Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
The only thing that should matter is whether or not you enjoyed it.
Beyond that it wasn't anything more than a good game.
Beyond that it wasn't anything more than a good game.
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Why was Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze snubbed by gaming journalists?
- Thread starter Gonzo The Great
- Start date
Yeah, you ain't gonna see game journalists nominate it for a soundtrack award. Music just isn't their forte, and frankly neither is skill with the footage they capture of themselves failing miserably at playing games.
Thankfully a site that knows it's video game music gave it Score of the Year , Wise was pretty happy about it as well.
Bel_Air_Jeff
Banned
Pitchfork honored DK:TF in their feature for best game music of 2014.
http://pitchfork.com/thepitch/605-the-best-video-game-music-of-2014/
The soundtrack definitely got some recognition, but it wasn't enough.
It is a god-tier soundtrack.
http://pitchfork.com/thepitch/605-the-best-video-game-music-of-2014/
The soundtrack definitely got some recognition, but it wasn't enough.
It is a god-tier soundtrack.
Tye The Czar
Member
They were spending more time gushing about games like Dragon Age Inquisition and This War of Mine.
grandwizard
Member
I love it that now reviewers stream their gameplay. Really puts things like this into perspective:
Reminds me of Klepeck streaming Evil Within and failing against the first enemy in the game during the tutorial an insane number of times, then the 2/5 score.
I love it that now reviewers stream their gameplay. Really puts things like this into perspective:
Reminds me of Klepeck streaming Evil Within and failing against the first enemy in the game during the tutorial an insane number of times, then the 2/5 score.
That's actually Richard Eisenbeis playing in the stream and not Totilo.
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
Nah, that intro was genuine bullshit.
grandwizard
Member
My point remains, vague complaints like 'trial and error' have pretty much lost all meaning to me. And from what I gather now amounts to what basically means 'anything I didn't beat immediately on my first try'. Streams of gameplay clear this up.
It really wasn't. It's an absurdly simple section and the fact people actually had trouble with it just goes to show how coddled we have become as gamers. I guess since it's an intro scene it's expected to just be hold up to make it through, and any small roadblock in the way of the story is unexpected and alien.
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
People want the freedom to act and learn without an incredibly over-dramatic reset button on any tiny mistake throwing them back into an incredibly confined circumstance with little to no feedback on what they did wrong or what they are expected to do. That is not a result of coddling, it is just bad, unfun design. If you get your rocks off over the "challenge" of monotonously checking off a list of theories on what to do and watching the same cutscene over again because of a non-skill-based total ultimatum, congratulations, you're some kind of masochist when it comes to gameplay design and are in the extreme minority (and should probably try Dragon's Lair), not some kind of old-school gamer badass who remembers days everyone else forgot or gave up on. Plenty of very challenging games are very well received, but that kind of shit won't fly for good reason.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
Yeah, you ain't gonna see game journalists nominate it for a soundtrack award. Music just isn't their forte, and frankly neither is skill with the footage they capture of themselves failing miserably at playing games.
Thankfully a site that knows it's video game music gave it Score of the Year , Wise was pretty happy about it as well.
Ah, I guess I can go to bed in a positive mood. I know that Metroid fans are going to hate me for saying this, but I sincerely wish that Retro is working on another DKC game.
The Xtortionist
Member
DICKS AHOY
Banned
Couldn't Monster Games work on a new one that measures up to the first two Retro games? They handled DKCR3D, assisted with DKCTF and I'm assuming a number of people were contracted in and don't work at Retro Studios proper and hence could be brought back in without messing with a different potential project.
I'M FINISHED!
Um exCUSE me Sakurai but CLEARLY the best choice for Smash Bros would be my fav niche character HOWEVER you are clearly INCOMPETENT and
In a perfect world, Retro has two teams and they are making both Metroid Prime 4 and Donkey Kong Country: Kremling Katastrophe. Nintengaf would explode with happiness, then join hands, sing as one, and cure Nintenthumb.
I say this as a huge fan of Tropical freeze, the original DKCR, and all of the Snes titles:
IT CAN WAIT
We need Retroid first. By "we" I mean "I", and by first, I mean last month. C'mon, retro did right by DK, they went the extra mile and then some to craft the perfect 2D platformer. Now their time has come to show us the true potential of Metroid in HD and save us from the disarray that Other M left the series in. I hate to be selfish, but we got 2 superb platformers with multiplayer and one with an incredible soundtrack. Now give me the Metroid.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
Monster Games is a tiny company. IIRC, they currently have 20 employees. I think the most you'll see them do is a third Excite game, which would be fine by me. However, now that the engine is in place, I think Retro could handle working on a new DKC + Metroid simultaneously.
