Big-E said:Not worth getting banned for these idiots. If you can't see how giving money to the people who made this game gives money to Card and why people would have problems with this I feel sorry for you because you are disconnected from reality. And to the people saying don't buy his books, what about the poor copy editor or print manufacturer who physically make the books? What about them, they deserve to make a living too for their work? Chair knew who this guy was and what they were getting into and for the record, I already said I bought the game before I knew he was involved.
divisionbyzorro said:Should we boycott Shadow Complex?
You're asking the wrong question. If you cannot, in good conscience, give money to Epic/Chair/OSC, then don't. If you want to raise awareness that OSC contributed to this game, then do. But it's not something that this community as a whole should feel obligated to either do or not do.
I must admit that I know next to nothing about Card personally, other than he is Mormon and campaigned for the prohibition of gay marriage (which, in this country, he does have the right to do). But even if he is as hateful as he appears to be from this thread, I still am glad that I bought this game, and I'm enjoying it very much. And honestly I somewhat resent the implication that I am a bad person for doing so.
By all means - follow your conscience, but don't suggest that I should follow yours too.
My god, I can't believe you're being serious. Are you really that blind? Good work is good work. Card does good work. Chair was making a game they hoped would be good. They looked for somebody who does good work to help with their future good game. It's that simple. I really doubt they give a shit what his opinion of gay people is. This is business. Not a fucking tea party. You don't just invite your friends over, you take the best.Big-E said:Not worth getting banned for these idiots. If you can't see how giving money to the people who made this game gives money to Card and why people would have problems with this I feel sorry for you because you are disconnected from reality. And to the people saying don't buy his books, what about the poor copy editor or print manufacturer who physically make the books? What about them, they deserve to make a living too for their work? Chair knew who this guy was and what they were getting into and for the record, I already said I bought the game before I knew he was involved.
kodt said:Where does it end? How much research do you have to do about each company before you do business with them? Is it simply a matter of "Well I heard bad things about this company so I won't support them, but if I haven't heard anything bad then I'll go ahead and support them". Isn't that a very irresponsible view to take? Is it morally wrong to support a company if you don't know the bad causes they support? Or is it only morally wrong if you do know? Because the outcomes are exactly the same.
NinjaFusion said:i would just like to add this.... i have just been reading about his campaign.... it was an organised and systematic lobby to to away the rights of people.
after this i will not send these game out to create potentially a new fan that he could profit from
Mooreberg said:I did the same thing after Mark Rein would not stop making derogatory remarks about the Wii.
Costanza said:15 minutes later and I still can't believe you did this
PhoenixDark said:If it's a good game, and you like it, buy it. If it's a sucky game and you don't like it, don't buy it. Simple
His beliefs have nothing to do with the content of the product. Besides this is a slippery slope considering how much of your consumer dollars finance shit you don't support
But so is blaming the consumer.TheChillyAcademic said:And how realistic is that? Do you really think that is going to happen? Don't be ridiculous, Card is a moron, but he isn't an idiot. He will not remove any beneficiary title he has while he still has the ability to make money.
Is it fair?
Of course not.
Google said:You're disconnected from reality, if you don't believe there are millions of people out there, making you games, cooking your lunch, and being your friends who probably feel exactly the same way as Card and his cronies.
It's simply a matter of Card publishing his fucked up opinions, and those who sit next to you in Starbucks keeping quiet.
Google said:You're disconnected from reality, if you don't believe there are millions of people out there, making you games, cooking your lunch, and being your friends who probably feel exactly the same way as Card and his cronies.
It's simply a matter of Card publishing his fucked up opinions, and those who sit next to you in Starbucks keeping quiet.
divisionbyzorro said:By all means - follow your conscience, but don't suggest that I should follow yours too.
:lolBKXB said:Wait, Ender wasn't gay?
sn00zer said:I find it very funny that the left is known for huge free speech support yet this seems like the digital equivalent of a book burning.
Big-E said:Not worth getting banned for these idiots. If you can't see how giving money to the people who made this game gives money to Card and why people would have problems with this I feel sorry for you because you are disconnected from reality. And to the people saying don't buy his books, what about the poor copy editor or print manufacturer who physically make the books? What about them, they deserve to make a living too for their work? Chair knew who this guy was and what they were getting into and for the record, I already said I bought the game before I knew he was involved.
Yeah, because not buying something is the same as book burning :lolsn00zer said:I find it very funny that the left is known for huge free speech support yet this seems like the digital equivalent of a book burning.
Indeed, and it reminds me of a thread recently hosted on this forum, and another in OT.Askani said:We have to...if we don't we're homophobes. It's the transitive property of homophobia.
sn00zer said:I find it very funny that the left is known for huge free speech support yet this seems like the digital equivalent of a book burning.
sn00zer said:I find it very funny that the left is known for huge free speech support yet this seems like the digital equivalent of a book burning.
Zyzyxxz said:wow I'm pretty disappointed that Epic would choose to use his material...
