• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Hearthstone |OT8| Elise's Extremely Irresponsible Field Trip To Un'Goro

Status
Not open for further replies.
D

DyslexicAlucard

Member
fertygo said:
I fucking hate flametongue

yeah 2 mana korkron is fucking fair
Click to expand...

It's not really comparable at all. Yes, you get 4 "charge" damage, but it requires you to have two bodies on the board. Plus, it has no attack of its own, so it can be dealt with for "free," if they don't have a taunt.

It can be annoying to deal with, for sure, but I don't think it's OP. It's just that with Shaman's current tools, they have a much easier time maintaining board control than they did a year or so ago. Either way, FTT isn't really the main culprit, IMO.
 
F

fertygo

Member
Familienoberhauptvogel said:
that's not a fair comparison, it's much better than Korkron
Click to expand...
yup its much better

DyslexicAlucard said:
It's not really comparable at all. Yes, you get 4 "charge" damage, but it requires you to have two bodies on the board. Plus, it has no attack of its own, so it can be dealt with for "free," if they don't have a taunt.

It can be annoying to deal with, for sure, but I don't think it's OP. It's just that with Shaman's current tools, they have a much easier time maintaining board control than they did a year or so ago. Either way, FTT isn't really the main culprit, IMO.
Click to expand...

I talking about current state its really easy to get multiple body even in turn bloody one
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Giant developer comment dump: http://www.hearthpwn.com/

Yong Woo said:
  • The majority of players do not use 18 deck slots. Yong would rather see importing and exporting of lists to solve the deckslot issue.
  • One designer is focusing on figuring out a way to allow players to more easily get wild cards they're missing.
  • Some promotional heroes and card backs should be coming back during the Year of the Mammoth.
  • There are no current plans to give end of month rewards for both formats; they don't want to force players to play both modes.
  • The bug where Hearthstone cuts off music you are playing is something they want to fix but requires an engine upgrade which takes a lot of time and effort and as such is not currently high on the priority list.
Click to expand...
Dean Ayala said:
Legend Rank Matchmaking

Person: TLDR: Players stopped playing versus dumpster players if they were high ranked. Blizzard haden't said anything so the players wasen't 100% sure if any changed actually occurred. Iksar first said it was unlikely that they changed anything. However today he confirmed it was true. The reason he didn't know was because he wasen't involved in the change.

Dean: Basically, some back-end changes were made that made matchmaking at the top-end a little 'better' in terms of finding you a match against someone with a closer MMR. We'll be evaluating that change over the course of this month to see what kind of effect it actually had on match MMR disparity and queue times. At that point we'll have a further update.
Click to expand...
Blizzard said:
  • This thread is just to discuss the move to the Standard format in Arena. Personally, I am quite sad we can't choose from all the cards in the game. I am hoping if enough people care Blizzard might reconsider this change, however unlikely that is.

    Changing Arena to Standard is a big experiment. If players play it for a while and don't enjoy it, we're happy to revert it. We're also likely to experiment with other, crazier formats in the future. Naxx cards only? Only Legendaries and spells?

    I think we just need to take a more active role in the Arena experience.

    Internally, I don't think we expected much out of the Standard Arena change. But after playtesting, we felt it was pretty fun. I think players will enjoy it, but like I said, try it and let us know. (Ben Brode)
  • Golden Cards Show Up In Arena

    If you own golden cards in your collection, copies of that card that appear in your Arena run will show up as golden. If you own a single golden card, the first copy of it you choose will be golden. If you own two copies of a golden card, every copy of that card you choose in the Arena will be golden. If you own one golden Legendary, every copy of that Legendary you choose in Arena will be golden. (Zeriyah)
  • You said Blizzard didn't want to change the rarity of Abyssal Enforcer - why is that? Couldn't they have just made it a rare and solved the problem of decks having 2 or 3 or 4 of them?

