Null Persp
Member
Sorry but what are the differences between Tempest 3D and other virtual surround implementations?
Remains to be seen. It’s just Sony’s implementation to get around paying licensing fees for Atmos, DTS etc. just like MS has Windows Sonic as theirs. Only time will tell if one is noticeably better than the rest.Sorry but what are the differences between Tempest 3D and other virtual surround implementations?
Sounds awesome.What if we had both?! VR support with Tempest Audio?
I tried the demo.I would suggest you tried to understand what it really means before writing diminishing comments. Surround sound can be backed in so it's not what people discovered, it's the real time nature of the tech that is interesting. From what I experience it seems to be using ray-tracing for audio occlusion and binaural recorded sample.
I tried the demo.
Once with an atmos receiver and once with a headset.
It’s great and I totally agree that it’s better than the sound of a PS4 pro
but have you played games with Dolby atmos?
It is more impressive with speakers and at least equal if not better with a headset than Sony’s 3D audio
I only played with Pulse 3D since I don't have Atmos setup. While I trust you about sound positioning and quality of Atmos, binaural audio is known to only work with headphones.I tried the demo.
Once with an atmos receiver and once with a headset.
It’s great and I totally agree that it’s better than the sound of a PS4 pro
but have you played games with Dolby atmos?
It is more impressive with speakers and at least equal if not better with a headset than Sony’s 3D audio
Yes 3D audio itself is not new and has been around for a while. BUT 3D audio with native support for video games is still very much in its infancy. Everyone wants to talk about how Dolby Atmos has been around for years on Xbox and PC (which is technically true) but they fail to point out how there are only still a handful of titles that have been developed and designed with native support for Dolby Atmos. Here is the full list straight from Dolby's website: https://www.dolby.com/experience/games/. Yes, in over 5 years there are still less than 2 dozen games with native Atmos support. There is a reason for that! (hint: not very developer friendly and expensive both financially and computationally)Nothing impressive about it. 3D audio is 20 odd years old. It went into hibernation for a few years, and it's nice to see it back, but it's really not innovative. We had this whole sound thing worked out a long time ago.
There were 3D audio implementations long before Atmos. Ever heard of Creative EAX? This tech existed and was computationally realistic in 1999.BUT 3D audio with native support for video games is still very much in its infancy. Everyone wants to talk about how Dolby Atmos has been around for years on Xbox and PC ... Yes, in over 5 years there are still less than 2 dozen games with native Atmos support. There is a reason for that! (hint: not very developer friendly and expensive both financially and computationally)
I just played this with a new Pulse 3D and this is true. It's not as impressive as Atmos. If you've never played anything in Atmos
What Atmos do you mean? The atmos app on Series X? I've tried it with Gears 5 and... no, it's not better in any way. Plus it introduces audio delay with many people.
Sony btw doesn't charge you for their new 3D audio technology, it's free for everyone, while MS charges you with 20 bucks for that shit. That's not cool at all.
I do not think you can compare the kind of 3D audio simulation you had in GTA3 with what say PSVR offered (which required an extra custom audio chip offered in the PSVR additional breakout box and which the Tempest Engine replaces [and then some] in PS5) or what modern iPhones do with AirPod Pro in Spatial Audio mode...There were 3D audio implementations long before Atmos. Ever heard of Creative EAX? This tech existed and was computationally realistic in 1999.
Edit: What about DirectSound3D? No? Literally any game using the DirectSound3D library (and many back in the day did) supports true native 3D audio. GTA3 supports it. GTA3...this is not remotely impressive.
Surround and binaural are different things.2021.
Someone discovers surround sound.
yeah it’s cool and all but nothing ground breaking.
Binaural audio is superb on headphones
If they use samples recorded this way with this kind of microphone, we're in a treat
Or
Because it does not fake how we hear stuff it records almost exactly as we hear it.
I know that, but if all samples are recorded like this and tempest engine puts it all together - you could use almost every headset and not be like "I neeed PS5 3d headset". That was the "treat" and my intention with this post - the key word in my previous post was sample not set or scene. I have good hifi stereo headphones and I think they will kick ass with PS5, for example.Games are much more complex. Music is easy. There's only one way it's intended to sound. And listened. Games are chaotic. The player is in control. You can't just record a "set" scene and play it out. Well, in cutscenes you can. What they have is complex engines that try to simulate this.
I know that, but if all samples are recorded like this and tempest engine puts it all together - you could use almost every headset and not be like "I neeed PS5 3d headset". That was the "treat" and my intention with this post - the key word in my previous post was sample not set or scene. I have good hifi stereo headphones and I think they will kick ass with PS5, for example.
The entire idea behind DirectSound3D was to treat sounds as objects in a 3D space, processing them realistically...so yes...it's exactly the same kind of 3D audio. DirectSound3D is literally the Spatial Audio API's predecessor (which is what Atmos / Windows Sonic are hooking into). These days you'd have to use wrappers because DirectSound3D has been dead for 15 years but once you have it all set up and apply a HRTF I can personally attest to the 3D audio in GTA3 sounding...incredible. You'd know that if you had actually tried it and weren't going off faulty assumptions.I do not think you can compare the kind of 3D audio simulation you had in GTA3 with what say PSVR offered (which required an extra custom audio chip offered in the PSVR additional breakout box and which the Tempest Engine replaces [and then some] in PS5) or what modern iPhones do with AirPod Pro in Spatial Audio mode...
While most here would spend weeks and 100s of pages arguing about 1% frame drops and a few missing pixels that are largely undetectable, I thought it refreshing to focus a bit on something meaningful that will actually enhance and elevate the gaming experience this generation over the last. Here is a great read on what PS5's 3D audio brings to the RE Village Maiden demo: : https://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/resident-evil-village-maiden-demo-3d-sound/
If you have a Pulse 3D headset for PS5, I highly recommend you try it with the Maiden demo! It's probably the best demonstration of what PS5's 3D engine is capable of thus far! To think what the 3D audio combined with the haptics/adaptive triggers and the visual fidelity at 4K/60fps could do for a horror game like Resident Evil....goosebumps!
It is something I would have to try yes as well as look more in depth about the differences and evolution of the API (DirectSound3D to Spatial Audio to Atmos).The entire idea behind DirectSound3D was to treat sounds as objects in a 3D space, processing them realistically...so yes...it's exactly the same kind of 3D audio. DirectSound3D is literally the Spatial Audio API's predecessor (which is what Atmos / Windows Sonic are hooking into). These days you'd have to use wrappers because DirectSound3D has been dead for 15 years but once you have it all set up and apply a HRTF I can personally attest to the 3D audio in GTA3 sounding...incredible. You'd know that if you had actually tried it and weren't going off faulty assumptions.
There are lots of better headphones for very little more cost.They work fine and sound fine to me....enjoy your overpriced headset
Xbox doesn't charge for it. Dolby doesXbots never mention it for obvious reasons. You have a free 'trail version', yes. But then it's 20 bucks for a software upgrade. No thanks.
Binaural audio is superb on headphones
If they use samples recorded this way with this kind of microphone, we're in a treat
Or
Because it does not fake how we hear stuff it records almost exactly as we hear it.
Well you see that's the beauty of exposing such things to an API. Back in the day they were certainly limited in the number of voices that hardware could work with (though that quickly lifted, EAX 5.0 could work with 128 voices in 2005) and you did need a proper soundcard but these days it can be done in software (and has to be since DirectSound3D is dead) and games of the era can use as many voices as your CPU can handle...which is rather a lot assuming it's relatively modern. Not all implementations sound the same mind, I find ALchemy too heavy on the reverb and prefer dsoal with OpenAL soft.It is something I would have to try yes as well as look more in depth about the differences and evolution of the API (DirectSound3D to Spatial Audio to Atmos).
I am not disputing you could have created immersive sound before, I am still not convinced the same level of fidelity and amount of sound sources (as well as the complexity of the sound simulation) is anywhere near comparable to what modern API’s expose to games and dedicated HW blocks can deliver (which was obviously out of reach for PS4 and PS4 Pro hence the added HW component).
Xbox doesn't charge for it. Dolby does
Windows Sonic for Headphones does exactly the same thing for the low, low price of...free. Atmos / DTS-X aren't Microsoft's solutions, why would they pay for them for you? You can argue that Atmos sounds better...and I would agree...but it's not like you have to pay for it to get 3D audio, you don't.From a customer standpoint, it doesn't matter.
Would be cool if MS would cover the cost of a feature they so eagerly promote, don't you think?
I think sony fanboys would go wild if sony would charge them for the tempest engine. But no, it's included in the console price.
From a customer standpoint, it doesn't matter.
Would be cool if MS would cover the cost of a feature they so eagerly promote, don't you think?
I think sony fanboys would go wild if sony would charge them for the tempest engine. But no, it's included in the console price.
Yes, it is so often thrown in people’s faces as if it were free for the user but it is not.From a customer standpoint, it doesn't matter.
Would be cool if MS would cover the cost of a feature they so eagerly promote, don't you think?
I think sony fanboys would go wild if sony would charge them for the tempest engine. But no, it's included in the console price.
Dolby atmos for headphones doesn’t require a special headset. It’s an app , you need to own the license. (Still you can try it for free)Surround and binaural are different things.
Tempest Engine is trying to fake binaural so we dont need surround setups or BS 7.1 headsets.
Still $20 or so cheaper to use Tempest for users (and cheaper for devs too).Dolby atmos for headphones doesn’t require a special headset. It’s an app , you need to own the license. (Still you can try it for free)
But depending the quality of your headset might give different results (logical, the same applies for tempest)