WD rises from the ashes (sort of)

#9
Good to see my ol' hero Vic is back, and I hope that despite the terrible name, this works out :)

Apparently he is rather hated in some circles... I guess deflowering a beautiful and pure Japanese game with clinton jokes is just an unforgivable sin to some people or something :(
 

Blackace

if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
#10
Gaijinworks.... a name Japanese people will avoid and westerns will laugh at.. good choice
 
#12
One of the only things gaijinworks.com has right now are meta-tag keywords for search engines.

Gaijinworks,
ichiban,
gaijin,
otaku,
RPG,
jRPG,
role-playing game,
japanese role-playing game,
videogames,
games,
anime,
microsoft,
xbox 360,
playstation,
sony,
import games,
localization,
11 is over,
award-winning,
one nation under games

I'm not sure what "ichiban" is doing in there. Anime is a little unexpected. Xbox360 is obvious given Vic's earlier comments, but mentioning PlayStation seems like asking for trouble. And where's the DS? "11 is over" is obviously a reference to WD's old "Our games go to 11!" motto. "One nation under games" seems like a canditate for their new motto, but it doesn't come close to WD's old one.

I like the "works" part of the name, but the "gaijin" part has to go. He needs something that plays off of "design". Or just starts with a "D". Draftworks, or something like that.
 
#15
although it's clear he prefers other systems, his reasoning for avoiding DS/Nintendo development in the past is sound - cartridges are harder for him to make money on, and being a small company it's a big risk.

but we'll see what happens here
 
#16
Amir0x said:
although it's clear he prefers other systems, his reasoning for avoiding DS/Nintendo development in the past is sound - cartridges are harder for him to make money on, and being a small company it's a big risk.

but we'll see what happens here
But aren't DS cards pretty facking cheap? XD
 
#17
I thought he said that he did like Nintendo, and that carts weren't expensive anymore (although he still didn't like the turnaround time on them), but that it was just that he was expecting the DS to crash and burn any day now when faced with the PSP.

That doesn't seem like it's going to be happening any time soon, so if he's going multiplatform enough to try and get back in with Sony, I don't see why the DS shouldn't be on his radar.
 
#19
One can only wish , he's a big Mystical Ninja Fan and people were asking him if he'd localize the DS game and the GBA double pack port of the games, since his team was localizing the PS2 version. But he always seem hesitant about it, and expecting the DS to fail and stuff.
 
#21
Besides the medium costs (which was probably the reasons WD worked on PSOne, even if they DID publish cartrridge-based games IIRC), I think I remenber him saying here that it was loathing DS and wanted it to fail...
 

Shard

XBLAnnoyance
#22
Koren said:
Besides the medium costs (which was probably the reasons WD worked on PSOne, even if they DID publish cartrridge-based games IIRC), I think I remenber him saying here that it was loathing DS and wanted it to fail...
I remember that as well, Vic was very vocal in his hatred of the DS. Though as I recall his tirades took place in the fairly early days of the system when it looked like the PSP was just going to come in, kick ass and take names, ect, ect, ect. Obviously things didn't quite work out that way. Shit, he must hate Nintendo an awful lot in order for him to focus on the XBOX 360 of all things. Kind of the worst system to pick in my opinion.
 
#23
Amir0x said:
although it's clear he prefers other systems, his reasoning for avoiding DS/Nintendo development in the past is sound - cartridges are harder for him to make money on, and being a small company it's a big risk.

but we'll see what happens here
I always found that a bit laughable given how Atlus seems to have made a boatload on buying the rights to cheap GBA games that literally no one wanted and then manufacturing an insanely small run which would almost immediately sell through.

Given that he's either worked with or committed to working with every major hardware manufacturer in the biz except Nintendo, even when the GBA dominated the handheld market completely and plenty of other small companies were making money off localization there, the cart excuse is just transparently silly. I love Working Designs and I've always liked Vic, but the guy just pretty clearly hates Nintendo for some reason.
 