    For what it's worth, the rarity distribution changes make cards of different rarities fairly similar in terms of individual cards. Common cards as a whole show up more often that rare cards, but the difference of appearance rates between a common card like Kabal Talonpriest and a rare card like Drakonid Operative is quite small. (Dean Ayala)
  • My issue with this is that it ends up being counter productive to the standard goal of it being more worth it to play around cards again. As in past, you mostly focused playing around premium commons and very rarely on other higher rarity cards. But now when specific rares and epics are about just as often seen as commons, this dilutes back down the first point. So ok you nerf Flamestrike odds aye, but when next week for example average priest deck has more Dragonfire Potions than mage has Flamestrikes, it seems kind of weird you went down that nerf route for just two cards in middle of such massive overall changes that change so much anyways.

    Part of it is perception. From our end it feels like players are fairly bored with losing to Flamestrike and Abyssal. Mage and Warlock are both relatively strong classes right now so it felt safe to make changes to those two cards. You are right that there will probably be new cards that crop up as the new Flamestrikes/Abyssals, but we'll cross that bridge when it happens. (Dean Ayala)
  • Why not have every areana run randomly generate 3 or four sets (also with classic/basic cards) so that each run has consistency but the arena itself has diversity. At the beginig of the run it might tell you that you rolled WOG GVG Naxx and MSG, you know what sets will appear and can plan your choices accordingly. The way this Change is I fell that arena will lose its fun identity and people will attempt to draft the same sort of decks that are being played in standard. I understand wanting consistency but I feel there are better ways to do that then taking away so many fun and memorable cards that have already been taken away in many formats.

    I think this is a cool idea and one we've talked about in the past. I think it's a pretty reasonable solution but we decided to go with the simplest form of this for now and see how it plays out in practice. From doing a few hundred standard arena drafts myself, I think it's a pretty fun and different draft experience. Constructed and Arena decks on average are still a good distance apart even if they are using the same cards. I mentioned this above, but unless standard only arena gets overwhelmingly positive feedback post-release, I would expect there to be continued changes over time to the format. (Dean Ayala)
  • Hi Iksar. I'd love to hear more about how Blizzard playtests Hearthstone. When testing Standard Arena how did you get your "few hundred" drafts in? Were the first hundred within Team 5? Were the last hundred within all of Blizzard?
    Any thoughts you'd like to share on how y'all playtest would be awesome. I just want to know from a sheer curiosity perspective. I've never worked on a game that required a months worth of testing to see how the meta evolves and settles. That's pretty mind blowing to me. It's a whole other world.

    I specifically am referring to drafting a deck and having it seem interesting and fun. When I say a few hundred drafts, I literally mean I drafted hundreds of decks myself over the course of the last few weeks/months to see how various iterations would feel. We used this anecdotal data in combination with automation tests of each class doing 100k runs and analyzing the card output results. (Dean Ayala)
  • Changes are good, but it's just odd to me that such a change was implemented expecting to change it that easily, we don't get that with other aspects of the game, but the opposite. I personally don't play Arena for making syngergies but to have a whole pool of cards, make a random deck and make the most of it playing it well, I hope that idea survives cause I think we aren't changing a mode but removing one and adding another.

    I hope that is not the case. The idea isn't that arena decks will turn into constructed decks overnight, but to create a pool of cards that work together enough to give some synergistic excitement slightly more often. (Dean Ayala)
  • do you find it a good idea to do 3 expansions a year when we've seen a lot of dead cards with 2 >.>?

    dead cards for who? There are other types of players besides tournament contenders. Some players build silly decks for fun. (Ben Brode)
  • what are your thoughts on fiery war axe in standard right now ?would it be moved to wild in the future ?

    it's very powerful. Unlikely we'd move Basic cards. Could nerf it, but not something we're considering right now. (Ben Brode)
  • Hey I have a question from the recent live stream you posted on youtube. Will Reno Jackson switch to classic?