It doesn't need to be an either/or, damn it! DKC:TF was my GOTY last year and while I'd rather see Retro tackle a HD Metroid Prime right now, it would be a damn shame if they never returned to the Donkey Kong franchise just because Tropical Freeze wasn't very successful.
I'd be pretty happy if Retro became the Metroid Prime and Donkey Kong Country team, exclusively.
I agree just to see the fucking meltdowns again for Fucking Donkey Kong.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
Tropical Freeze is a great game, a great Donkey Kong game, but I think the issue for many is it definitely didn't have that "wow" factor that a lot of the other releases of post-E3 2013-2014 had.
Like, think of what was shown alongside it at E3...the first mainline 3D Pokemon game, a very visually impressive Mario Kart, dual Smash Brothers releases. It's understandable the game wasn't really on the radar from the get-go. Even 3D World, which was alongside Tropical Freeze as having a pretty ho-hum reveal, was hyped up a bit more when we learned more about it, while Tropical Freeze, except for the reveal of Cranky, didn't have anything else up its sleeve that was mind-blowing. Most people had made up their minds about Tropical Freeze, it was either a solid 2D platformer, or a relic made by a company that should be working on Metroid instead. There wasn't a lot of wiggle room for it I think, room for it to surprise people.
I enjoyed playing it, actually I need to get around to playing it again, but I do think it didn't have the same impact on me as Returns did, even though I think Tropical Freeze was a bit better in many areas. I found it felt a bit too short, and it did have sort of this "been there, done that" feeling to it, which wasn't bad certainly...it was a feeling I enjoyed, but it doesn't surprise me it sort of fell off the radar after it was released.
That being said, I'm looking forward to seeing another Donkey Kong Returns soon hopefully, and it doesn't need to reinvent the wheel for me to love it. I just want to see a culmination of Retro's Return series to reach its apex. Animal Friends would be nice, and alongside bringing back the Kremlings easily a great draw, although I'm still mixed on how I feel about the Animal Friends working with Return's style which has a different pace from the original where I think the Animal Friends wouldn't work quite as well. Rambi's alright, but Enguarde would feel redundant since the Kongs are more adept underwater now, Squitter's webbing ability works better with slower paced platforming that doesn't rely on set pieces and diagonal movement as much like Returns, etc.
Like, think of what was shown alongside it at E3...the first mainline 3D Pokemon game, a very visually impressive Mario Kart, dual Smash Brothers releases. It's understandable the game wasn't really on the radar from the get-go. Even 3D World, which was alongside Tropical Freeze as having a pretty ho-hum reveal, was hyped up a bit more when we learned more about it, while Tropical Freeze, except for the reveal of Cranky, didn't have anything else up its sleeve that was mind-blowing. Most people had made up their minds about Tropical Freeze, it was either a solid 2D platformer, or a relic made by a company that should be working on Metroid instead. There wasn't a lot of wiggle room for it I think, room for it to surprise people.
I enjoyed playing it, actually I need to get around to playing it again, but I do think it didn't have the same impact on me as Returns did, even though I think Tropical Freeze was a bit better in many areas. I found it felt a bit too short, and it did have sort of this "been there, done that" feeling to it, which wasn't bad certainly...it was a feeling I enjoyed, but it doesn't surprise me it sort of fell off the radar after it was released.
That being said, I'm looking forward to seeing another Donkey Kong Returns soon hopefully, and it doesn't need to reinvent the wheel for me to love it. I just want to see a culmination of Retro's Return series to reach its apex. Animal Friends would be nice, and alongside bringing back the Kremlings easily a great draw, although I'm still mixed on how I feel about the Animal Friends working with Return's style which has a different pace from the original where I think the Animal Friends wouldn't work quite as well. Rambi's alright, but Enguarde would feel redundant since the Kongs are more adept underwater now, Squitter's webbing ability works better with slower paced platforming that doesn't rely on set pieces and diagonal movement as much like Returns, etc.
