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Forza 3 vs Gran Turismo 5 Comparison Thread of John, Chapter 11, Verse 35

L

LordPhoque

Banned
Firewire said:
Environments? In those GT5P shots the mountains look way better to me, the track looks better as well also there are actual spectators that help with the realism. That's not to say Forza 3 looks bad or anything its right up there with it.
Click to expand...

The FM3 mountains aren't from the same location :

montserrat.jpg


GT5P mountains are the alps. It's not about looking better or not, it's about being close to the reality. You can't compare spain mountains with the alps.

When I was talking about environnments it wasn't about this track especially but all we've seen of FM3 in terms of tracks. I just think that it has the best environnments. Interiors looks better in GT5P, yes. But car models are extremely close to each other. FM3 finally achieved the "solid look" that lacked in FM2 cars.

And whatever is your opinion, "generation ahead" is just ridiculously exagareted.
 
T

TheHeretic

Banned
Firewire said:
Environments? In those GT5P shots the mountains look way better to me, the track looks better as well also there are actual spectators that help with the realism. That's not to say Forza 3 looks bad or anything its right up there with it.
Click to expand...

There are spectators in the Forza 3 demo as well, they are 3D but pretty low res.

As a PC gamer who plays games on a monitor a lot of the time Forza 3 held up better than 95% of what i've played on either system. Its surprisingly sharp and well detailed.

GT5's lighting is really amazing, but I don't see anything a generation ahead. Both games look inferior to PC racing games in terms of graphics, which is why I find this entire argument so puzzling. Forza and GT5 may be the two premier racing sims but if graphics are so important people should be buying PC's.

The interiors are undoubtedly better in GT5 (though I prefer the camera position of Forza) and in terms of detail both games look roughly equivalent. GT5 seems to have more AA, a higher rendering resolution or potentially both from what i'm seeing. Forza also has a more stylized look than GT5 which is going for pure realism, the environments for example look more "gamey" which winds up looking better in my opinion.
 
B

bobbytkc

ADD New Gen Gamer
Dra-Q said:
The models are the same? Do we look at the same pics? GT5p has the more detailed models and the better lightning. Forza 3 would maybe look better, if MS didn't rushed the the development.
Click to expand...


On image quality alone, GT5 would win out already. Especially since in racing games there are so many diagonal lines and you are always looking at the far distance. 4xAA definitely makes the whole image look a lot better.
 
C

Corky

Nine out of ten orphans can't tell the difference.
oh wow nice comparison pics rockstar, for some reason ( not that it matters ) I thought that forza 3 looked better that gt5P but those pictures are saying otherwise. Nonetheless I traded in my gt5p a couple of days ago and am looking forward to both f3 and gt5.
 
K

KillerAJD

Member
TheHeretic said:
There are spectators in the Forza 3 demo as well, they are 3D but pretty low res.

As a PC gamer who plays games on a monitor a lot of the time Forza 3 held up better than 95% of what i've played on either system. Its surprisingly sharp and well detailed.

GT5's lighting is really amazing, but I don't see anything a generation ahead. Both games look inferior to PC racing games in terms of graphics, which is why I find this entire argument so puzzling. Forza and GT5 may be the two premier racing sims but if graphics are so important people should be buying PC's.
Click to expand...
Bwaa?? Throw up some links to some racing games that are comparable. Anything I've seen out there looks good, but not anywhere near GT5 or Forza levels. Shift seems to have come the closest. (and really, give me some links. I want to play some better looking sim racers). Anyways, I think they both look excellent. I'd give the edge in car detail to GT5/P, and while Forza's environments look awesome, I still think people are overly harsh on GT5/P's environments. I'll be picking up Forza 3 as soon as I get a 360 though.
 
lowrider007

lowrider007

Licorice-flavoured booze?
eso76 said:
those comparison shots actually make cars look very similar, but at close inspection (zooming in with triangle button during replays in prologue, using car close camera in forza) the difference is rather huge. Prologue probably switches to higher lods model at some point, forza doesn't.

oh well, enough with graphics.