    No, it's very powerful, and would make it harder for Standard to rotate and be fresh each year. (Ben Brode)
  • are you planning to nerf some old cards from Nax and GvG to develop wild format?

    no current plans to nerf any cards but we would if we felt the format needed it. (Ben Brode)
  • at Blizzcon, @ywoo_dev briefly mentioned making import/export of lists easier. Any updates?

    I am trying to make it happen!!!! (Yong Woo)
Click to expand...
 
Z

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
I'm tired of people calling for nerfs to FWA. I think if you nerf FWA you start having to cross this bridge where you nerf all sorts of powerful basic cards. Fireball, Frost Bolt, Innervate, Wild Growth, Eviscerate, Power Word: Shield, Kill Command, cards like these. Every class has some really powerful cards in their basic kit and if you start tapping out even one of them you can toss that set out of balance even more than it is out of balance right now. Don't touch FWA unless you have a plan to completely renovate the basic and classic sets.
 
I

inky

Member
ZealousD said:
I'm tired of people calling for nerfs to FWA. I think if you nerf FWA you start having to cross this bridge where you nerf all sorts of powerful basic cards. Fireball, Frost Bolt, Innervate, Wild Growth, Eviscerate, Power Word: Shield, Kill Command, cards like these. Every class has some really powerful cards in their basic kit and if you start tapping out even one of them you can toss that set out of balance even more than it is out of balance right now. Don't touch FWA unless you have a plan to completely renovate the basic and classic sets.
Click to expand...

Change Fiery War Axe for Innervate and that's pretty much my opinion. It's a pretty shortsighted thing to be always complaining about basic class identity cards like those.
 
Z

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
FWA is the only solid early game that Warrior has in the basic set. Nerf it or drop it and suddenly Warrior becomes a Paladin-tier class.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
Innervate is way more broken than War Axe anyway.

Besides I don't think any Basic card is a sacred cow. They already nerfed Rockbiter and Execute, two very class defining basic cards for the classes. They shouldn't nerf War Axe though, War Axe is like the litmus test for how fast/degenerate a meta is.


Kill Command isn't even over powered, it's like slightly above average at best. The best Hunter basic card is Animal Companion and I have heard people ask for nerfs on that plenty of times in the past due to its high swing RNG.
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
I never got the Innervate complaints. Mana cheating is an extremely common mechanic in card games, and it's not like Druid has been much of an issue ever since the Force of Nature nerf.
 
I

inky

Member
Nirolak said:
I never got the Innervate complaints. Mana cheating is an extremely common mechanic in card games, and it's not like Druid has been much of an issue ever since the Force of Nature nerf.
Click to expand...

Yup. Calling it "broken" is a step too far. It can be under some circumstances, it can also be completely useless under different ones. It's a class identity card that has pros and cons like any other and despite what people claim is not enough to push the class above the rest by itself, because, heck, by design it doesn't work by itself. It just enables other stuff.

Like maybe, maybe not letting you go over 10 mana with it could be considered as a way to keep it in check, but in the current form of the game when is that ever a problem anymore? Games end by turn 4-5. I'm not even sure it would be a problem in a control meta anyway, but we'll never find out so who cares.
 
B

Blizzard

Banned
inky said:
Games end by turn 4-5. I'm not even sure it would be a problem in a control meta anyway, but we'll never find out so who cares.
Click to expand...
By "end" do you mean "you know who will win"? Because I think I've literally once, maybe twice, seen a game end through the hero dying before turn 6 in my last 50 ranked games or so. Never before turn 5 that I remember.
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
The mana cheating also comes at the tremendously high price of having the worst removal options in the game.

You can get out your big creature early, but your enemy can often remove it, and you're pretty much just fucked when they finally start playing their own threats if you can't keep the board.

Jade is great against Control, but you're generally playing against slow ass decks where you don't need to be speeding along anyway. You're using your mana cheating just to keep up with the tremendous cost of your Jade cards.
 
