• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

Will Avatar ever be surpassed in Box Office?

Status
Not open for further replies.
this thread has reminded me of how pathetic the box office business is that it never uses actual ticket sales as a measure of how popular a movie is.

also, the inflation goal post moving makes the highest grossing title quite hollow since you either use it and have a 77 year old movie hold #1 forever with twisted numbers or don't use it and pretend that most money grossed = most popular.

worst of all is that gaming seems to be imitating that trend lately in it's infinite desire to copy the film industry. how come we could get more acurrate numbers more than a decade ago than now?
 
this thread has reminded me of how pathetic the box office business is that it never uses actual ticket sales as a measure of how popular a movie is.

also, the inflation goal post moving makes the highest grossing title quite hollow since you either use it and have a 77 year old movie hold #1 forever with twisted numbers or don't use it and pretend that most money grossed = most popular.

worst of all is that gaming seems to be imitating that trend lately in it's infinite desire to copy the film industry. how come we could get more acurrate numbers more than a decade ago than now?

@ the bolded, that is something that will forever be a problem. I would think Beverly Hills Cop making $316,360,478 in 1984 is waaaaaaaay more significant than a lot of films released today hitting a billion.

I would presume it sold a shit ton more tickets too.
 
Anyone explain the Avator success to me? I didnt even bothered to watch it at the movies. Only on TV and found it to be extremely generic sci-fi with boring generic characters. The CGI is ok i guess. How did it managed the word to mouth success?

The success is always simple to explain . People enjoyed it.

this thread has reminded me of how pathetic the box office business is that it never uses actual ticket sales as a measure of how popular a movie is.

also, the inflation goal post moving makes the highest grossing title quite hollow since you either use it and have a 77 year old movie hold #1 forever with twisted numbers or don't use it and pretend that most money grossed = most popular.

worst of all is that gaming seems to be imitating that trend lately in it's infinite desire to copy the film industry. how come we could get more acurrate numbers more than a decade ago than now?

Not just inflation. Inflation + 3d + Currency fluctuation.

I'm looking through some data (tickets vs revenue) , and Avatar was 23% inflated of its gross compared with Mamma Mia (just for 3d alone) . This is borderline ridiculous. If you would adjust it accordingly movies trends would probably surprise a lot of people.
 
I think the new Star Wars film has a decent chance of being much better than a Star Wars film has been in a long while. I think, given the investment into the IP, Disney's probably are trying harder than usual to make sure the script and practical and CG effects look amazing and authentic enough to really rejuvenate people's opinion on the series and forge a strong foundation for the Star Wars Cinematic Universe.

Because of this, I do think even the obvious Star Wars mega-hit prediction is probably going to be lowballing how well the movie will end up performing in theaters.
 
I think the new Star Wars film has a decent chance of being much better than a Star Wars film has been in a long while. I think, given the investment into the IP, Disney's probably are trying harder than usual to make sure the script and practical and CG effects look amazing and authentic enough to really rejuvenate people's opinion on the series and forge a strong foundation for the Star Wars Cinematic Universe.

Because of this, I do think even the obvious Star Wars mega-hit prediction is probably going to be lowballing how well the movie will end up performing in theaters.

SW has the benefit of releasing in the Avatar window this year, with a pretty clear path through January and February. (that is unless Alvin and the Chipmunks 3 derails it. /s)

Can it surpass Avatar? I suppose anything is possible but the idea that it will be "easy" comes off as a little laughable.

I do see it overtaking Titanic though.
 
After this exchange, which could be considered highly transgender-phobic I certainly hope so.
And there’s also this, evidently the kind of joke Hollywood makes when no one is looking:

On Oct 6, 2014, at 9:29 AM, Pascal, Amy wrote:

> DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING TO SHOW ME THIS WEEK?

Crowe to Pascal:

DOES BRUCE JENNER WANT BOOBS? HELL YES I HAVE SOMETHING
TO SHOW YOU!!!! (looking at tuesday)

In a release with the documents, Julian Assange of Wikileaks said: “This archive shows the inner workings of an influential multinational corporation. It is newsworthy and at the centre of a geo-political conflict. It belongs in the public domain. WikiLeaks will ensure it stays there.”