As much as I want a new Retro Metroid I'd be perfectly fine with a new Donkey Kong. The David Wise soundtrack alone would be enough to warrant a sequel.
grandwizard
Member
I would say that the enemy spotting you and chainsawing your head off is your feedback on what you did wrong and are expected to do. It has nothing to do with challenge and more to do with enjoying a game that actually expects the player to be awake and at the controls.
I'd rather see Retro be put to work on something that isn't DK or Metroid. They're obviously a talented studio, and I'd like to see that applied to as many things as possible, especially a completely new IP. That said, I'd still be totally be down with third game rounding out their DKC trilogy. Metroid, eh, not so much.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
Retro should really combine their mastery of the action-FPS style they perfected with Metroid with the visual, cartoonish flair they demonstrated with Donkey Kong to give me my long-awaited Tin Star revival.
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
The chainsawing is not instructive. All it does is confirm one of your theories as one of the of the not-it things that results in it happening. Being awake and at the controls has nothing to do with it, since until you find the solution, you have no idea what the solution is, and no skill will prevent him from cutting your head off if you have tried anything but the exact thing you need to do, so the only thing you can do is try new things until you happen upon the one that is intended. It is still the very definition of tiral-and-error. Very few games are designed this way because it has nothing to do with real exploration, learning, skill, or challenge.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
They can find alternative uses for the Animal Buddies if they get creative. Like, instead of riding on a mine cart, let us hitch a ride from Expresso. Or, Enguarde can serve as an aquatic variant of the Rocket Barrel levels they introduced in DKCR. Why would I want to ride on a lifeless brown thinger majig when Squitter the fucking Spider exists? I'd also like to see Retro include more vertically inclined levels, such as Kannon's Klaim from DKC2, and Swoopy Salvo from DKC3. And finally, I want a more expansive overworld akin to the Northern Kremisphere from DKC3. There is a lot they could do with a hypothetical third game, and I'll be sorely disappointed if they move onto something else before finishing their second trilogy.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
Yeah, but I feel like people would be disappointed a bit if the Animal Buddies return as a on-rail Rocket Barrel Blast-type mechanic as opposed to elevating the basic platforming.
One idea I think would be neat though, to fix another big issue with Returns which is the fact that 2P is useless on the Rocket Barrel/Mine Cart levels, is to transform Player 2 into the Purple Squawks during those segments, and they can fly around and help gather items. I think letting players have a bit of relief for those rather difficulty segments, and give the second player something to do instead of both players battling the controls together, would be a cool idea.
One idea I think would be neat though, to fix another big issue with Returns which is the fact that 2P is useless on the Rocket Barrel/Mine Cart levels, is to transform Player 2 into the Purple Squawks during those segments, and they can fly around and help gather items. I think letting players have a bit of relief for those rather difficulty segments, and give the second player something to do instead of both players battling the controls together, would be a cool idea.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
Well, like you said, now that the Kongs have their own unique abilities, the Animal Buddies are a bit obsolete. Surely there are other ways to incorporate them without removing them entirely. I'd take Expresso over a dumb mine cart every day of the week. Except for Sunday.
Fantastic suggestion. The co-op could definitely use some refinement. Trying to play through the Cave world in DKCR with my friend was literal hell.
So, my theory is this:
1. It's not a sexy pick. 2D platformer that, when it was announced, many Nintendo fans were disappointed it wasn't a new metroid.
2. Nintendo released it the same year they released Smash and Mario Kart 8, essentially making it completely overshadowed by games that are going to sell much better than it. On top of that, they had Bayonetta 2 release, and that is by far, like DKTF, the best game in it's genre last year.
3. Same as usual - there were other really good games out there.
I feel like when media or anyone really goes about making game of the year nominations, they first look at what games they enjoyed most, then go by platform and consider what games they remember most. In this case, there are 3 pretty big games on the Wii U last year that overshadow DKTF. It also, unfortunately, came out at the end of the year, giving us plenty of time to forget about it. THouhg, that isn't always a direct correlation - Other games have released early and still won some awards.
This is before we get into the fact the game didn't get recieved well because journalists today can't seem to handle a game that punishes you for failure.
1. It's not a sexy pick. 2D platformer that, when it was announced, many Nintendo fans were disappointed it wasn't a new metroid.
2. Nintendo released it the same year they released Smash and Mario Kart 8, essentially making it completely overshadowed by games that are going to sell much better than it. On top of that, they had Bayonetta 2 release, and that is by far, like DKTF, the best game in it's genre last year.