A friend of mine actually had a friend of his (currently tester for bridgestone and former kart/gt/whatever racer) come over and try both games with a wheel (logitech driving force for prologue, ms wheel for forza 3) and all assists off.
His opinion was forza is an immensely more realistic driving simulator. Cars behave almost exactly the way he would expect (except the mini which didn't feel right to him) with the most accurate being, not too surprisingly, the audi r8 which he stated was absolutely spot on.
I guess cars having too much grip compared to fm2 is just the way it should be ?
Click to expand...

Interesting, thanks for that.

One of the problems I have with GT:p is how much acceleration you lose going into a corner, anyone else feel that ?, on Forza the cornering feels completely different.
 
D

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
Both games look inferior to PC racing games in terms of graphics, which is why I find this entire argument so puzzling.
Click to expand...
Uhh, which PC games are you talking about? Post some pics for us, if you don't mind.

I can't think of any PC sim racers that look this nice.
 
N

nib95

Banned
eso76 said:
those comparison shots actually make cars look very similar, but at close inspection (zooming in with triangle button during replays in prologue, using car close camera in forza) the difference is rather huge. Prologue probably switches to higher lods model at some point, forza doesn't.

oh well, enough with graphics.

A friend of mine actually had a friend of his (currently tester for bridgestone and former kart/gt/whatever racer) come over and try both games with a wheel (logitech driving force for prologue, ms wheel for forza 3) and all assists off.
His opinion was forza is an immensely more realistic driving simulator. Cars behave almost exactly the way he would expect (except the mini which didn't feel right to him) with the most accurate being, not too surprisingly, the audi r8 which he stated was absolutely spot on.
I guess cars having too much grip compared to fm2 is just the way it should be ?
Click to expand...

Not with traction control off. Don't care what you're driving, M3, Porsche GT3, Audi R8 etc. In real life, you turn the TCS off and you're going places other than the track. Or at least, it's a heck of a lot harder to try not to. In this regard, F3 is a bit un-realistic. That said, I haven't used a wheel with F3 yet. It might make a substantial difference. It definitely does in GT5P. Feels like a totally different game with the G25.
 
C

Corky

Nine out of ten orphans can't tell the difference.
dark10x said:
Uhh, which PC games are you talking about? Post some pics for us, if you don't mind.

I can't think of any PC sim racers that look this nice.
Click to expand...

well...you know...erhm...theres crysis..





._. sorry but I hate HATE when people for some bizzare reason need to point out that multiplatform games look better on pcs.



edit : those mercedes pictures are godly, can I theoretically get the same results in the games photomode or did the developers use somekind of ultrahigh poly models or something?
 
D

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
Corky said:
well...you know...erhm...theres crysis..


._. sorry but I hate HATE when people for some bizzare reason need to point out that multiplatform games look better on pcs.
Click to expand...
I agree. Improved image quality and framerate boosts are nice (though things aren't always totally smooth in the PC port realm), but those are just mild enhancements.

Something that is considered to look vastly superior has to be doing a lot more than that.
 
J

jett

D-Member
Wowowowow at the drop in car quality in F3. Now you people know that Che is full of shit. :p And also, NOW we also know why T10 doesn't release anything but photomode crap.

And interestingly Polyphony just released spectacular direct-feed pictures, with no bullshottery. :)
 
T

TheHeretic

Banned
dark10x said:
Uhh, which PC games are you talking about? Post some pics for us, if you don't mind.

I can't think of any PC sim racers that look this nice.
Click to expand...

In hindsight maybe not Sim Racers as the ones i'm aware of are fairly graphics low, like RType. Racing games like Grid, Dirt and Dirt 2 will invariably look better with higher internal resolutions and as much AA and AF as your setup allows. Of course those aren't simulations but as to why the graphical fidelity is the main selling point continues to allude me, and if such a thing were so important to games like this why there wouldn't be more pent up demand for a PC equivalent.
 
F

Firewire

Banned
LordPhoque said:
The FM3 mountains aren't from the same location :

montserrat.jpg


GT5P mountains are the alps. It's not about looking better or not, it's about being close to the reality. You can't compare spain mountains with the alps.

When I was talking about environnments it wasn't about this track especially but all we've seen of FM3 in terms of tracks. I just think that it has the best environnments. Interiors looks better in GT5P, yes. But car models are extremely close to each other. FM3 finally achieved the "solid look" that lacked in FM2 cars.

