Summer Haze
Banned
Lol, true.
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PS4K information (~2x GPU power w/ clock+, new CPU, price, tent. Q1 2017)
- Thread starter OsirisBlack
- Start date
Lol, true.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Once they show consumers that there upcoming games going to work find on PS4 after PS4K comes out i don't think they have to worry .
If price is the biggest factor for a consumer PS4K won't effect them in any way .
Marketing will play a key part but i don't think it going to be as hard as some people think .
Since consumers know there are tiers for everything else in the world but they can still get use out of older tech .
Devs will do that either way new hardware or not just look at last gen .
Plus more powerful hardware is already out it's call PC and they doing that already .
Some people think that because of PS4K there PS4 version going to be even worst .
But i don't see it that way since devs will do that either way .
Also since PS4 using PC part there no hidden juice these devs going find after 3 to 4 years that would really matter .
Preach.
Marty Chinn
Member
It has never had to do with PC hardware; it's had to do with developers trying to push things as far as they can and consumer expectations of things getting visually better. PC hardware is not a part of this equation. PC hardware has always been held back by consoles, not the other way around where consoles were pushed because of PC hardware.
Huh. At 60fps you'd be sampling controller Input and rendering twice as much per second, that's way more than 30-40ms of tv input lag.
Papacheeks
Banned
I guess? We don't know what they are planning or if they even will have something for the end of the year refresh wise?
That's my whole point. People are carrying on with just the leak information and are as clueless as the rest of us in how this will play out. You can't predict what you don't know. You don't know how well this will be, how many developers will make use of it, how many titles in the future may or maynot be PS4K only.
And dismissing people concern's who bring up examples of other gaming products that have tried something similar in the past should not be dismissed. And that's what's happening in the conversation.
At least in the xbox thread about this similar discussion, we had good examples from developers on 32bit apps for UWP, and what not.
In here it's all 100% opinion. Unless a developer who has the PS4K kit, and has been using it comes in, and starts clearing things up in how work flow is between base PS4 and newer model, it all remains conjecture at this point.
And people against it who are putting their 2 cents in, should not be belittled because it doesn't go with the majority who are all for it.
Wishmaster92
Member
Sure, it will run at 720p-900p will look around 80% same with some dips. I doubt a normal aaa game will be 4k because for that you need to increase the og ps4 gpu by a factor of 4X-5 but this is just a 2X increase. It will have a 4k upscaler for people with 4k tvs, but thats just not the same.
Commanche Raisin Toast
Member
That's my point. People seem to believe that PS4 games will keep looking like UC4 and PS4K will look even better, but every gen shows us that old gen takes a hit in visuals and performance because the games are designed around the new hardware instead of focused and optimized for the old.
R10Neymarfan
Member
It's either between Polaris 11 or downclocked Tonga IMO. Tonga(285/380/380x) is the newer architecture with GCN 1.2, power efficiency, and delta compression and it's been out for a while so AMD can offer it with improved yields compared to the newer Polaris. I do wonder what they will choose.
As for the CPU part they will probably go mobile again with either beefing up the Jaguar cores or going for 8 cores of Puma, the successor. I doubt they'll go for Zen for the same reason as Polaris. Especially if this has been planned since I'm guessing around 2014 after the PS4 just launched.
And for the memory they can probably get away with 8GB of GDDR5x
PC ha.... WHAT? Since when has the far more powerful hardware like a 980ti been held back by consoles?!
GlamFM
Banned
There is no precedent for for what´s happening right now. + This is not a new generation.
The PS4 becomes a platform.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Interesting... I thought it was because developers find new ways to squeeze out that much more, with taking slight hits to performance.
I do not believe this is the case... at all.
The Last of Us had nothing to do with the PS4. Completely different architectures... it had to do with pushing more out of the hardware, with slight hits than can be overlooked due to such achievements and game pacing.
