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[cormack12]

Source: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-65243518

The government has rejected calls to ban physical punishment of children in England, saying they are already protected in law.

In Wales, Scotland and Jersey any type of corporal punishment, including smacking, hitting, slapping, and shaking is illegal.

The NSPCC and Barnardo's say England must follow suit.

The government has argued parents should be trusted to discipline their children.

A Department for Education spokesperson said: "The government does not condone any violence towards children and has clear laws in place to prevent it."

In England and Northern Ireland it is legal for a carer or parent to discipline their child physically if it is a "reasonable" punishment.

However, any punishment over what is considered "reasonable" is illegal. The Children Act 2004 says it is unlawful to assault a child causing actual or grievous bodily harm, or with child cruelty.

A 12-year-old girl who contacted Childline said: "My mum heard me swearing from the other room today. I know I shouldn't swear, it always gets me in trouble and makes mum act scary. Mum hit me so hard this time, harder than usual.

"She was screaming and hit me in the head so hard I fell into the wall. I still feel a bit dizzy now and there's a lump. I don't know how to make it stop."

 

[Spaceman292]

Fuck them kids man

 

[feynoob]

Either option is not good.
I have seen messed up parents who beat their kids badly.
Then there are kids who beat their mothers, because no one disciplined them.

 

[Kev Kev]

I have heard some interesting arguments for bringing back corporal punishment in public school’s in the US, but I’m still not convinced.

That being said, students in the US know their teachers can’t do shit to them and essentially have no fear, which has lead to students running the classroom and scaring away would be educators from getting a teaching job.

It’s a problem and I don’t know what the solution is, which is where the corporal punishment argument comes into play. I have to say, I’m less against it than I was before I heard the argument, but I still think there has got to be a better way to make students fear repercussions of bad behavior.

It’s a complicated situation with lots of moving parts, including parents who obviously aren’t in the classroom to see how shitty their kids are being and claim their children are all little angels. I’m not sure about the situation in the UK, but it’s an interesting discussion going on right now.

 

[RAÏSanÏa]

I have heard some interesting arguments for bringing back corporal punishment in public school’s in the US, but I’m still not convinced.

That being said, students in the US know their teachers can’t do shit to them and essentially have no fear, which has lead to students running the classroom and scaring away would be educators from getting a teaching job.

It’s a problem and I don’t know what the solution is, which is where the corporal punishment argument comes into play. I have to say, I’m less against it than I was before I heard the argument, but I still think there has got to be a better way to make students fear repercussions of bad behavior.

It’s a complicated situation with lots of moving parts, including parents who obviously aren’t in the classroom to see how shitty their kids are being and claim their children are all little angels. I’m not sure about the situation in the UK, but it’s an interesting discussion going on right now.

Part of the problem with discipline in regards to classrooms is the lack of removal by administration. It puts the problem and handling it back onto the teachers. Admin isn't doing its role to ensure that no students are harmed by other students or teachers. Corporal punishment is another way for admin to abandon its responsibility as well as suppress anything that can be regarded as disruptive with violence under legal protection in corrupt circumstances.

 

[SlimySnake]

Kids need discipline, but as someone who was beaten up in school growing up, I would not wish that upon my kids. My dad never hit me, but my mom did maybe once or twice a year and It was never vicious or hurt. I have more respect for her than any of my cunt teachers.

I think it needs to be left to the parents. Im with England on this. If its causing bodily harm like that girl who now has a lump on her head then yes, thats going too far and the parent needs to be punished until they stop. If they dont, then the kids needs to be taken away.

Kids nowadays are just different. If yours is a good one then good for you, but every kid is different.

 

[GreenAlien]

Personally, I think some kids need a good slap.

I have gotten slapped by my mother only once. It didn't really hurt, I was just shocked it happened.

I never did what caused it again, so I can say it worked wonders.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

The government has argued parents should be trusted to discipline their children.

Children are not the property of their parents, the parents are their legal guardians till the age of majority, as citizens it is the state's responsibility to look out for their well-being.

Lol UK, keep on losing.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Discipline doesn't need to involve beating up your kids. If that's what you need then your kid doesn't respect you, at most he's afraid of getting beaten up again, lol.

