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Vice: Bring on the Class War: Bernie Sanders Dreams of a Revolution in 2016

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GK86

Homeland Security Fail
Link. I'm liking him more and more.

After a few frenetic weeks of campaigning, the UK elections are being held today—which should serve as a reminder of just how bloated and drawn-out America's presidential races have become. Even the most ardent political junkies might blanche at the numbing loop of focus groups, fundraisers, and cable news spin that will be stretched out over the next 18 months. Compounded with the apparent inevitability of Hillary Clinton's coronation as the Democratic nominee—and the prospect of another Clinton vs. Bush—it's hardly surprising that most Americans have been bored out of any interest in the national electoral process.

Bernie Sanders wants you to know that it doesn't have to be this way. The Vermont senator's nascent presidential campaign, announced last week, is based around the idea that electoral politics can work when it is driven by voters—in fact, he thinks that this "political revolution," as Sanders calls it, is the only antidote to the overwhelming influence of money and corporate interests on politics.

"I get very frightened about the future of American democracy when this becomes a battle between billionaires," Sanders said in an interview Sunday with ABC's This Week, one of his first after announcing his White House bid. "We need a political revolution of millions of people in this country who are prepared to stand up and say, 'Enough is enough,'" Sanders argued. "I want to help lead that effort."

Sanders has been talking about this revolution for months. In the lead up to his announcement, the Vermont Independent was on a grassroots tour of various lefty watering holes—community arts centers, student unions, garden parties, SEIU halls, Progressive Democrats of America conventions—warning voters about the myriad threats facing the working class and the need to mobilize a grassroots movement that will somehow be strong enough to take on what he calls "the billionaire class."

At these events, as in most things he does, Sanders is outraged, and usually didactic, spouting his wisdom about the working class. He warns about corporate interests, the Koch brothers, and myriad other forces working to game the economy and gum up the democratic system. He demands audiences answer questions about college tuition, Social Security, the cost of childcare in Denmark.

"How many countries are there—major countries, wealthy countries—that do not guarantee health care? Give me an answer," he demanded of an audience in Keene, New Hampshire, last fall, one of dozens like it that Sanders addressed as he explored the idea of running for president. "Young lady, in the pink sweatshirt, you. How many countries? No? How about you, Keene State red sweatshirt. You don't know?

"If there is one thing that bothers me—I'm going to be very hard on you here—it is that many young people do not know very much about what goes on in the world."

If any of the college students are upset by this interrogation, Sanders doesn't seem to notice or care. Badgering college sophomores is just part of waking people up. This idea—that Americans are ignorant or disinterested in the political system, feudal vassals of a crony capitalist government—is the driving force behind Sanders's political project. He points out that just under 54 percent of Americans voted in the 2012 presidential election, a number that is consistent with most recent presidential years, but that trails turnout rates in other developed countries.

Despite widespread contempt for the political system—Congress' approval rating is just 22 percent, and political parties aren't faring much better—the anger doesn't seem to have translated into political action. A new poll from Harvard's Institute of Politics found that just 21 percent of young voters consider themselves "politically engaged." Other surveys have found similar lack of political engagement levels among the general electorate.

In the meantime, rich people are very active in politics. A recent study by researchers at Northwestern University looked into the political habits of the 1 percent, and found that the super wealthy reported a stunning 99 percent turnout rate in the 2008 election. The researchers concluded that "by several measures, wealthy Americans participate politically at two or three times the rate of members of the general public as a whole."

According to Sanders, the wealthy and powerful have a vested interest in keeping things this way. In his view, the electoral system is set up to deter those outside the political process from getting involved, insulating those inside the process from any inconvenient consequences of democracy.

"How do you change political consciousness? Well that requires really a revolution in every sense of the word," Sanders told me in an interview last fall. "You are taking on a society that spends a huge amount of money, in a variety of ways, trying to convince people that politics is irrelevant to their lives, that to the degree it is relevant, it has to do with candidates' personalities or characteristics that have absolutely nothing to do with the real issues."

Sanders believes, perhaps quixotically, that most of those voters would support his positions—higher taxes on the wealthy, more infrastructure investment, expanding Social Security, raising the minimum wage—if only they could be persuaded to vote. Most politicians avoid advancing any narratives carrying even a whiff of "class warfare," but Sanders isn't shy about his vision for an uprising of trade unionists, fast-food workers, indebted students, and traditionally Republican voting blocs like old people, white working-class voters, rural farmers—mobilizing against the entrenched corporate interests keeping them down.

That all these groups will suddenly embrace Sanders's beloved vision of Scandinavian socialism is dubious and almost endearingly naive. The senator's focus on class and inequality seems to ignore the fact that people often don't vote in their own economic interests, and Americans almost never back self-described socialists. And though Sanders is incredibly popular in Vermont—he cruised to reelection with 70 percent of the vote in 2012—he doesn't seem to have quite worked out the details of creating a national movement.

