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[TTP]

Ok, I do agree tutorials can sometimes be rather boring and superfluous, the game forcing you to go through a learning process you don't actually need.

But while this might be true for the most popular game genres with the most common gameplay systems, I do actually find tutorials in uncommon, "first-timers" games pretty fascinanting and engaging. I recall, for example, how hyped I was while going through the tutorial in Exit (PSP), the many "wow I can do that?" I said to myself. That was quite an experience itself.

And also, when given the opportunity to skip the tutorial in a common game genre, I do still go through it in order to avoid missing some subtleties of the gameplay and therefore enjoy the game less. Case in point is GRAW2. As a veteran GRAW player u might know the basics, but what about the new stuff?

I'm perfectly aware tutorials can be better integrated in games (Bioshock is doing this by teaching while playing), but are standard tutorials really that bad?

So... uhm... well, just wanted to share this.

(Personal prediction about how this thread while evolve: people will come here listing the best and the worst tutorials they have gone trough. Which would be nice honestly, albeit a bit OT.)

 

[Chris_C]

There's nothing wring with tutorials if they're organic and well implemented into the game experience rather than hand-holdy and or preachy.

 

[Red Scarlet]

They're nice if you can skip them if you want to.
I liked Tomb Raider's a lot, but I think part of the reason was so I could kill Lara while she was talking.

 

[Ranger X]

I love "standard" tutorial and those that are seperated from the game. Those are awesome when they are in the list of the main menu. You're noob you enter the process and if you don't want to bother you just start the game.

I always felt integrated tutorials were shit for the most part. It's very distracting and silly to see/hear a character in the game talking about you hud, buttons and such. It shouldn't be. The player's realm and the game's realm should ALWAYS be seperated for the good of immersion.

 

[Oldschoolgamer]

I have no problem with them, when I'm not forced to use them. I mean, if I'm playing as a badass space marine, he should already know how to reload and shoot his damned pistol. I kind of liked how Area51 went about it. "Hey, lets get some target practice in. First to five wins"(or something like that).

 

[santouras]

I hate tutorials in sequels. If you've played the first one you shouldn't need to have your hand held through the first part of the second. All tutorials should have an option to be skippable, or at least not to be stopped every 10 seconds by your trainer telling you what button to push

 

[sphinx]

tutorials that are independent of the actual game are rather annoying but bearable.


if tutorials were done like in metroid prime ( space frigate ), then I am all for it.

 

[Taichu]

If I want to replay a game, I don't want to replay the tutorial at the beginning. I'm thinking of games like Advance Wars and Fire Emblem, but those aren't too bad. Super Mario Sunshine is a really bad offender.

I'm all for tutorials as seperate from the main game. For instance, Yoshi Touch & Go had a little video that showed all of the gameplay elements and was only a few seconds long.

 

[jaundicejuice]

I hate tutorials because at best they're usually just a tedious waste of time while the worst of the lot treat you like you're a mouth breathing, sister f*cking inbred moron.

The most mind numbing tutorials I have encountered are all in platformers...

"Press A to jump, press A again while jumping to perform a double jump. Press B while jumping to perform a butt drop. Collect random bits of shiny shit for [insert bonus here], ect, ect."

 

[TTP]

Ah yeah, the video tutorials. I recall those in MGS2 too. Crackdown also has them. Dunno if i dig them too much tho.

 

[White Man]

Integrated tutorials are a waste of resources. Instead of wasting developers' time with that shit, how bout they pony up the money to have a decent manual written instead? It would definitely be cheaper than wasting their time coding a tutorial. Big wastes of time.

 

[Ranger X]

And how hard it is to have them in the main menu or the game asking if you've played before when you hit "new game"?

Most devs are morons with tutorials.

 

[splattergnome]

Integrated tutorials are a waste of resources. Instead of wasting developers' time with that shit, how bout they pony up the money to have a decent manual written instead? It would definitely be cheaper than wasting their time coding a tutorial. Big wastes of time.

That is assuming that people actually take the time to read manuals these days.

 

[Joshua Hull]

If your game is markedly different from the norm, I LIKE a tutorial that takes it real slow and explains everything. For more familiar genre pieces it's not really necessary to explain EVERY little thing, a instance is this is the original No One Lives Forever which would explain every new gadget you would use in the level ahead.

I think the best balance is Valve's very subtle skill training in Half Life 2. Take the "Grav grab a glowly ball and shoot it in the socket" stuff in Episode 1, which explained initial concept in a sentence and then expanded on the idea though training and slight repetition.

 

[TTP]

Integrated tutorials are a waste of resources. Instead of wasting developers' time with that shit, how bout they pony up the money to have a decent manual written instead? It would definitely be cheaper than wasting their time coding a tutorial. Big wastes of time.

