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ARK: Survival Evolved XO-PS4 crossplay working internally; Sony won't allow it
- Thread starter Spider_Jerusalem
- Start date
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
If we're talking about opinions that the majority of the population have; I doubt your average PS4 owner would be concerned about "but Microsoft wouldn't do it", or "what's in it for Sony?", or "this is a smart business decision" when posing the idea of being able to cross play.
This should deserve a new thread imho, just to show outraged cross-play fans MS' hypocrisy and double standard.
I don't think the average PS4 owner gives a toss about this and until they do, or it starts impacting the bottom line in console sales Sony won't move on it.
Not really, because the first person you responded to didn't even mention "#4thplayers", or anything to that effect, simply that it hasn't impacted their sales. Hell, they were technically on your side of the argument.
The second person used the term, but added explicit context, in that arguing how its "good for Sony" as a defense is basically the definition of being an apologist. The term naturally causing a stir, because it has a negative conotation, but that is literally what some people in here and other threads on the subject are doing.
I didn't claim the person I was responding to was trying to change my mind, or was restricting my opinion in any way. I hadn't made a post in the thread before that one, so that obviously wasn't the case. I was pointing out the contradiction in saying "I'm not apologising for anybody" followed by why it doesn't matter and it's all fine because they don't care.
"but MS didn't allow it last gen"
"I don't have any troubles finding games on PS4"
"PS4+PC is the largest combo"
"It only affects <insert current crossplay count here> games"
These aren't simply people not caring, these are stated in defense of Sony blocking it. That's literally what being an apologist is, and in this case the posters never even explain how that's supposed to be a good thing for them. We understand the "other perspective" of the billion dollar company, but as has been stated many times before, it's not a very valuable perspective for a consumer If you're not opposed to crossplay, then there's very little reason to offer a defense for Sony... if you're happy with them for other reasons (such as games library) then that's great and all... but that's also completely irrelevant to the topic, and if you were arguing in good faith, such points (especially when you had to basically make up a theoretical post by me in order to shoehorn them in) goes a long way towards camouflaging that, and instead making you come across as defending Sony because it's Sony.
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
It was bad policy last generation, it's bad this generation.
If you are annoyed that MS didn't allow it then you should be equally annoyed that Sony aren't now - not "fine with it."
reptilescorpio
Member
DAMN
johancruijff
Banned
everybody lose with this stance
players, devs and platform owners
even fanboys
players, devs and platform owners
even fanboys
MatrixMan.EXE
Member
Okay, so while I think Sony's stance on this is incredibly frustrating, this is one of the most ridiculous things I've read all year, and partly why I feel so many other comments in these "Sony won't allow crossplay on ___" the height of naivety.
What you're saying is that it's anti-consumer for Sony to try and "force" people to buy their console instead of buying their competitor's console. Regardless of what you think you're saying, that's what you're saying. Your logic entails that anything a platform holder does that doesn't benefit everyone, including people that don't own their platform, is anti-consumer. Again, my view is that Sony is being way too protectionist and conservative here, but them not allowing this cool feature in some games, emphasis on some because there are still cross play games on PS4, is not anti-consumer in the way you think it is.
I mean as much has I would like crossplay this is extremely hyperbolic/not the best analogy with the way things work for the most part atm.
In the first place you can't communicate with other platforms, plus in most cases you wouldn't be able to because of the extra work/maintenance/cost needed by devs. Cross platform parties are a separate issue(Second quote in link) to crossplay which is limited to increased player pool without any interaction unless enabled by lobby system like Rocket League's.
Don't know about that one iirc we had someone saying along the lines of not wanting to interact with Xbox because of people like crapgamer and the like whilst forgetting these same behaviour and mentality exist on pretty much any platform connected to the internet.
reptilescorpio
Member
Pretty sure it was stated previously to be related to accessing MS servers but Sony have done a poor job making a statement on the issue.
DongBeetle
Banned
Nope, it certainly is anti consumer. Every game you purchase that is crossplay with all consoles and PC is objectively inferior on PS4 automatically. When it comes down to it, I don't give that much of a shit about a multimillion dollar corporation squeezing as much money out as possible if it is affecting its users in a negative way. Just because it's good for lining Sony executives' pockets doesn't mean it's good for you
Judging from this thread, it appears like they believe they are "winning" something.
