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Two German-born terror suspects to be deported

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C

chromatic9

Member
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-39348270

Germany says it will deport two men born in the country but whose parents are foreign - the first such case in German history.

The men, a 27-year-old Algerian and a 22-year-old Nigerian, were arrested last month on suspicion of planning a terror attack. A gun and a flag of the so-called Islamic State were found at their homes during police raids in the central city of Gottingen.

But the men have never been charged.

The criminal proceedings were dropped because police never established whether the suspects had planned to carry out an attack. Police say the two men are "dangerous".

Lower Saxony Interior Minister Boris Pistorius said the deportations would take place as soon as possible, and certainly before mid-April.

He said discussions were already under way with Algeria and Nigeria to facilitate this, and the two men would be subject to a "life-long re-entry ban", preventing their return to Germany.
Click to expand...

I would've thought someone born in a country should be either tried for criminal activities and put away or let go back into the country they were born if it can't be proven. It sets a strange precedent of being shipped out if the authorities think you might be dangerous. Also when does one become a national then? Third or fourth generation?
 
B

Barzul

Member
Why not jail them? Seems weird if they were plotting a terrorist activity wouldn't that be enough to try them?
 
S

Sölf

Member
That makes no sense. If they were born here and raised here, they are germans. No matter where their parents came from. I am all for deporting people that were not born here, but in this case lock them up.
 
G

G.ZZZ

Member
Uuh, pretty sure that's inconstitutional and just plain impossible, you can't deport someone without process, let alone a citizen.
 
S

Skyzard

Banned
Xando said:
They do. Unless they are german citizens by law
Click to expand...

Oh right, these aren't citizens. Don't have an issue with this tbh.

Descent from a German parent. A person born of a parent with German citizenship at the time of the child's birth is a German citizen. Place of birth is not a factor in citizenship determination based on parentage. Those born after 1 January 1975 are Germans if the mother or father is a German citizen.
Click to expand...

Though there's this:

Children born in Germany

Under transitional arrangements in the 1999 reforms (effective 1 January 2000), children who were born in Germany in 1990 or later, and would have been German had the law change been in force at the time, were entitled to be naturalised as German citizens.

An application for naturalisation was required by 31 December 2000.
The child was required to apply for retention of German citizenship by age 23 and normally show that no other foreign citizenship was held at that time.
Click to expand...

But I'm guessing it doesn't apply.
 
D

Derwind

Member
What level of German citizenship does one have to have to not be deported from the place they were born to a land they shouldn't really have any affiliation with beyond where their family originated?

It's nice to get an idea where you stand in a country like Germany.

Skyzard said:
Oh right, these aren't citizens. Don't have an issue with this tbh.
Click to expand...

So two generations down?
 
C

Chairmanchuck

Member
Skyzard said:
Oh right, these aren't citizens. Don't have an issue with this tbh.
Click to expand...

If you are born after 2000 in Germany, you have German citizenship. Before that, there are special laws for that.

What level of German citizenship does one have to have to not be deported from the place they were born to a land they shouldn't really have any affiliation with beyond where their family originated?
Click to expand...

I actually guess they are not German citizens at all/dont have a German citizenship. Otherwise even suggesting that would be crazy.
 
O

Osahi

Member
In Belgium they recently signed a law making this possible too. It's crazy. People born and raised in a country can be deported without being convicted. I do believe those two are scum, but the thing that actually seperates us as a democratic society from dictatorships and fundamentalists is that we have separation of powers and that we have a justice system.

It sets a dangerous precedent to say the least, and I can't think of what consequences these kind of laws could have when populist parties grab power.
 
entremet

entremet

Member
Derwind said:
What level of German citizenship does one have to have to not be deported from the place they were born to a land they shouldn't really have any affiliation with beyond where their family originated?

It's nice to get an idea where you stand in a country like Germany.



So two generations down?
Click to expand...
Birthright citizenship is not guaranteed in other countries.
 
G

G.ZZZ

Member
Ah they're not citizens? Guess they never asked for citizenship then.

Still seems plain incostitutional to me. What the hell.
 
Chuckie

Chuckie

Member
chromatic9 said:
Also when does one become a national then? Third or fourth generation?
Click to expand...

Well in the Netherlands one becomes a national when one gets a Dutch passport. It has nothing to do with generation. For new immigrants it usually takes 5 years to become a Dutch national...that is if said person wants that.

People born here are automatically Dutch if one of their parents has Dutch nationality. In other situations the third generation born will become automatically Dutch (if none of their parents/grandparents are Dutch)

There are some more ways to get the Dutch nationality if you lived here for a while or born here.

I don't know how the situation is in Germany though. However if this had happened in the Netherlands, I would assume those two never wanted the Dutch nationality otherwise they could have gotten it quite easily.
 
I

Ikuu

Had his dog run over by Blizzard's CEO
Chairmanchuck said:
It is now in Germany, but only for children born after 2000. So I guess these guys didnt apply for German citizenship, that they could actually have gotten.
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Unless Wikipeda is wrong that isn't true either,

Children born on or after 1 January 2000 to non-German parents acquire German citizenship at birth if at least one parent:

has a permanent residence permit and
has been residing in Germany for at least eight years.
Click to expand...
 
C

ClosingADoor

Member
If they still have their other passports and don't become stateless, I see no issue with this. Citizenship comes with rights and responsibilities. And it can be taken away in extreme cases like this.
 
C

chromatic9

Member
Skyzard said:
Oh right, these aren't citizens. Don't have an issue with this tbh.



Though there's this:



But I'm guessing it doesn't apply.
Click to expand...


So born after 2000 they couldn't deport you to your parents country and between 1990 and 2000 you have to apply otherwise you could still be deported?
 
C

Chairmanchuck

Member
Ikuu said:
Unless Wikipeda is wrong that isn't true either,
Click to expand...

Yeah. I was simplifying it a bit.

chromatic9 said:
So born after 2000 they couldn't deport you to your parents country and between 1990 and 2000 you have to apply otherwise you could still be deported?
Click to expand...

Its more like that it seems they never applied for German Citizenship, so they also are not "Germans" by law and so I guess they have a Algerian and Nigerian passport, so they qualify as "immigrants", not Germans.
 
X

Xando

Member
chromatic9 said:
So born after 2000 they couldn't deport you to your parents country and between 1990 and 2000 you have to apply otherwise you could still be deported?
Click to expand...

If they are born between 1990 and 2000 and never got themselves german citizenships yes
 
J

Jumeira

Banned
Crazy, they are German, they are scum but they are still nurtured by that country. Whatever happened to them its up to them to deal with, and to pacify. They'll be German even in their parents country of origin.
 
C

Chairmanchuck

Member
Jumeira said:
Crazy, they are German, they are scum but they are still nurtured by that country. Whatever happened to them its up to them to deal with, and to pacify. They'll be German even in their parents country of origin.
Click to expand...

They are not German on paper though, because apparently they didnt want the German citizenship (that they could have gotten).

That is something they should have known...
 
N

nampad

Member
Well, they apparently didn't apply for citizenship and tried to do an terror attack. I don't see why they should have the privileges of citizens then.
 
Chuckie

Chuckie

Member
Jumeira said:
Crazy, they are German, they are scum but they are still nurtured by that country. Whatever happened to them its up to them to deal with, and to pacify. They'll be German even in their parents country of origin.
Click to expand...

They aren't German citizens.
 
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