The days we were reading manuals alongside playing games are gone forever dude. I say this with sadness. Nobody reads manuals anymore. I recall when I used to bring a game manual with me when going to bed and reading it until I fell into Morpheus' arms.

 

[White Man]

The days we were reading manuals alongside playing games are gone forever dude. I say this with sadness. Nobody reads manuals anymore. I recall when I used to bring a game manual with me when going to bed and reading it until I fell into Morpheus' arms.

It sounds really lame, but awesome manuals you could read while going to bed are one of my fondest memories of old school PC gaming. After you finished the game of X-Com for the night, you could go to bed and read the detailed, 80 page manual and formulate strategies for the next day. I guess it kind of made it seem like the game didn't end when you shut down the computer.

 

[Umino]

That is assuming that people actually take the time to read manuals these days.

At least there's a choice. If you don't want to read the manual you don't have to but if I don't want to play the tutorial level I have to.

 

[Greenpanda]

FF Tactics's tutorial is arguably more entertaining than the game itself.

 

[revolverjgw]

I like them, especially when they're well integrated into the game. I need them, because games with similar techniques and mechanics tend to have different keymaps, and I need to quickly familiarize myself with them in a low-pressure situation before getting into the game.

 

[Powerslave]

The tutorial of FF Tactics is a real turn-off for new players. They implemented a freaking library of text into that game.

 

[Ranger X]

I like them, especially when they're well integrated into the game. I need them, because games with similar techniques and mechanics tend to have different keymaps, and I need to quickly familiarize myself with them in a low-pressure situation before getting into the game.

So, would you like to have a tutorial sub-menu in the main menu?
I don't get why devs aren't doing this. For gamers like you it ends up low-pressure (you're not even in your full game!) and for gamers like me, i can start a game without assle.

 

[radios shipping overview]

They're done well so rarely that I have no patience with them. I don't understand why devs start with the assumption that I don't know how to use an analog stick.

Many 16-bit games introduced concepts one by one using visual language and never, ever stopped the game to explain something in patronizing terms. Unfortunately, most devs have no idea how to do this.

A lone bright spot: "Pick up that can."

The Romance of the Three Kingdoms games these days have amusing (and well-appreciated) optional tutorials that are a comedy routine at the same time, with Liu Bei acting like a buffoon and Guan Yu playing the straight man.

 

[HAL_Laboratory]

Because they make games boring.

 

[Dachande]

There's nothing wrong with tutorials if they're organic and well implemented into the game experience rather than hand-holdy and or preachy.

This is exactly what I was going to say, so I'll just quote you.

Integrated tutorials are a waste of resources. Instead of wasting developers' time with that shit, how bout they pony up the money to have a decent manual written instead? It would definitely be cheaper than wasting their time coding a tutorial. Big wastes of time.

Because integrated, organic tutorials are better than manuals. Players would be able to learn much, much faster and better by playing through an integrated tutorial and learning by actually performing the actions in-game rather than reading about them in a booklet.

You'll learn how to do an action in-game and should be able to progress further by pulling it off correctly, making sure that the player definitely knows and understands how to do an action, rather than just going "yeah, press this, do that and it ought to work, good luck" on a page in the manual.

Manuals are an outdated concept that ought to be discarded entirely.

 

[Night_Trekker]

I get a little irritated with the tutorials that tell you really obvious, basic things anyone would figure out with trial and error, but I can deal with it. There's always someone just getting into gaming so tutorials need to be there in some form.

Generally I think it's better when the gameplay lessons are integrated into the main game and are fed to you as you need them, but some games really call for seperate tutorial modes and you can damage the experience if you don't include one.

The best example I can think of, off the top of my head, is the Full Spectrum Warrior series. The first game has an optional tutorial in the form of a mock battle, separate from the rest of the game. During that level you learn everything you need to know.

In the sequel you're instead given a series of not-so-helpful videos that explain (poorly and far too quickly) what it's all about. The first level serves as something of a quasi-tutorial, but you're actually playing the game and getting killed if you screw up. There's no way you could play Ten Hammers and understand what's going on if you missed the original.

I've always appreciated those diagrams on the back of the instructional manuals that give you a quick rundown of the controls, so you can get the info you need at a glance and get into the game. I wish more games did that.

 

[MomoPufflet]

Honestly, I don't think I've ever really learned anything from a tutorial, integrated or otherwise. Integrated tutorials seem to make sense, but when I crack open a new game I'd much rather jump into it and learn that way. And when I replay games, the integrated tutorials are just annoying and take away from the immersion. Extensive menu-based tutorials are worse-- when I want to know how to do something I don't want to watch/navigate a whole tutorial on it, I just want to be able to read how to do it quickly. This is why I wholeheartedly agree that, ideally, games should just have really well-written manuals.

