Netherscourge
Banned
Isn't the game released in the US? I assume that means it's not classified as child porn
I believe the US version had all explicit sexual content removed?
Isn't the game released in the US? I assume that means it's not classified as child porn
It's true that games with nudity weren't always forbidden in Japan like they are now. If you look at this (NSFW) article about Snatcher you'll see that there's nudity present in some of the Japanese console versions, but not the western Sega CD version.
Wouldn't this game (Criminal Girls) be banned in the USA anyway? I don't see how it's getting through the ESRB.
If any of the girls are younger than 18 and are being painted in a sexual way it's instant bad/ illegal shit in the USA yeah? I thought loli stuff was completely illegal in the states.
Doesn't matter if it's anime or real either - if the anime is obscene, like in this game, then it is illegal.
Please make a logical counterargument instead of a shitty GIF.
I don't see how it's getting through the ESRB.
As I said in the last thread, the obscenity charge works on a state by state thing when referring to this kind of stuff. It is not a federal law. In certain states, it would not be illegal if a real child is not involved.
That being said, Criminal Girls probably could get NIS in trouble in certain states if any law/government people truly wanted to pursue it. I don't think anyone in that position really cares, though.
Wouldn't this game (Criminal Girls) be banned in the USA anyway? I don't see how it's getting through the ESRB.
If any of the girls are younger than 18 and are being painted in a sexual way it's instant ban/ illegal shit in the USA yeah? I thought loli stuff was completely illegal in the states.
Dat ad hominem.Defending simulated sexual assault of children makes you a revolting excuse for a human being.
Tada!
It's not a porn but in the trailer you see a girl who appears to be 10-12 with legs outstretched and labia showing while you rub/smack hurt which is pretty disturbing. Still kind of nasty to have discussion of it banned given it got an ERSB rating.
Edit: Just saw the quoted mod explanations.
GAF is an international forum. Whose age of consent are we going to use to define this limit?
I agree, and I think that instead of banning theads like this, mods should instead ban the people who into threads for the game and then proceed to just derail the game.
It's an international forum, and yet as far as I know this game isn't actually banned anywhere. So by all of these international standards, the game is fit for public consumption.
To be clear we are trying to be as narrow as possible here.As long as we can still have a Kill la kill thread I'm cool
It wasn't flawed, it wasn't loaded, and it wasn't a fallacy. It was a legitimate issue, which got legitimate discussion within this thread, before you decided to attack the post for whatever reason.
But, obviously this is adding nothing either to this thread or to the actual discussion branching off of this post.
There are already other games on 3DS/Vita that have content like this and they're not illegal, so...
PC Engine was pretty much the most liberal console in terms of first party standards in Japan. It's definitely not the norm. Nudity was pretty much a no-no on Nintendo, Sega, and Sony systems. Most of what people associate with nudity in "old Japanese games" is limited to PC-Engine and PC-88/PC-98 games, which is closer to modern PC games in terms of not having real standards.
http://touch.destructoid.com/destru...be-mildly-censored,53bbebafb7d8d24162e20420/4I believe the US version had all explicit sexual content removed?
Wouldn't this game (Criminal Girls) be banned in the USA anyway? I don't see how it's getting through the ESRB.
I'm not sure where NeoGaf is based, but it's illegal in the USA to possess, trade, distribute or host child porn on the internet or even on your own private computer. Doesn't matter if it's anime or real either - if the anime is obscene, like in this game, then it is illegal.
http://www.justice.gov/criminal/ceos/citizensguide/citizensguide_porn.html
From wiki:
So, it's pretty easy to see why moderation is required - all it takes is one or two gifs with one of these girls in it to get the FBI's attention.
generated images indistinguishable from an actual minor, and images created, adapted, or modified, but appear to depict an identifiable, actual minor.
1-3 more posts probably.Anyone want to take best on how long before Settin gets a permaban?
Custer's Revenge was an explicit game for the old Atari 2600 consoles. So yes, creepy games have been around since before the NES.
The reason you didn't see a lot of it on the PS1/PS2 is because Sony's censorship standards were higher then. The standards have been loosened now, largely because of the slumping economy and increasing influence of "creepy otaku types" as mentioned in an earlier post.
Wouldn't this game (Criminal Girls) be banned in the USA anyway? I don't see how it's getting through the ESRB.
If any of the girls are younger than 18 and are being painted in a sexual way it's instant ban/ illegal shit in the USA yeah? I thought loli stuff was completely illegal in the states.
No, that's not how it works. What that is really talking about is digitally, computer made/manipulated photographs of children. Not anime/cartoons.