And whatever is your opinion, "generation ahead" is just ridiculously exagareted.
Click to expand...

Didn't know they where two different locations sorry, but I disagree on the car models. The models in GT5P look allot better to me.

In regards to "generation ahead" I never said that, so I'm assuming that's in response to someone other than me.
 
L

LordPhoque

Banned
jett said:
Wowowowow at the drop in car quality in F3. Now you people know that Che is full of shit. :p And also, NOW we also know why T10 doesn't release anything but photomode crap.

And interestingly Polyphony just released spectacular direct-feed pictures, with no bullshottery. :)
Click to expand...

Wow, sorry to say that, but you're so full of shit. All of your posts in this thread are retarded, and this one make no exception.
 
J

jett

D-Member
TheHeretic said:
In hindsight maybe not Sim Racers as the ones i'm aware of are fairly graphics low, like RType. Racing games like Grid, Dirt and Dirt 2 will invariably look better with higher internal resolutions and as much AA and AF as your setup allows. Of course those aren't simulations but as to why the graphical fidelity is the main selling point continues to allude me, and if such a thing were so important to games like this why there wouldn't be more pent up demand for a PC equivalent.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, I own GRID or PC, I play it in 1080p, and it looks like crap compared to GT5P.

http://i33.tinypic.com/w8m3uq.jpg

Lucky for this game I play with a cockpit camera mod, otherwise you would see their entire hideousness.
 
D

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
TheHeretic said:
In hindsight maybe not Sim Racers as the ones i'm aware of are fairly graphics low, like RType. Racing games like Grid, Dirt and Dirt 2 will invariably look better with higher internal resolutions and as much AA and AF as your setup allows. Of course those aren't simulations but as to why the graphical fidelity is the main selling point continues to allude me, and if such a thing were so important to games like this why there wouldn't be more pent up demand for a PC equivalent.
Click to expand...
Those games really don't look that much better on the PC. I own GRID and DiRT on the PC, for instance, and while I appreciate the improvements, it's not a night and day kind of difference.

Furthermore, the actual car models and lighting on those cars is still nowhere near as impressive as GT5. The games just look really different.

Furthermore, while the console versions of those games are indeed 30 fps, GT5 and Forza 3 are both 60 fps games on the console. The only area where they are lacking is in image quality, which is hardly bad looking.
 
T

TheHeretic

Banned
dark10x said:
Those games really don't look that much better on the PC. I own GRID and DiRT on the PC, for instance, and while I appreciate the improvements, it's not a night and day kind of difference.

Furthermore, the actual car models and lighting on those cars is still nowhere near as impressive as GT5. The games just look really different.

Furthermore, while the console versions of those games are indeed 30 fps, GT5 and Forza 3 are both 60 fps games on the console. The only area where they are lacking is in image quality, which is hardly bad looking.
Click to expand...

The increase in resolution is a big deal to me, i'd rather have less detail with a higher resolution than vice versa.

But whatever. Simulations are supposed to impress by their mechanical fidelity to reality. I haven't heard anyone talk about the differences in driving from GT:p to Forza 3, which is probably what a "sim fan" would actually care about.
 
D

Dra-Q

Banned
theignoramus said:
Are those 1080p screens truly direct feed?

They look a little too good to be true. Prologue doesnt look that clean at "1080p"
(1280x1080)
Click to expand...

Some GAFer said, the final GT5 will render in a higher resolution. Only time will tell.
 
B

BeeDog

Member
theignoramus said:
Are those 1080p screens truly direct feed?

They look a little too good to be true. Prologue doesnt look that clean at "1080p"
(1280x1080)
Click to expand...

They are apparently photo mode pics; if you study them, you'll see jaggies on various parts of the car. Hopefully the Mercedes pics are direct outputs from GT5's photomode. If so, I'm gonna have a hell of a time photographing all the awesome cars in my ingame garage. :D
 
cyberheater

cyberheater

PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
Rockstar said:
Here are some comparison pics, to me, Gt Prologue is still better than Forza 3...
Click to expand...

I'm loving the GT 2D trees... Best in visual class...
 