DongBeetle
Banned
Maybe Sony will notice them
How does it affect its users negatively if the player count is still more than good enough to play your MP games? Or to be more precise: How does it effect me negatively, when I don't have any problems to find matches in Rocket League or whatever?
It's a non-issue for me and I'm pretty sure that at least 90% of PS4 owners think alike. And the other 10% is bothered in some way but still supports Sony with buying their consoles and games.
So why should Sony care if their consumers don't care and how does it make it anti-consumer, if they don't care?
It's a non-issue for me and I'm pretty sure that at least 90% of PS4 owners think alike. And the other 10% is bothered in some way but still supports Sony with buying their consoles and games.
So why should Sony care if their consumers don't care and how does it make it anti-consumer, if they don't care?
The privilege of not playing with PC or Xbox scum.
DongBeetle
Banned
Like I've been saying, those multiplayer games are objectively worse on PS4 now. Sony is now making it so their system is getting the worst version of each of these games
Devs want it. You and a shit load of people keep talking about PS4's player population and yet devs are still speaking out that they would like crossplay to happen.
Because it benefits the devs more than you. Benefits the devs more than the corporations. Because it's the devs that are making these games. Especially the smaller developers.
But yeah. You and Sony gets yours. Non-issue here.
Jarod McChicken
Member
Anti-consumer is a really strong assertion for a secondary feature like this. At this point, every decision you don't like is anti-consumer. Not having EA Access is anti-consumer. PS Now is anti-consumer. No PSN ID change is anti-consumer. No refunds is anti-consumer. No gifting is anti-consumer. The DualShock Lightbar is anti-consumer. No BC is anti-consumer. Meet Sony, the most successfull anti-consumer company in the world. ¯\_(ツ
_/¯
For my part, I dont play online so much, but my anti-consumer PS4 allows me to meet PC players for some years now on Street Fighter V and Final Fantasy XIV. Assuming those games existed on Xbox One, would it be nice if I could also play with them ? Sure, why not, there are never too much people online, it can't hurt. But on the other hand, not having them won't make me feel I'm playing any kind of inferior version unless the game in question is deserted. Still I hope it's happening one day for the devs who want it.
_/¯For my part, I dont play online so much, but my anti-consumer PS4 allows me to meet PC players for some years now on Street Fighter V and Final Fantasy XIV. Assuming those games existed on Xbox One, would it be nice if I could also play with them ? Sure, why not, there are never too much people online, it can't hurt. But on the other hand, not having them won't make me feel I'm playing any kind of inferior version unless the game in question is deserted. Still I hope it's happening one day for the devs who want it.
I quoted another statement.
Devs care and should care; that's understandable. Who wouldn't want a higher player count? This would ensure a higher lifetime for their MP games.
Well, probably not much longer, but still. I get that argument.
Then the devs need to provide Sony with something of value to make it worth Sony's while. This is not Sonys problem, it's the developers problem. Sony should not do anything they think isn't in their systems or bottom lines best interest. Does it suck for a minority of gamers and developers? Sure but that's not Sonys problem.
There are some possibilities to be had when it comes to connecting a game between the big three consoles, PC, and mobile. I tend to think beyond what crossplay can do for me as an individual and wonder what developers could do with it. Especially small, unknown indie devs.
But its our problem and thats what this whole thing should be about for us. Imo the devs should be implement crossplay for all plattforms and exclude the ones who have problems with it. If sony says no they dont get to crossplay with pc and if ms says no (like in fortnite) they dont get to play with others. All or nothing. Some day there will be enough examples that it really hurts the reputation and then they have to play ball.
This is news to me, link?
Sony is willingly making their console and games worse than they could be to keep an advantage against their competitor. Obviously this hurts Xbox and their players more, but in general this is bad for everyone (albeit a very small thing for most).
I do not understand what Sony are scared of. They have the best games coming up, the most players and the most positive public image. Why are they acting like a someone afraid of losing what they have and not like a company trying to gain what they doesn't have?