"In one way or another, in a thousand different ways—and this is what I mean by a political revolution—we've got to educate, we've got to organize, we've got to make people understand that what happens in the state house, what happens in Washington, happens in their lives," he said. "What I can guarantee you is that if we don't do that, this country will move pretty rapidly toward an oligarchy."


For all of his "let the ruling class tremble" rhetoric, Sanders's socialism is decidedly unsexy. But neither is Sanders sexy, unless you go for septuagenarian ex-hippies who talk like Brooklyn deli countermen. He doesn't have Barack Obama's gift for ringing oratory or Bill Clinton's talent for flirtatious charisma. Most often described as "curmudgeonly" and "rumpled," Sanders is perpetually outraged, and obsessively focused on even the most mundane fights against inequality. He is, as Matt Taibbi described in a Rolling Stone piece praising Sanders' presidential bid, "the kind of person who goes to bed thinking about how to increase the heating-oil program for the poor."

Sanders' commitment to both political ideology—he calls himself as a "socialist democrat"—and to the more mundane aspects of governance has been the hallmark of his unlikely political career. He first won elected office in 1981, when he became the mayor of Burlington, where he became known for establishing diplomatic ties to Marxist governments and for his impressive dedication to snow removal. It's made him a revered, if not beloved, political institution in Vermont, where he's known simply as "Bernie."

"We always joke that he has ten brains," a Sanders staffer told me when I asked about the Senator's constituent services. "I'm not sure he ever sleeps. He's always thinking about the big picture, but then he also has a hundred ideas about things we can do to help, to get the government to work better for people."

Sanders's political success has been built around his ability to prove that the government can work for voters—a task that is possible in a small state like Vermont, but hardly feasible in a presidential race . And for all his talk of revolution, it's unclear how many voters will get behind his plan for class war.

Still, Sanders seems to have struck a chord, particularly among liberal voters looking for someone to challenge Clinton on the left. His campaign raised $3 million in four days following his announcement, and claims that 185,000 supporters have signed up on the Bernie Sanders for President website. To the Anyone-but-Clinton crowd, Sanders is an excellent foil: authentic, untethered, with a shamelessly liberal agenda. Clinton, by contrast, is seen as scripted and stage-managed—and between the Clinton Foundation's fundraising, and her own efforts to woo corporate campaign donors, she's clearly not afraid of mixing money and politics.

Although Sanders has almost zero chance of beating Clinton for the nomination, his candidacy could push her into taking more specific policy positions, particularly on issues like trade, increased government spending, and higher taxes on the wealthy—key liberal tenants that Establishment Democrats have tended to dance around in order to avoid being attacked as wealth redistributionists. Already, Sanders and other progressives like Massachusetts Senator Elizabeth Warren have pressured Clinton into softening her support for the Trans-Pacific Partnership trade deal, and Sanders isn't letting up.

"I have voted against every disastrous trade agreement coming down the pike and [am] helping to lead the effort against this Trans-Pacific Partnership, which would mean the outsourcing of more good paying jobs to low-wage countries," Sanders said in an interview with CNN on Wednesday. "People have got to look at Secretary Clinton's record."

Of course, Sanders knows he's not going to win, that the revolution he's trying to launch may never materialize, at least not in 2016. Still, he insists that he's running a serious campaign, that he's "running to win." And while it might be tempting to dismiss all this as the romantic ravings of another doomed progressive from Vermont, there is something simple, and powerful, about the idea that American democracy can still respond to popular action, that rather than disengaging from the electoral system, voters can make it work for them. In an election that is expected to cost upward of $2 billion, and where the outcome seems predetermined, it even sounds a little revolutionary.
 
I've been saying it since Bernie started signaling he was going to run... don't count him out. He has all the ingredients needed to make this Obama 2.0 vs Hillary. I absolutely think he has a reasonable chance to beat Hillary.
 

Laconic

Banned
I agree with everything he says.

Which means he'll never be President, despite getting my nominal nomination nod.
 
I've been saying it since Bernie started signaling he was going to run... don't count him out. He has all the ingredients needed to make this Obama 2.0 vs Hillary. I absolutely think he has a reasonable chance to beat Hillary.

The whole age part doesn't really help. He'd be an interesting candidate if he was 20 years younger.
 
He also has my vote.

I believe that thinking strategically about what kind of person is more electable and more acceptable is doing a disservice to yourself, since there really isn't anything more powerful than a vote to get your actual opinions heard.
 
I agree with his opinions and I think he'd be a solid president. Not to say I don't care for Hillary but it's unfortunate that she's more or less the anointed one at the current juncture. Bernie is saying a ton of great things that I would love to see put into practice.
 