#24
maybe he could bring those up and coming 360 square games, which my newest egm rumor mole says probably won't be hitting us shores, stateside.
 
#25
Shard said:
I remember that as well, Vic was very vocal in his hatred of the DS. Though as I recall his tirades took place in the fairly early days of the system when it looked like the PSP was just going to come in, kick ass and take names, ect, ect, ect. Obviously things didn't quite work out that way. Shit, he must hate Nintendo an awful lot in order for him to focus on the XBOX 360 of all things. Kind of the worst system to pick in my opinion.
Why? Its not like he publishes games in Japan, and the 360 looks real strong in North America. The lack of support from major Japanese 3rd parties helps as well, since he isn't going to be competing with Atlus, Aksys, etc. so much if he's focused around the X360.
 
#26
ethelred said:
I always found that a bit laughable given how Atlus seems to have made a boatload on buying the rights to cheap GBA games that literally no one wanted and then manufacturing an insanely small run which would almost immediately sell through.

Given that he's either worked with or committed to working with every major hardware manufacturer in the biz except Nintendo, even when the GBA dominated the handheld market completely and plenty of other small companies were making money off localization there, the cart excuse is just transparently silly. I love Working Designs and I've always liked Vic, but the guy just pretty clearly hates Nintendo for some reason.
Pretty sure even Atlus is much bigger than WD ever was
 
#27
Amir0x said:
Pretty sure even Atlus is much bigger than WD ever was
That's not the point. Atlus is larger, but that certainly isn't why they were making money on GBA games. His argument was he'd either print too few or print too many, and it was just too expensive for a small company to risk overprinting. But that's why Atlus deliberately did low, conservative print runs of all their GBA games, to eliminate that financial risk. Size had nothing to do with it.

I'm just saying, man... they can profit off the TurboGrax 16 and the Sega CD (which sold, what, five pieces of hardware?) but the cost of cartridges was so volatile that WD would've been courting financial ruin to publish a game on a system which sold 33 million units in the US? :lol

Like I said, I'm sorry, but I find it pretty laughable. I absolutely love Vic and WD (they consistently made one Sega system after another worth owning), but I don't buy the line here for a second.
 
#29
Unless they're picking up actual quality overlooked imports like Goemon DS (not trash like Goemon PS2), I don't see much reason to care. The PS2/PSP/DS/360 RPG import markets already seem well covered thanks to Atlus, Agetec, Ubisoft, NIS, Xseed and others who're more than capable of localizing a game within resonable timeframes anyway.
 
#30
Drek said:
Why? Its not like he publishes games in Japan, and the 360 looks real strong in North America. The lack of support from major Japanese 3rd parties helps as well, since he isn't going to be competing with Atlus, Aksys, etc. so much if he's focused around the X360.
The problem is that WD (and this new company, I guess) aims to publish typically japanese games for the western audience. While success of 360 is good, I'm not sure that niche japanese game lovers are the main 360 audience. It makes probably more sense to support mostly PS2 at this time (if you want to avoid DS for any reason - I think bad sound subsystem was one of Vic's concerns, by the way... -)

There is japanese games, but since some of them are Microsoft-published, I'm not sure they're available for localization.
 
#31
jarrod said:
Unless they're picking up actual quality overlooked imports like Goemon DS (not trash like Goemon PS2), I don't see much reason to care. The PS2/PSP/DS/360 RPG import markets already seem well covered thanks to Atlus, Agetec, Ubisoft, NIS, Xseed and others who're more than capable of localizing a game within resonable timeframes anyway.
Exactly. Unless WD/Whatever can secure better games with much shorter turnaround times, they are obsolete.

Sorry vic.
 