Godbless him for releasing these documents.

http://www.salon.com/2015/04/16/doe...t_jenner_bill_murray_bradley_cooper_and_more/
 
One of the new set of Star Wars films will (more likely the 3rd/ 2nd one than than VII). That said I think Avengers 2 has a shot at at getting the number 1 spot.
 
After this exchange, which could be considered highly transgender-phobic I certainly hope so.


In a release with the documents, Julian Assange of Wikileaks said: “This archive shows the inner workings of an influential multinational corporation. It is newsworthy and at the centre of a geo-political conflict. It belongs in the public domain. WikiLeaks will ensure it stays there.”

Godbless him for releasing these documents.
Wrong thread?
 
After this exchange, which could be considered highly transgender-phobic I certainly hope so.


In a release with the documents, Julian Assange of Wikileaks said: “This archive shows the inner workings of an influential multinational corporation. It is newsworthy and at the centre of a geo-political conflict. It belongs in the public domain. WikiLeaks will ensure it stays there.”

Godbless him for releasing these documents.

http://www.salon.com/2015/04/16/doe...t_jenner_bill_murray_bradley_cooper_and_more/

How does this relate to Avatar?
 
Right, so the people that liked it are hip to some "game".

Got it.

Stop, drop and roll read.

It is a phrase standing in clearly for the meaning "they have seen what Avatar's universe has seen to offer, and many have found it wanting."

When Avatar came out, there was this element of freshness related to things like competent 3D and mastery of CG beauty. It certainly was a beautiful film much of the time, a few minor quibbles aside. But it's chained to the mediocrity of the first in my and others opinion (just in case you don't "mistake" this post for being thought of FACTUALLY *cough*), so when people go to look at the marquee in this year, they'll stop and pause and consider things with a new variable. This is something that companies usually hate if they can't control that variable. And the tastes revolving Avatar are very difficult to define, given how apathetic people often seem when discussing the movie.

And there's no room for middle ground either. I've said multiple times for example that I thought the film was exceedingly mediocre. I believe that owing mostly to the script/lame use of concept and some of the poor acting and characters. And it was saved from being awful by the superlative visual direction. This view warrants "biting" sarcasm which actually did have implications that if I wanted to could be interpreted far more believably in a meaning that is insulting, rather than the contortion you were doing with my words.

Basically it means Avatar 2 has baggage that Avatar quite obviously didn't.

It only took me seeing a film I hated once to opt out of future viewings. Ami, the helpless victim of circumstance. :( You could have politely declined after the first viewing but whatevs. Cling to your qualifications on why you saw mediocre Avatar, 3 times.

Your obstinate defense of a series you keep trying to pretend you don't have a laughably obvious agenda about is making you so oblivious to reality that you think it odd that someone would go to movies he doesn't like with the people he loves for the sake of spending time with them.

Like, we go out, eat out for dinner and talk about our family as everyone gets older and sicker. We have a fun time in the movie doing personal rifftrax if we don't like a movie (depending on if the theater has many people in it at the time), enjoy laughing and gawking at the latest trailers. Sometimes I like explaining details my mother forgets or didn't understand, as my mom's illness messes with her memory. I was a "victim of circumstance" insomuch as my relationship with my close immediate family compels me to spend time doing activities they may be really into but that I am content just being there to be together and talk about the latest goings on. And there's always a chance that they end up enjoying the movie I didn't like, and we could go out and have a great time going back and forth on why it clicked for some of us but not others.


Please quote where I have defended the film, at every turn. I have simply laughed at people that would say Star Wars will "easily" outperform it. I have not once tried to convince anyone of the quality of the film, why their opinion is wrong for disliking it, etc.

I just said that the opinions of the detractors aren't fact, but feel free to keep punching upwards.

Nobody in this thread said their opinion is fact, not one person. Nor has any of their statements implied such a thing. And anyone who is on a discussion forum who doesn't automatically interpret a post about someone's opinion on the quality of something is meaning it all in his/her opinion is clearly in my view demonstrating they are not coming into the discussion in good faith.

So you're spending all this time trying to convince us your agenda doesn't really exist over a problem that has not even occurred unless I missed a post wherein someone claimed their view was fact. Man that is really extreme bro.


Ghosts?

Wat.

It's called a metaphor. Ghosts here being a stand in for boogey men you're inventing out of thin air in order to defend the honor of Avatar. Seriously are you even trying?
 
