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Why are Nintendo games uncopiable?
- Thread starter Kathian
- Start date
gamerMan
Member
Why do companies have to copy? Can't we just have more platformers and action RPGS? I think the better question is why don't we have as many genres as we got in PS1 and PS2 era. Every game is trying to be more open world than the last game or trying to push a more emotional storyline or trying to be the most violent shooter. Where are the games like Dark Cloud, SSX, Jak And Daxster, Prince Of Persia, Silent Hill, Jet Moto, Jumping Jack Flash and more?
Also, it's hard to copy Nintendo because so much of what make their games work is control. There are a ton of Mario Kart clones but none of them feel as good as Mario Kart. You can copy the formula, but getting a character to feel like Mario or move like Link is next to impossible.
It's like asking, Why isn't anyone copying Last Of Us. Even if a game had the exact gameplay as the Last Of Us, the story isn't going to compare with anything that Naughty Dog puts out. Naughty Dog is a master of storytelling just like Nintendo is a master of control. I can pick up Mario 64 today and running around with Mario on the field outside the castle still feels better than most games feel today. Nintendo has mastered the art of control which is what makes their games so fun to play.
Also, it's hard to copy Nintendo because so much of what make their games work is control. There are a ton of Mario Kart clones but none of them feel as good as Mario Kart. You can copy the formula, but getting a character to feel like Mario or move like Link is next to impossible.
It's like asking, Why isn't anyone copying Last Of Us. Even if a game had the exact gameplay as the Last Of Us, the story isn't going to compare with anything that Naughty Dog puts out. Naughty Dog is a master of storytelling just like Nintendo is a master of control. I can pick up Mario 64 today and running around with Mario on the field outside the castle still feels better than most games feel today. Nintendo has mastered the art of control which is what makes their games so fun to play.
im in that minority then... i loved it more than most zelda games too.
Even with its issues, Mario Sunshine is a more consistent game then the Adventure games to me
. Galaxy is one of the best games I have ever played! So you are right that Mario reaches grand heights
.Alundra does exist, you know?
Not to mention Darksiders 2 is a janky mess. Just no.
Yeah, Legends definitely seemed like a game bolted together from unused Origins assets. However, the music levels are some of the best ever put in a platformer.
Origins is easily in my top 10 games all time. I had more fun with it than any other 2D platformer, even Mario World, Mario 3, etc. I loved that it was speed/rhythm based without being out of control/frantic like the old sonics.
Stevey
Member
It played janky in consoles. Borderline unplayable for me actually.
He said beats, not mechanics, which I assume is the same sort of thing I've spoken about before:
There's nothing about Race's platformers that suggests they were giving Nintendo a run for their money beyond a technical perspective. Mechanically, Rare's platformers were boring as fuck.
I do agree with this a bit. The issue is they don't have many studios. They need to think more on expansion, buy some companies in the west, create new development studios in the west. They can be the Disney of video games, they just need more diversity.
If Nintendo fears some kind of image related issue, they could probably make a publishing and developing house catered to more adult audiences much like Disney had to do in the 80's when they created Touchstone Pictures.
geordiemp
Member
Ah, another thread where da gamez I like are da best / uncopyable / unsurpassed.
Everyone has different tastes, I got bored of Zelda on Wii pretty quick, preferred excite truck. I remember the fishing and goat herding, fucking terrible.
But for an action adventure give me Skyrim anyday. But thats opinions.
But the whole superiority rubbish needs to go away, gamers like different things.
A platformer alone does not cut much mustard with non Nintendo platforms unless its 20 bucks, it needs other things such as shooting / flying like Ratchet and clank. But thats my opinion.
Everyone has different tastes, I got bored of Zelda on Wii pretty quick, preferred excite truck. I remember the fishing and goat herding, fucking terrible.
But for an action adventure give me Skyrim anyday. But thats opinions.
But the whole superiority rubbish needs to go away, gamers like different things.
A platformer alone does not cut much mustard with non Nintendo platforms unless its 20 bucks, it needs other things such as shooting / flying like Ratchet and clank. But thats my opinion.
Stevey
Member
What a shame.
OrbitalBeard
Member
Cool, so I guess personal attacks are alright now.
Ah, okay. I understand what you mean about Alundra. I just don't know if it's fair for you per se to say it's the best Zelda when you haven't played the majority of the series. You might find any of the ones you haven't tried to be better. Perhaps not, I just took a small issue with the hyperbole. My hyperbole detector is always going off like crazy in threads like this, though, I certainly don't mean to give you a hard time.
As to 2D platformers, I think Rayman holds a candle, but possibly no other game or series.
Their not in anyway similar?
Wait, when was it said the new Zelda is inspired by Western games?
They have a lot of talent, a pretty unique company culture in the industry and some of the most iconic brands in gaming.
The only developer I can think of being in a similar standing is Rockstar.
So what Zelda-like game are you thinking about?
The only developer I can think of being in a similar standing is Rockstar.
So what Zelda-like game are you thinking about?
POWERSPHERE
Member
Zelda is the only rpg that is basically a coming of age game. It focuses on hope and the pain of getting older / responsibilities. All the other games of this style are focused on being hardcore, dark and gritty. I really enjoy the ray of sunshine that Zelda offers.
wild wild rice
Member
what a post
Napalm_Frank
Member
I shall lay my last defense with the fact that at least I have played the games majority seems to regard as the best in the series.
As for Rayman it comes closest for me too but it doesn't quite touch the best 2D Marios. Something like Sonic tho in my opinion is far below.
edit: well I forgot goddamn KLONOA. That's a classic if there ever was one.
which consoles? PS3 version had a single glitch that was patched... but fighting, and controls were tight, exploration was fun, loot was great and art direction was amazing.