Maybe they didnt know? Truth is I am a fervent supporter of gay rights but I really want the game too.
To be honest I'm probably going to end up buying the game anyway but I'll do everything I can to support the coming election in California by making sure my vote counts!
It's his right to share his opinion. No matter how much you, I, or anyone else think it's wrong.Big-E said:And you are one of the countless idiots in this thread that don't understand the fundamental difference. Those assholes at Starbucks are probably not privately funding multi million dollar campaigns to strip rights from people but please, continue to bring this up because I like all the douchebags being exposed this way.
Divvy said:How is this this like a book burning at all. No one is saying this game shouldn`t exist. Consumers are just expressing their freedom to buy or not buy the game.
NinjaFusion said:i would just like to add this.... i have just been reading about his campaign.... it was an organised and systematic lobby to to away the rights of people.
after this i will not send these game out to create potentially a new fan that he could profit from
http://i29.tinypic.com/15dbcdy.jpg[IMG][/QUOTE]
You should deface the box to get your point across more strongly. Draw some dicks in Marcus's mouth, or smear some cat food on it, and post the pics.
Big-E said:Not worth getting banned for these idiots. If you can't see how giving money to the people who made this game gives money to Card and why people would have problems with this I feel sorry for you because you are disconnected from reality. And to the people saying don't buy his books, what about the poor copy editor or print manufacturer who physically make the books? What about them, they deserve to make a living too for their work? Chair knew who this guy was and what they were getting into and for the record, I already said I bought the game before I knew he was involved.
Gary Witta -> Book of Eli -> Warner Bros -> Empire -> Card
is not the same as
Shadow Complex -> Chair=Card
Card is directly profiting from this game. Card is not directly profiting from me seeing the Book of Eli.
NinjaFusion said:i would just like to add this.... i have just been reading about his campaign.... it was an organised and systematic lobby to to away the rights of people.
after this i will not send these game out to create potentially a new fan that he could profit from
Smash88 said:I understand where this money might be going. And I respect your opinion and stance. If you look at it that way, and as others have said previously, how many anti-semite, anti-homophobe, etc... should we boycott then? I'm sure there is one in almost every company.
hampig said:It's his right to share his opinion. No matter how much you, I, or anyone else think it's wrong.
So, respect to everyone? Or are not giving respect to those that disagree with boycotting? What the hell do you mean, exactly?freddy said:Respect for those standing up for what they believe in.
Would you compare this particular reaction to say Resident Evil 5?GreekWolf said:Oh, this thread is comedy gold. :lol
I have to wonder how many of these 'suddenly concerned' activists, who have chosen to exercise their progressive, free-thinking ideals by not supporting an ambiguously (at best) connected Card project, will still be first in line to purchase the new Final Fantasy game, despite Square's well documented history of racism?
That would be quite an interesting poll indeed!
/clapAmir0x said:Stuff.
Thus is the nature of our dark world.
mavs said:You should deface the box to get your point across more strongly. Draw some dicks in Marcus's mouth, or smear some cat food on it, and post the pics.
You know what, you're right. Boycott the game, save gay rights! That will show him. :lolBig-E said:Again you are not getting it. No one gives a flying fuck whether OSC is a homophobe or an anti-semite or hates black people. No one cares. What people care about is that this man is on the forefront of an anti gay movement in the united states and funds campaigns with his own money to ensure that gay rights never see the light of day or get squashed before surfacing. Do you understand the difference? I think it's pretty clear but it seems to be something completely foreign to others.
That's wonderful but guess what? It doesn't stop him from being a gigantic hateful douche who should be immune to a boycott. I have been through a lot of threads on GAF but I think this one is making me the most angry and I ain't even homosexual.
woodypop said:But so is blaming the consumer.
As has been pointed out many, many times already in this thread, there is a big difference between holding a particular view and using one's power, money and influence to push an agenda that strips rights from other people.Amir0x said:Do you realize how many amazing works of art, literature and cinema have been made that you've loved, that have probably been written by homophobes, racists and pedophiles?
If you're going to stop playing games because they are associated with someone who is this, you better stop doing a lot of things.
The slippery slope goes far.
For example. You should never, ever read anything by Lovecraft. And you probably should ditch the classic works by Aldous Huxley.
If the only issue is you have trouble contributing -any- money to -any- homophone currently alive, then the problem is you've probably done it HUNDREDS of times and you just didn't know it. But these games are a collection of their parts. No one person represents the product in this case. Nobody anywhere is endorsing homophobia through this product.
In essence, it comes to this:
we have to accept in our gray world, where things often don't have perfect conclusions or morally "right" endings, that people who are racist and homophobic and who like to molest kids... they sometimes make great things.
They sometimes make amazing, wonderful things.
And that extends to games as well. You should do what you feel is right as it's your money, but you should also acknowledge that you are not going to hurt Orson Scott Card or send him any message he will understand. He is already highly successful, and has made good works of art. He is also a homophobe.
Thus is the nature of our dark world.