Marty Chinn
Member
Since forever? No developer targets a 980ti for their game. They target lower and higher specs give you polish. There's a reason why every time we get a new console generation, PC games suddenly also get a jump in visual fidelity. It's because developers target against consoles and PCs. A high end GPU is never fully exploited because it would be at the expense of alienating a larger user base.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Be honest.....have you seen what Uncharted 4 looks like? Underpowered isn't a word I'd use.
I bet there will be some 720p PS4 games that will be 20hz.
TLOU was heavily optimized for the PS3 and still ran like shit because the hardware couldn't support the devs vision. Even if the PS4k wasn't a factor games would still run worse as time goes on.
EDIT: Nvm TLOU ran great.
gundamkyoukai
Member
PC hardware was never held back by consoles .
It's was held back by older PC and the consumer base for certain games being else where .
Any pub can go and make a game that take advantage of PC hardware but they won't because they won't make money .
great, I guess thats the reason you should get PS4k and not 980 Ti
Bubba_Sparks
Member
I imagine they are going to be significantly downgraded from the PS4K version in the way current PS4 / Xbox One games are downgraded from their PC counterparts. Durante already pointed out that a 2x increase would put the card roughly on par with a 280x, so there wouldn't be much more graphical power to do anything else.
No developer targets super high end due to the fact that a very small percentile actually even own those....
They want their games to sell yaknow
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Yeah, I never get that argument.
The mass majority not having enthusiast set ups on the PC hold it back graphically more than the consoles, by far.
Exactly.
Fat Cry was a thing, and something that was not repeated since. Devs have the mod community to pick up the slack for the higher end tech.
Marty Chinn
Member
This is just not true. Why do you think games like Assassin's Creed Unity got a huge jump in visuals compared to previous versions of Assassin's Creed? It's because suddenly we had a new generation of console hardware. It's not suddenly that everyone bought new GPUs. There were plenty of PCs fully capable of doing Assassin's Creed Unity quality graphics before the PS4 and Xbox One came out, but they didn't. So yes, PC games have always been held back by consoles because developers want to cross platform against all three for the best bang for their buck. Also given the scope of sales on consoles versions of games compared to their PC counterpart, you bet they're going to focus more on the console version.
Yes, and where do games sell the most still? Consoles. So they target that range of specs because they're not going to put out something that they can't put out on the console.
OsirisBlack
Banned
I dropped a game hint yesterday no one caught on.
No clue there was absolutely no mention of a different controller.
IF there was any type of trade in program it would be from retailers and would only be about $100 or so due to a likely OG PS4 price drop.
I also verified the other information but will not drop it today because of the dates (April 1st) implications.
Commanche Raisin Toast
Member
Yeah, I mean, this is just all that I've been spitballing around with my ex game dev friend this morning.
And yes, this isn't a new gen, but that's beside the point. New better hardware is being injected into the market and available for devs to take advantage of. That's all that matters.
PdotMichael
Banned
I would bet money that the PS4 will never hit that price. Not with all that hardware and fix costs, they will just discontinue the console at some point.
Actually no. At the end of last gen devs started using new tricks and techniques to run games looking better while being able to be ran on lower end.
Primarily it is mostly lighting and material rendering.
Mister Megative
Banned
Absolutely not. Especially if there's a price cut.
Holding back is used as a negative term though, against consoles, which is schizoid given the realities.
velociraptor
Junior Member
That's fine because most people can't tell the difference between PS4 and PC games.
I'd honestly be happier with 1080p60
jimbobsmells
Member
Damn that's the post this thread needed. Well done sir.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Yes we had a new gen of consoles but it was never about hardware .
It's about consumer base , if Assassin's Creed Unity could have sold 6 million copies on PC without consoles they would done it already .
Look at SC they don't care about consoles because they have other way of getting money .
So i don't see consoles holding back PC games .
Which would have not even been made \ have there budget cut without the console consumer base.
PC gamers should be happy since the get the benefits .