BFIB

Member
Every politician has skeletons in their closet, he's speaking a lot of great things, but just like every other politician, I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop.
 

lednerg

Member
Even if he doesn't get the nomination, I hope he gets enough votes for the Dems to take notice. We need to end this shift to the right.
 
Every politician has skeletons in their closet, he's speaking a lot of great things, but just like every other politician, I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop.

He's been around in politics for decades and has self-identified as a socialist for almost as long. There's an actual record of things he's done and said that you can look up right now. If there were any skeletons in his closet they would've found a long time ago.
 
Even if he wins, he's delusional in thinking that he can affect Congress to pass the bills necessary to fix socioeconomic inequality in the US.

It's impossible until we get a liberal Congress.
 

Eidan

Member
Even if he wins, he's delusional in thinking that he can affect Congress to pass the bills necessary to fix socioeconomic inequality in the US.

It's impossible until we get a liberal Congress.

I'm sure he's fully aware. But "Congress is loaded with Republicans who will prevent any of my domestic agenda from becoming a reality" doesn't help GOTV efforts.
 
I agree with him but can he defeat the Republican nominee in 2016? That is far more important.

I don't want to risk another Scalia, No Child Left Behind, another Iraq, and more economic policy favoring the top 5%.
 

WaffleTaco

Wants to outlaw technological innovation.
He sounds like the left's Ron Paul. An old man with dreams of getting out a message and knowing he won't win. I am keeping a close watch him and would probably vote for him in the primaries, but I need to watch the debates before anything.
 
He sounds like the left's Ron Paul. An old man with dreams of getting out a message and knowing he won't win. I am keeping a close watch him and would probably vote for him in the primaries, but I need to watch the debates before anything.

I feel similarly, but I'd really like to see him pick up momentum after the debates, which he absolutely will, and eek out a victory for the democratic nomination. It's all a matter of how much his message catches on. Hillary is really coasting on name recognition and foreign policy experience for the most part. I think espousing ideals in a debate will be hugely advantageous to Bernie and detrimental to Clinton.
 

War Peaceman

You're a big guy.
He sounds like the left's Ron Paul. An old man with dreams of getting out a message and knowing he won't win. I am keeping a close watch him and would probably vote for him in the primaries, but I need to watch the debates before anything.

The whole value of his run is to shift the party - Hillary in particular - leftwards. In the same way that the Tea Party shifted the Republicans rightwards. Or Ron Paul, as you mentioned.

It is classic politics and the kind of basic politicking often ignored by more left-leaning (in relative terms) groups.
 

TheFatOne

Member
He's been around in politics for decades and has self-identified as a socialist for almost as long. There's an actual record of things he's done and said that you can look up right now. If there were any skeletons in his closet they would've found a long time ago.

Don't really believe this line. Politicians are going to be politicians. So something will pop up eventually.
 
You know maybe if every other line wasn't "he doesn't have a chance" people would actually give a shit and stuff would get into motion instead of constant pessimism.

"WE NEED A REVOLUTION"

"Oh but we don't stand a chance..."

Can't think of a more annoying thing.
 

FyreWulff

Member
Sounds cool, but unfortunately when you try to be real with people, the other side is just going to say "lalalala"

see also: Jimmy Carter.
 
While sure, he'd never be able to pass most of the stuff he'd like to pass if republicans remain the major players in congress, it should be kept in mind that promissing the impossible didn't stop republicans from getting elected for congress. Quite the contrary, it is what got them the job.

Don't really believe this line. Politicians are going to be politicians. So something will pop up eventually.

If you've that concern for all politicians, it stops becoming a factor.
 

mcrommert

Banned
I've been saying it since Bernie started signaling he was going to run... don't count him out. He has all the ingredients needed to make this Obama 2.0 vs Hillary. I absolutely think he has a reasonable chance to beat Hillary.

This thread is hilarious. If you think a self professed socialist can win election in this country...you really should look at some polling data
 
I'm voting him just to scare Hillary into being more left leaning.

I know a lot of people like Bill, but I don't want a repeat of his policies. He won by making Democrats more right leaning. And that does no good for people like me (black, not rich).


But he's not winning a thing.
 
He sounds like the left's Ron Paul. An old man with dreams of getting out a message and knowing he won't win. I am keeping a close watch him and would probably vote for him in the primaries, but I need to watch the debates before anything.
Unlike Mr. Paul, Mr. Sanders isn't crazy. So he has that going for him lol.
 
I'm thinking of it he doesn't drop out and endorse Hillary and instead runs to the end as an Independent candidate.

If he runs for the democratic primaries and loses I'm not sure he can just go and switch to independent.

Besides, that's the worst thing he could do for the party, fracturing the voter pool between Democrat and independent.
 
If he became Hillary's running mate, would that be a good or bad thing? I can see it go either way.

