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The Last Story (Wii, Mistwalker x Nintendo) Information Thread

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F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
duckroll said:
Why does anyone want the game to use the vitality sensor? I really don't get it. It's as dumb as the craze about RPGs using the DS touchscreen, RPGs using motion controls on the Wii, and soon FPS games using Natal, and next ZOMG 3DTV GAMING.

In the end all these gimmicks fucking fail. Unless a game is designed with a certain peripheral in mind, and does it really well, it just ends up being a gimmick and another title on some "list" of what supports what. Most traditional games on the DS now rarely use the touch screen at all, Wii games are getting packaged with the classic controller, etc.

I just want a good game, why the fuck would I want it to support some peripheral I know nothing about and add more uncertainty into the overall quality and polish of a game? Yuck.
Click to expand...

I some how missed the bolded. :lol

I thought it was weird by you saying:

"In the end all these gimmicks fucking fail. Unless a game is designed with a certain peripheral in mind, it just ends up being a gimmick and another title on some "list" of what supports what."

Even then so who's to say that this game might not use the Vitality Sensor as intuitively as TWEWY used some of the DS's hardware features?
 
C

CruxisMana

Member
Out of curiosity, what were the controls for ToS: DOTNW like?

Last I heard of the game before it's release was that they were trying to make the controls more natural, trying not to go overboard with the 'waggle' etc.
 
J

jrricky

Banned
duckroll said:
Why does anyone want the game to use the vitality sensor? I really don't get it. It's as dumb as the craze about RPGs using the DS touchscreen, RPGs using motion controls on the Wii, and soon FPS games using Natal, and next ZOMG 3DTV GAMING.

In the end all these gimmicks fucking fail. Unless a game is designed with a certain peripheral in mind, and does it really well, it just ends up being a gimmick and another title on some "list" of what supports what. Most traditional games on the DS now rarely use the touch screen at all, Wii games are getting packaged with the classic controller, etc.

I just want a good game, why the fuck would I want it to support some peripheral I know nothing about and add more uncertainty into the overall quality and polish of a game? Yuck.
Click to expand...
I seem to remember they all use the dual screen though and most do it well...really well.
 
V

Vinci

Danish
Why are people talking about the Vitality Sensor in the thread for a game that most likely would never even be considered for using it?
 
D

duckroll

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
Even then so who's to say that this game might not use the Vitality Sensor as intuitively as TWEWY used some of the DS's hardware features?
Click to expand...

What I'm saying is, what do we even KNOW about the vitality sensor which makes it an appealing peripheral to actively WANT a game to support it. I'm not saying that if they announce a game supporting it, and present an interesting angle on how it would be used, that it will automatically be a failure. I'm simply wondering why, with so little we know about both the game in question AND the peripheral mentioned, why anyone would actually hope and want the game to support the peripheral. That makes no sense to me.
 
A

AceBandage

Banned
Vinci said:
Why are people talking about the Vitality Sensor in the thread for a game that most likely would never even be considered for using it?
Click to expand...


Like I said, people saw that the game will be about "The feelings we all share" and jumped onto the Vitality Sensor kick.
 
S

slaughterking

Member
Vinci said:
Why are people talking about the Vitality Sensor in the thread for a game that most likely would never even be considered for using it?
Click to expand...
That's what I'm wondering. How could you even use it for this or any other game?
 
A

avatar299

Banned
duckroll said:
Why does anyone want the game to use the vitality sensor? I really don't get it. It's as dumb as the craze about RPGs using the DS touchscreen, RPGs using motion controls on the Wii, and soon FPS games using Natal, and next ZOMG 3DTV GAMING.

In the end all these gimmicks fucking fail. Unless a game is designed with a certain peripheral in mind, and does it really well, it just ends up being a gimmick and another title on some "list" of what supports what. Most traditional games on the DS now rarely use the touch screen at all, Wii games are getting packaged with the classic controller, etc.

I just want a good game, why the fuck would I want it to support some peripheral I know nothing about and add more uncertainty into the overall quality and polish of a game? Yuck.
Click to expand...
Why should we assume any game that uses a different control input is bad? You sound like the Kirby fans who bitched about kirby: Canvas curse before it released.
 
V

Vinci

Danish
AceBandage said:
Like I said, people saw that the game will be about "The feelings we all share" and jumped onto the Vitality Sensor kick.
Click to expand...

People are unaware that, in Japanese lingo, that could mean everything from 'love and loyalty' to 'an appetite for pizza,' right?

slaughterking said:
That's what I'm wondering. How could you even use it for this or any other game?
Click to expand...