#32
jarrod said:
Unless they're picking up actual quality overlooked imports like Goemon DS (not trash like Goemon PS2), I don't see much reason to care. The PS2/PSP/DS/360 RPG import markets already seem well covered thanks to Atlus, Agetec, Ubisoft, NIS, Xseed and others who're more than capable of localizing a game within resonable timeframes anyway.
Atlus? Aces.
Agetec? Horrible, horrible translations. They do a terrible job.
Ubisoft? They do even worse than Agetec!
NIS? They do an okay job most of the time with the translation, but their taste in selection (Idea Factory, Blade Dancer, their own repetitive shovelware) leaves much to be desired and pales in comparison to WD's going-to-11 games.
Xseed? They picked up one mediocre, one above average game, did a decent job in the localization, and then vanished.


And in the same breath you knock WD's quality of coice and say this bunch is more capable? Sorry, but no. I'd take WD over all but one of them (Atlus).
 
#33
Koren said:
Besides the medium costs (which was probably the reasons WD worked on PSOne, even if they DID publish cartrridge-based games IIRC), I think I remenber him saying here that it was loathing DS and wanted it to fail...
Time makes changes.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1128502&postcount=43
vireland 2005-03-17 said:
I firmly now believe that the DS is indeed stillborn. I wanted to like it, but Nintendo's making it really, really hard. I'm keeping one system to play Goemon and Castlevania DS, and that's about it. My kids have moved on to PSP and are selling their DS machines, as I imagine many will once they experience the sexiness and functionality of the PSP.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3605916&postcount=24
vireland 2006-06-12 said:
Nothing, and I mean *nothing* is completely static in this industry.

...

I *love* the potential for the PSP, but it's been absolutely butchered on the software front, while the DS started slowly and has really taken off.
 
#34
camel said:
maybe he could bring those up and coming 360 square games, which my newest egm rumor mole says probably won't be hitting us shores, stateside.
You mean Project Sylpheed? There is a trademark from Square Enix filled for it in the US Patent Office.
 

Shard

XBLAnnoyance
#38
Koren said:
The problem is that WD (and this new company, I guess) aims to publish typically japanese games for the western audience. While success of 360 is good, I'm not sure that niche japanese game lovers are the main 360 audience. It makes probably more sense to support mostly PS2 at this time (if you want to avoid DS for any reason - I think bad sound subsystem was one of Vic's concerns, by the way... -)

There is japanese games, but since some of them are Microsoft-published, I'm not sure they're available for localization.
Exactly, the XBOX 360 is not exactly overflowing with JRPG goodness or other odd bits of Japan quirkiness that Working Designs/GajinWorks is apt to pick up; moreover, those bits that are there have already been pretty much carved out by other publishers. I mean what is Gajin Works going to pick up Far East of Eden? Furthermore, in regards to the demographics split, I think they are even more profound then mentioned here. Indeed, the main XBOX buyer is vastly disparate from those who would ever pick up a Working Designs game, but I also contend that this rift seeps down into the hardcore gamer as well. Indeed, there are all sorts of hardcores out there, we know this, and the specific hardcore that would buy a WD/GW game is a lover of JRPGs or just a general Japanophile and so on and so forth along those lines. Let me ask a honest question here, how many of those kind of gamers actually own a XBOX, own a XBOX 360, or plan on getting one? I know this isn't the case for all games but in all reality the system this kind of hardcore is going to own is one of the Microsoft systems. They are more likely to own a PS2 and/or a GameCube depending on system specific fanboy allegiances. In essence, Vicky here is walking into the harshest market product wise for reasons chronicled in this thread compounded with what is potentially the least receptive audience to this type of product. At this point I would be very surprised if GW would be able to find success on the XBOX 360.
 
#41
Shard said:
Why do we need him?

Vic knows games; Working Designs was one of the greatest publishers of the past 2 decades. Sure there were a ton of delays, but every WD game I've bought was quality. I would have never gotten to play a couple of my favorite games, Lunar and Dragon Force without WD. Plus, they actually gave a shit about their fanbase, they would communicate and answer questions. Add in the fact that they're one of the few companies to actually de-roboticize the monotonous text that we're usually used to seeing on our shores, I'm all for the cause. I don't understand the hate at all. What is your reasoning for not liking WD or Vic or something? Are you going to bring up the "stillborn" quote, too? God, you people are relentlessly perfect, huh?
 

Shard

XBLAnnoyance
#42
I loved WD a hell of a lot back in the day, but the fact of the matter is that WD got lost in the shuffle around the time of the PS2. What they did was indeed revolutionary and quality and set templates and so on and so forth. The sad thing is WD became outmoded and others have filled the void from peers like Atlus and NIS to big dogs like Namco, Ubisoft and Nintendo. Shit, even Vic's trademake special packaging has been co-opted for the most part with the advent of Limited Editions. Working Designs was once a great company but its time has come and gone. So I say so long and thanks for all the fish.
 
#43
Alot of the turbulence during the PS2 time can fairly be attributed to Sony's policies on releasing games. I'm not sure of all the details, but I do remember quite a few barricades that Sony put on WD during the fizzling release of Goemon. As for NIS, I'm going to say it as bluntly as possible: NIS is shit. All of their games are retreads of the same game, with little innovation. Those Atelier Iris games were also crap. Atlus has done some great things, but if we're speaking solely on ratios, then WD has released a higher percentage of good games to bad games, unlike Atlus, who will release crappy titles from time to time.
 

Shard

XBLAnnoyance
#45
Yes, I know all that, Vic took a risk and ended up burning a lot of bridges and indeed his company over it. The hate comes from various sources and besides you miss the point here, WD was and is no longer the only company who specialized in this kind of localization, and futhermore we do not have to wait 4-5 years to play the next Atlus game simply because the manual wasn't foil stamped.
 
#46
Propagandhim said:
Alot of the turbulence during the PS2 time can fairly be attributed to Sony's policies on releasing games. I'm not sure of all the details, but I do remember quite a few barricades that Sony put on WD during the fizzling release of Goemon. As for NIS, I'm going to say it as bluntly as possible: NIS is shit. All of their games are retreads of the same game, with little innovation. Those Atelier Iris games were also crap. Atlus has done some great things, but if we're speaking solely on ratios, then WD has released a higher percentage of good games to bad games, unlike Atlus, who will release crappy titles from time to time.
I wouldnt say the atelier games themselves are crap, average is a bit more acurate. My problem with (at least the 1st one) the games is the shitty localization done to them. It's just downright sloppy. Their addition of a second language option in iris 1 added a ton of new bugs to the game that were not present in the original (freezes and such, voices cut off). the language option didnt save. there were several formatting / grammar issues, most notably when creating items (all this from playing about 10 hours before returning it in disgust, this shit was barely acceptable in 97 when FF7 came out (horrible example), it sure as hell doesnt fly now, not for me)
 
#48
Nah, I got the point. I'm just saying that WD is unique and would cater to a certain pool of people who aren't into Atlus' games. There are alot of differences between WD and Atlus, or any other company, after all. You make a good point though, I don't think they can afford to play the game the same way, and risk delays for ultra-fancy (and awesome) packaging, even though that is one of the very things that made them unique in the first place. I wish we could get the whole package...but maybe that's not viable in today's domain of videogame business. I won't pretend like I know a thing about what's viable in the industry anymore, but I do know that if WD would work out the kinks on a few things, they'd definitely be up there with the top dogs.
 
#49
ethelred said:
And in the same breath you knock WD's quality of coice and say this bunch is more capable? Sorry, but no. I'd take WD over all but one of them (Atlus).
When their choice is stuff like Goemon PS2 or Silpheed TLP... well, that sort of opens itself up to criticism, no? Working Designs' catalog has always been far from spectacular though, even in their heyday on PS1... I'd say the only must own products from them were the four Lunars, Popful Mail and Alundra actually.
 
#50
Yay!!!! I love it when RPGs take 5 years to come overseas!

Seriously though, I am glad they brought over Magicknight Rayearth for Saturn even if it was a little off target.