The visual novels may not have but other red label games did. Just check out the many mahjong games produced prior to Sega's policy change in 96(?).
Have you ever used the term "Ephebophilia" to defend it?
there ya go
It's no less a "real game" than SRWZ3. Or does having fanservice bits suddenly make it not a real game? Don't get me wrong I have no personal interest in this game, but it has plenty there gameplay wise for people that like these kind of RPGs.
So, it's pretty easy to see why moderation is required - all it takes is one or two gifs with one of these girls in it to get the FBI's attention.
To be clear we are trying to be as narrow as possible here.
While some might find an obsession with people who are clearly high school girls odd, that's nothing we have an intention of stopping.
People concerned about Senran Kagura or Akiba's Trip for example also need not be worried unless they make a spin-off with girls who are much younger.
Criminal Girls we are talking about a game that revolves around people who are visually little kids and abusing them sexually, not half naked high school girls getting their clothes torn off.
I attacked the post because it's actually a logical fallacy.
Pointing out your opponent's hypocrisy doesn't weaken their original position. It's poor debate.
You haven't really put up much of a defense here aside from attack me or blindly deny anything I've said. Neither of which I've done.
What in the name of fuck?
No, that's not how it works. What that is really talking about is digitally, computer made/manipulated photographs of children. Not anime/cartoons.
see this part
why the kids gotta be blackWhen this game launches, there will be a police officer inside every Gamestop awaiting to to make an arrest.
"I dare you to buy that game son"
To be clear we are trying to be as narrow as possible here.
While some might find an obsession with people who are clearly high school girls odd, that's nothing we have an intention of stopping.
People concerned about Senran Kagura or Akiba's Trip for example also need not be worried unless they make a spin-off with girls who are much younger.
Criminal Girls we are talking about a game that revolves around people who are visually little kids and abusing them sexually, not half naked high school girls getting their clothes torn off.
Oh, so drawn illustrations of sexually abused children is totally okay. Glad you clarified that...
Do you realize how absolutely ridiculous you sound right now?
When this game launches, there will be a police officer inside every Gamestop ready to to make an arrest.
"I dare you to buy that game son"
Anyone want to take best on how long before Settin gets a permaban?
No, that's not how it works. What that is really talking about is digitally, computer made/manipulated photographs of children. Not anime/cartoons.
Custers revenge was long before there was any real policing of content, I can't say it's a great example for that reason. It was also american made, and the company made several other pornagraphic titles, so I'm not sure what you're getting at with this.
It's not child porn, but let's be real - it's aimed at the same audience.NISA Already talked with the ESRB, as they mentioned in the forums, so it's safe to assume that it is getting through the ESRB, most probably because it is not child porn as some here mistakenly assume.
this is a good one, lolAlso:
Do you know the age of consent laws of multiple countries, including Japan?
I would like to ask about other topics that generate moral outrage similar to Criminal Girls. To set it, I'm more concerned about the precedence this could set, rather than the actual game itself, but I know some anime threads get derailed due to moral outrage, for something that isn't actually present in comparison to Criminal Girls. How will that be handled?
GAF is an international forum. Whose age of consent are we going to use to define this limit?
It's cool dude, apparently you only see the faintest of child labia in the game. Apparently labia don't count unless they're chiseled into granite.
I'm pretty sure the Supreme Court ruling makes it federal law.
Due to the fact that the definition of obscenity differs between states, the legality of lolicon and shotacon depends on the community; in several states, there are clauses that state that for something to be deemed obscene, real harm must be done or the child depicted must be someone that exists in real life, while other areas may specifically allow unrealistic "cartoon" depictions but prohibit more "life-like" depictions. Some states may have heavy penalties on such material but only ban depictions of minors under 16 years of age (Arizona and New Jersey), while others may decide to ban it altogether.
That game looks like the equivalent of an exploitation/snuff film insofar as a video game can get.
I doubt there's much more to it than shock value so I don't see a problem with restricting publicity/discussion for those types of games.
Oh boy, linking to a Wikipedia article to say "Actually I'm right."
Yeah, I'm definitely done with that particular line of discussion.
As I said in response to your edit, linking to a Wikipedia article as an "Aha, I'm right!" is basically an instant end to any sort of meaningful discussion.
And, speaking of meaningful discussion - there was plenty of meaningful discussion that came as a result of my post which you took so much issue with. I'm sorry that you felt the need to attack the post, as opposed to observing the discussion that came as a result of it.
But, anyway, I'm done with this line of discussion, as it clearly adds nothing meaningful to this thread.