Oh, I could come up with some potential uses, but I highly doubt they're going to be doing any of those. When the guy says, "We're looking at the origins of the RPG genre," the Vitality Sensor does not immediately come to mind.
 
D

duckroll

Member
I think NeoGAF should support the Vitality Sensor. I have this great idea too on how to make it all work. Basically, we implement levels and stats on all members, and release a WiiWare "battle browser" for NeoGAF. You read and post in that browser on the Wii, while connected to the Vitality Sensor. It will detect how angry, excited, scared, depressed, etc you are when you post replies, and it will use that to calculate damage taken and damage dealt to other members. Friends can also heal each other by posting replies of encouragement or defense. This is brilliant, I'm calling Iwata now!
 
F

Fimbulvetr

Member
I just thought of a way to use the vitality sensor.

What if you suck at a game and you keep getting pissed because there's one annoying section you can't get past.

Once you're angry enough your character goes berserk and becomes more powerful for like a minute or so allowing you to get through the section you where having trouble with.

Basically it's a Trance meter. :lol
 
V

Vinci

Danish
Fimbulvetr said:
I just thought of a way to use the vitality sensor.

What if you suck at a game and you keep getting pissed because there's one annoying section you can't get past.

Once you're angry enough your character goes berserk and becomes more powerful for like a minute or so allowing you to get through the section you where having trouble with.

Basically it's a Trance meter. :lol
Click to expand...

"Slap me, Mom! I need to go Super Saiyan!"
 
T

thetrin

Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
duckroll said:
I think NeoGAF should support the Vitality Sensor. I have this great idea too on how to make it all work. Basically, we implement levels and stats on all members, and release a WiiWare "battle browser" for NeoGAF. You read and post in that browser on the Wii, while connected to the Vitality Sensor. It will detect how angry, excited, scared, depressed, etc you are when you post replies, and it will use that to calculate damage taken and damage dealt to other members. Friends can also heal each other by posting replies of encouragement or defense. This is brilliant, I'm calling Iwata now!
Click to expand...

I will play this. Grimoire Assembly Forge's next game confirmed.

Vinci said:
"Slap me, Mom! I need to go Super Saiyan!"
Click to expand...

There's something so very wrong about this.
 
G

Gospel

Parmesan et Romano
Vinci said:
Oh, I could come up with some potential uses, but I highly doubt they're going to be doing any of those. When the guy says, "We're looking at the origins of the RPG genre," the Vitality Sensor does not immediately come to mind.
Click to expand...
I thought that quote was from Takahashi in regards to Xenoblade?
 
T

thetrin

Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
AceBandage said:
They both said it, actually.
Both Xenoblade and Last Story are trying to take RPGs back to its roots.
Click to expand...

I have a feeling they're both feeling the bite of JRPG overcomplication, and they know they're losing older JRPG fans as a result.
 
G

Gospel

Parmesan et Romano
AceBandage said:
They both said it, actually.
Both Xenoblade and Last Story are trying to take RPGs back to its roots.
Click to expand...
I want to expect great things from these games then. Just hope they hit the Americuz, or else.
 
D

duckroll

Member
AceBandage said:
They both said it, actually.
Both Xenoblade and Last Story are trying to take RPGs back to its roots.
Click to expand...

They did? Where? Sakaguchi has always said that this game would be a "true" next-generation game, and that he wants to explore new ways of presenting a RPG to players, etc, etc. I don't recall him ever claiming that he is going back to the roots of anything, instead he talks about the flower blooming! Quite the opposite!
 
A

AceBandage

Banned
duckroll said:
They did? Where? Sakaguchi has always said that this game would be a "true" next-generation game, and that he wants to explore new ways of presenting a RPG to players, etc, etc. I don't recall him ever claiming that he is going back to the roots of anything, instead he talks about the flower blooming! Quite the opposite!
Click to expand...


Hmm, maybe Gooch didn't say it.
Could of sworn one of the blog entries said something about how he wanted to bring back his vision from where he started on the Final Fantasy games.
 
D

duckroll

Member
AceBandage said:
Hmm, maybe Gooch didn't say it.
Could of sworn one of the blog entries said something about how he wanted to bring back his vision from where he started on the Final Fantasy games.
Click to expand...

No. What he said was that they were working on a prototype for a concept he hasn't touched since FFVII. They were experimenting with some sort of game mechanic to see if it would work. That's all.