Purple saying avengers or sw do you guys realise how much money avatar made. Even if both of them gross $700-800 million domedtic 300-400 million dollars in China they still need to make 1.2 billion in rest of the world. And star wars is not that big in international market
 
well obviously it will at some point, but not by anything in the near future. i'm sure avatar 2 will make more money than people still kvetching about how the story is predictable and everyone was deluded and no-one likes it will expect, but it won't come close to the flash in the pan aspect of the original.

the main genius of cameron is that with titanic and avatar he makes films that hit a really wide range of audiences. star wars and the avengers are really popular with children and men, and lots of women and older people too, but less so than his love stories that are also spectacle action films. he also makes films that aren't known quantities, they are exciting prospects. you know exactly what the new avengers film will be, marvel keeps to a rigid formula, most of the marketing about the new star wars is how it'll be just like those old star wars films that people have seen and convincing people that they can deliver that. this is a good way to make a lot of money, like more than a billion, but it does set a bit of a cap for the very top.
 
Stop, drop and roll read.

It is a phrase standing in clearly for the meaning "they have seen what Avatar's universe has seen to offer, and many have found it wanting."

When Avatar came out, there was this element of freshness related to things like competent 3D and mastery of CG beauty. It certainly was a beautiful film much of the time, a few minor quibbles aside. But it's chained to the mediocrity of the first in my and others opinion (just in case you don't "mistake" this post for being thought of FACTUALLY *cough*), so when people go to look at the marquee in this year, they'll stop and pause and consider things with a new variable. This is something that companies usually hate if they can't control that variable. And the tastes revolving Avatar are very difficult to define, given how apathetic people often seem when discussing the movie.

And there's no room for middle ground either. I've said multiple times for example that I thought the film was exceedingly mediocre. I believe that owing mostly to the script/lame use of concept and some of the poor acting and characters. And it was saved from being awful by the superlative visual direction. This view warrants "biting" sarcasm which actually did have implications that if I wanted to could be interpreted far more believably in a meaning that is insulting, rather than the contortion you were doing with my words.

Basically it means Avatar 2 has baggage that Avatar quite obviously didn't.



Your obstinate defense of a series you keep trying to pretend you don't have a laughably obvious agenda about is making you so oblivious to reality that you think it odd that someone would go to movies he doesn't like with the people he loves for the sake of spending time with them.

Like, we go out, eat out for dinner and talk about our family as everyone gets older and sicker. We have a fun time in the movie doing personal rifftrax if we don't like a movie (depending on if the theater has many people in it at the time), enjoy laughing and gawking at the latest trailers. Sometimes I like explaining details my mother forgets or didn't understand, as my mom's illness messes with her memory. I was a "victim of circumstance" insomuch as my relationship with my close immediate family compels me to spend time doing activities they may be really into but that I am content just being there to be together and talk about the latest goings on. And there's always a chance that they end up enjoying the movie I didn't like, and we could go out and have a great time going back and forth on why it clicked for some of us but not others.




Nobody in this thread said their opinion is fact, not one person. Nor has any of their statements implied such a thing. And anyone who is on a discussion forum who doesn't automatically interpret a post about someone's opinion on the quality of something is meaning it all in his/her opinion is clearly in my view demonstrating they are not coming into the discussion in good faith.

So you're spending all this time trying to convince us your agenda doesn't really exist over a problem that has not even occurred unless I missed a post wherein someone claimed their view was fact. Man that is really extreme bro.




It's called a metaphor. Ghosts here being a stand in for boogey men you're inventing out of thin air in order to defend the honor of Avatar. Seriously are you even trying?

Welcome back Amirox!!!!! Glad to see your SJW persona take a back seat ;)
 
Not going to happen today because the dollar is strong as fuck , and the idiots who spit the data keep converting it to dollars.

The "idiots" keep converting grosses to US dollars because they are US based companies reporting their earnings and expenditures in US currency. Is Nintendo idiotic for posting their North American and European revenue in yen?

As for reporting ticket sales over box office gross, I don't think that studios really care about ticket sales. Toy Story 3 almost certainly sold more tickets than The Dark Knight Rises due to more children's admissions and less help from IMAX grosses, but does that really matter if it grossed less?
 