T

theignoramus

Member
If so, then it would have no AA. But you really don't need much when rendering at that resolution...but I'm still a little suspicious, those screens look fucking insane. Will wait for the beyond3d verdict.:D
 
X

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
TheHeretic said:
But whatever. Simulations are supposed to impress by their mechanical fidelity to reality. I haven't heard anyone talk about the differences in driving from GT:p to Forza 3, which is probably what a "sim fan" would actually care about.
Click to expand...
There's a few posts in the thread actually that tried to do this objectively (m0dus did one at least, Iknos is planning on it), but as expected it's been lost in the middle of the larger system warrior bitchfest and picture spam.
 
F

Firewire

Banned
cyberheater said:
I'm loving the GT 2D trees... Best in visual class...
Click to expand...

Yes the tree sim game that everyone is so hyped about has clearly been won by Turn10. Can't wait to see pics of the maple trees. Oh shit I think I just saw a chipmunk! :lol
 
Interfectum

Interfectum

Member
belvedere said:
Yes, but do you love the flat wheel textures used on the gameplay car models?

Oh wait, that's a different game.
Click to expand...

he'd rather have poly starved models and blacked out interiors during gameplay :lol

117fkma.gif
 
S

skybaby

Member
jett said:
Wowowowow at the drop in car quality in F3. Now you people know that Che is full of shit. :p And also, NOW we also know why T10 doesn't release anything but photomode crap.

And interestingly Polyphony just released spectacular direct-feed pictures, with no bullshottery. :)
Click to expand...
So those are not photomode pictures? In game motion blur confirmed?
 
P

proposition

Banned
My favourite bit of this thread is people complaining about bullshots and then posting bullshots of their preferred game instead.

Wait actually my favourite bit of this thread is the whole thing.
 
N

nib95

Banned
Tom Penny said:
Destructoid said they are not and also say Forza 3 has superior graphics and gameplay going by the TGS demos. Somebody's telling lies.
Click to expand...

Well...watch any of the video's or just look at the screens I posted above...? I mean, you don't know whether you can believe me, or Destructoid, but surely you can trust in your own eyes?
 
D

danwarb

Member
jett said:
Wowowowow at the drop in car quality in F3. Now you people know that Che is full of shit. :p And also, NOW we also know why T10 doesn't release anything but photomode crap.

And interestingly Polyphony just released spectacular direct-feed pictures, with no bullshottery. :)
Click to expand...
lol, it's like you haven't played either of these game.
 
J

jett

D-Member
danwarb said:
lol, it's like you haven't played either of these game.
Click to expand...

Considering they haven't been released yet, I have not. :p

To be honest though on closer inspection those picture are still bullshots.

And just to be fair, GT5 still uses 2D trees, at least it does The Ring, as the E3 trailer shows. The new Mercedes trailer also shows the 2Dness. I guess it depends on the course. Either that or the tracks are unfinished.
 
W

WHOAguitarninja

Member
I'm a bit bummed about the drop in car quality in F3, and a bit more bummed that we were specifically told otherwise, but the game still looks flat out fantastic, so I'm not that upset.

One thing PD could learn from Turn10 (and seemingly every other racing game at the moment) is how to do reflections in bonnet cam/in car cam. The trick of taking the framebuffer from the previous frame and using it to make reflections on the car is just much much better up close than doing the standard cube maps. GT5's reflections are quite low res. They look fine from a distance but when you get close, and especially when you get into the bonnet cam, they just look hideous. Cube maps work well enough for outside the car view, as they're the only way you'll reflect anything behind you, but in car/bonnet cam needs to use the same method turn10 is employing.
 
eso76

eso76

Member
nib95 said:
Not with traction control off. Don't care what you're driving, M3, Porsche GT3, Audi R8 etc. In real life, you turn the TCS off and you're going places other than the track. Or at least, it's a heck of a lot harder to try not to. In this regard, F3 is a bit un-realistic. That said, I haven't used a wheel with F3 yet. It might make a substantial difference. It definitely does in GT5P. Feels like a totally different game with the G25.
Click to expand...

Racer's word, so i'll have to believe it, but i do wonder how he was able to force traction control off in the R8 to compare.
 
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