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The War Z: shady, misleading and false advertising.

G

gutabo

Member
BurnOutBrighter said:
"Want the ORIGINAL first MMO 400km2 open world zombie survival game? DayZ standalone drops on XXX 2013. Forget subscriptions, forget paid DLC and expansion packs. DayZ standalone is as simple as this - once you install the game to your computer, you will be able to get into the game quickly and play without worrying about subscription fees, no hidden fees, and no paid updates. All updates will be seamlessly delivered to you free of charge when they're released. Add AAA graphics and effects mixed with the ability to run even on integrated video cards or low end laptops and you have a unique, fun, experience that is available to everyone. Choose one of the hundreds of servers to play on. As more worlds become available, just switch between them at any time, without losing your character's data, or paying any "world transfer fees". Start playing in our first world Colorado "Chernarus", today, and prepare yourself to join other gameplay locations scattered around the world as we release more and more content."
Click to expand...
Fixed.
 
K

KKRT00

Member
gutabo said:
You truly are this thread's dubq. So it's ok to advertise a 100-400 square km map and get an around 10 square km instead? And that's one of the many lies. Do you even know what false advertising is? Minecraft early alpha was free BTW, I played the shit out of it and Notch never did false advertising about it. Hell, classic is STILL free.


I don't care what pay to win is to you. If someone has access to items that give him an advantage(as food an ammo are) by paying for them, it's pay to win, plain and simple. That's a fact, not an opinion. You're being obtuse. And IIRC they did say that you could recover all your stuff after dying for a price in a near future.


What does that mean? That their priorities are to make a good product or that their priorities are to make a quick cash in? They are giving paid access to an alpha with few finished features, misleading information, ugly textures, crappy animations, buggy gameplay and shitty support with no refunds at all BUT with a fully working marketplace with items ready to be bought.

Yeah, keep defending that POS game. If you like the game and you like being lied to, that's up to you.
Click to expand...

You're calling me out to be selective about responses, but You completely omit like 90% of my post and still try to put into my mouth opinion i have never stated, like being ok with advertisement of map size or defending the game. Are You crazy or just so blinded with hatred that You cant read and understand few neutral and logical posts?

BTW and link me a quote where they stated that they will return items with premium revive option, because i havent read that.
 
C

Card Boy

Banned
Looks like the first (of many) official reivew is up on Metacritic from Multiplayer.it (Italian publication)

2.5 out of 10

"The War Z is a total disaster. The worst zombie game ever made. "
Click to expand...

This is what happens when you release a pre-alpha product as a full release game and expect people to pay for it.
 
G

gutabo

Member
KKRT00 said:
You're calling me out to be selective about responses, but You completely omit like 90% of my post and still try to put into my mouth opinion i have never stated, like being ok with advertisement of map size or defending the game. Are You crazy or just so blinded with hatred that You cant read and understand few neutral and logical posts?

BTW and link me a quote where they stated that they will return items with premium revive option, because i havent read that.
Click to expand...

The discussion is over, the game is out of steam because it was a scam. Reviews are also coming out and they are trashing the game into Big Rigs levels.

I will answer tho: My post was answering yours with questions, which if you answer(I know you won't but let's assume that), will obviously lead to my answer and how I feel about the game(backed up with some facts). Here: You were saying that there was nothing wrong with the game prior to its steam release, I said the opposite(stating why) and I also said that Minecraft was a completely different scenario. About microtransactions, you're cherrypicking what it means to you, which is an opinion. Like I said, I stated a fact, and I mentioned the morality issue which comes with the game's marketplace which you can't seem to even start to see. And the pay for revival with items option was mentioned in early interviews, I'm sorry but I don't feel like reading Titov's crap again. If you really want you can read the thread I linked(WarZ OT) where I also posted, I'm sure the link to that interview is buried somewhere there.

Nothing personal here buddy, the game is crap, if you enjoy it that's ok, doesn't mean that it isn't crap tho. I have enjoyed crappy games many times but I don't remember any of them being as shady and full of lies from the beginning as this one.
 
A

Acinixys

Member
If they had just stuck to their guns and said that they had an alpha version, instead of insinuating that what theyre selling is basically a finished game, non of this shit would have hit the fan. Their communication with their customers is terrible. Its almost like you buying a new car, but when you see it its just 2 wheels and a chassis, and when you complain, you are told that youre an idiot and misread their brochure.
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
DayZ standalone will be alpha and they will charge money for it, Minecraft-style. And yes, it will be called foundation release (well, probably).