I do not understand what Sony are scared of. They have the best games coming up, the most players and the most positive public image. Why are they acting like a someone afraid of losing what they have and not like a company trying to gain what they doesn't have?
This whole thing is a mess. In a perfect world, it doesn't matter what platform you choose to play on. Everybody could just play online with each other, with no restrictions. We're the only ones being hurt by this.
Cross play will continue on being a trend as more games become and/or have services across all platforms they are on. Blocking crossplay will make updates harder for developers. They'll have to focus on how their game plays on cross play versions AND non-cross play versions instead of just the former.
People who buy the non cross play version of a game may end up getting updates/features at a slower rate because of it.
Hm. Sounds vague. Devs say that MS said no to crossplay, but it also sounds like they didn't get permission from MS first and got found out.
There's absolutely no benefit to Sony except for a small number of consumers being annoyed and certain developers being irritated to a certain extent.
Sony have nothing to gain from this except for telling Xbox1 owners that you can safely by the game on a rivals platform and have the benefit of the market leaders player base. That's not a winning thing for Sony.
Caayn
Member
Maybe that's how Sony-senpai will notice them.
Right I forgot that as gamers we have to be on the side of our fav company, tell me please what exactly has ms from letting ps users join the minecraft better together update ?
Yeah, why did this not get a thread?
fabricated backlash
Member
Just a new poster shilling for his corporation
wapplew
Member
We don't need to turn this issue into a console war, doesn't help the cause.
DongBeetle
Banned
Then why are you so passionate in your defense of Sony? You guys say you don't care but you're commenting yet you also say you WANT it to happen but you refuse to be critical of Sony under any circumstances?
Colbert
Banned
While I would like to play with PS4 owners I also think that Sony will not change their stance until PS4 owners will articulate their demand for such a thing.
It is not sufficient that developers put the ball into Sony's yard but gamers in the Playstation ecosystem need to do the same thing.
But I have my doubts that this will happen.
It is not sufficient that developers put the ball into Sony's yard but gamers in the Playstation ecosystem need to do the same thing.
But I have my doubts that this will happen.
Wasn't that statement then removed to not say it was because of Microsoft? Probably a mistake if that's the case. It wouldn't make any sense really, how does the cross play party work in Fortnite that would lead to it being removed?
Jarod McChicken
Member
That's your interpretation. Like I said before, Sony did not gave a valid explanation for their stance, that's their wrongdoing and I encourage journalists to push on that question, if possible by asking someone else than Jim Ryan. And while waiting for that, I wont stop thinking that the matter is overblown and that a lof of people are complaining for the sake of trolling, just being happy to shipost their sarcastic 4ThePlayers and such when they have the opportunity, even when they don't actually care.
MatrixMan.EXE
Member
I'd love to know where I said that it was good for me or anyone else for that matter? My point is, what you said about "forcing people to buy a PS4 instead of sticking with the console they already own" being anti-consumer is inherently ridiculous. Your logic suggests that everything a company does to stop to keep it's consumers locked in is anti-consumer.
I'm not agreeing with what Sony is doing, but I'm also not agreeing with some of the nonsense spewed by people both sides of this argument either.
Anti-consumer is a really strong assertion for a secondary feature like this. At this point, every decision you don't like is anti-consumer. Not having EA Access is anti-consumer. PS Now is anti-consumer. No PSN ID change is anti-consumer. No refunds is anti-consumer. No gifting is anti-consumer. The DualShock Lightbar is anti-consumer. No BC is anti-consumer. Meet Sony, the most successfull anti-consumer company in the world. ¯\_(ツ
This is exactly my point. People in this thread throwing words around like anti-consumer without actually knowing what they mean. It's a hell of a stupid stance on Sony's part. Anti-consumer though? Not really. You could maybe make the case for this in Minecraft because it's having a literal negative impact on owners of Minecraft for PS4, but in these other speculative cases of cross-play, not really.
I mean ARK's performance is fucking embarrassing but let's not try and change the subject here.
DongBeetle
Banned
The anti consumer part comes from the fact that objectively EVERY crossplay multiplat to come out on PS4 will be objectively inferior to the other console versions
The more it is spoke about the more likely Sony comes out and says something about it.