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Why do gaming tradeshows make gamers so angry?
- Thread starter TitusGroan
- Start date
CecilRousso
Member
A choice has been taken away from them, the choice to select to buy the game from other platforms.
Granted, it might turn out for other platforms later, but when we wont know exactly if or when, so we're being pushed to the available option now. That's a worse situation for customers then how it was for the previous game in the series.
To be fair, when TR was announced at the conference, it was heavily implied that the game was fully exclusive. Even Aaron Greenberg's tweet in response to Geoff's question (while cagey) still hinted that it was a full exclusive.
And hey, it's a hobby people are passionate about. Happens in every industry. Sure there's the initial kneejerk reaction but there's legitimate disappointment there too. And it's something that I can honestly sympathize with unlike say fans who were upset that FF13 went multiplat or that the new Xmen movie did better than Captain America.
I also don't think most people are willing to drop a ton of cash to just play one game they were excited for. I for sure don't have that sort of money to spare but I can still be disappointed that I won't be able to play said game.
EDIT:
There's also the issue of not being comfortable with such practices. Which is what is also being discussed. In an industry that's already rife with day one DLCs, exclusive DLCS, exclusive content, the act of restricting other players from playing a game through deals such as these ones aren't going to make people any happier with the direction the industry could be possibly moving towards.
Griddlelol
Banned
Then all those games you've got suddenly don't work. It's not as "simple" as selling a console for a massive loss, then buying another expensive device. You also have to sell the games for a massive loss, buy them again if you want.
Unlike changing services, where you simply stop paying a moderate fee, then start paying the same fee to a different company. You don't lose anything, and you can easily switch back and forth between companies. Imagine having to buy and sell consoles for a continual loss every time an exclusive comes out, constantly losing money, and constantly dropping £300+. The analogy between streaming services and consoles is actually rather ridiculous.
With the advent of digital media, we're locked to a system even more than before. That Titanfall I bought digitally is lost if I switch to PS4.
Another idea:
Imagine if every music festival had only country music. The top 40 lists all had nothing but country, and other forms of music were shunted off into a corner where only a niche could hear it. Producers and talent scouts decide only country music can sell and your most talented singers, who could do very well in other forms of music, were either shunted off into country music where they became mediocre, or just didn't make it at all.
Great world if you're a fan of country music, but not so great if you're a fan of other music hoping to get some good music.
The game industry and game trade shows are a lot like this if you aren't a shooter fan.
Imagine if every music festival had only country music. The top 40 lists all had nothing but country, and other forms of music were shunted off into a corner where only a niche could hear it. Producers and talent scouts decide only country music can sell and your most talented singers, who could do very well in other forms of music, were either shunted off into country music where they became mediocre, or just didn't make it at all.
Great world if you're a fan of country music, but not so great if you're a fan of other music hoping to get some good music.
The game industry and game trade shows are a lot like this if you aren't a shooter fan.
would you say it's the same situation as destiny's DLC, if it's timed the same? or what if it's a situation where MS funded the game ala DR3 and will come to PC but stay off PS4 platforms? is that ok
CecilRousso
Member
I haven't followed the discussions about Destiny so I can't comment on that game.
If it's anything like Microsofts "we have timed exclusive DLC for this and that game, that's good for you" that they run on every E3, then yeah, it's not something that's really good for anyone who is a customer.
TitusGroan
Banned
Except that there is an alternative for people who aren't fans of country music: PC, Wii U, 3DS or Vita.
...christ did that sentence feel weird to type out.
You're talking more about popular genres nudging out less popular ones, which is a different debate. If anything, this Gamescom showed an amazing variety of games and genres, and was much much more than just shooters.
BurnOutBrighter
Banned
Try telling people that they can only watch Star Wars movies at AMC.
Chaos2Frozen
Member
For Destiny at least they still get to play the game on their console!
That said, even if Destiny is completely PS exclusive imo at least it's a new ip and not one with a prequel that is multiplat so it's fine. And for the record, I never made a big deal about Titanfall being on XB and PC either.
People are angry at video-game trade-shows because they're naive. The gaming industry, like any other, is there to maximize profits, not to maximize our fun and the value of our hardware investments in said fun. There have *always* been console-exclusive video games, ever since Atari and Intelivision and the famous Sega-Nintendo rivalry. If you don't like it, either get more than one console or get used to missing out on a few of them.