Since Avatar 2 won't be releasing until 2018 and Avatar 1 has already been completely forgotten according to articles and gaf threads, I think it could actually top or come close to topping the first movie at the box office. It'll be like a completely new experience all over again.
 
I still don't really know how or why Avatar was such a success. It's a terribly mediocre film.

People like spectacle, and Avatar offered that in spades (even if you didn't see it in 3D). It's not like the top 20 of all time worldwide list is filled with the pinnacle of cinema.
 
Any comparison over time that is made using nominal currency is meaningless. One has to consider inflation.

That's pointless for several reasons, chief among them being that were used to be way fewer film releases in a year, allowing for movies to be in theaters for longer. The original Star Wars was in theaters for over a year. Movies used to be re-released several times over several decades, this was the case with Gone with the Wind.
 
That's pointless for several reasons, chief among them being that were used to be way fewer film releases in a year, allowing for movies to be in theaters for longer. The original Star Wars was in theaters for over a year. Movies used to be re-released several times over several decades, this was the case with Gone with the Wind.

Movies after the invent of VHS are more comparable, but really, the modern era of box office began around the turn of the century when Harry Potter and Spider-man were dropping. You start to see some dramatic changes around that time. Huge first weekends followed by limited legs and quick home video releases 3-8 months later. That's around the same time when international totals started to regularly overtake domestic totals by large margins.
 
Any comparison over time that is made using nominal currency is meaningless. One has to consider inflation.
Adjusting for inflation is the dumbest thing too many people do in these threads. Gone With the Wind and even Star Wars wouldn't be forced off screens by other exhibitor engagements and wouldn't release alongside as many as 6 other new simultaneous releases and have to compete with home video.

Market is completely different.

You guys think Avatar made a lot of money? I want to know how much it would have made if Disney's contracted screens for Alice in Wonderland hadn't forced it off screens when it did.

Gone With the Wind would have theatre engagements of literally YEARS.
 
do you think it will ever be surpassed... Avengers 2? Star Wars Episode 7?..Avatar 2?

what made this movie get the box office it got..i still don't understand it, it amazes me to this day..the movie was sub-par
Yes. In the last 5 years there have been 10 $1+ billion movies, and it looks like Furious 7 will soon join the list. Eventually something will surpass Avatar, if for no other reason than inflation.
 
This thread is entertaining to say the least. I didn't realize there were ardent, hardcore Avatar defenders. I just didn't know you existed.

Yes. In the last 5 years there have been 10 $1+ billion movies, and it looks like Furious 7 will soon join the list. Eventually something will surpass Avatar, if for no other reason than inflation.

Furious 7 already passed a billion dollars.
 
Adjusting for inflation is the dumbest thing too many people do in these threads. Gone With the Wind and even Star Wars wouldn't be forced off screens by other exhibitor engagements and wouldn't release alongside as many as 6 other new simultaneous releases and have to compete with home video.

Market is completely different.

You guys think Avatar made a lot of money? I want to know how much it would have made if Disney's contracted screens for Alice in Wonderland hadn't forced it off screens when it did.

Gone With the Wind would have theatre engagements of literally YEARS.

Part of the reason Avatar was so impressive is that it was commonly believed that a blockbuster with crazy legs was more or less impossible in the current era of cinema. The film opened to over $75M, so it's not like this was a sleeper release that built up steam. Having even a $30-40M opener going on to make over 9x its opening weekend is pretty much unheard of now. We say that a blockbuster film has amazing legs it if ends up with a 3-4x first weekend multiplier (see Guardians or the Dark Knight).

As for a film making $750M domestic. With $150-200M openings becoming more common, that will only be a matter of time. A $250M opening with a 3x opening weekend multiplier will get a film there, and I think that sort of gross will be possible within the next 5 years or so.

Overseas, who knows. Might be sooner, might be later.
 
This thread is entertaining to say the least. I didn't realize there were ardent, hardcore Avatar defenders. I just didn't know you existed.

Why would you even think that? The movie grossed 2.8 billion dollars, has an 83 on Rotten Tomatoes, has a 7.9 on IMDB, has a 7.5 user score on metacritic and is the best selling Blu-ray of all time. Most people like the movie. Hearing people try to claim it's one of the worst movies ever is much funnier than people defending it.
 