My dad didn't usually beat me, except for one time...but i can tell you when i messed up and he raised his voice (and that man never raised his voice) was enough for me to show some respect.

Also the fact he only did beat me up once was enough for me to never do that shit one more time

If you spend your time beating up your kids is it even discipline?

 

[HoodWinked]

The issue is probably when a kid gets punished for doing something wrong which is typically reasonable.

Versus when a parent is taking out thier problems and frustrations on thier kid which then leads to a unreasonable amount of force.

 

[Saiyan-Rox]

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Children are not the property of their parents, the parents are their legal guardians till the age of majority, as citizens it is the state's responsibility to look out for their well-being.

Lol UK, keep on losing.

I agree with the bolded part...but what does this have to do with discipline? Education, values, responsibility, etc...all that starts at home. It's called...parenting.

 

[BigDeadFreak]

I have heard some interesting arguments for bringing back corporal punishment in public school’s in the US, but I’m still not convinced.

That being said, students in the US know their teachers can’t do shit to them and essentially have no fear, which has lead to students running the classroom and scaring away would be educators from getting a teaching job.

It’s a problem and I don’t know what the solution is, which is where the corporal punishment argument comes into play. I have to say, I’m less against it than I was before I heard the argument, but I still think there has got to be a better way to make students fear repercussions of bad behavior.

It’s a complicated situation with lots of moving parts, including parents who obviously aren’t in the classroom to see how shitty their kids are being and claim their children are all little angels. I’m not sure about the situation in the UK, but it’s an interesting discussion going on right now.

Do you have a link to these arguments? I'd be interested to hear what people had to say about it.

 

[22:22:22]

As a world we should be better to focus on the core issues at play rather then instead forcing a rule of a symptom. Clown world.

 

[DeepEnigma]

It's good exercise for the fat and lazy epidemic.

 

[SirTerry-T]

Children are not the property of their parents, the parents are their legal guardians till the age of majority, as citizens it is the state's responsibility to look out for their well-being.

Lol UK, keep on losing.

Let it go chap, Waterloo was years ago.

 

[Thaedolus]

Violence is acceptable in self defense situations, and hitting your kids out of anger or frustration isn’t self defense, it’s weakness.

I don’t know that it should be legislated, but we don’t spank or hit our kids and, shocker, the older one hasn’t learned to hit the younger one the way my older siblings beat on me.

 

[6502]

Its banned where I am. There has been no visible change except you don't get kids being smacked in public. Behavior is no different.

 

[22:22:22]

I guess rules regarding the psychological imprint of parents which is a complex generational facet made up of so many (severe understatement) aspects which will determine their way of dealing with their child(ren). Which goes the same for said child(ren) which upbringing and social environment etc is hardly known to their parents for example. This is a very very complex social/cultural issue. Alas, my expertise on this matter is lacking and so is my English.

 

[cormack12]

I guess rules regarding the psychological imprint of parents which is a complex generational facet made up of so many (severe understatement) aspects which will determine their way of dealing with their child(ren). Which goes the same for said child(ren) which upbringing and social environment etc is hardly known to their parents for example. This is a very very complex social/cultural issue. Alas, my expertise on this matter is lacking and so is my English.

 

[22:22:22]

You're turning me on cormack12

 

[BlackTron]

I get that failing to discipline kids has its own dangers, but it's really hard to believe there isn't some other effective way to punish bad behavior that doesn't involve direct physical force.

But it might require basic foresight and tactics on the part of parents.

 

[22:22:22]

The government has argued parents should be trusted to discipline their children

Yes let's not think about the average parent that's Ill equipped with psychological discipline resulting in a positive manner.

Supposedly this government seems to trust their people to have a basic/general understanding of child psychology

And hey. If some good slaps or a beating doesn't do it just psychologically manipulate the child.

 

[Sleepwalker]

Just ban them from having ipads, that'll teach em

 

[DeepEnigma]

Yes let's not think a out the average parent that's Ill equipped with discipline resulting in a positive manner.

Supposedly this government seems to trust their people to have a basic/general understanding of child psychology

And hey. If some good slaps or a beating doesn't do it just psychologically manipulate the child.

"The government" is also a body made up of humans that do (parents) and do not (non parents) have kids, so...

...we are in a constant perpetual cycle of "who do we listen to."

 

[22:22:22]

"The government" is also a body made up of humans that do (parents) and do not (non parents) have kids, so...

...we are in a constant perpetual cycle of "who do we listen to."

We're in a cycle of fools making these decisions. But it won't matter unless there's a fundamental change in consciousness which will lead to simply deducting the symptoms to it's core root and start form there.

Won't happen anytime soon.

I'm sorry but do you really listen to the "goverment" ??

 

[DeepEnigma]

We're in a cycle of fools making these decisions. But it won't matter unless there's a fundamental change in consciousness which will lead to simply deducting the symptoms to it's core root and start form there. Won't happen anytime soon.

But those fools on your account are parents and non parents alike. So if said fools say,

The government has argued parents should be trusted to discipline their children

Then how is this ever solved? Parents and non parents are saying that it should be left in the hands of the parents and not the state, since there are already abuse laws.

You see where this goes when you put too much weight in what "the government" should control for us?

If the argument is that they are fools, that it should not be left in the hands of the parents, then you want to give control to the state/government, which are those very same parents and non parents. In short, humans are not infallible.

 

[Kev Kev]

Do you have a link to these arguments? I'd be interested to hear what people had to say about it.

It's an Orlando talk show called The Jim Colbert Show. It's a 3 hour, 5 days per week show and they talk about a bunch of different topics daily, so you'll have to locate the segments where they are discussing it (use the 2x audio feature on Spotify, or just skip around till you find it). It's been brought up several times over the years, but here are three episodes where the words 'corporal punishment' were included in the show description on Spotify.

 

[22:22:22]

But those fools on your account are parents and non parents alike. So if said fools say,

Then how is this ever solved? Parents and non parents are saying that it should be left in the hands of the parents and not the state, since there are already abuse laws.

You see where this goes when you put too much weight in what "the government" should control for us?

If the argument is that they are fools, that it should not be left in the hands of the parents, then you want to give control to the state/government, which are those very same parents and non parents. In short, humans are not infallible.

Perhaps a mistake on my part due to my English but that wasn't my point at all.

Having the government saying they have trust in the parents regarding disciplining their children is a very easy way out.

I'm not saying the government should take that roll. I'm saying that parents are mostly ill equipped with dealing with their children in the best way possible as to facilitate their psychological state and thus their life.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Perhaps a mistake on my part due to my English but that wasn't my point at all.

Having the government saying they have trust in the parents regarding disciplining their children is a very easy way out.

I'm not saying the government should take that roll. I'm saying that parents are mostly ill equipped with dealing with their children in the best way possible as to facilitate their psychological state and thus their life.

Well that is due to there not being a handbook on being a parent. You can get an idea from self help books, etc., but there are so many factors that come into play from financial changes, emotional/hormonal changes, stress changes, societal changes, institutionalized influence, etc., etc..

It's not easy, for sure, and it's a very real "learn as you go" type of thing.

 

[22:22:22]

Man I have so much to say on this subject but whatever. English + Mobile =

 

[StreetsofBeige]

A good kick in the ass works wonders.

If parents did that to kids now, you'd get a lot less kids talking back and staring at their cell phone all day and all dinner time. And probably less school shootings. Kids now seem to do and say whatever they want as nobody (home or school) seems to want to crack down on kids with attitude. That's why so many young people in their 20s joining a company act like retards disrespecting bosses, vets and do snapchat at the back of the room during board meetings. They grew up no holds barred and carry that home life garbage to the office.

The longer the leash, the bigger the attitude.

 

[22:22:22]

Well that is due to there not being a handbook on being a parent. You can get an idea from self help books, etc., but there are so many factors that come into play from financial changes, emotional/hormonal changes, stress changes, societal changes, institutionalized influence, etc., etc..

It's not easy, for sure, and it's a very real "learn as you go" type of thing.

That's what I meant is there should be a paradigm/consciousness shift which WILL take into account the myriad of facets that'll prepare parents. But said shift has to be on such a global fundamental scale so as to work globally that your post is the least we can do in this reality. And while I come across cynical I truly applaud that kind of effort.

 

[DeepEnigma]

That's what I meant is there should be a paradigm/consciousness shift which WILL take into account the myriad of facets that'll prepare parents. But said shift has to be on such a global fundamental scale so as to work globally that your post is the least we can do in this reality. And while I come across cynical I truly applaud that kind of effort.

Like a borg?

 

[22:22:22]

Like a borg?

I hope that's a joke

 

[DeepEnigma]

I hope that's a joke

 

[22:22:22]

I hope that's a joke

Ufo...Contact from Planet Iarga https://amzn.eu/d/iN180zx

 

[Impotaku]

Need to follow this method

 

[Zathalus]

For those concerned about discipline, instilling that into a child does not require physical punishment.

 

[Jezbollah]

I'm happy with this decision.

It means King Charles can slap Harry when he next sees him. The ginger cunt.

 

[cornonthecrobb]

my dad was a vicious bastard. would beat the absolute fuck out of me if I even said something he didn't like.

I remember when he had an affair..I was about 13.. so to punish him for what he did to my mum I destroyed his magazine collection.. some of the issues were worth a pretty penny.

he beat me so badly with a bit of wood that he found in the garden that I not only had physical injuries but a nasty infection after it.

so as someone who lives in the UK... I disagree with this

 

[DeepEnigma]

I'm happy with this decision.

It means King Charles can slap Harry when he next sees him. The ginger cunt.

It would matter more if that was actually his son.

 

[Kilau]

A little bit of fatal beating never hurt anyone.

 

[Quasicat]

I have heard some interesting arguments for bringing back corporal punishment in public school’s in the US, but I’m still not convinced.

That being said, students in the US know their teachers can’t do shit to them and essentially have no fear, which has lead to students running the classroom and scaring away would be educators from getting a teaching job.

So many stories related to this post. Here’s one: a few years ago, during Parent/Teacher Conferences, I had a girl that was failing History. I told her mom some suggestions for her to raise her grade and Mom told me that this was our top priority. Her daughter looked at her and said, “Come on you stupid bitch…you know as soon as we get home I’m going to do whatever the Hell I want and there’s nothing you will do about it!” Mom just say there taking it. I ripped into that girl about how this was not happening in my room.
About an hour later I had administration in my room telling me how the mother was angry with how I handled it and I was to formally apologize to both the mother and her daughter. I never did.

 

[BossLackey]

I think kids really do need at least a HINT of a physical threat behind the authority of their parents.

My dad whooped me with a belt a few times and I legit needed it.

 

[bitbydeath]

I don’t like how people conflate smacking kids with extreme violence or anger. These people don’t have kids or know what discipline is.

 

[Nobody_Important]

I feel horrible for the girl in the OP. Hopefully protective services or whatever the UK equivalent is can get her out of there.

 

[Kev Kev]

So many stories related to this post. Here’s one: a few years ago, during Parent/Teacher Conferences, I had a girl that was failing History. I told her mom some suggestions for her to raise her grade and Mom told me that this was our top priority. Her daughter looked at her and said, “Come on you stupid bitch…you know as soon as we get home I’m going to do whatever the Hell I want and there’s nothing you will do about it!” Mom just say there taking it. I ripped into that girl about how this was not happening in my room.
About an hour later I had administration in my room telling me how the mother was angry with how I handled it and I was to formally apologize to both the mother and her daughter. I never did.

Wow. That's insane man. Well, you did the right thing, both ripping her daughter a new one and not apologizing for it. It's absolutely mind blowing how often there is no follow through or accountability on the parent's part.

 

[Torrent of Pork]

Spanking your kids, and beating them are two very different things. People acting like taking an open palm or a hairbrush to their kid's bare ass is the same as a closed fist beating are delusional.

 

[bitbydeath]

Spanking your kids, and beating them are two very different things. People acting like taking an open palm or a hairbrush to their kid's bare ass is the same as a closed fist beating are delusional.

Exactly, if any rules need to be set, it is that.
Open hand, not the face.