SliceSabre
Banned
Because music and film is a mature industry and games are not.
...Is what I used to think but now I'm not too sure. I think its more people put too much emotional stock in video games companies rather than movie companies.
...Is what I used to think but now I'm not too sure. I think its more people put too much emotional stock in video games companies rather than movie companies.
Ovek
7Member7
Because they are full of pointless double talk PR that serves no purpose other than pander to the fucking gaming "press" that just regurgitate it to the public like the good little boys and girls are told to do so by the same fucking PR people.
The problems with it is the most gamers can see right though this shit and are getting larger and larger stages on which to shout back and call them out on there bullshit.
Take the latest example Tomb Raider, well all know Microsoft has paid SE tens of millions for an exclusive (maybe timed) but what do you get a pre written PR statement some Crystal Dynamics (it really wasn't) about how it's the best platform etc which of course we all know is shit and have all ways known it was shit. It infuriates people that publishers, developers and in most cases the gaming press can't tell the truth at least once.
PR & Marketing is the biggest thing wrong with gaming today and events like Gamescom highlight it for everyone paying attention to see.
The problems with it is the most gamers can see right though this shit and are getting larger and larger stages on which to shout back and call them out on there bullshit.
Take the latest example Tomb Raider, well all know Microsoft has paid SE tens of millions for an exclusive (maybe timed) but what do you get a pre written PR statement some Crystal Dynamics (it really wasn't) about how it's the best platform etc which of course we all know is shit and have all ways known it was shit. It infuriates people that publishers, developers and in most cases the gaming press can't tell the truth at least once.
PR & Marketing is the biggest thing wrong with gaming today and events like Gamescom highlight it for everyone paying attention to see.
They probably are under contractual obligation to not mention how much Microsoft paid them. They aren't under a contractual obligation to not make PR. This is also the case in other industries as well, and if you think there's a lot of funny hidden money in the games industry, you haven't seen film.
TitusGroan
Banned
...
...look, as much as I can admit that a lot of Games PR is a bit of a joke, Marketing and PR are not the worst evils in the world. After all, it's the marketing and PR guys who are the ones letting us know about the games in the first place. You sure as heck couldn't leave it to the coders and engineers to organise game reveals and marketing campaigns on top of making the game. I may be biased, as I work in the PR sector, but there are far worse things in the gaming industry currently than PR, and they are nto what you should get angry about. Bad management, exploitative labour practises, lack of QA before release, those are all things which actually damage the gaming industry and negatively affect gamers. PR being PR doesn't.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
Because they don't announce things are music or movie festivals, and if they do it's not an announcement telling people they'll have to spend another $400 to listen to a new album or watch a new movie.
Music and movie festivals are more about the actual art and displaying it for other people to see. E3 is not a games festival, E3 is a business show. If you want a video game festival go to MAG Fest or something like that. People aren't getting mad about those.
Music and movie festivals are more about the actual art and displaying it for other people to see. E3 is not a games festival, E3 is a business show. If you want a video game festival go to MAG Fest or something like that. People aren't getting mad about those.
I don't know if you were around for the Betamax/VHS wars.... For a number of reasons though, software is impractical to standardize on just one platform, especially platforms as proprietary as game consoles. I'm not sure if we'd want a world where there was only one type of game console, for that matter.
TitusGroan
Banned
Spending more money on videogame platforms isn't an excuse for using every little thing as an excuse to get angry. it is perfectly possible to not own all platforms, and be happy that more games are coming out for people to play, even if you won't get to play all of them. I try and do that as much as possible. I'm not going to get to play Bloodborne or Tomb Raider anytime soon, but I will get to play Bayo 2 and Civ Beyond Earth. Yay, happy me! I get to play great games. You get to play great games. We all get to play great games.
This is an exacerbation of those exclusive DLC deals.
DR3 wouldn't have existed without MS. Heck, MS even published the game themselves. I's say that situation is more similar to Bloodbourne than TR.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
Yes, but that happens once in a blue moon comparatively. I didn't say that it would be better if we narrowed everything down to one console. I was explaining why people get mad at trade shows. People don't constantly like hearing that they can't play something they want to play unless they shell out hundreds of dollars more to play it. It's not that hard of a thing to understand.
