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[Joe T.]

When girls hit puberty and especially high school their aptitude for giving a shit about leadership positions tanks. This is a campaign focused on getting rid of some of the negativity surrounding female leadership at a very young age. If you take a gander at any media study about how female politicians are described vs men, there's a clear pattern of disparaging adjectives rather than neutral ones.

Having poured countless hours into team sports, the workplace and MMOs where the leadership roles were positions looked upon with much dread by everyone, I find the sudden idea that banning a single word would improve a girl/woman's likelihood to push for such positions a bit amusing.

I do think there were, and to a lesser extent still are, factors at play in everyday life that make leadership positions seem less appealing to women, but I also think arbitrarily singling out a single word in the English language and asking for it to be banned is ridiculous. It's an exercise in futility because once you ban bossy kids will soon find something else to replace it. Better to teach kids how to respect each other and how to behave out in the real world than to impose further restrictions on a society that already has too many.

 

[yogloo]

Google is so bossy.

 

[Dude Abides]

It's about making a statement and afterwards saying that you don't actually mean it

What are people supposed to think when they read Ban bossy? "Oh someone wants to ban the word bossy" seems likely

If those people are obtuse, sure.

I did. Great book. But it's not the only thing he wrote about trying to control language.

Oh, you were referencing Homage to Catalonia, then?

 

[Bobby Roberts]

but I also think arbitrarily singling out a single word in the English language and asking for it to be banned is ridiculous.

1) it's not arbitrary
2) it's not really a ban.

Again - this reads to me like you understand PERFECTLY what the movement is trying to get across in terms of asking people to think about the words they use and how they use them. And if that's the case - what's the benefit to you in opposing it?

 

[someday]

Apparently you've never met a lot of my bosses. Many of them were annoying nags of men. I should've been calling them powery and leadery all this time.

But did you call or refer to them as nags? Or bossy?

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Having poured countless hours into team sports, the workplace and MMOs where the leadership roles were positions looked upon with much dread by everyone, I find the sudden idea that banning a single word would improve a girl/woman's likelihood to push for such positions a bit amusing.

I do think there were, and to a lesser extent still are, factors at play in everyday life that make leadership positions seem less appealing to women, but I also think arbitrarily singling out a single word in the English language and asking for it to be banned is ridiculous. It's an exercise in futility because once you ban bossy kids will soon find something else to replace it. Better to teach kids how to respect each other and how to behave out in the real world than to impose further restrictions on a society that already has too many.

I'm not entirely won over by the efficacy of this campaign, but I also think that some are clearly not "getting it" in terms of putting a modicum of effort into understanding the "why" of this. I'm going to go off on a bit of a tangent here and preface this by clarifying that calling a girl "bossy" probably isn't as bad as some adjectives out there. But when one thinks of insulting terms that get levied at people of certain races/genders/sexual orientations/nationalities, do you think that people are just arbitrarily objecting to a random word, or what that word represents? If you agree that it's the latter and read the explanation of what people are taking away from the usage of "bossy," it should be clear what the point of this campaign is. Of course, I expect that some may not be in complete agreement about how gendered or insulting the term is, and that's fine. But that's different than expressing confusion at the mere notion of trying to tackle words that are perceived as problematic by some.

 

[Suite Pee]

On average, people react more negatively to women in power than their male counterparts. It's kind of a given in the Sociological literature at this point.

 

[Kinyou]

If they stop there, yes.

It's akin to the "read only thread title and not OP" syndrome prevalent around here.

I guess the problem there is that an hashtag has no OP attached to it.

 

[Dead Man]

It's not really a word I use at all, unless I am talking about a child (of any gender). I get the intention, but this isn't going to catch on I don't think, and even if it did, it is not addressing anything of substance.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Looks like the organizers of the campaign gave the general public more credit than they should have

 

[The Lamp]

i dont believe that a lack of women in leadership positions is a made up problem

And what, you think the word "bossy" made it that way? LOL

 

[kirby_fox]

I'm all for this 2nd women's rights movement that's been going on recently with media representation, but I think this is where I stop.