Cavia had their chance with the Gooch, and they blew it. I'll be very surprised if he works with them again immediately after the last major game he was working with them got canned.
 
A

Agnates

Banned
And I thought Xenoblade also said it's going to be new-type, I don't expect any to end up like Dragon Quest or something, more like attempts to give the old school feeling in a new way, since the old ways are tired and don't provide the same excitement anymore. To Some. Or something.
 
D

duckroll

Member
As far as Xenoblade is concerned, I'm pretty sure he's not talking about JRPGs, but RPGs in general. He mentions specifically how he wants to explore the roots of RPGs in terms of being a grand adventure, with a high degree of freedom in exploration of the world, etc.
 
C

carlo6529

Member
Just curious, do you think sakaguchi has meetings with Miyamoto to get opinions and any sort of input? Basically, do you think Nintendo is meddling in his affairs?
 
D

duckroll

Member
Sakaguchi is in Hawaii, so if Miyamoto tries to message him on IM about changes to his game, he can just right click and select "ignore user".
 
V

Vinci

Danish
thetrin said:
I have a feeling they're both feeling the bite of JRPG overcomplication, and they know they're losing older JRPG fans as a result.
Click to expand...

The Xenoblade guy seems to notice that more keenly, however. Whether he puts that into practice or not, we'll see.
 
C

carlo6529

Member
I'm sure he occassionally has to have some sort of meeting with Nintendo; at very least to discuss how the development is going.
 
V

Vinci

Danish
carlo6529 said:
I'm sure he occassionally has to have some sort of meeting with Nintendo; at very least to discuss how the development is going.
Click to expand...

I think Nintendo is more than aware of his credentials.
 
A

Aokage

Pretty nice guy (apart from the blue shadows thing...)
So apparently it is being developed by an arm of AQI. Here's hoping for Artoon.

http://www.aqi.co.jp/ir/2010/data/20100218.pdf

■国内外大手パブリッシャー向け企画提案強化
　・バイオハザード/ダークサイド・クロニクルズ（カプコン）
　・NieR Gestalt/NieR Replicant（スクウェア・エニックス）
　・NINETY-NINE NIGHTS Ⅱ（コナミデジタルエンタテインメント）
　・THE LAST STORY（MISTWALKER CORPORATION）

Edit: Beaten, of course!
 
J

jay

Member
Vinci said:
I think Nintendo is more than aware of his credentials.
Click to expand...

Miyamoto checks in on everyone and I'd guess Iwata checks in on Miyamoto. I'm not sure what credentials you could have to make you immune to your publisher wanting to know how things are going.
 
C

cosmicblizzard

Banned
Fimbulvetr said:
I just thought of a way to use the vitality sensor.

What if you suck at a game and you keep getting pissed because there's one annoying section you can't get past.

Once you're angry enough your character goes berserk and becomes more powerful for like a minute or so allowing you to get through the section you where having trouble with.

Basically it's a Trance meter. :lol
Click to expand...

Oh shit! Limit Break/Trance/Overdrive IN REAL LIFE! I'm gonna always play angry and omni-slash the shit out of everything.
 
V

Vinci

Danish
jay said:
Miyamoto checks in on everyone and I'd guess Iwata checks in on Miyamoto. I'm not sure what credentials you could have to make you immune to your publisher wanting to know how things are going.
Click to expand...

I'm just suggesting that I don't think they're going to micromanage this title. RPGs aren't exactly their strongpoint as a company.
 
D

dragonlife

Member
CruxisMana said:
Out of curiosity, what were the controls for ToS: DOTNW like?

Last I heard of the game before it's release was that they were trying to make the controls more natural, trying not to go overboard with the 'waggle' etc.
Click to expand...
There is no waggle at all, unless you want there to be (motion shortcuts are an option alongside button ones).

ivysaur12 said:
What if cavia is developing?
Click to expand...
It would be the best day ever for duckroll and I.

OMG, what if Kimihiko Fujisaka suddenly became the main artist!?
 
J

jay

Member
Vinci said:
I'm just suggesting that I don't think they're going to micromanage this title. RPGs aren't exactly their strongpoint as a company.
Click to expand...

Yeah, possibly. I noticed the conversation sort of diverge into two paths; some of us are arguing Nintendo will check in and others are arguing Nintendo won't have much design input. Both of these things could be true.
 
D

duckroll

Member
Vinci said:
True. Still, I don't know... if Nintendo were making suggestions, who would made a strong advocate? Int Sys?
Click to expand...