I'm not one of the people complaining. I'm explaining why people are complaining and pointing out that the comparison to festivals isn't a very apt one. Also, you're misrepresenting people. You see a bunch of people get angry and assume that it's the same people over and over when there are thousands of people here, and millions on the internet every day. If you're a PS4 owner and a huge Tomb Raider fan that expected to be able to play the sequel, it's understandable why that person would be upset. That doesn't mean that same person is complaining every time the One gets an exclusive. I think there are less people finding "Every little thing as an excuse to get angry." then you think, and just that there are a lot of people that get angered by different things.
The fact of the matter is that this has been going on for at least 25 years if not longer. Exclusives are the nature of consoles, they aren't open platforms, even though both of them resemble PCs now due to economies of scale. As someone else has mentioned in the thread, other series, such as Resident Evil, have gone from being a series on one console to being on another. We actually have, incidentally, more multiplatform games for Xbox One and PS4 than in prior generations where console-exclusives were a lot more common.
The thing is, that things are actually getting better. There were very few multiplatform games in the 8 bit era, and things stayed that way up until the seventh console generation. The eighth console generation is no doubt going to have more multiplatform titles than any other. Throwing a fit just because one of them became an exclusive is kind of missing the forest for the trees, and it has happened many times before; more often at that.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
It doesn't matter how long it's been going on to the people who love a game series and can't afford to play it because they bought the wrong console. It doesn't make it any more enjoyable for those people just because there has been a history of it.
People over react to it, but I understand their general sentiment.
CecilRousso
Member
Didn't see this part of the post previously.
I would say that the DR3 situation is slightly better, since it was announced for XBOX One from the beginning. If I was interested in the series it would be annoying, but it's still better then the TR situation.
People might be correct when they say that the TR game might not have been announced for any specific platforms at E3, but as it's a direct follow up to game that was released just the other year, and they didn't say anything about an exclusivity then, people made pretty good assumptions that this game would have been handled the same way, and got their expectations up -- which of course is the purpose of such an announcement. Expecations that have now been dealt a blow for those that doesn't have an XBOX or had plans to get one.
If this was the plan all along from CD and MS, then this affair have been handled very poorly PR wise, and that's on them, not the customers. There are of course over reactions to this, but anyone who doesn't understand or had expected reactions are pretty naive.
All these announcements are about generating hype, and when they toy with peoples expecations, then we can't fault people for giving them backlash. It's situations like this that generates so much of the anger, and we can't accept customers who companies try and handle as open wallets, to be understandable to corporate descisions. That's not our business, that's theirs.
Disappointment, I get that, and feel it too whenever I don't have a platform that a game or other interesting product comes out on. Anger though, makes sense if an injustice has occurred or if things aren't usually that way.
protomouse
Member
OP made me sad inside. I agree. Nothing excuses the kind of behaviour that these scenarios bring about. No amount of dedicated hardware or paid exclusives should invoke so much hate in the gaming community. Then we have companies purposely fuelling the fires for their own benefit, further pitting fan bases against each other in order to strengthen their own brand. On the front lines, we have gloat and jealousy, spite and name calling, and even attacks aimed at industry people who are just doing their job. Are we going to stand by any of this and still expect to be taken seriously by other communities?
I try to stay out of it and find solace inside gated circles of people who share OP's sentiments. But yeah, it sucks that there is so much anger instead of acceptance and solidarity.
I try to stay out of it and find solace inside gated circles of people who share OP's sentiments. But yeah, it sucks that there is so much anger instead of acceptance and solidarity.
Xbone already had Tomb Raider. PS4 now doesn't (for however long). That's what was announced yesterday.
The anger comes when something that helps create console parity is taken away. Surely if companies worked less toward removing access from the opposing company's consumers it would be a lot easier to get "beyond" a huge annoyance that is still actively happening. The outrage when more people get to play a game -- or DLC content, whatever -- is silly, but when fewer people have access I think it's pretty understandable.
Exploratory
Banned
Console wars are serious fucking business.
No but seriously its kind of sad. Especially now that GAF is like this.
No but seriously its kind of sad. Especially now that GAF is like this.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
I don't get it either, but as with everything else on the internet, people don't seem to think there are any emotions between "THIS IS THE GREATEST THING EVER." and "THIS IS THE WORST THING EVER."
This isn't a problem exclusive to gamers, people on the internet are shitty in general.
