended on either sideline. If there is a violation by both teams, play shall be resumed by a jump ball between any two opponents at the center circle.


I've rerun that a few times and the ball looks like it's JUST about to reach the Apex... it's certainly does not look to be on the way down.
 
Again, doesn't the ball have to be on a DOWNWARD path? it was hitting the apex when Amare swatted the shit out of it
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http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_11.html?nav=ArticleList

Read item b. I'm surprised many people don't know this rule. Maybe the refs didn't know either :lol


Also, here are some past Allstar clips I had on my pc:

http://www.cs.wayne.edu/~cs3852/All%20Star%20Game%20'04%20-%20One-Two%20Punch%20Combo.mp4

http://www.cs.wayne.edu/~cs3852/Kobe%20Bryant%20-%20'02%20All-Star%20MVP.mp4
 
Negative Konex, it's not above the cylinder... watch the clip, stop playing it, move to when his hand swats the ball and zoom in.

At the 9sec mark... the ball is JUST outside the cylinder.
 
I've looked at it from every angle. It's goaltending. I've seen stuff that isn't nearly as close get called and they let this slide? BS!!!!!
 
1. Above the cylinder = you can't block the ball when it's right over the basket.
2. Ball was still on the way up when Amare swatted it. No goaltend.
 
You can't tell from a clip whether or not the ball was above the cylinder unless see it from the perfect angle.

Still is anyone surprised that the refs might have fucked it up? NBA refs are a total joke. Who the hell trains these morons? I expect that from rec league refs, but these guys are paid a ton of money and have no excuse.
 
Cloudy said:
Whatever, dude. I'm a basketball fan first and foremost and the Kings CLEARLY got robbed. There is no rivalry anymore and I have no reason to "hate" the Kings. The current Lakers roster can't beat the Suns but I like their chances against the Kings in a first round matchup so I actually root for Sactown.

All that said, that was a fucking bogus call and you know it. When my team is helped by the refs, I can admit it :lol
Click to expand...

Look at it on the replay and it's totally unclear (which is why none of the national reports mentioned goaltending), look at it from two specific still shots and it looks like it may be above the rim. I'll just quote Kings fans from a Kings message board:

"the Kings missed 2 point blank layups during the game and Bibby missed 2 free throws and if my math is correct that's 6 points and the Kings lost by 2."

"ol' B-52 shoulda banked it off the glass or as mentioned before, thrown it down like a big man. "

"Exactly what I was going to say. When the game gets down to the wire, bad calls can make or break the game for your team. Sac should have been able to keep the lead. Remember that botched 3 on 1 layup? Brad, Mike, and Peja vs. ONE SUNS PLAYER and the Suns got the rebound. If you want to be mad about something, be mad about that. Or be mad about Bibby and Webbers combined 6 missed free throws. These are things that were under the players control."

But feel free to keep whining if it makes you feel better. Guess what close calls happen all the time, sometimes they are right sometimes they aren't, sometimes it would be hard for anyone to tell (other than the fans who immediately take sides). I understand that. The only time I get really worked up is when it's a rivalry game for my team, the playoffs, or I have money on the game. Personally I am looking forward to the next game between these teams.
 
bionic77 said:
You can't tell from a clip whether or not the ball was above the cylinder unless see it from the perfect angle.

Still is anyone surprised that the refs might have fucked it up? NBA refs are a total joke. Who the hell trains these morons? I expect that from rec league refs, but these guys are paid a ton of money and have no excuse.
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Brad miller missed that layin (dunk) and he gets paid a lot of money.
 
Damn.
A Medill freshman was hospitalized Saturday after injuring his knee in a halftime competition during the men's basketball game against Purdue. Kyle Adams, who coach Bill Carmody hand-picked as Wildside captain of the game before tip off, had a chance to win $100 by dribbling down the length of the court and making a basket in five seconds.

But as Adams went up for his shot, he lost control of the ball and crumpled to the floor under the backboard. After his fall, Adams lay on the court for nearly six minutes. Paramedics arrived, administered treatment on his right knee and brought in a stretcher. Adams' knees were bent the entire time he was on the floor and his right shoe was removed. Adams was taken to the Evanston Hospital Emergency Room and released Saturday night. Adams said he dislocated his kneecap and will wear a brace for up to two weeks. It will be a month until he can regularly exercise again.

"I collapsed on the floor and I felt my kneecap over to the left of where it should have been," Adams said. Chris Boyer, associate athletic director for external affairs, said the event was unusual.

"I've been here four years and we haven't had anyone actually treated for injury," said Boyer, who heads the marketing department that puts on the halftime competitions.
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I had my doubts at first, but after Konex's pics it's safe to say that's a goaltend. It was on its way up, but a good 4/5 of the ball is right above the basket. That qualifies it as being in the cylinder, and thus a goaltend. It doesn't matter anymore, though. Pretty nasty swat regardless.
 
bullsp1.jpg


Remember that whole "Jordan Curse" thing....ya, like the one Sportscenter is doing like a 5 part series on? Yea...can we PLEASE stop with any and all jordan comparisons...thanks.


having said that, I love seein headline stories about the Bulls on espn. its been too long. :) and good article to boot
 
Why is everyone making such a big deal about this? I thought it was goaltending, but it wasnm't called, and there's nothing that can be done about it now.