I

inky

Member
Blizzard said:
By "end" do you mean "you know who will win"? Because I think I've literally once, maybe twice, seen a game end through the hero dying before turn 6 in my last 50 ranked games or so. Never before turn 5 that I remember.
Click to expand...

The former. Isn't Patches like a guaranteed win in 60% of the games when it comes out in the first turns? And is played in like 70% of the games? That's what I saw in the recent Disguised Toast video.
 
B

BannedEpisode

Member
When do you guys think the rotation and expansion will happen? I'm the past booster expansions were December and April.

With them getting rid of adventures do you see them dropping in March or is early April still the target?
 
P

Pooya

Member
Innervate can be too much depending on the available creature quality. When druid had Dr. Boom or double combo, innervate felt absurd. Now you innervate something out, it is hex'd and you lose.... It's just a way to accelerate your otherwise slow game plan, it's fine by itself.

cheating out stats earlier by burning extra card is not that good right now.
 
Y

Yaboosh

Super Sleuth
BannedEpisode said:
When do you guys think the rotation and expansion will happen? I'm the past booster expansions were December and April.

With them getting rid of adventures do you see them dropping in March or is early April still the target?
Click to expand...


Probably April again. Every four months makes obvious sense.
 
C

charlequin

Banned
Blizzard said:
No, I'm leery of third-party programs as technically violating ToS, even if it's unlikely they will ever be banned. Blizzard and the Hearthstone team could always change their minds later on.
Click to expand...

WoW's old enough to go to high school, Blizzard's policies on third-party programs are pretty set in stone at this point. There's zero chance any of the apps that do deck/play tracking, etc. will ever get in trouble with them.
 
J

JesseZao

Member
charlequin said:
WoW's old enough to go to high school, Blizzard's policies on third-party programs are pretty set in stone at this point. There's zero chance any of the apps that do deck/play tracking, etc. will ever get in trouble with them.
Click to expand...

Yeah. Unless it's performing player actions a la a bot, they're cool with community extensions.
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
BannedEpisode said:
When do you guys think the rotation and expansion will happen? I'm the past booster expansions were December and April.

With them getting rid of adventures do you see them dropping in March or is early April still the target?
Click to expand...

The next expansion was listed as Q2, which starts in April.

That said, I think it will be early April instead of late April this time around since they're more comfortable with their setup.
 
L

Lone_Prodigy

Member
Any opinions on this Jade Rogue deck? I don't have the dust for Prep.

Backstab x2
Counterfeit Coin x1
Cold Blood x2
Conceal x1
Swashburglar x2
Eviscerate x2
Jade Shuriken x2
Jade Swarmer x2
Sap x1
Brann x1
Edwin x1
Fan of Knives x2
Shadow Strike x1
Unearthed Raptor x1
Jade Spirit x2
Tomb Pillager x2
Azure Drake x2
Aya x1
Auctioneer x2
Click to expand...
 
B

Blizzard

Banned
charlequin said:
WoW's old enough to go to high school, Blizzard's policies on third-party programs are pretty set in stone at this point. There's zero chance any of the apps that do deck/play tracking, etc. will ever get in trouble with them.
Click to expand...
Thanks. I don't want anything that adjusts arena card value or estimates percentage changes. If there's a commonly used extension that can do replay recording and nothing else (as in, I can turn off every other feature), I might try that.
 
P

peakish

Member
Blizzard said:
Thanks. I don't want anything that adjusts arena card value ot estimates percentage changes. If there's a commonly used extension that can do replay recording and nothing else (as in, I can turn off every other feature), I might try that.
Click to expand...
Hearthstone Deck Tracker pretty much automatically adds decks and tracks matches. You can turn off the ingame display completely, that's what I do.
 
D

DyslexicAlucard

Member
fertygo said:
I talking about current state its really easy to get multiple body even in turn bloody one
Click to expand...
And I agree with that, but I'm saying the issue is that they can take the board so easily early on, not FTT itself. It has been around since early beta and hasn't been a big problem until now.
 