We need to get more women into leadership and assertive roles. But the word bossy isn't going to do much, and this campaign I feel is weak as hell. Bossy is a nice way to call someone a bitch or asshole, because they're being a bitch or asshole. Assertiveness doesn't need to come off cold, if it does you're bossy.

But maybe I'm the only one with the perception that way.

 

[Sub_Level]

Bossy sounds like something you would use to describe your 2 year old daughter demanding something in a cute way.

If it's a dude I would just use "a real hard ass", "asshole", or "kind of a dick". Also variations of douchebag. If it's a woman and it's really bad then the word "bitch" comes to mind. Bitch is so all-encompassing.

Language is weird.

 

[Famassu]

I'd suggest reading the first paragraph, since it since nothing about a boy running the risk of being called "bossy".

Bossy would be an insult for both men & women, it's more about the fact that women are more easily called bossy (or any other similar negative term) in situations where they might (try to) take a leading role than men. And yes, this is or can be a problem.

And what, you think the word "bossy" made it that way? LOL

I'm pretty sure they don't mean they want to ban just bossy, but want to discourage the use of all words/phrases that mean the same thing or all negative judgments when a girl wants to try to take the leading role. Bossy is probably the most common one. Or manipulative/over-controlling bitch.

 

[daycru]

More creepy nonsense from relentless weirdos.

 

[Zoc]

I don't think it's obtuse at all to think that "ban bossy" as the slogan of a campaign to encourage leadership in girls is weaksauce.

What's really needed is something like the affirmative action program, to enforce fairness in the way that teachers call on students, grade them, and give them leadership roles in the classroom.

I can see a parallel with the civil rights movement. Sixty years ago, it was a common belief that African-Americans were lazy and thus could never be leaders. I'm sure AA kids were more often called "lazy" by their teachers. What if someone had started a "Ban Lazy" campaign in schools? How much change would that have caused, compared to, say, the Civil Rights Act or affirmative action?

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

I don't think it's obtuse at all to think that "ban bossy" as the slogan of a campaign to encourage leadership in girls is weaksauce.

What's really needed is something like the affirmative action program, to enforce fairness in the way that teachers call on students, grade them, and give them leadership roles in the classroom.

I can see a parallel with the civil rights movement. Sixty years ago, it was a common belief that African-Americans were lazy and thus could never be leaders. I'm sure AA kids were more often called "lazy" by their teachers. What if someone had started a "Ban Lazy" campaign in schools? How much change would that have caused, compared to, say, the Civil Rights Act or affirmative action?

This is a pretty bad analogy

 

[Famassu]

More creepy nonsense from relentless weirdos.

What's creepy or nonsense about any of this?

 

[Joe T.]

1) it's not arbitrary
2) it's not really a ban.

Again - this reads to me like you understand PERFECTLY what the movement is trying to get across in terms of asking people to think about the words they use and how they use them. And if that's the case - what's the benefit to you in opposing it?

I don't oppose the movement to empower women, particularly in being more assertive towards leadership roles, what I oppose is the silly means in which it's being done via this campaign. It almost belittles it from my point of view.

I'm not entirely won over by the efficacy of this campaign, but I also think that some are clearly not "getting it" in terms of putting a modicum of effort into understanding the "why" of this. I'm going to go off on a bit of a tangent here and preface this by clarifying that calling a girl "bossy" probably isn't as bad as some adjectives out there. But when one thinks of insulting terms that get levied at people of certain races/genders/sexual orientations/nationalities, do you think that people are just arbitrarily objecting to a random word, or what that word represents? If you agree that it's the latter and read the explanation of what people are taking away from the usage of "bossy," it should be clear what the point of this campaign is. Of course, I expect that some may not be in complete agreement about how gendered or insulting the term is, and that's fine. But that's different than expressing confusion at the mere notion of trying to tackle words that are perceived as problematic by some.

They're objecting to the meaning of the word, obviously, but that's a meaning we've given to the word and if we push to ban it rather than the meaning then all is for naught. I'm not going to sit here and proclaim myself a sociology expert or pretend that I know what it's like growing up in the school system today - I graduated a good while ago when this sort of thing, as well as bullying, wasn't the problem it is today - but it does seem like we're not doing enough to deal with the problems we have in society today, this being but one of a great many, and not very high up on that list either considering that, unless I'm mistaken, the number of women in positions of power has been on the rise over the last few decades.