It was just a regular season game, I doubt this will have any effect on who wins the championship this year.
 
anyone got a video of this much disputed play?? I have yet to see it, but I did see the reactions of Kings players after the shot had already been blocked. They looked piss.
 
Sactown said:
Why is everyone making such a big deal about this? I thought it was goaltending, but it wasnm't called, and there's nothing that can be done about it now.

It was just a regular season game, I doubt this will have any effect on who wins the championship this year.
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Well, the Lakers 2nd round chances depend on who wins the Pacific. They can beat the Kings in a series >_<
 
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=list/050209/nbaoverpaid

Top 10 Most Overpaid NBA Players in the 2005 season :lol

10. Keith Van Horn, Milwaukee Bucks ($14,487,000)
By far the highest-paid Buck, Van Horn chews up a quarter of the team's payroll and has only chipped in 11.3 points and 5.7 rebounds per game, when he's been healthy. Van Horn's good, but not great, and he'll be 30 by the start of the 05-06 season.

9. Jalen Rose, Toronto Raptors ($14,487,000)
After trying and trying to find some stat or metric that would get Rose off this list, I gave up. The Raptors are losers both with and without him, meaning that their highest paid player -- he makes $9 million more than any other Raptor -- is a money pit. Sixteen points, 2 assists, and three rebounds ... Isn't Rose supposed to be a star? Then I triple-checked. Here's what John Hollinger had to say in his 2004-05 Pro Basketball Forecast: "He shouldn't be starting, even on a team as desperate for offense as the Raptors." And this: "Rose's offense would be acceptable if he played any defense, but he doesn't."

That's a lot of ouches in one evaluation. Rose, 32, has come way, way down since his peak years in 2001 and 2002. But nothing like a bundle of cash to cushion your fall.

8. Tim Thomas, New York Knicks ($12,900,000)
Isiah Thomas acquired Tim from Milwaukee in the middle of last season, and it doesn't appear this was one of the key rebuilding moves the Knicks had hoped for. The 6-foot-10-inch forward muscles his way to 3.4 rebounds a game and adds 10.3 points, his worst numbers since the 1998-99 season. He's only 27, but he's a downgrade from his all-overpaid list buddy, Keith Van Horn.

7. Antonio Davis, Chicago Bulls ($12,925,000)
This is what happens when you're 36 years old and playing in your 12th NBA season: the main news item on your ESPN player page provides this skinny on your current status: "mid-back strain, virus, and ear infection." Davis has managed to play almost 24 minutes a game, but has averaged only six points and 5.6 rebounds, following a near-perfect decline-line from 2000-01. Right after that season, he inked a 5-year, $60 million deal, reaping rich rewards for his pre-millennial performances. Despite his floor presence, the Bulls are doing remarkably well.

6. Dale Davis, Golden State Warriors ($10,068,750)
Davis signed his current deal when he was at his peak ... nine years ago, when he was putting up 10 points and pulling down 10 rebounds a game. He wouldn't be making this kind of cash if not for the generosity of the Blazers, who extended his contract two years ago, for reasons only billionaires like Paul Allen can comprehend.

The highest-paid Warrior has been on a four-year slide, and, despite a recent hot streak, is usually uneffective when playing. Which doesn't happen often, unless -- like now -- the Warriors are desperate for able bodies. Davis is averaging 2.7 points and 4.2 rebounds, and shooting .388 from the field, off-the-charts bad, especially considering his career average of .531.

5. Anfernee Hardaway, New York Knicks ($14,625,000)
Penny's played only nine games since Dec. 1, hobbled most recently by an ankle injury. But even when he's on the court, for his average of 23 minutes a game he's ineffective, averaging 7 points and 1.8 assists. Here's the kicker: as his productivity declines, his salary increases.

4. Allan Houston, New York Knicks ($17,531,250)
The rich man's Dell Curry, Houston's best post-retirement move would be as an original player in the new hit reality series, "Overpaid in the Apple." It's a perfect gimmick -- a bunch of young guys (and a gal or two), with multi-multi-million take-homes, on the loose. Here's the twist: put 'em to work in Pittsburgh. Who will be the first to discover their true mediocrity? Will it be the Wall Street Boiler Room sharks? The fashionistas who design clothes for anorexic catwalkers? Or the Knicks? The tiebreaker: take a snap from Steelers center Jeff Hartings in the face of a Pats blitz. Everyone loses. And Big Ben -- who actually earned his salary -- is one of the stretcher-bearers.

3. Dikembe Mutombo, Houston Rockets ($18,760,000)
We don't like to knock Dikembe, but still. The Rockets only pay him $4.49 million, but he's also banking $14.27 million from the Nets. Meanwhile, the old man plays only 13 minutes a night, averaging four points and four rebounds a game. Not a bad deal for Houston, but that's not the point.