Well to be honest, I don't think Nintendo really watches third party developments they are publishing as closely as they should. If they did, ASH and Glory of Heracles would never have been released in Japan.
 
C

carlo6529

Member
Vinci said:
I think Nintendo is more than aware of his credentials.
Click to expand...

Personally, if I were sakaguchi, I would want Miyamoto's professional opinion, even though he isn't known for role playing games.

I wouldn't want him controlling the project though, ultimately leaving me with the final say, but in my opinion he would be undeniably a valuble asset.
 
V

Vinci

Danish
carlo6529 said:
Personally, if I were sakaguchi, I would want Miyamoto's professional opinion, even though he isn't known for role playing games.

I wouldn't want him controlling the project though, ultimately leaving me with the final say, but in my opinion he would be undeniably a valuble asset.
Click to expand...

You want the guy who could barely play RPGs outside of Mother 2 to give the guy advice? Miyamoto is a fucking legend, but not for his RPG knowledge.
 
D

duckroll

Member
carlo6529 said:
Personally, if I were sakaguchi, I would want Miyamoto's professional opinion, even though he isn't known for role playing games.

I wouldn't want him controlling the project though, ultimately leaving me with the final say, but in my opinion he would be undeniably a valuble asset.
Click to expand...

I agree. I don't like this mindset that RPGs can only be critiqued by RPG developers or experts. It's nonsense. RPGs are games, just like any other genre of game. They may have a different focal point for the audience, but ultimately they still operate on the same basic rules. Anyone who is familiar with games or entertainment in general will be able to look at something and comment if certain things feel off or something looks poorly implemented. It can be anything from the user interface, to how intuitive a command or action is to the user, to even simple things like character motions or map layouts.

Having an experienced designer give a second opinion is invaluable for anyone who is serious about releasing a polished product that has universal acclaim. Often having someone who is not an expert in your own field will actually get you feedback that you and your own core team might not have seen because you're so used to certain staples in the genre, even if it can be further improved.
 
G

gamergirly

Member
thetrin said:
I have a feeling they're both feeling the bite of JRPG overcomplication, and they know they're losing older JRPG fans as a result.
Click to expand...

All of Japan should know they're losing Jrpg fans. Hopefully, Saka can take it back to where it started from, rpgs really do need a different twist or element
 
J

jj984jj

He's a pretty swell guy in my books anyway.
dragonlife29 said:
OMG, what if Kimihiko Fujisaka suddenly became the main artist!?
Click to expand...
That would be the only advantage of it being cavia over Artoon, and he still could be the main artist. Actually, scratch that, I'd rather it be Manabu Kusunoki even though it probably is Fujisaka.
 
V

Vinci

Danish
duckroll said:
I agree. I don't like this mindset that RPGs can only be critiqued by RPG developers or experts. It's nonsense. RPGs are games, just like any other genre of game. They may have a different focal point for the audience, but ultimately they still operate on the same basic rules. Anyone who is familiar with games or entertainment in general will be able to look at something and comment if certain things feel off or something looks poorly implemented. It can be anything from the user interface, to how intuitive a command or action is to the user, to even simple things like character motions or map layouts.

Having an experienced designer give a second opinion is invaluable for anyone who is serious about releasing a polished product that has universal acclaim. Often having someone who is not an expert in your own field will actually get you feedback that you and your own core team might not have seen because you're so used to certain staples in the genre, even if it can be further improved.
Click to expand...

I can see this perspective. I mean, you don't have a to be an RPG developer or expert - but wasn't there a quote from Miyamoto posted on here recently (even though it's old) in which he said he barely got through Mother 2 and that he doesn't play RPGs at all? I'd think some experience with the genre would help educate one's opinions.

Then again, you might be right. Maybe what RPGs need is someone from 'outside' to help figure out how to make something that appeals to larger demographics.
 
E

Effect

Member
Vinci said:
You want the guy who could barely play RPGs outside of Mother 2 to give the guy advice? Miyamoto is a fucking legend, but not for his RPG knowledge.
Click to expand...

That wouldn't matter. Miyamoto is one of the best game designers if not THE best out there today. He makes games that are aimed at everyone or made in such a way that everyone will want to try them. It is because of this that his games are so successful. His input would be important. It also pays to get the opinion of someone who doesn't mainly work in the RPG field so you don't stay in a bubble. If you have access to one of the best out there who's games (of different genres at times) on average sell several million each why not ask him his opinion? You aren't asking him or letting him have the final say so.
 
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