3. Same as usual - there were other really good games out there.
I feel like when media or anyone really goes about making game of the year nominations, they first look at what games they enjoyed most, then go by platform and consider what games they remember most. In this case, there are 3 pretty big games on the Wii U last year that overshadow DKTF. It also, unfortunately, came out at the end of the year, giving us plenty of time to forget about it. THouhg, that isn't always a direct correlation - Other games have released early and still won some awards.
This is before we get into the fact the game didn't get recieved well because journalists today can't seem to handle a game that punishes you for failure.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
I sort of think the poor co-op goes hand in hand with the lack of Animal Buddies, Returns just has a tighter design-style that's built around set-pieces and directly interacting with the level, which fall apart when you try to accommodate a second player, or include an Animal Buddy.
In Country, most of the Animal Buddies were built around letting you bypass segments of the level---with Expresso, Squitter, or Rattly, there were moments where you could basically leave the level and completely escape the platforms by moving over them. That pretty much never happens with Returns, the game is built around the player always being surrounded by the level, they're actors on a stage, and always are interacting with it.
Rambi's unique among the Animal Buddies, as he detracts from the movement ability of the Kongs (except for a bit more speed), and forces them to be on the ground more. His one ability allows you to break through obstacles, but that's encouraging you to interact directly with the stage. He's the one Animal Buddy who doesn't give you freedom, he simply pushes you along the script. So it's no surprise Retro kept him, as he works perfectly well with their level style...the fact he's the most well-known doesn't hurt, either.
But with the way Returns and Tropical Freeze is set up, unless they change things and make things more free-form, I just can't picture the Animal Buddies working as smoothly. For me, to accommodate the Animal Buddies would be removing the tightness of Returns' level design, and personally I enjoy what Retro has done with the tightness.
I'd be happy at the least with seeing the Animal Buddies get decent cameos.
In Country, most of the Animal Buddies were built around letting you bypass segments of the level---with Expresso, Squitter, or Rattly, there were moments where you could basically leave the level and completely escape the platforms by moving over them. That pretty much never happens with Returns, the game is built around the player always being surrounded by the level, they're actors on a stage, and always are interacting with it.
Rambi's unique among the Animal Buddies, as he detracts from the movement ability of the Kongs (except for a bit more speed), and forces them to be on the ground more. His one ability allows you to break through obstacles, but that's encouraging you to interact directly with the stage. He's the one Animal Buddy who doesn't give you freedom, he simply pushes you along the script. So it's no surprise Retro kept him, as he works perfectly well with their level style...the fact he's the most well-known doesn't hurt, either.
But with the way Returns and Tropical Freeze is set up, unless they change things and make things more free-form, I just can't picture the Animal Buddies working as smoothly. For me, to accommodate the Animal Buddies would be removing the tightness of Returns' level design, and personally I enjoy what Retro has done with the tightness.
I'd be happy at the least with seeing the Animal Buddies get decent cameos.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
I think this is true to a certain extent, particularly regarding the first DKC, but many levels in DKC2 were designed around the Animal Buddies so that they didn't have to sacrifice the tight level design for what were basically glorified power-ups. Take Web Woods, for example. Without Squitter, the level would be impossible to complete. Yet it's just as enjoyable as the other levels in that world, if not more so. Not every level has to have a faster pace. And like I said, including Animal Buddies like Squawks and Rattly would allow them to explore other types of levels not yet seen in Retro's games. Something along the lines of Screech's Sprint would be interesting to see, since you're airborne the entire time, but you have to move at faster speeds.
Oddly enough, I think Jungle Beat did a great job at incorporating Animal Buddies into the mix, but they were undermined by the gimmicky controls and forgettable level design. Orco was really, really cool, and in many ways I prefer him over Enguarde. Hoofer was a bad Rambi wannabe, but the levels were designed to take advantage if his abilities, not the other way around. They were on-rail segments, sure, but they gave the game personality. Sentience is always more desirable than inanimacy.
Calamari41
41 > 38
Good lord, you weren't kidding. I swear, watching "games journalists" play games is like frustratingly watching your girlfriend or five year old nephew play. Once I made this realization several E3's ago, I stopped listening to these twats completely.
*long-jumps off into a void* "How was I supposed to know that a platform wasn't going to pop up?" Holy cow, how about you observe your surroundings and wait half a second!