2. Brian Grant, Los Angeles Lakers ($13,233,434)
What a wonderful world it must be ... to play 15 minutes, score three points and grab three rebounds, and collect a cool $161,383.34 for your night's work.

Let's break that down:
$10,750 per minute
$53,800 a point

Wow.

Two positive notes: Grant plays especially well on Friday nights, when he averages 18 minutes, 5.7 points, 4 rebounds, and 0.5 assists. And he's the most efficient shooter on the Lakers.

1. Latrell Sprewell, Minnesota Timberwolves ($14,625,000)
What do you do when you're overpaid, barely make enough to feed your family, are getting old in a profession where that's not an asset, and are on the last page of your juicy contract?

After you get your foot out of your mouth, you play. It's your contract year, Latrell and you are being found out. You can put in the minutes, and you can dazzle, still. But, bottom line: 12.5 points, 2.45 rebounds, 2.2 assists. Terrible shooting. And a rapidly declining hairstyle.
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DarienA said:
Come on now....



http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_11.html?nav=ArticleList

Section I-A Player Shall Not:
a. Touch the ball or the basket ring when the ball is using the basket ring as its lower base.
EXCEPTION: If a player near his own basket has his hand legally in contact with the ball, it is not a violation if his contact with the ball continues after the ball enters the cylinder, or if, in such action, he touches the basket.
b. Touch the ball when it is above the basket ring and within the imaginary cylinder.
c. For goaltending to occur, the ball, in the judgment of the official, must have a chance to score.
d. During a field goal attempt, touch a ball after it has touched any part of the backboard above ring level, whether the ball is considered on its upward or downward flight.
e. During a field goal attempt, touch a ball after it has touched the backboard below the ring level and while the ball is on its upward flight.
f. Trap the ball against the face of the backboard. (To be a trapped ball, three elements must exist simultaneously. The hand, the ball and the backboard must all occur at the same time. A batted ball against the backboard is not a trapped ball.)
g. Touch any live ball from within the playing area that is on its downward flight with an opportunity to touch the basket ring. This is considered to be a "field goal attempt" or trying for a goal.
h. Touch the ball at any time with a hand which is through the basket ring.
i. Vibrate the rim or backboard so as to cause the ball to make an unnatural bounce.
PENALTY: If the violation is at the opponent's basket, the offended team is awarded two points, if the attempt is from the two point zone and three points if it is from the three point zone. The crediting of the score and subsequent procedure is the same as if the awarded score has resulted from the ball having gone through the basket, except that the official shall hand the ball to a player of the team entitled to the throw-in. If the violation is at a team's own basket, no points can be scored and the ball is awarded to the offended team at the free throw line extended on either sideline. If there is a violation by both teams, play shall be resumed by a jump ball between any two opponents at the center circle.


I've rerun that a few times and the ball looks like it's JUST about to reach the Apex... it's certainly does not look to be on the way down.
Click to expand...


Those two clauses are different infractions, they both don't have to be a factor at the same time. The only constant factor is:

c. For goaltending to occur, the ball, in the judgment of the official, must have a chance to score.

For instance, a player can do infraction h. or i. and its goal tending, but he doesn't have to do both for it to be so. The downward arc rule is for when the ball is moving before it reaches the rim. And replays from that under the basket angle clearly show the ball above the cylinder. It's near impossible to be as close as Miller was and not have the ball be above the cylinder.

And I don't want to hear "they should have made free throws/layups earlier" etc. You know what? Both teams missed free throws and layups and open shots. That's a wash. That call was not a wash, and I'm just sick of the NBA officiating and just saying "Oh well thats how it goes" has never been what I'm about.

Yeah, I'm still pissed. This could factor into home court advantage later down the road.

There are videos, but none of the under the basket angle. There is one that shows the ball go up and then move towards the rim before Amare swats it here:

http://hkeylocalmachine.com/goaltend.avi

Yet, its stills ort of hard to tell from that angle.
 
Jordan Sighting!

capt.nyma10302092127.people_jordan_nyma103.jpg
capt.nyma10102092126.people_jordan_nyma101.jpg


NEW YORK (AP) -- Michael Jordan is willing to wait for the right situation before becoming an NBA owner.

In the meantime, Jordan said Wednesday, he is spending time with his family and promoting various interests, including his high school All-Star game and the release of the 20th edition of Air Jordans.

``I still have that desire (to purchase a team). But I'm being patient and waiting for the right scenario,'' Jordan said at a news conference announcing his Jordan Classic prep game in April will move from Washington, D.C. to Madison Square Garden. ``When the right situation comes up, it will happen. I'm very patient.
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Come on MJ! Las Vegas expansion team, Stern will even make gambling legal in the NBA just for you!
 
DMczaf said:
Top 10 Most Overpaid NBA Players in the 2005 season :lol
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Paul Allen's only responsible for 20% of them? I would've wagered a much higher percentage.
 
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