I agree with the "why" of the campaign, what I don't agree with is the "how."

 

[timetokill]

"Bossy" means "like a boss."

For guys that's a mark of pride. Reclaim the word "bossy," girls! If somebody calls you bossy, just say, "damn right, I'm a boss."

 

[Plywood]

I would like to be a boss bitch.

 

[overcast]

I don't know much about the usage of the word, but I can't seem to recall girls in HS being portrayed as "leaders" in pretty much any environment. So, I think that definitely needs to change.

 

[MrCunningham]

Because women can be so bossy at times. I'm not going to ban a word because a few people disagree with this statement.

 

[MutFox]

Usually when a guy is "bossy" he's a douchebag.
If a girl is being "bossy" she's a bitch.

There's a difference between being bossy and a boss.

 

[Famassu]

Because women can be so bossy at times. I'm not going to ban a word because a few people disagree with this statement.

Don't get too hung up on that ban thing. It's basically just a slogan. The more important thing is the ideology behind the slogan. So if you're ever in a position where a young girl is put into a leading position and you are somehow in control of the situation (an adult taking care of a group of children, a teacher or something), try to encourage her instead of being all "why so bossy" or some shit like that.

 

[BobbyRobby]

It seems like they are latching onto a word, because it's easier to complain about the symptom of a problem, rather than tackle the actual problem. How is starting a campaign to control the way people talk going to help with the problem of women being labelled bossy? It's so counterproductive that I think it might be a satire of feminism.

Go become a mentor to a young girl, inspire her to be a leader in some way. It seems like that would make more of a difference than getting fixated over a word.

I feel like everyone's attention is too divided to actually do meaningful things. So people are judged way more by what they say, rather than their actions nowadays.

 

[Cartman86]

You seriously think the word bossy is being banned? Get a fucking grip. It's a campaign to raise consciousness. To get people to think before they use certain words.

 

[Themacabre]

Don't get too hung up on that ban thing. It's basically just a slogan. The more important thing is the ideology behind the slogan. So if you're ever in a position where a young girl is put into a leading position and you are somehow in control of the situation (an adult taking care of a group of children, a teacher or something), try to encourage her instead of being all "why so bossy" or some shit like that.

Bossy is used when someone is being bossy and they aren't your actual boss. Nothing more. If someone is being bossy and gets called out on it, maybe they should stop ordering people around without any right to? That's what bossy means. It's annoying.

Little kids included, and lets' face it, they need to be taken down a peg or two anyway.

 

[BobbyRobby]

You seriously think the word bossy is being banned? Get a fucking grip. It's a campaign to raise consciousness. To get people to think before they use certain words.

A campaign asking people to look at the connotations of the words they are using should understand that the word 'ban' has some too.

 

[Rentahamster]

You seriously think the word bossy is being banned? Get a fucking grip. It's a campaign to raise consciousness. To get people to think before they use certain words.

Accusations of other members for being purposefully obtuse are premature. Give them a little credit. We don't have to assume the worst about each other.

The campaign is an attempt to ban the word "bossy" to achieve the goal of inspiring young girls to be leaders. For many, the banning of speech is a touchy subject that has many negative connotations. Whether or not "ban" here is used tongue-in-cheek, it is a serious subject and a serious word, and they have to take responsibility for the speech that they themselves use, too.

Here's a campaign that attempts to get people to change their speech/thinking, without having to use the "b" word so blatantly:

http://www.thinkb4youspeak.com/

 

[Famassu]

Bossy is used when someone is being bossy and they aren't your actual boss.

It's not just about being called bossy, it's the whole notion that it AND MANY OTHER SIMILAR PHRASES/WORDS are used more commonly when a woman is trying to assume a leader's role.

And that's a vast oversimplification of the uses of that word. That's the basic definition of the word perhaps, but that's not the only reason or situation where it's used. That's why this campaign even exists, some feel that women are more easily called bossy (or similar negative terms) in a situation where men aren't.

Nothing more.