That's pointless for several reasons, chief among them being that were used to be way fewer film releases in a year, allowing for movies to be in theaters for longer. The original Star Wars was in theaters for over a year. Movies used to be re-released several times over several decades, this was the case with Gone with the Wind.

Adjusting for inflation is the dumbest thing too many people do in these threads. Gone With the Wind and even Star Wars wouldn't be forced off screens by other exhibitor engagements and wouldn't release alongside as many as 6 other new simultaneous releases and have to compete with home video.

Market is completely different.

You guys think Avatar made a lot of money? I want to know how much it would have made if Disney's contracted screens for Alice in Wonderland hadn't forced it off screens when it did.

Gone With the Wind would have theatre engagements of literally YEARS.

Those are valid points, but one could normalize for all these factors. Ticket prices, competition, and Length of time in theaters.
 
Those are valid points, but one could normalize for all these factors. Ticket prices, competition, and Length of time in theaters.

Titanic or E.T. had the biggest first run attendance in the history of domestic box office. After that would probably be Star Wars, followed by Jurassic Park or Avatar. If we capped grosses to the first calendar year, I don't think that Gone with the Wind or the Sound of Music would even rank. Sound of Music's "initial" theatrical run was almost 5 years long.
 
Why would you even think that? The movie grossed 2.8 billion dollars, has an 83 on Rotten Tomatoes, has a 7.9 on IMDB, has a 7.5 user score on metacritic and is the best selling Blu-ray of all time. Most people like the movie. Hearing people try to claim it's one of the worst movies ever is much funnier than people defending it.
Even the biggest fan can admit it was a flash in the pan movie with no cultural longetivity.

There is no merchandise at all for it. No one ever quotes it. No one really ever cosplays as the characters. I bet the average person couldn't tell you who Jake Sully is if you asked them. Etc. the movie and it's universe didn't really take hold at all on a pop culture level.
 
Even the biggest fan can admit it was a flash in the pan movie with no cultural longetivity.

There is no merchandise at all for it. No one ever quotes it. No one really ever cosplays as the characters. I bet the average person couldn't tell you who Jake Sully is if you asked them. Etc. the movie and it's universe didn't really take hold at all on a pop culture level.

It didn't have the cultural impact of something like Star Wars but let's not pretend it's forgotten. People might not know who Jake Sully is because it's pretty bland and common name but they would know Neytiri and yes people still cosplay as her. Anyway the characters weren't the biggest draw of the movie, Pandora was. No one knows the names of the humans from Jaws either but they know the shark.
 
Given that population goes up as does the amount of people in other countries going to movies I would guess that yes it will eventually be toppled.
 
Movies after the invent of VHS are more comparable, but really, the modern era of box office began around the turn of the century when Harry Potter and Spider-man were dropping. You start to see some dramatic changes around that time. Huge first weekends followed by limited legs and quick home video releases 3-8 months later. That's around the same time when international totals started to regularly overtake domestic totals by large margins.

True. Harry Potter started the obsession with franchise potential. LOTR started the everything must be a trilogy fad. Spider-man started the comic book craze. And now Mahvel has created the everything must be part of a shared universe insanity.

21st century Hollywood.
 
I simply can't comprehend how Star War fans are so confident that Force Awakens has a great chance, hell or even worse that it's inevitable. You have to be living in a bubble to believe that.

I will be impressed if Force Awakens even gets close to 2 billion.
 
I wonder how many times will he go to see ABADAR deux. Four times? Five times? Place your bets!

I find it pretty funny that it is apparently foreign to some GAFers to go to the movies with different family members for the sake of spending time with them, even if that movie is one that one party was not into after seeing it. It must be pretty weird to think all outings must be equally enjoyable for both parties in regards to family, or else you might have neoGAFers making snarky remarks about it! I was treating family members to a movie that at the time they all wanted to see, and I happened to tag along for these trips because we love each other and have a good time together. Being family, sometimes you participate in things you might not love 100% because there are other benefits, like simply enjoying being around each other!

I live away from my family, so I take every opportunity I can to hang out with them. Shit, we do this all the time as an excuse to hang out together. Sometimes some of our family has seen the movie and didn't like it, but come a second time just to hang out with others who didn't see it. It is remarkable that this is so unbelievable to you that you want to make up desperate bullshit conspiracies about it. About seeing a movie multiple times with family. Just incredible.