CecilRousso
Member
People who think gamers are the worst when it comes to overreactions should spend some time on football fans forums, when some players change clubs.
friskykillface
Banned
Console wars
That's basically it , if you stick to one console then you'll feel :/ at exclusive games coming to a different console
It sucks but its not new, been around for ages.
Tomb Raider situation seems new though.
At least its a timed exclusive, PS4 will get eventually
That's basically it , if you stick to one console then you'll feel :/ at exclusive games coming to a different console
It sucks but its not new, been around for ages.
Tomb Raider situation seems new though.
At least its a timed exclusive, PS4 will get eventually
Jakoozie89
Neo Member
Isn't it obvious? At movie shows you don't have two blu-ray platform holders showing tons of exclusive movies that only their customers can watch, or multiplatform movies where half of the people get a video with more grainy picture or worse sound.
I appreciate your sentiment and I would like gaming tradeshows to be more friendly and positive. But you're way off target here. Gaming tradeshows and movie festivals aren't even remotely similar.
I appreciate your sentiment and I would like gaming tradeshows to be more friendly and positive. But you're way off target here. Gaming tradeshows and movie festivals aren't even remotely similar.
TitusGroan
Banned
Playstation had Resident Evil. Then it didn't. Then it did again.
The OG Xbox got MGS2, Silent Hill 2 and Soul Calibur II. The sequels to all those games were all PS2 exclusive. If one case of Tomb Raider going from multi-plat to exclusive is such a harsh thing to endure, what does that make three games going from multiplat to exclusive?
Sonic, after Sega got out of the hardware business, went multiplatform for a while. Now he's gone Nintendo exclusive for a time. Not exactly going to make GAF weep, I'm sure, but are Nintendo just as bad as Microsoft for stealing Sonic? Were they a bad company for getting Sonic Colours, an actually awesome Sonic game, exclusively on Wii after the multiplat games that preceded it? What about all the people who wanted a follow up to Generations, and were presented with Lost World?
Shin Megami Tensei used to be a SNES franchise. Then it went PS2 with Nocturne. Then it went back to Nintendo with IV on 3DS. Should Atlus have also released IV on Vita/PS3 as a nod to all the PS2 owners of Nocturne?
Should Square have kept releasing Final Fantasy games on Nintendo systems to appease the gamers who supported them from I-VI?
These are all examples where console parity was taken away, yet everyone seems cool with them now. No-one was upset when Colours was a Wii exclusive, and GAF didn't get angry when Generations was then revealed as coming to everything except Wii. If you're against stuff like Tomb Raider going exclusive, then where do you draw the line with other franchises?
You said why aren't we beyond it already, and I responded.
Because the companies are still behaving in a way that targets the consumers more than their opposition, "punishing" them for choosing someone else rather than drawing them in with something new. People will easily stop being upset once the major corporations are the ones who get beyond such petty behavior.
Because the companies are still behaving in a way that targets the consumers more than their opposition, "punishing" them for choosing someone else rather than drawing them in with something new. People will easily stop being upset once the major corporations are the ones who get beyond such petty behavior.
justsomeguy
Member
Audience maturity
ReBurn
Gold Member
People are just salty because Microsoft's of moneyhat of Tomb Raider. If Sony had done it some people would still be mad, but I guarantee that there would be a ton of "back to its roots" and "RIP XBOne" posts, and when XBOne owners complained they would have examples of MS moneyhats shoved at them.
Gamers, no matter how old we get, love our console wars. Even when we insist that we don't, we love it when our "primary platform" gets a boost, and we relish in our schadenfreude when the "other" console takes a hit.
TitusGroan
Banned
How are you being punished? It's Tomb Raider, not a public flogging in the market square. Lest we forget, PS4 has got Uncharted coming out next year, and the differences between the two franchises as they stand are so slight they could practically be brother and sister.
I'd be more willing to judge Microsoft harshly on this if it wasn't something every platform holder has done and still does. Even Nintendo is securing third party exclusives of formerly multiplat series (hello Fatal Frame U). This is just how gaming works. Everyone does it. Sony, Nintendo and Microsoft.
Or music fans when their favorite artist releases an album that's too different from the old ones. Or too similar. Anyway, music fans are always angry. Hell, I remember people getting mad when all members of Metallica cut their hair!
TitusGroan
Banned
Hey man, friends don't let friends get friends haircuts.