Ephebophilia isn't the same as pedophilia.
Dat ad hominem.
mods have already taken the anime thread aside for a talk about this kinda nonsense
As a result of a few different industry trends, we're seeing an increasing number of games being released and localized that focus their appeal around sexualized interaction with young children, or characters who appear to be young children. A few years ago this type of content typically wouldn't be allowed by Western platform-holders at all; today it's getting published with light censorship.
Threads about these games get creepy very, very quickly. They tend to bring out discussion which is, in and of itself, bannable due to inappropriate or offensive sexual content. They frequently involve content that cannot actually be discussed or posted without breaking our NSFW rules. And even if neither of these happens, they often degenerate into angry discussions about censorship, pedophilia, or child pornography. Frankly, we don't like moderating these threads, and we don't think they reflect well on the community.
We're not trying for philosophical rigor here. Maybe lots of people enjoy GTA in ways that can defensibly be understood as being just as creepy as something like Criminal Girls. But that doesn't dominate threads about GTA, those threads don't turn into arguments about murder-philia, and they don't trigger the same kind of fundamental revulsion. So we're not saying these games can't exist or even that people can't enjoy them. We just don't want them /here/.
We're not going to draw an absolute sharp boundary on this. We just want to make it clear going forward that games which focus on the sexualization of children are not appropriate for our community. Criminal Girls is out. Games that include creepy elements as one small part are okay -- Fire Emblem isn't inappropriate to discuss even though we don't want long thread derails about its more unpleasant fanservice elements.
Let me start by stating that everyone has their own individual set of values, and we do understand that. Our goal with the policy going forward is not necessarily to single out any group of fans as outright reprehensible people for liking video games, particularly not games that are released legally and rated by the ESRB. Further, there are valid arguments to consider in terms of why other morally dubious content seemingly gets a pass.
Having said that, though, I want to also state that the consensus on the moderation team here is that -- fair or not -- we really have next to no desire to have games that feature sexual content starring characters that either are or appear to be underrage given a platform here. We have even less desire (i.e. none) to actually have to read and moderate these threads. As such, these threads will often go unmoderated.
This is a problem. It's a problem for everyone. It's a problem for fans of the game that actually want to talk about the game and aren't necessarily there just to oogle questionable artwork. It's a problem when imagery gets posted that goes beyond what we consider in good taste and we aren't there to react. It's a problem for us in that we get complaints from people on either side of the issue and feel a sense of responsibility to react, but don't really know what to do. Do we go in to promote civility in the conversation, or do we go in to crack down on what we deem to be inappropriate sexual content that features characters that appear to be minors? I think by and large, several (perhaps most) just opt out of doing anything because we simply want no part of the conversation. Frankly, the less I personally know about Monster Monpiece or Criminal Girls, the better.
But that's not appropriate as an official policy. It's confusing for you, and it's even confusing for us. So the consensus we've reached in regards to these games that prominently feature underage girl fan-service is to simply not give them a platform here. That's not to say that we all out and out condemn the very existence of these products and the fans that would play and want to talk about them. But we just honestly feel that there is no place for it here.
As always, if you have questions about a particular game, or a facet of the conversation that you are unclear of, you are more than welcome to PM moderation with your comments and concerns.
Thank you guys for these thoughtful responses. I feel like I understand the reasons behind the your decisions a lot clearer. I can especially sympathize with not wanting to even enter the threads to have to moderate them. Especially being unpaid.Right. I'm just trying to make it painstakingly clear that a lot of suggestions on "how to keep threads on track" ignore that this kind of activity takes a not-insignificant amount of effort. It's not a trivial thing that's being asked of unpaid staff. When you couple that with the fact that the content in question isn't something we're eager to defend, and it becomes clear why these threads go to shit for a myriad of reasons. I'm not saying that there's not an argument to be made for letting the discussions go on and banning people on both sides -- fans for posting content that is against the ToS on one and people trolling with ad hominemens on the other. But that takes a lot of effort that we don't want to expend. Perhaps there's a moderator on our staff that wouldn't mind being the fanservice thread mod, but I don't want the job. And several of the other people on staff don't want it either.
Oh wait, I think I do remember SuchiPai stuff. It's weird, because pretty much everything else was censored. I wonder how some of them got away with it. ADVs knew to stay as "clean" as possible, so what made mahjong games different?
It was a promotion between the Ottawa police and a shopping centre to give 25 needy children $200 to buy stuff.Out of sheer curiosity, what's the context of the pic? I feel like this was something big that I should have heard of long ago.