As for Avatar 2, I doubt I'll see it more than once, for the simple fact that I'm not sure I can get the rest of my family excited about the sequel this go around. Not a one of them thought it was memorable and are in a rush to see it. Maybe if it gets good reviews and really positive buzz from people who previously didn't like the first...

Oh, PHOTOGRAPHIC EVIDENCE of my sisters as na'vi:

navismallergeuxr.png


(mom, brother-in-law, sisters as na'vi)

Initially when I took them all the first time each left the theater back then they all seemed to say they liked it, but as the night wore on into the next days everyone seemed to fall into the pattern of pretty much agreeing it wasn't a very memorable sci fi movie and they weren't compelled to see it again or a potential sequel any time soon. Only reason we did see it more than once is because we kept going again with family members who did not see it yet and wanted to form their own opinion but obviously didn't want to go alone.
 
I simply can't comprehend how Star War fans are so confident that Force Awakens has a great chance, hell or even worse that it's inevitable. You have to be living in a bubble to believe that.

I will be impressed if Force Awakens even gets close to 2 billion.

I'd say the 1.5-.1.7 billion range is pretty realistic.
 
I find it pretty funny that it is apparently foreign to some GAFers to go to the movies with different family members for the sake of spending time with them, even if that movie is one that one party was not into after seeing it. It must be pretty weird to think all outings must be equally enjoyable for both parties in regards to family, or else you might have neoGAFers making snarky remarks about it! I was treating family members to a movie that at the time they all wanted to see, and I happened to tag along for these trips because we love each other and have a good time together. Being family, sometimes you participate in things you might not love 100% because there are other benefits, like simply enjoying being around each other!

I live away from my family, so I take every opportunity I can to hang out with them. Shit, we do this all the time as an excuse to hang out together. Sometimes some of our family has seen the movie and didn't like it, but come a second time just to hang out with others who didn't see it. It is remarkable that this is so unbelievable to you that you want to make up desperate bullshit conspiracies about it. About seeing a movie multiple times with family. Just incredible.

As for Avatar 2, I doubt I'll see it more than once, for the simple fact that I'm not sure I can get the rest of my family excited about the sequel this go around. Not a one of them thought it was memorable and are in a rush to see it. Maybe if it gets good reviews and really positive buzz from people who previously didn't like the first...

It was a joke, you didn't need to write multiple paragraphs explaining yourself. :P
 
Even the biggest fan can admit it was a flash in the pan movie with no cultural longetivity.

There is no merchandise at all for it. No one ever quotes it. No one really ever cosplays as the characters. I bet the average person couldn't tell you who Jake Sully is if you asked them. Etc. the movie and it's universe didn't really take hold at all on a pop culture level.

was it scullibundo who once tried to argue that people saying "you're not in kansas anymore" spoke of avatar's cultural relevance?
 
Avengers and Star Wars have no chance at 2.8 billion. None, zero, zilch. I would be frankly amazed if either flirted with 2B.

If anything ever touches that number, it will be something that has a gimmick attached to it and becomes an "event", basically like what Avatar was.
Avengers did 1.5 billion worldwide and the hype for Ultron is miles ahead of the original and Star Wars 7 will surprise people.

Do i think either will hit 2.8? No, but Avengers will hit 2 billion and i wouldn't be surprised if SW7 hit 2.
 
It didn't have the cultural impact of something like Star Wars but let's not pretend it's forgotten. People might not know who Jake Sully is because it's pretty bland and common name but they would know Neytiri and yes people still cosplay as her. Anyway the characters weren't the biggest draw of the movie, Pandora was. No one knows the names of the humans from Jaws either but they know the shark.

I really didnt remember the female/cat lead name. I bet its less popular than the name Jake Scully

I think one of the billions of joke websites and youtube channels should go around asking people in the street about Avatar. Because really, i dont think people remember even the name Pandora

In fact i think such stunt could bring more publicity for the franchise than anything that happened on the last few years post release
 
It was a joke, you didn't need to write multiple paragraphs explaining yourself. :P

I think Amir0x likes typing and reading his own novels here on GAF, snickering to himself as he types. It was pretty hilarious seeing him post another brick of text and a picture of his sisters to prove whatever...against a playful jab by you.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom