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Why Can't We Have One Standard for Chat/Texting with Different Clients?

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M

Marion Cobretti

Member
I hate having to use 3 or 4 different apps to be able to chat with everyone.

SMS, Facebook, hangouts, and whatsapp. Thank god I have no friends on aim.

Point is, why can't it, or hasn't it been done?

As terrible as it must sound to some, I kinda wish everyone would just use Facebook messenger. Phone, tablet, computer, any operating system. Works on basically anything.
 
C

collige

Banned
standards.png

Using pidgin or Adium solves most problems though.
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
There is a "standard", but Google and Facebook decided to abandon it and many other services don't support interfacing with it.

XMPP is that standard and many chat platforms supported gateways to interface with XMPP servers/services (AIM, Lync, Skype, MSN Messenger, etc).

One of the problems with XMPP is that the underlying protocol is XML based, which is highly inefficient when you think of a mobile network, for example. Another problem is that XMPP lacked inherent support for many features of modern chat clients like group video, voice. So I can understand why some mobile services would want to us a proprietary implementation.
 
S

Somnid

Member
Regardless of the standard you need a network to route it. These are owned by someone, Facebook, Google, Microsoft etc. There are peer-to-peer variants but they don't provide the type of history or login anywhere functionality that users expect due to not having centralized storage. So whichever network you use, you are locked to and so the standard does not matter.
 
Z

zoku88

Member
Somnid said:
Regardless of the standard you need a network to route it. These are owned by someone, Facebook, Google, Microsoft etc. There are peer-to-peer variants but they don't provide the type of history or login anywhere functionality that users expect due to not having centralized storage. So whichever network you use, you are locked to and so the standard does not matter.
Click to expand...
That's assuming no federation, which xmpp had. Which allows people using Google accounts to talk to people using jabber.org accounts or whatever.
 
E

Edwardo

Member
A group of my friends and me use a group chat, but two out of six of us have android and the rest have iphones. They all used imessage until I joined the group and one person switched to android. It always works fine for me and my android buddy, but some of the iphone dudes will get random old messages from us days later or they won't get anything all day then all of a sudden get 100+ messages at 10pm.

I want us all to switch to facebook messenger, but one friend is a clown and refuses to reactivate his facebook.

Anything else I suggest, like hangouts, they just say they don't want to download it. It's funny that our group text works fine for me, yet im the one making suggestions for something that works for all of us.
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
zoku88 said:
That's assuming no federation, which xmpp had. Which allows people using Google accounts to talk to people using jabber.org accounts or whatever.
Click to expand...

XMPP federation + gateways to non-XMPP based services would allow fully cross platform functionality (add friends from AIM, get presence from MSN Live Messenger, chat with users on Google Talk, etc).

I work(ed) heavily with XMPP and I really like the protocol, but I can also see the limitations and issues with dealing with such a heavy, inefficient protocol when you shift your focus to mobile.
 
S

Senoculum

Member
Well, SMS was the standard wasn't it? and the different "clients" were just different phone manufacturers. It had 3.5 billion users too. But now that we're past sending short texts, and now images and video are the norm, the standard is to send info via wi-fi.

I think that's pretty fair. It's not like facebook messenger, whatsapp, or even twitter are difficult to get into. And it provides choice for the consumer. I like having to differentiate between work, family and friends. Some messaging handles have me as my full, real name, where in others, I like being anonymous.

Everything is awesome.
 
J

Junior Mint

Member
I hate that everyone uses Whatsapp in Canada. What a garbage ass app, they can't even figure out how to get browser messaging working on iOS... you know, the biggest mobile OS in North America. Even worse is the fact that I can't sync messages with it on my work phone.

If I had to pick one platform, I think facebook messenger is best. It's quick, the apps looks good, and it's accessible on nearly every device on the planet.
 
S

Somnid

Member
zoku88 said:
That's assuming no federation, which xmpp had. Which allows people using Google accounts to talk to people using jabber.org accounts or whatever.
Click to expand...

That was when client apps used to compete. Now the client app doesn't matter, they're practically identical, it's the service layer/user base and nobody wants to give it up. They'll just open up an API.
 
kamineko

kamineko

Does his best thinking in the flying car
I had me some Trillian

I just wish their would be some international, platform-agnostic emoji-like keyboard standard
 
Q

quaere

Member
collige said:
standards.png

Using pidgin or Adium solves most problems though.
Click to expand...
if only this was true. It would be a vast improvement over what we have now if there were actually competing open standards. Instead we have competing proprietary closed protocols.

I blame Google really. Apple has always been a closed fuck you if you don't use our products company. Google were supposed to be our do no evil saviors. But somewhere along the line they changed. Now third party clients aren't even allowed to connect to Hangouts, even in reduced functionality XMPP mode.
 
T

The Albatross

Member
OP is right. It's a damn shame things just don't work. I'm constantly frustrated that Apple has no PC support for Messages. "But why would they want you to use it on a PC when they make Macs?!?" Because many people have multiple computers, especially for work, and while I have a Mac at home and an iPhone for my phone, my work computer is a PC and I also have a Linux workstation. It would not be hard for Apple to make a web client for Messages.

This is something Google gets. When they create a service they generally try to get it onto as many device types as possible, sometimes being *better* on non-Google devices. Apple is just too stubborn to put any effort in and just assumes that if you have an iPhone, you'll buy a Mac, and then if you buy a Mac, you will never use a PC or Linux or any other OS.

Where I disagree with OP is 'wishing everybody would use Facebook messenger.' I wish there were some universal client, but I don't want to have to use Facebook or have Facebook be a part of my life to use it. I'd prefer an open SMS/Messaging client that also has a web (or desktop) interface. If WhatsApp worked with Google Hangouts/SMS or Messages/SMS I'd use it.
 
Q

quaere

Member
JMDSO said:
That is patently false.

I'm using pidgin connected to hangouts right now.
Click to expand...
Oh really? It was pretty widely reported earlier this year XMPP was being discontinued. I guess those reports were incorrect or Google changed their mind?
 
P

phyrlord

Member
Isn't everyone using a phone? isn't SMS your 'chat with everyone' client? I'm confused by this post. lol. Maybe the rare person with FB only.
 
R

RDreamer

Member
I feel like everyone would be using SMS if it weren't for phone companies gouging the ever-loving fuck out of you for it. That's a lot of what caused the splintering, honestly.

Marion Cobretti said:
As terrible as it must sound to some, I kinda wish everyone would just use Facebook messenger. Phone, tablet, computer, any operating system. Works on basically anything.
Click to expand...

Same, mostly.
 
M

Marion Cobretti

Member
phyrlord said:
Isn't everyone using a phone? isn't SMS your 'chat with everyone' client? I'm confused by this post. lol. Maybe the rare person with FB only.
Click to expand...
I can't use SMS on my tablet and computer.

That's the whole point or desire. Every device, every OS, one app.

Pushbullet brought me a little closer, but still no SMS on my tablet.
 
B

bms2993

Banned
I gave up social media. Now I use specifically iMessage for communication. Oh, wait does count for social media?
 
U

UraMallas

Member
I just switched from Windows Phone to Android and the thing I miss the most is the way Windows Phone's OS seemlessly meshed Facebook Messenger, SMS, Skype, etc. into one thread so you didn't have to go from app to app.
 
J

JMDSO

Unconfirmed Member
Marion Cobretti said:
I can't use SMS on my tablet and computer.

That's the whole point or desire. Every device, every OS, one app.

Pushbullet brought me a little closer, but still no SMS on my tablet.
Click to expand...

Google Voice (and Hangouts) can send SMS from a PC, but it would be sent as the GV number.
 
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