Commanche Raisin Toast
Member
Yep. They really need to just eventually phase out PS4 and make PS4K the standard unit. Treat it like a slim model. That would require aggressive pricing though, and with the rumored $400-$500 price tag it could be hard for them to pull off.
One thing to remember is consumers are used to their consoles going down in price over a generation. If these hardware refreshes keep the cost relatively flat through the gen we may not see widespread adoption by the masses. (Not that I think PS4 would naturally reach PS2 numbers or anything)
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Who is the earthly HECK thinks this is a good idea?!?! JESUS CHRIST! So do some people want the PS4 to also play PS5 games?
Do people realize that this will forever hold back the future consoles from reaching their true capability?
I don't think they will let go the OG model. If they drop it to 200, they will keep working on a slim model and try to get this even lower. I wouldn't make sense to phase it out and replace with a SKU that's more expensive.
They could appease the mass market with a low cost unit while still keeping the enthusiast happy with a more powerful console.
PS3 was a problem in these two fronts. It never became as cheap as previous consoles to appease to the low end market while also becoming underpowered in the final years, a problem for the enthusiasts.
Does it really matter?
Some people still think this is a April Fools joke anyway.Most know its not though.
GlamFM
Banned
I think it´s pretty safe to say that GAF knows that this is not an April Fools thread.
Drop THE BOMB!
Mister Megative
Banned
But was it the post this thread deserved?
longdi
Banned
So April fool has come and almost gone...and this thread survives still.
Tbh, I'm not sure it is a good thing for Sony to do this. It means in future, more will wait for the 'new' nextgen go bit before buying. As such it will take a longer time to hit critical sales volume and publishers will be more careful to invest big games for a next gen console.
Consoles gamers are not too loyal to keep buying new consoles every 3 years
Tbh, I'm not sure it is a good thing for Sony to do this. It means in future, more will wait for the 'new' nextgen go bit before buying. As such it will take a longer time to hit critical sales volume and publishers will be more careful to invest big games for a next gen console.
Consoles gamers are not too loyal to keep buying new consoles every 3 years
-ImaginaryInsider
Member
Whatever the dev kit out now is likely just an early target spec, it's going to be very generic and general, so no specialized custom final silicon.
Since Sony isn't sure what the final CPU might be, it's likely they gave the devs an idea of lowest possible ballpark of what it could be. Really early dev kits (like Xenon G5 alpha kit) can feature much better CPU's that the devs just end up modifying as closer to the final silicon kits come out.
This isn't going to be a crazy architecture shift, so the whole thing "should" be pretty straight forward to adapt.
Omnistalgic
Member
Someone go detective and figure out what game Osiris hinted.
Mister Megative
Banned
Drop it like it's hot. We know it's not an April Fool's. Or maybe PM those of us who know this is neither a joke nor a disaster?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
For the work and risk the OP is doing... yes.
Drop it like it's hot. We know it's not an April Fool's. Or maybe PM those of us who know this is neither a joke nor a disaster?
This.
I looked through for.yesterday and I can't see anything obvious bar a Deadpool quote.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
A Deadpool game?
wapplew
Member
More like held back by majority low end hardware, PC and console included.
That's the nature of PC hardware, no one going to make games specific for best hardware at the time
On console, we'll get first party exclusive, desgin specificity for that hardware alone, day 1 until next successor arrive.
All that will be gone if console follow the same model.
Omnistalgic
Member
Who the fook would care about a Deadpool game? That can't be it..lol
David Cage's Detroid?
To clarify, his quote was "...I'm living to 102 and then dying". The complete sentence is "I'm living to 102 and then dying like the city of Detroit.."
Yes but there are well thought out arguments on why this is a bad idea that get met with the same response. As if it makes any less sense than someone's post who is all for this change.
I was hoping to see that sneaker guy, i think that's his name, in these threads. He had a good post for people who think it'll just be copy and paste between platforms.
gundamkyoukai
Member
So what do think going to be it's lowest price ?
Cause going 14nm should allow them to do that .
They already went $300 last year and i can see them doing $200 this year .