I doubt she'd choose him. Hillary wants the safest, cleanest route to the white house possible and she's not going to risk that by putting an actual socialist on the ticket. If she wants to placate the more progressive ends of the democratic party, she might go with O'Malley or maaaaybe Warren, assuming Warren would even take the offer.

That said, I'd prefer that Sanders is the one deciding to offer Clinton the VP spot, not the other way around. Again, I think Clinton's strong lead in the polls will erode rapidly once the democratic base is familiarized with other options. It seems to me that only a small contingency of voters are at all excited for a Hillary presidency.
 

HiResDes

Member
I hope he doesn't win the nomination. There is no way America will vote him into office (too many conservatives/moderates who would never vote for him). All this does is provide a more likely victory for the Republicans.

Although, in a perfect world, I'd love for him to win, and if I were a Democrat I would still vote for him.

You agree with his policies, but you don't want him to win, you're part of the problem in my eyes.
 
I doubt she'd choose him. Hillary wants the safest, cleanest route to the white house possible and she's not going to risk that by putting an actual socialist on the ticket. If she wants to placate the more progressive ends of the democratic party, she might go with O'Malley or maaaaybe Warren, assuming Warren would even take the offer.

That said, I'd prefer that Sanders is the one deciding to offer Clinton the VP spot, not the other way around. Again, I think Clinton's strong lead in the polls will erode rapidly once the democratic base is familiarized with other options. It seems to me that only a small contingency of voters are at all excited for a Hillary presidency.
I'd love a Sanders/Clinton ticket. I'm certainly not excited about a Hillary presidency. It's just a lesser of two evils.
 

obin_gam

Member
You know maybe if every other line wasn't "he doesn't have a chance" people would actually give a shit and stuff would get into motion instead of constant pessimism.

"WE NEED A REVOLUTION"

"Oh but we don't stand a chance..."

Can't think of a more annoying thing.

Yep. It reads like something out of a Douglas Adams story really.
 
You agree with his policies, but you don't want him to win, you're part of the problem in my eyes.

People need to be pragmatic when it comes to presidential elections.

There's too much at stake in 2016, including the future of the Supreme Court, to take a gamble on someone like Bernie Sanders, who would have a much more difficult time winning a presidential election than Hillary Clinton.

Call me cynical or "part of the problem," but it's the truth.
 

Damaniel

Banned
I really, *really* like his politics, but I also like not having a Republican in the White House, so I just can't vote for him. Even if by some miracle he manages to win the primary (though the odds of that are essentially zero), one GOP talk radio or Fox News commentator calling Bernie an admitted socialist and the race will be over, with Ted Cruz or Jeb Bush or one of the other clown car occupants sailing into office, loading up the Supreme Court with anti-choice, pro 1% justices, and rolling back what little progressive legislation we've had pass in the last 8 years. Keeping a Republican out of the White House is a far more important goal than just about anything else, and Bernie is a guaranteed loser in the general election.

Sadly, the country is so far right at this point that being painted with the 'socialist' brush is a fate worse than death; doubly so when Bernie uses the term openly to describe himself. Bernie's biggest benefit in the race is pushing the other candidates (aka Hillary) further to the left, and hopefully he'll make enough of a splash to make that possible. I only hope that Americans will eventually be more open to electing a far left President, but it's not going to happen in 2016.

You agree with his policies, but you don't want him to win, you're part of the problem in my eyes.

No, we're pragmatists and realists. Bernie has about the same chance of winning a general election as Ron Paul did - zero. I'd rather have a non-optimal Democrat in the White House (especially one at least influenced by Bernie's run) than any Republican. Just about any Republican would beat Bernie in a matchup, so what good are all of those progressive ideals if they tossed out the window while we're swearing in President Bush or President Cruz?
 

HiResDes

Member
Moderate Republicans and moderate Democrats like Hillary Clinton aren't too far apart, neither are going to enact very much change at all. Bernie is a guy that could really shake things up, he's less bipartisan and doesn't seem as influenced by lobbyists and appeasing moderates, which I really really like.
 
I'd love a Sanders/Clinton ticket. I'm certainly not excited about a Hillary presidency. It's just a lesser of two evils.

Exactly, and I get the "don't let perfect be the enemy of good" mentality behind supporting Clinton, but I think we're in for a repeat of the 2008 primaries. People have pointed out that she has a stronger lead at this point compared to 2008, but I really don't think she is personable or sincere enough to clinch the nomination. If Bernie doesn't build a groundswell of support then I think O'Malley has a strong chance as well. It would take a miraculous restructuring of Hillary's platform along with an outstanding debate performance for her to do anything but lose popularity among the base following every debate. As someone mentioned above, with the GOP constantly showing their ass the need to support Hillary as a safe choice becomes less and less important.
 
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