Heh, there can always be more to the use of words than it's basic definition (where it's used, who most commonly use it, who are the word(s) most commonly used against, what does using the word say about the person using it etc.). The world & words aren't as simple as you seem to think they are.

If someone is being bossy and gets called out on it, maybe they should stop ordering people around without any right to?

What if someone is supposed to assume a kind of leading position (not a boss per se) and when a girl/woman tries to do it, they are more easily called bossy than boys/men? And then some boy/man tries to take that same leading position and is not called bossy?

 

[MIMIC]

Is a campaign about talking to young girls about leadership and feeling more confident about speaking up really that controversial?

I personally love commercials that encourage young girls to challenge the status quo. Like the Verizon commercial about the little girl who beat out Terry Bradshaw to anchor a football game (there's actually a better one, but I can't find it). There needs to be more commercials like this.

 

[kirblar]

Very curious how much of the leadership gap could be attributed to Men being generally overconfident as a whole. You see this in a lot of other behavior differences.

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

Telling everyone else what to do because reasons is bullying. It almost sounds like this is supporting it, but maybe I'm just looking at it too literally.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

This commercial will probably explain it to those who don't get it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOjNcZvwjxI

Context here: http://business.time.com/2013/12/10...-every-sexist-workplace-stereotype-in-one-ad/

If you don't see women like that, great! Don't act like because you think you're decent that everyone else is, though.

 

[And_Gignac]

Women who have to take dominant but assertive instances are called bossy while males are referred as good leaders. Any sign of assertive aggressiveness in a woman is viewed negatively.

they are campaigning to erase the word from dictionaries, just to not apply the word in the mentioned context.

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

Is a campaign about talking to young girls about leadership and feeling more confident about speaking up really that controversial?

ah, OK. but I have never heard anyone called bossy for raising their hand to answer a question.

 

[Shadownet]

Because men aren't bossy, they're just asshole.

Excuse my French.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Notice how in places like subways, women will often be the voice of information while men will be the voice of commands. It's by design because we know how people react to things.

It seems like they are latching onto a word, because it's easier to complain about the symptom of a problem, rather than tackle the actual problem. How is starting a campaign to control the way people talk going to help with the problem of women being labelled bossy? It's so counterproductive that I think it might be a satire of feminism.

Their side is that it's on everyone to stop with the labels, because if women just go hard on this and stand strong, they're being bossy. Everyone has to do their part, but let's relax a bit on the people who have been conditioned not to be the best version of themselves.

 

[Themacabre]

The world & words aren't as simple as you seem to think they are.

My eyes just rolled out of my head.

What if someone is supposed to assume a kind of leading position (not a boss per se) and when a girl/woman tries to do it, they are more easily called bossy than boys/men?

Maybe they are being bossy?

And then some boy/man tries to take that same leading position and is not called bossy?

Maybe they aren't being bossy?

How about a campaign that shows all of the amazing female scientists and engineers that we have (especially at NASA) and our wonderful female CEOs and entrepreneurs and then a slogan like, "These women didn't get here by complaining about words".

I guess I'm too cynical for things like this in general. Also, I think women are pretty awesome and more than capable of anything they put their minds to, so forgive me if I come off as a dick, I just have too much respect for women to even be able to look at a site like this without feeling grossed out. I don't like anything like this, and I never will.

 

[EVOL 100%]

There is a kind of stereotype in fiction of the 'know-it-all' kid who's sassy, arrogant and nosy as fuck with their hands typically on their hips and they're almost always girls. I can definitely see where these people are coming from

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

How about a campaign that shows all of the amazing female scientists and engineers that we have (especially at NASA) and our wonderful female CEOs and entrepreneurs and then a slogan like, "These women didn't get here by complaining about words".

Oof. Then you're ignoring the problems involved in getting women to even think they can attempt engineering jobs due to peer influence, let alone the ones who are actually able to suffer through the whole ordeal. There's a whole lot about this: http://www.nae.edu/Publications/Bri...BarriersandEnablersforWomeninEngineering.aspx

Also, I think women are pretty awesome and more than capable of anything they put their minds to, so forgive me if I come off as a dick, I just have too much respect for women to even be able to look at a site like this without feeling grossed out.

