Pinko Marx
Banned
Some of you guys need to chill the fuck out and enjoy some video games. The nit picking here has gotten ridiculous.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
The Witcher 3 Fans Claim Downgrade-ation Is In Full Effect After Latest Trailer
- Thread starter Poetic.Injustice
- Start date
And what I and the other poster are pointing out is this type of behavior is commonplace and defended in video game software whereas it is not in most other industries. And I would add that because it is so widely accepted by consumers here the behavior continues to get worse and worse.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
I get so mad when movie trailers have music that are not in the final movie. How dare they misrepresent the product in such a blatant, deceitful way? Yet this is an accepted practice of the industry and people keep watching movies in theatres. Shameful.
Messofanego
Banned
Admiral Woofington
Member
For all we know the trailer shown was the console version and PC fans are freaking out. And considering that their main platform is still PC it's probably unnecessary to think the worst.
Pre-orders just are double edged sword kinda thing. It can be viewed as vote of confidence in developer X, but it can also be viewed as "People will pre-order products when shown Y things in Z way" kinda thing [mostly by pubs I bet].
I do pre-orders, e.g. jumped to DAI train after very good "read between the lines" impressions pre-release, and I don't really care if person X pre-orders games or doesn't. I just find it weird when pre-order is placed in months before release, based on initial marketing stuff, and then person vocally complaints about game not being 1:1 with initial marketing stuff.
I strongly think that we as gamers by now should acknowledge that next to never game is what initial marketing says it will be, graphically or otherwise, and jumping to pre-order train is gamble in a sense.
That all said I'm very hyped for W3 and can't wait to see how it turns out. Most of trailer has excellent looking graphics, imo, and then those few short segments with some not-so-hot models.
jim2point0
Banned
How I know not to take someone seriously:
Inquisition isn't breaking any new ground visually, but it's a very pretty game. Tis all subjective, of course, but.... ugly? WTF?
I think most games being released now look pretty damn good. And the Witcher 3 will look good, too. Just might not be as good as I originally hoped.
Inquisition isn't breaking any new ground visually, but it's a very pretty game. Tis all subjective, of course, but.... ugly? WTF?
I think most games being released now look pretty damn good. And the Witcher 3 will look good, too. Just might not be as good as I originally hoped.
Pound_lb003
Member
To be fair, I never thought The Witcher 2 was actually pretty.
I think people playing it on PC's when the last gen consoles were on their last legs, really blew it's technical and artistic prowess out of proportion. CDPR certainly don't have the kind of chops on them that a KojiPro do, or Naughty Dog do.
I am just happy we're getting an open-world, next-gen exclusive RPG.
I think people playing it on PC's when the last gen consoles were on their last legs, really blew it's technical and artistic prowess out of proportion. CDPR certainly don't have the kind of chops on them that a KojiPro do, or Naughty Dog do.
I am just happy we're getting an open-world, next-gen exclusive RPG.
Zeyphersan
Banned
I haven't conceded anything, I was forming my post around your assumption that there was a downgrade. Truth be told, my position continues to be "who cares". That's the same if there is or is not a downgrade.
I also recognize a few vital things:
If people only want marketing material that accurately reflects what the game is like when they buy it, then they don't want any screenshots, videos, or play sessions until the game goes gold. Any pre-release material is either a mock-up or vertical slice, both by necessity and by demand. Any level running at a trade show has been polished up for exactly that show, usually as something separate from the main game, meaning it does not have all the variables of the main game. A game also does not REALLY start coming to completion until the very last steps of development, but even abiding by this new "six month rule" that I've seen tossed around in this thread, that's too much time. Things WILL change from six months out to release, sometimes for the worse. It just happens.
What you and others are asking for is absolutely no hands-on information, no screenshots, no videos, not a peep about the game at all except words until the game essentially comes out, because only then will it be "accurate". Which is absurd. Sometimes you have to estimate the final product, and sometimes the estimation is wrong. You just kinda gotta deal with it and not take it personally.