The days we were reading manuals alongside playing games are gone forever dude. I say this with sadness. Nobody reads manuals anymore. I recall when I used to bring a game manual with me when going to bed and reading it until I fell into Morpheus' arms.

This is because manuals have not evolved from a time when games were infinitely more simple. If developers took the time to make manuals actually be informative, they might be worth reading.

 

[Night_Trekker]

It sounds really lame, but awesome manuals you could read while going to bed are one of my fondest memories of old school PC gaming.

I still love reading through some game manuals, especially if they have character art or are creatively constructed, like the manuals for the GTA games. I wouldn't want to see them disappear altogether.

 

[firex]

I prefer optional tutorials to required ones. Although, and I'm sorry because this is kind of drifting off into the "sort of OT" territory mentioned in the original post, the tutorials done in HL2 are really great because they don't feel like "hey you're an idiot, learn how to do this" training. Conversely, I really enjoyed MGS3, but I felt like the game was treating me like a 5 year old when it gave me the tutorial on climbing a tree to get my backpack.

What I mean by this is that tutorials can be integrated into the regular game without feeling like "idiot training" (my term for bad tutorials, as they tend to explain things as if you can't think for yourself at all) and it isn't annoying. But, still, I prefer an optional tutorial separate from the main game most of the time. I think for most people, they hate forced tutorials because of the following:

1) They're frequently unskippable
2) They can be condescending with the way they treat the player
3) They tend to take too long
4) They feel like interruptions to the gameplay if it's integrated into early, easy levels

 

[radios shipping overview]

This is because manuals have not evolved from a time when games were infinitely more simple. If developers took the time to make manuals actually be informative, they might be worth reading.

And in the case of games that have always been complex, like PC RPGs, the manuals are often worse off nowadays. It's not just the fault of developers; it can be publishers who don't want to front the cost of production or the packing weight involved. See also: the strategy guide market.

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

I would like to play a tutorial that kind of exists as a stand alone adventure independent of the main games plot- preferably with lots of comedy thrown in.

 

[JCX]

I would like to play a tutorial that kind of exists as a stand alone adventure independent of the main games plot- preferably with lots of comedy thrown in.

I think there was a tutorial for a spiderman game (64 I think) that was a little funny.

I like some tutorials, but sometimes it seems like it insults your intelligence. I think they are mostly necessary in games with unconventioal control schemes. Especialy since a lot of games have similar control schemes.

 

[Gantz]

I personally think games that require tutorials in order to play the game are poorly designed. I don't mind quick tips in games though.

 

[Ranger X]

I personally think games that require tutorials in order to play the game are poorly designed. I don't mind quick tips in games though.

Wow. There can be complex games and there's always a moron somewhere that can't play right. The fact you have a tutorial or not simply is having no link with good/bad design. Seriously.

 

[Grayman]

I like racing game style license schools. Doing that in GTR now and having fun.

I don't enjoy FPS style ones that take more than 10 minutes and progress way too monotonously (crounch here, jump this, learn to use this gun, that gun, grenades, now pick the lock on this door).

Quick tips in the game are the best, and if it has to have load times tips on those help too.


Pacing is important if the first few areas will teach the game. Wind Waker's half an hour of boring crap wasn't fun, i would have rather been dumped right into the fun part of the game. God of War was the exact opposite of WW, you start in one of the best areas in the game and just have little pop ups quickly explaining stuff.

 

[Gantz]

Wow. There can be complex games and there's always a moron somewhere that can't play right. The fact you have a tutorial or not simply is having no link with good/bad design. Seriously.

I disagree. Just like anything if it's well designed it will be intuitive enough that the user can pick it up and play/use it without much trouble. If they're a complete moron they can RTFM.

 

[Dachande]

I personally think games that require tutorials in order to play the game are poorly designed. I don't mind quick tips in games though.

I don't think that's completely fair. Some games require some sort of tutorial to explain a game-specific feature that a player needs to be informed how to use. The best ones of these are ones that're seamlessly integrated into the game, and that are transparent to players who already know how that feature works.

HL2 keeps being brought up in this topic because it's pretty much the perfect example of that. You can completely ignore all the tutorial help tips at the start if you wish, and the first sections that teach you how to mess with the physics (

Spoiler

when Barney tells you to sneak out by stacking boxes to get out of the window

and just after

Spoiler

when the Metrocop forces you to throw the can in the trashcan

) are completely integrated into the game in such a way that a first-time player learns what they need, and a seasoned veteran can get right in there and complete the task without thinking about it because it's part of the game and needed to progress. Same for when you learn how to use the gravity gun, as that scene also has a specific purpose to continue the storyline (

Spoiler

i.e. it's an excuse to go outside for Alyx to spot the Combine and to set-up the point where you get seperated

).

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

I like em in some games, I don't like em in others. The tutorial in Breakdown was ****ing bad ass, but the one in Sonic Wii is annoying.