If you have respect for women, you'll respect them for being where they are due to many widespread forms of subtle oppression rather than only championing the ones with the strongest wills. Take them at their worst and their best, not just what's most comfortable for you.

I dated a person who mentors girls into being future leaders, and she mentioned that it takes about seven different people before a woman decides she can even do something. Many people in power who she holds in respect have to say "you can do this thing" before they even think about actually trying it. Men can often make these decisions with just one person supporting them. Shit is very real out there.

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

Women who have to take dominant but assertive instances are called bossy while males are referred as good leaders. Any sign of assertive aggressiveness in a woman is viewed negatively.

I view it negatively in men and women.

 

[BobbyRobby]

Their side is that it's on everyone to stop with the labels, because if women just go hard on this and stand strong, they're being bossy. Everyone has to do their part, but let's relax a bit on the people who have been conditioned not to be the best version of themselves.

I have two women superiors.

One is assertive. She calmly tells people what they have to do. If someone is screwing up, she will get a bit stern.

The second is on a power trip. She will hover around people, constantly questioning people and nit-picking things they are doing.

'Bossy' is a perfectly fine way to describe the second woman. It is not unfair. I think it is a just evaluation of the person's behavior. It is a good label.

We don't need a campaign to create another bad word. Bossy women do exist. Stuff like this makes it harder for real communication to take place.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

I have two women superiors.

One is assertive. She calmly tells people what they have to do. If someone is screwing up, she will get a bit stern.

The second is on a power trip. She will hover around people, constantly questioning people and nit-picking things they are doing.

'Bossy' is a perfectly fine way to describe the second woman. It is not unfair. I think it is a just evaluation of the person's behavior. It is a good label.

We don't need a campaign to create another bad word. Bossy women do exist. Stuff like this makes it harder for real communication to take place.

http://thesaurus.com/

If people say they don't like being called something, just listen and do it. We generally offer this civility with everyone else because it's not that big of a deal to us but we can recognize that it's very important to them. If you're actually interested in real communication, you wouldn't be stubborn about using words that are known to confuse and frustrate people who can't tell if you're being sexist. There are many ways to express valid criticisms that don't evaporate just because certain words feel bad to some.

 

[kirblar]

Women who have to take dominant but assertive instances are called bossy while males are referred as good leaders. Any sign of assertive aggressiveness in a woman is viewed negatively.

they are campaigning to erase the word from dictionaries, just to not apply the word in the mentioned context.

If you think that excessive micromanagement is viewed positively in males but not in females, I don't know what I could tell you to change your mind. (I don't disagree that there are real issues related to how people view women in power, btw, just that "dominant but assertive" isn't what comes to mind when describing the term "bossy.")

 

[Themacabre]

Oof. Then you're ignoring the problems involved in getting women to even think they can attempt engineering jobs due to peer influence, let alone the ones who are actually able to suffer through the whole ordeal. There's a whole lot about this: http://www.nae.edu/Publications/Bri...BarriersandEnablersforWomeninEngineering.aspx

Yawn. I've seen it all before and I'm not ignoring anything. The fact is that there ARE women engineers. How did that happen? Magic? Luck?

That article is basically calling women weak, which I don't agree with.

Take them at their worst and their best, not just what's most comfortable for you.

No. I wouldn't do that for men, why would I for women? I will continue to point out strong female role models to my nieces, and not tell them that there is an evil oppression barrier around them at all times that only the strongest women can break through.

 

[davepoobond]

I'm going to make a new word for people to be offended at.

All women are fjtogkvientes
And all men are fmtklltkfnes


Lets make some web sites people.

 

[hipbabboom]

I've personally have used the word to describe men than I have women. Granted I've reported to more men than women but that's typically not where the word comes up for me. The word comes up when someone who has no business telling me what to do decides to command rather than ask.

 

[Kazerei]

That article is basically calling women weak, which I don't agree with.

No, it's not, it's saying women have to deal with greater obstacles in becoming engineers.

I will continue to point out strong female role models to my nieces, and not tell them that there is an evil oppression barrier around them at all times that only the strongest women can break through.

But there are additional barriers for women, which this campaign is hoping to break down.