I preordered too, months ago. My preorder had nothing to do with any of these trailers or the game's visuals. However, I can totally understand someone that saw that first trailer being disappointed in this new trailer. I dont understand getting excited over a game based on visuals or a cool trailer but that's their prerogative.
The reason I preordered it is because I'm a huge fan of the first two games, I've enjoy the books, and I appreciate the way CDPR has treated me as a consumer. They gave me 20% discount on the game just for owning the previous two, no body else in this industry does shit like that. That doesnt mean that I've forfeited any of my rights as a customer. If at some point during development I saw something that completely turned me off the to game, then I'd cancel the preorder... a few low res texture certainly aren't motivating. If it turns out "the insider" was right and the game is a technical mess then I'll get a refund, GOG gives you 30 days. In no way am I being taken advantage of.
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
Regardless of the downgrade this is still my most anticipated game of next year. More than Arkham Knight and Bloodborne. Cant wait to throw it in my ps4 and start exploring every nook and cranny of the giant world. I love to scavenge and pillage in games.
Fahrenheit
Banned
The game clearly has been downgraded from the initial trailer. Regardless if they purposely made it look unrealistic to build hype or they intended the game to look like that but due to whatever reason they couldn't match it, it's still a shitty thing to do and just because everyone else is doing it doesn't make it okay. I hope the toxicity around bull shots/trailers keeps growing so the practice its self stops.
With that said, game still looks good and I can't wait to play it.
With that said, game still looks good and I can't wait to play it.
SocksAndShoes
Banned
I would wager that 95 out of 100 people who buy this game couldn't even tell you what fur physics are. The simple fact is that GAF is one tiny, relatively insignificant portion of the people purchasing video games. Until the masses learn to get in an uproar over lower detail textures, we aren't going to see game marketing change. That's the long and short of it.
No, what I am asking for is for companies not to claim that a game still looks like X when it clearly looks like it has been downgraded to Y. Nice straw man though.
jim2point0
Banned
I'd like to see what a massive, open world game from Naughty Dog would look like. Most of their games are much more limited in scope, which allows you to get away with much more, visually.
And the Witcher 2 looked effing fantastic.
SneakyStephan
Banned
You give a shit, a threadshit...
OT: the trailer did have ugly parts in it, and some of the early screens/gifs/teasers (the horse riding through the path with the pine trees then overlooking the valley) looked vastly much better than anything shown in the last trailer.
I think it never looked amazing graphically otherwise though (that windmill farmland scene with the kids playing etc scene keeps getting trotted out as looking amazing while I thouhgt it looked no better than tw2)
Anyhow, CDPR are gaf's darling, if you're gona point out inconsistencies and downgrades in ubishit games then don't balk when people do it in a CDPR game when they see it.
People defending this come across as biased as hell.
I think the PS4 and always-online showed that the vocal core has a ripple effect on the industry. Most major shifts in gaming either grow from the grassroots outwards or through viral incidents.
When things like developers downgrading footage and claiming they haven't continues to get a pass, or forced parity is brushed aside(ubisoft) or target renders being sold off as in-game footage(EA), or lighting engines are removed last second but marketing doesnt change to reflect or clarify it(Dark Souls 2) and nothing is said, but pre-orders rise when developers do that stuff and don't drop off when it is revealed the marketing wasn't accurate, well, why change the behavior? Heck why not increase that behavior?
Some Nobody
Junior Member
Your eyes are broken. Seek out an optometrist immediately. Ask a friend for help, you may get the number wrong and dial an auto mechanic by mistake.
Either way, I'm seeing people say this is downgraded from E3, which was supposedly X1 footage. Can we confirm that? If so, what happened between that and this? There was never any way this game was going to look the same on PC versus console, but if things are looking different from console footage to what's also meant to be console footage, I think there's a slight problem.
Teletraan1
Banned
The game still looks good. Just not as good as that reveal. It is a downgrade with 100% certainty. Now I might have a chance of actually running this game on my PC so I am not too stressed.
Lactose_Intolerant
Member
lots of vision impaired people in this thread
Dictator93
Member
I do not think it was a downgrade, but rather we previously saw cherry picked scenes with cherry picked lighting (as in scenes in the game will look exactly like that, but definitely not all).
AKA, were completely mislead regarding what its continous graphical quality would be.
Some Nobody
Junior Member
All things are not the same. I showed my friends this trailer, downloaded through Gamersyde and displayed on their 32 inch screen, and all I heard was: "This looks amazing!" and "I can't wait to play!" I could explain how the fur physics and smoke physics look to be different/absent compared to the old trailers, but that's not going to make them care.
On the other hand, most people I spoke to IMMEDIATELY understood the problem with "always online".
SocksAndShoes
Banned
Once again, don't buy the product then. Don't preorder games. That's how you fight this. Even still, you're not going to change the way the industry markets games with a handful of cancelled preorders on GAF.
The masses will need to pay attention to stuff like this, and the vast majority of gamers simply don't care. Even those that do care will still likely buy the game.
I fall into the category of "It looks good enough for me to enjoy."
Solidsoul
Banned
Well said sir. I'm sure this game will be enjoyable and awesome nonetheless.
That X1 parity love. I just hope they push each as promised.
FinalStageBoss
Banned
From zelda to unharted and now the witcher lol. Idk how ppl enjoy videogames anymore. Nothing but whining.
It seems to be a notable difference from the xbox one videos showed in conferences earlier. So even if it is a console version it technically should be classified as a downgrade.
Man, GAF has been caught up in some conspiracy theory-style shit for like two years now, but I think the Microsoft-CDPR link is the most ridiculous. CDPR ported TW2 to 360 but not PS3 because 360 was more similar to PC and CDPR had only made PC games up until that point. The same was true for a lot of PC developers in the early 360 and PS3 days, 4A games with Metro 2033 for instance. Probably also the reason Valve didn't develop any PS3 games in-house until Portal 2, or why the PS3 version of Oblivion was late. And a third party developer choosing to show off a game at the Microsoft or Sony conference means jack shit as far as I'm concerned unless they actually come out and say "Sony is co-developing this game," or "this game is a console exclusive," or "we have exclusive DLC" or some shit. Actually, all the parity theories in general are bullshit if you ask me. Ubisoft admitted to parity with Unity probably not because Microsoft asked them to. I honestly do think it was just a stupid decision on Ubisoft's part to avoid flame wars between different versions of the game. CDPR I believe has confirmed multiple times they're doing what they can with each individual platform.
As for the new trailer, I'm sticking with what I established earlier: CDPR had to basically throw it together. Also, every character model in it with the exception of Yennefer's head and the wild hunt dudes (one of which we haven't seen at all until now) looks pretty much just like they do in previous trailers. For instance, that first villager guy you see, in my opinion his character model looks about the same quality as any normal NPC we've seen up till now. The environments in this trailer are also all new. I'm not calling a definite downgrade until we see the exact same places in previous trailers but in a more recent build, which might not happen until the game is out.
Shit I don't even think Uncharted got downgraded (unless it really has been switched to 30fps). I think absolutely everything we saw in the first trailer was a real time cut scene, which in Uncharted 3 looked much better than actual gameplay. The real time cut scene at the end of the latest U4 trailer looks pretty much just as good. It's just that the real gameplay looks significantly different (and is in a bland environment).
As for the new trailer, I'm sticking with what I established earlier: CDPR had to basically throw it together. Also, every character model in it with the exception of Yennefer's head and the wild hunt dudes (one of which we haven't seen at all until now) looks pretty much just like they do in previous trailers. For instance, that first villager guy you see, in my opinion his character model looks about the same quality as any normal NPC we've seen up till now. The environments in this trailer are also all new. I'm not calling a definite downgrade until we see the exact same places in previous trailers but in a more recent build, which might not happen until the game is out.
Shit I don't even think Uncharted got downgraded (unless it really has been switched to 30fps). I think absolutely everything we saw in the first trailer was a real time cut scene, which in Uncharted 3 looked much better than actual gameplay. The real time cut scene at the end of the latest U4 trailer looks pretty much just as good. It's just that the real gameplay looks significantly different (and is in a bland environment).
It still needs to look like this or shit will hit the fan.
Console version is not going to look like this is it?
Looks so beautiful!Zelenogorsk
Banned
Witcher 1 didn't look too hot and it's still one of the best games i've ever played so I think i'll be able to get through the "downgraded" Witcher 3.
Well, for first, they aren't some big company like those you mentioned..
And your statement, that W2 wasn't pretty, only reminded me how good W2 looks even today
Game has still some really solid textures (without the help of mods)
Console version is not going to look like this is it?
Maybe on the PS5 remaster.
Why are we claiming downgrading again? That would imply something looked great and was then altered and thus looks uglier. You've all found a few nitpicky bits of a trailer, and caused a ridiculously petty uproar over it, why? I mean, please. If you want to say it was downgraded, find something from a previous trailer that's also in a newer one, and compare them. It's sodding normal for unimportant NPCs to have lower resolution textures, sodding hell...
Someone find me a downgraded Geralt, Ciri or Yennifer and we can agree on a downgrade-athon, if not, give it a sodding rest >_>
Someone find me a downgraded Geralt, Ciri or Yennifer and we can agree on a downgrade-athon, if not, give it a sodding rest >_>
Scrooge McDuck
Member
Mm, I don't think this is an effective way to prove your point. An open world game understandably would look uneven in some parts. When people say "downgrade," they are obviously making a comparison to the best parts of the old trailer. You can't really go "no, let's use the worst parts as comparisons instead!"
It's better to take the best parts of the old trailer and see if there's anything on the new one matching up to it.
RandomSeed
Member
I survived the Mass Effect 3 ending. This... I can handle.
TW2 holds up amazingly well.
As for this... I did notice the "problems" in the last trailer, but I think people don't really know what they're complaining about. The biggest "downgrade" I saw was the scene with Geralt and whats-his-face (I can never remember the other witchers' names) in the snow. The lighting in that scene is shit, and it makes everything look flat.
The textures on Geralt appear to be the same ones that have always been there. There's just some really lousy shots in the trailer... badly lit, badly composed.. the other trailers with the same assets are much more impressive due to how it's all put together, not just the fidelity of the models and textures.
As for this... I did notice the "problems" in the last trailer, but I think people don't really know what they're complaining about. The biggest "downgrade" I saw was the scene with Geralt and whats-his-face (I can never remember the other witchers' names) in the snow. The lighting in that scene is shit, and it makes everything look flat.
The textures on Geralt appear to be the same ones that have always been there. There's just some really lousy shots in the trailer... badly lit, badly composed.. the other trailers with the same assets are much more impressive due to how it's all put together, not just the fidelity of the models and textures.
Vulcano's assistant
Banned
This is the one thing I'm missing. (that's a random NPC)
which was out of the ordinarily even back then since people seem to forget this is how the game also looked like
As far as i know that's the only time we have seen fur in NPC clothes in the game.
Fallout-with-swords
Banned
I feel like people complaining about graphical downgrades is getting pretty old too. But that's not a good example, like at all.
Blame companies like Ubisoft and Sega for showing off really impressive demo builds of games that don't end up looking nearly as good even on the highest PC settings.
Messofanego
Banned
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqQ3LeBgGDM#t=16sThis is the one thing I'm missing. (that's a random NPC)
To be fair, that was from an in-engine cutscene so they could have jacked up the fur physics for it.
When people claim downgrade they are using the worst parts of the new trailer, just look at the shots in the OP.
Edit: Ok so lets have another comparison, does this look like a downgrade to you?
wanderingprostheyltite
Member
Gerd dammit I hope they kept the fur in for the pc version, ordered a 970 recently, I wanna cash in on dat nvidia fur tech dag gummit!
Yeah exactly. I really don't know why people bother.