I'll write about Titov a bit later, he's quite known in russian developer community.
 
eot

eot

Banned
So, how much buggier than DayZ is this game actually? I mean, in DayZ I've died and lost all my gear on login countless times, I've lost AS50s to inventory bugs, died by being prone next to a wall etc. I don't care that WarZ is a paid game and DayZ isn't, most people paid money for DayZ even if legally they didn't and regardless of that I think that what matters more is if a game is worth your time regardless of its price. When I run into stupid bugs in DayZ I don't accept them because I didn't technically pay for DayZ, I deal with them because the experience is good enough to warrant it.

I thought WarZ seemed like a shameless cash-in from day one but I can't help but feel that criticizing it for being buggy is hypocritical. If it's a worse game than DayZ you need to come up with some other reason for why that is.
 
Vlodril

Vlodril

Member
eot said:
So, how much buggier than DayZ is this game actually? I mean, in DayZ I've died and lost all my gear on login countless times, I've lost AS50s to inventory bugs, died by being prone next to a wall etc. I don't care that WarZ is a paid game and DayZ isn't, most people paid money for DayZ even if legally they didn't and regardless of that I think that what matters more is if a game is worth your time regardless of its price. When I run into stupid bugs in DayZ I don't accept them because I didn't technically pay for DayZ, I deal with them because the experience is good enough to warrant it.

I thought WarZ seemed like a shameless cash-in from day one but I can't help but feel that criticizing it for being buggy is hypocritical. If it's a worse game than DayZ you need to come up with some other reason for why that is.
Click to expand...

You seem to miss the point that DayZ was a free mod and not a new game that you paid. It also didn't lie about what you can and cannot do in game.
 
S

stryke

Member
eot said:
So, how much buggier than DayZ is this game actually? I mean, in DayZ I've died and lost all my gear on login countless times, I've lost AS50s to inventory bugs, died by being prone next to a wall etc. I don't care that WarZ is a paid game and DayZ isn't, most people paid money for DayZ even if legally they didn't and regardless of that I think that what matters more is if a game is worth your time regardless of its price. When I run into stupid bugs in DayZ I don't accept them because I didn't technically pay for DayZ, I deal with them because the experience is good enough to warrant it.

I thought WarZ seemed like a shameless cash-in from day one but I can't help but feel that criticizing it for being buggy is hypocritical. If it's a worse game than DayZ you need to come up with some other reason for why that is.
Click to expand...

I haven't played WarZ and I'm coming from a very strong DayZ bias but DayZ gets its concessions because it's a MOD, it's allowed and forgivable because it's forcing a game to do things it wasn't designed for. Now you have WarZ come along, a "standalone" title built from the ground up, released onto Steam and confirmed by the creator that it is no longer in beta and it is still laced with problems.

UnblessedSoul said:
Why would they put it on sale if it's still in beta?
Click to expand...

Money.
 
B

blitzcloud

Banned
Gez said:
Gamespy review

0.5 out of 5 (ouch!)

http://au.pc.gamespy.com/pc/the-war-z/1227010p1.html

Big Rigs Part Deux?
Click to expand...

"We don't hand out half-star ratings lightly. This is independent of our disgust with Executive Producer Sergey Titov's insulting attitude -- Craig's speaking strictly as a gamer who felt ripped off after playing. And yes, if DayZ were being sold in its current, unfinished state, we'd have similar problems with it. But it ain't!"

Guess we can see why rocket is getting nervous.

Not to mention that I was sold arma2 on the dayz premise, like those who bought half life for counter strike when it began.
 
G

gutabo

Member
Besides the pile of shit already there I think the main problem nowadays is that the devs/producers are now calling WarZ a full release and that's why it's getting formal reviews. They have gone as far as removing most of the in game references to the alpha state of the game, they have not removed them all tho and that also speaks volumes of their job. I'm not even sure the game even went into beta phase. So all the complaints about the bugs are relevant: Would you pay $99 to play this?
 
eot

eot

Banned
Vlodril said:
You seem to miss the point that DayZ was a free mod and not a new game that you paid. It also didn't lie about what you can and cannot do in game.
Click to expand...

No, I didn't miss it, I specifically addressed it.
What you pay for the game and what the developers say the features of the game are is relevant to whether or not the game is worth your money, but it has nothing to do with whether or not the game is worth your time. DayZ is the buggiest game I've ever played and I still found it to be worth my time. I'd just like to hear people dismiss the game in ways that don't also apply to DayZ.

If DayZ was a 20€ standalone released 6 months ago that wouldn't change my opinion of it, it'd still be my favourite game of the year. If something is worth playing despite bugs, then it's just worth playing. In my mind, if it's worth playing it's worth paying for.
 
Auto_aim1

Auto_aim1

MeisaMcCaffrey
The War Z trademark was suspended last month, they kept quiet.

http://tsdr.uspto.gov/documentviewer?caseId=sn85682663&docId=SUL20121115122102

The trademark examining attorney has searched the USPTO’s database of registered and pending marks and has found no similar registered marks that would bar registration under Trademark Act Section 2(d). TMEP §704.02; see 15 U.S.C. §1052(d). However, a mark(s) in a prior-filed pending application(s) may present a bar to registration of applicant’s mark.

The effective filing date of the pending application(s) identified below precedes the filing date of applicant’s application. If the mark in the referenced application(s) registers, applicant’s mark may be refused registration under Section 2(d) because of a likelihood of confusion with that registered mark(s). See 15 U.S.C. §1052(d); 37 C.F.R. §2.83; TMEP §§1208 et seq. Therefore, action on this application is suspended until the earlier-filed referenced application(s) is either registered or abandoned. 37 C.F.R. §2.83(c).
Click to expand...

They are probably referring to Paramount's World War Z which was filed earlier than War Z.
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
UnluckyKate said:
So we buy it and we force them to change they name or we contact Paramount to force them to change the name because it's too close the WWZ ?
Click to expand...

How the fact that we buy it would force it?

anyway, I wanted to write about Titov.

Titov is a pretty well-known person in russian gamedev. He worked at Riot as their technical director and he also worked on Gears of War (did some programming on it afaik), there was a talk about it on his blog and in the comments. He lives in California as far as I know. Well, at least he was living there with his wife 3-4 years ago when I stumbled upon his blog. As I understand they just began War INC. production because he talked about setting up the booth on E3 and posted some screens from the game. Free-to-play was just taking off in the West so they could be one of the first teams on the market who could make it right. It seems it didn't work out (has anyone heard about War INC. until WarZ popped up?).

Anyway his blog was pretty interesting to read becase he rambled about gamedev. He came off as a person in the know, being-there-done-that kind of guy. He was talking about them hiring people (bashed programmers who came from Google). He talked about bussiness side a bit. He also knew some people at Sony Santa Monica (or just local Sony office). He also seemed to know somebody at Naughty Dog (he bashed how Uncharted look actually when he talked about NG tech and it was the point after I started thinking that he is just full of shit). He mentioned in the comments that Big Rigs was done in a few weeks because he needed money badly (like really bad), so it seems that he has done more than just the engine. He also liked to write about good watches and cars.

Well, nothing in his blog would sound crazy or extremely arrogant but it's worth to remember that Titov comes from 90-early 00s russian background when the local russian studios could produce shovelware and still get their cheque from retail becase oil prices were rising, piracy was dwindling as internet wasn't quite there, people had money and just didn't care. It's also worth noting that 90s enterpreneur culture in Russia born a certain type of enterpreneurs with hit-and-run psychology - they aren't interested in developing their bussiness, they are interested in quick cash grabs and they don't care about customers thinking of them as the sheeple. This type of enterpreneurs exist everywhere but turbulent 90s made them numerous in Russia because there was a lot of people susceptible to fraud and there was not enough stability to build bussiness in rather painless way.

So I think Titov is this kind of enterpreneur. He can look/sound confident, like he knows his bussiness and he knows his bussiness really well: producing shovelware (because he is either too lazy or is just isn't able to make good stuff) and selling it duping common folk and, I think, enjoying it. I knew people like him. They think that they are very smart because they can dupe other people AND make money in easy way. But in countries where consumers are more protected and self-aware their "smart" strategies tend to fail more often (even though I think that Titov has already succeeded, just not to extent he hoped for).

Xsolla is a russian payment system btw. Good luck getting your refund (even though it depends on an tech support operator, some people succeeded).
 
A

Aquamarine

Member
subversus said:
How the fact that we buy it would force it?

anyway, I wanted to write about Titov.

Titov is a pretty well-known person in russian gamedev. He worked at Riot as their technical director and he also worked on Gears of War (did some programming on it afaik), there was a talk about it on his blog and in the comments. He lives in California as far as I know. Well, at least he was living there with his wife 3-4 years ago when I stumbled upon his blog. As I understand they just began War INC. production because he talked about setting up the booth on E3 and posted some screens from the game. Free-to-play was just taking off in the West so they could be one of the first teams on the market who could make it right. It seems it didn't work out (has anyone heard about War INC. until WarZ popped up?).

Anyway his blog was pretty interesting to read becase he rambled about gamedev. He came off as a person in the know, being-there-done-that kind of guy. He was talking about them hiring people (bashed programmers who came from Google). He talked about bussiness side a bit. He also knew some people at Sony Santa Monica (or just local Sony office). He also seemed to know somebody at Naughty Dog (he bashed how Uncharted look actually when he talked about NG tech and it was the point after I started thinking that he is just full of shit). He mentioned in the comments that Big Rigs was done in a few weeks because he needed money badly (like really bad), so it seems that he has done more than just the engine. He also liked to write about good watches and cars.

Well, nothing in his blog would sound crazy or extremely arrogant but it's worth to remember that Titov comes from 90-early 00s russian background when the local russian studios could produce shovelware and still get their cheque from retail becase oil prices were rising, piracy was dwindling as internet wasn't quite there, people had money and just didn't care. It's also worth noting that 90s enterpreneur culture in Russia born a certain type of enterpreneurs with hit-and-run psychology - they aren't interested in developing their bussiness, they are interested in quick cash grabs and they don't care about customers thinking of them as the sheeple. This type of enterpreneurs exist everywhere but turbulent 90s made them numerous in Russia because there was a lot of people susceptible to fraud and there was not enough stability to build bussiness in rather painless way.

So I think Titov is this kind of enterpreneur. He can look/sound confident, like he knows his bussiness and he knows his bussiness really well: producing shovelware (because he is either too lazy or is just isn't able to make good stuff) and selling it duping common folk and, I think, enjoying it. I knew people like him. They think that they are very smart because they can dupe other people AND make money in easy way. But in countries where consumers are more protected and self-aware their "smart" strategies tend to fail more often (even though I think that Titov has already succeeded, just not to extent he hoped for).

Xsolla is a russian payment system btw. Good luck getting your refund (even though it depends on an tech support operator, some people succeeded).
Click to expand...

I don't understand where the whole "Sergey worked on Gears of War" stuff is coming from. I just watched the entire credits for the Gears of War PC version (which includes the original credits), and I didn't see his name anywhere.

You would think that his name would be in the credits since people keep trying to use his "contributions to Gears of War" as an appeal to credibility.
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
Aquamarine said:
I don't understand where the whole "Sergey worked on Gears of War" stuff is coming from. I just watched the entire credits for the Gears of War PC version (which includes the original credits for the original Gears of War), and I didn't see his name anywhere in the credits.

You would think that his name would be in the credits since people keep trying to use his "contributions to Gears of War" as an appeal to credibility.
Click to expand...

He wrote about this on his blog, some person thanked him "for cool rain" on the Rain level (whatever the name of this level is) in the comments not related to GoW and well, there are a lot of cases when people aren't mentioned in credits when it comes to games industry. Anyway, I don't think that he was lying, I think his role was really, really minor but he blew it out of proportion.
 
S

Sn4ke_911

If I ever post something in Japanese which I don't understand, please BAN me.
“War Z” trademark SUSPENDED - Game will have to be renamed

LLGSe.jpg
Click to expand...
 
D

Drkirby

Corporate Apologist
I'm pretty sure they would only have to change it if Paramount cares enough to force them to change it, this just means right now that the name War Z isn't protected. That, or I really suck at Trademark law.
 
Woo-Fu

Woo-Fu

Banned
Just in case you needed more evidence that they didn't come up with the idea years ago, that application was filed July 2012.
 
G

gutabo

Member
subversus said:
Facts
Click to expand...

Thanks for that subversus. We had some of those here in south america and that quick money grab mentality kinda stands out if you have seen it before.

And WTF at that trademark notice. Seems like they tried to register the name and didn't wait for an answer/approval? Still, very unprofessional.
 
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