 

[_Alkaline_]

I love "standard" tutorial and those that are seperated from the game. Those are awesome when they are in the list of the main menu. You're noob you enter the process and if you don't want to bother you just start the game.

I always felt integrated tutorials were shit for the most part. It's very distracting and silly to see/hear a character in the game talking about you hud, buttons and such. It shouldn't be. The player's realm and the game's realm should ALWAYS be seperated for the good of immersion.

This is so very true.

One thing I love about Zelda is that the game slowly introduces you to all its concepts, and does it very subtlely rather than saying "press X to do this". Its tutorials are always long compared to most other games, but its soo effective in teaching the player whilst maintaininh that immersion.

 

[mattiewheels]

i just played half life 2 again, and there was that brilliant introduction with all the 'tutorial' type stuff presented in a really natural, story-driven way. the part that i really loved was when the asshole guard knocked a soda can off a trash can and tells you to pick it up. serves the purpose of a tutorial while adding something to the character of the game and the world.

 

[MCD]

Without Toya's tutorial in Enchanted Arms, i don't think i would have understood the game.

 

[Wario64]

I only hate if it's forced. But some games need to have forced tutorials, like the NeoGAF appreciated game EXCITE TRUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Sean]

I think the first Halo had an amazing tutorial. It was integrated so well into the game that it didn't even feel like a tutorial IMO.

- waking up from the tube thing and the marine technician "testing your suit" (learn about the shield/health system)
- the marine guy "adjusting your suit" (look around at the lights and it adjusts your aim)
- then the explosion blocking the door (learn to crouch)
- breaking down the broken door (melee) that leads into a dark tunnel (flashlight)

You'd have a marine NPC guy leading you throughout the whole level too (and he'd wait up for you too).

It pretty much taught you all the basics without holding your hand or forcing you to watch long cutscenes or reading a bunch of text. New players would love the tutorial and it's not annoying at all for more experienced players since they can just breeze through it.

 

[Bizarro Sun Yat-sen]

So, would you like to have a tutorial sub-menu in the main menu?
I don't get why devs aren't doing this. For gamers like you it ends up low-pressure (you're not even in your full game!) and for gamers like me, i can start a game without assle.

FF8 had a tutorial sub-menu, but apparently it wasn't enough since they felt the need to add in-game tutorials in the US version (they weren't in the Japanese original).

 

[Ranger X]

I disagree. Just like anything if it's well designed it will be intuitive enough that the user can pick it up and play/use it without much trouble. If they're a complete moron they can RTFM.

I doubt that. Some games are just more complex and some people won't just plug and play it. Finding a game "intuitive" is not just because of it's design, it depends also your experience as a gamer and how much you like games and will bother to learn it.
Since you make games for the largest audience possible, you include tutorials. You can be extremely well designed even if you include that tutorial.

 

[Twilight Dawn]

I think good or optional tutorials can be helpful, especially for people who learn best by actually doing things themselves. Stuff like "push A to jump" is obnoxious, but for example, some RPGs have complicated battle systems, and I would always read about them in the manual and not actually absorb or remember anything. Then, there would be an in-game tutorial and it would make a lot more sense.

I liked how Tales of the Abyss did it - it gave a tutorial every now and then for more complex aspects of battle as they became an issue, instead of dumping it all on at the beginning, which would probably have been overwhelming.

 

[Jiggy]

I think for most people, they hate forced tutorials because of the following:

1) They're frequently unskippable
2) They can be condescending with the way they treat the player
3) They tend to take too long
4) They feel like interruptions to the gameplay if it's integrated into early, easy levels

Other than 4, yeah, those are pretty much my problems with them. I'd throw in a new category, though:

5) They sometimes introduce you to gameplay elements that you won't encounter for another 18 hours and will have forgotten by the time they come up

 

[Phife Dawg]

I think tutorials are OK, if they are not mandatory and split up into different parts, which can be chosen independently.
A good example how to not do a tutorial is Warhammer:Mark of Chaos. I usually do the tutorials in RTS' because I'm too lazy to read thick manuals. But that one really go on my nerves-I just wanted to do the "advanced" stuff (heroes, special attacks, duels etc.) but had to go through lessons on how to click on a unit...bah!

 

[Pureauthor]

Integrated Tutorials:

I think that whenever you start a game and go through the first few easy missions, a question should pop up as to whether or not we want a tutorial.

Yes, you get a tutorial for those missions.

No, the game lets you play those missions on your own.

 

[Blablurn]

I think most ot them are quite boring. But I actually liked the tutorial of We <3 Katamari. That was entertaining.

 

[Yoshi]

I hate tutorials in the game, because when playing through the game a second, third,... time they are just boring and annoying. When the tutorial is seperated in the main menu, it's a good thin (for example in Yoshis Story - albeit the whole game seemed to be a tutorial ^^)