Orniletter
Banned
They are two series going for 2 very, very different things.
Souls games are obviously better at combat, because thats what they focus almost exclusively on.
On the same note, Zelda blows any Souls game out of the water in the puzzle department.
???
Their similarities are just superficial, they are on completely different ends of the action-adventure spectrum.
Oh, don't remind me.
They get copied all the time. I maintain that Okami is the best Zelda-style game out there and I hear good things about Darksiders. Plenty of indies have been tackling the Metroid style game, with Axiom Verge being a recent terrific example. Mario style platformers were a dime a dozen a few years ago (both the 2d ones during the NES/SNES years and the 3d ones during the N64/GC years), though have admittedly fallen by the wayside recently.
I think the biggest reason it might seem like Nintendo is the only one doing these games is because they stick so closely to their formulas. Zelda games have barely changed in a decade and outside the stray Mario-with-a-water-pack game, the plumber is doing almost the same thing as he was generations ago.
Meanwhile, someone else might take the 3d Mario platformer base and add more shooty bits, giving you Ratchet and Clank. They come from a similar place but some devs slowly riff on the base ideas to give us new ideas. And the riff on those ideas again and again leading to products that diverge more and more from where Nintendo continues to trundle.
I think the biggest reason it might seem like Nintendo is the only one doing these games is because they stick so closely to their formulas. Zelda games have barely changed in a decade and outside the stray Mario-with-a-water-pack game, the plumber is doing almost the same thing as he was generations ago.
Meanwhile, someone else might take the 3d Mario platformer base and add more shooty bits, giving you Ratchet and Clank. They come from a similar place but some devs slowly riff on the base ideas to give us new ideas. And the riff on those ideas again and again leading to products that diverge more and more from where Nintendo continues to trundle.
Dark Souls and Zelda both sell a few million copies per game. That leaves an awful lot of room for people to have played one, both or neither, and decide whether they like them or not, without resorting to personal insults. When two series are both critically acclaimed, the idea that someone might think one better than another is hardly controversial or proof of idiocy. Completely unnecessary post.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
Nintendo is really good at excelling in the types of games they make.
They also seem to understand that fun, art style, playability, etc trump raw horse power.
Also, I bet you one of the reasons local multiplayer is dead outside of Nintendo is cause most developers can't do 4 player, local multiplayer with the level of polish that Nintendo can.
They also seem to understand that fun, art style, playability, etc trump raw horse power.
Also, I bet you one of the reasons local multiplayer is dead outside of Nintendo is cause most developers can't do 4 player, local multiplayer with the level of polish that Nintendo can.
I love how people say that Dark souls is a copy of zelda .... when there is the game 3D Dot Game Heroes that is made by the same guys. When they want to copy zelda they do THAT =P
Zelda has a few copies ... but Mario is complicated because it has so many types. 2D Mario is copied more, Mario Kart is rarely copied but mostly without success and 3D Mario ... well the last copy I saw was on the n64 ... but lots of games like it are being Kickstarted so demand exists
Zelda has a few copies ... but Mario is complicated because it has so many types. 2D Mario is copied more, Mario Kart is rarely copied but mostly without success and 3D Mario ... well the last copy I saw was on the n64 ... but lots of games like it are being Kickstarted so demand exists
AdventureRacing
Member
I still prefer pretty much all the Zelda games to any game from the souls franchise. Opinions and all that.
I've always looked at Zelda as being a jack of all trades, master of none kind of series and I think a lot of developers probably see it the same way, there just isn't really much benefit to copying the formula outright especially if you're making a new IP. Mario on the other hand only reigns supreme because platformers have largely fallen out of the AAA environment.
Indies have been doing tons of local multiplayer games. Towerfall, Screencheat, Nidhogg, Capsule Force just to name a few off the top of my head. Heck, Sports Friends was an entire collection of local multiplayer only games. Nintendo is one of the larger companies doing them but they are far from the only ones playing in the space.
From only published 3D Dot Game Heroes in Japan. It was made by Silicon Studios, also known for the Bravely Default series.
Ratchet & Clank isn't Mario with Guns, it's Contra in 3D.
The distinction being that R&C really doesn't have all that much content based around actual traversal dexterity; that's generally trivial, whereas it's very much the heart of Mario. They didn't just add shooty bits, they also took away much of the platforming, making it a very distinct product; a great game, but not quite scratching the same itch.
Glass Shark
Banned
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ZombiePlatypus
Member
Yup. Dunno why extra comments about intellect are being dragged into this. I know people love Souls games and that's fine. When I tried it though, those games felt like a chore and devoid of fun. Zelda games feel infinitely more compelling to me. (And superior.)
I don't think it's fair to say that Zelda games barely change, it's a charge often levelled at a series that mixes things up far more than most AAA franchises when you consider how much the games work in tandem with the hardware they appear on.
Majora's Mask, Wind Waker, Spirit Tracks, Phantom Hourglass and Skyward Sword all contained huge changes to the 'formula' as seen in OOT, TP and most recently LBW. Stylus controls, motion controls, flying, boats, the ocean, trains, hub dungeons, hub towns, an overworld only existing on tracks, etc.
Sure, overworld/dungeon/item/boss is a formula, but if we have to simplify it down that much to reach it, then most series, and even most genres, share a formula they stick to as well.
OrbitalBeard
Member
They're also some of the highest rated games of all time and very few people dispute those scores, even years/decades later. You may not find these games to be "spectacular" but millions of players do.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
Yea I get that. Should clarify I was referring to full blown, HD, 3D console games. Not smaller scale stuff.
What am I reading.
There's actual quality, art, and polish that back these games up. It's not just hollow hype.
Nothing turns me off of wanting to play the Souls game more than Souls games fan shitposts.
Napalm_Frank
Member
They are Action Puzzle games.
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