L

Lone_Prodigy

Member
Mage mirror.

Opponent plays some Kabal minions so it's Reno.

I draw terribly so I just push damage to his face with my spells, hoping to burst him down fast.

Turn 10, he plays a second Frostbolt (not generated from anything) and I realize it's not Reno. He has a Secret up so I have to break his Ice Block ASAP.

I get him down to 1 HP with an empty hand and no board. Next turn he sets up lethal.

I draw, and just decide to ping him, HP hits 0. It wasn't Ice Block. I think it was Vaporize or Spellbender.
 
S

ScribbleD

Member
Nirolak said:
The next expansion was listed as Q2, which starts in April.

That said, I think it will be early April instead of late April this time around since they're more comfortable with their setup.
Click to expand...

When did they start revealing Gadgetzan cards? If it's gonna be early April, shouldn't we have heard something official about the next set by now? They haven't officially announced the name of the set yet, even though we all know what it is.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
Reynad thinks Shaman hero power should be reworked too.

That's been like the 3rd time I have heard some known player say that after I made a post about it here lol! Though I have really been saying this for a long time now.
 
G

Glass Shark

Banned
Blizzard said:
By "end" do you mean "you know who will win"? Because I think I've literally once, maybe twice, seen a game end through the hero dying before turn 6 in my last 50 ranked games or so. Never before turn 5 that I remember.
Click to expand...

Depending on the deck you're playing, you can absolutely determine the outcome of a game by turn 6. If I'm playing Pirate Warrior and going balls to the wall and a Reno comes down on 5 or 6, I concede. There is no chance in hell I'm winning that game, full stop. Same with a Shaman playing double Spirit Wolves against a fast aggro deck. There's no answer and you might as well give up and move on to a game you have a chance of winning.
 
W

wiibomb

Member
Dahbomb said:
Reynad thinks Shaman hero power should be reworked too.

That's been like the 3rd time I have heard some known player say that after I made a post about it here lol! Though I have really been saying this for a long time now.
Click to expand...


It is the only one directly dependant of pure RNG, no hero power, as a very base mechanic of HS, should have RNG involved, it should be attached to a constant value always, like all other hero powers.

Yeah, I saw that was weird when I started playing HS, I also believe it should be changed.

now that is something kind of hard to accomplish, it could mess with past cards.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
They just have to put it on a set rotation. It changes no other cards in Shaman's arsenal.

I guess now there is less of a reason to change it but then they have to be careful about making spell damage cards that Shaman can benefit off of. Blizzard was trying to push that "Zeus" archetype for Shaman in One Knight in Karazhan but that blew up in their face.
 
T

Tagyhag

Member
What should the hero power be? It would definitely have to be totem related.

Choosing a totem is obviously too powerful, unless maybe you make them all 0/1? Have the power cost 3? It's tough to do.
 
D

Drkirby

Corporate Apologist
I think it would be worth while to make more weapons unable to attack heroes. Like FWA unable to go face, or make Arcanite Reaper break if it is used to go face.
 
Y

Yaboosh

Super Sleuth
With Eternal being available on ipad now (at least by cheating the system and going through the Canadian store), I have been messing with that. I really like the more Magic style trading system. There is lots more single player options as well. Enjoying it so far.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
Yaboosh said:
With Eternal being available on ipad now (at least by cheating the system and going through the Canadian store), I have been messing with that. I really like the more Magic style trading system. There is lots more single player options as well. Enjoying it so far.
Click to expand...

Downsides: Mana screw and aggro dominant (like every damn digital card game out there right now).
 
L

Lone_Prodigy

Member
Tagyhag said:
What should the hero power be? It would definitely have to be totem related.

Choosing a totem is obviously too powerful, unless maybe you make them all 0/1? Have the power cost 3? It's tough to do.
Click to expand...

Discover a Totem and play it, can't have the same one twice.

Drkirby said:
I think it would be worth while to make more weapons unable to attack heroes. Like FWA unable to go face, or make Arcanite Reaper break if it is used to go face.
Click to expand...

That's what Taunt is for. And Ooze on Turn 2 after you've coined out War Axe.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
Tagyhag said:
What should the hero power be? It would definitely have to be totem related.

Choosing a totem is obviously too powerful, unless maybe you make them all 0/1? Have the power cost 3? It's tough to do.
Click to expand...
As I suggested before and other pro players have suggested... you put the hero power on a set rotation.

The one that Amnesiac posted I think was that Searing Totem (the 1/1), Taunt Totem, Spell Totem, Healing Totem in that order. He said that having Spell totem be at the 4th would make Shaman too weak but having the spell damage at 1 or 2 slot might be too powerful so 3 seems the best place to put it. I had Spell damage on 4th but after seeing his reasoning I think it's fine to have spell damage on 3rd position.

This makes it both skillful to play against the hero power and play with the hero power. You can plan out moves against it and with it.


Reynad was going one step further and saying that the whole Stealth mechanic needs nerfing. I am not there yet but I do see where he's coming from. That's just a disaster waiting to happen in the game if they print a bunch of stealth synergy cards that are hard to kill and then kill you if they survive. We already had a similar disaster with Charge and now Blizzard isn't making unconditional charge cards anymore (except Patches and Patches is broken).
 
S

squidyj

Member
I don't think a fixed rotation of totems is a good idea. Just cycling through it takes too long, too much investment.

do you skip a totem that's still up?
 
Z

Zoggy

Member
What is the pantheon (the REAL hall of fame) for hs?

Let's keep it to 5. Like hof rules for baseball

I'd say

Dr. Boom
Yogg
Prenerf undertaker
Gadjetzan auctioneer
Patches(early but I think it's deserved)

Right? What other have had as much an impact as these 5?
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
I'm guessing the patch date and the start of the daily login bonuses.

Hearthpwn said:
Hearthstone Announcement on Monday
By Fluxflashor 7 hours ago

Hearthstone Announcement on Monday

Earlier today Ben Brode posted a picture on Twitter of him in front of his excellent closet of flannel with a note mentioning a video that will be filmed on Monday. We didn't really consider it crazy news but according to an email we received from Blizzard..

They have something to share on Monday. Well now, no delay there from production of the video to release like it used to be.

We are not certain what this is. There have been lots of recent announcements coming out of the Hearthstone Team, namely the upcoming Card Nerfs, Year of the Mammoth, and Arena Changes, so maybe there's more coming or we'll start to hear about the new Dinosaur expansion.

Pure speculation of course about the expansion. Normally those announcements get a little more hyped up so it's more likely to be some sort of systems announcement or maybe Ben is just going to be talking about some other subject within the Hearthstoneverse. Whatever it is, we'll be covering it so stay tuned.
Click to expand...
Source: http://www.hearthpwn.com/news/2268-hearthstone-announcement-on-monday
 
H

Haines

Banned
Patch can't come soon enough.

I love and miss hearthstone but after hitting rank 1 in the meta I gave up bc it wasn't fun at all

Haven't played since
 
P

Pooya

Member
maybe start hall of fame on Monday along with the nerfs. That would change the meta...

Patch is probably coming out on Monday, last nerf patch came out on Monday too.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Show us your gaming setup: 2024 Edition
2 3 4
185
23K
SpearFist replied
52 Games. 1 Year. 2024. [BacklogBeat]
Social Community 2 3 4
167
8K
Dacvak replied
"I Need a New PC!" 2024. 240 Hz OLEDs, PCI-Gen5, Path Tracing & Ray Reconstruction.
4 5 6 7 8
399
17K
Rossco EZ replied
Graven |OT| A heretic priest killing hexed creatures
4
413
mansoor1980 replied
World of Warcraft 10.0 (Next Expansion) - Officialy To Be Revaled on April 19th and More
2
52
4K
March Climber replied
Top Bottom