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DF on Zelda Switch: Docked has major frame drops, portable doesn't (no score talk)

P

pswii60

Member
Why can't fhey just output at 720p in docked mode if it isn't powerful enough for 900p? Or at least give the option.
 
J

jj984jj

He's a pretty swell guy in my books anyway.
I never would've thought playing BotW at 720p HD portably would've been the best way to experience it, but there it is.

It's pretty weird that the system boost in docked mode can't handle the exact same game in 900p though.
 
C

ckaneo

Member
RoadHazard said:
Except the GPU clock increase in docked mode theoretically means it should be able to up the resolution while keeping the same level of performance. For some godforsaken reason that's not happening. Memory bandwidth seems the most likely culprit, which means this console (handheld) is gonna be shit for resolutions over 720p.
Click to expand...
No, because Nintendo never stated that the clock speeds were absolute. I'm pretty sure we just hearmd another report that you can set the portable clockspeed to docked levels.

In anycase it honestly makes more sense for the resolution increase to hurt the framerate. Once Nintendo stated there was no power in the dock this should have been the more rational conclusion had we not got rumors....
 
M

Matt

Member
ckaneo said:
I blame digital foundry for making people think the docked mode would run better when it was stating that there is no power in the dock.

Resolution increase means worse framerate everytime. And yes, I'm well aware about the clock speed and scaling rumors that were proven to be not entirely true.
Click to expand...
It does (or more specifically can) run at different clocks.

And this does seem like a v-sync issue.
 
R

Raysoul

Member
I heard from a friend that changing the Switch' output mode to 720p increases the performance on docked. Can somebody also test it?
 
S

Stronghammer22

Member
I have been playing for about 10 hours and only seen 5 dips or so. Obviously it would be better if it maintained a solid framerate, but it honestly hasn't affected my enjoyment of the game.
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Handheld sounds like the way to go:

Eurogamer said:
Beyond performance, there is very, very little to separate the visual experience. Yes, the game runs at a higher resolution when hooked up to your HDTV, but the presentation on the 720p 6.2-inch display looks beautiful, and while the pixels-per-inch metrics may not impress by smartphone standards, it's still enough to ensure that the complete lack of anti-aliasing isn't that much of an issue, especially as the game renders at the screen's native resolution. Zelda looks crisp and precise in handheld form, while the blown-up image on your flatscreen serves to emphasise the less impressive aspects of the game's image quality.

However, playing while docked highlights one visual improvement: texture filtering still isn't great, but it's clearly improved over the handheld version, resolving more ground detail in particular further away from the player. Will you actually notice outside of eyeballing screenshots? It's highly unlikely. Miniaturising the action onto the 6.2-inch screen makes the difference virtually indistinguishable, and the improvement - such as it is - manifests as a 'band' of additional texture detail just ahead of the Link character.

Otherwise, the experience is identical. Nintendo could have made minor tweaks to engine settings in order to accommodate the handheld mode's slower GPU clocks, but as it turns out, that's not required. The lighting is unchanged, level of detail transitions and pop-in (such as it is) are like-for-like and shadow quality is a match. Overall, expectations of Switch performance here are reversed when looking at final code - going in, we'd expect downgrades in the mobile execution of the game owing to reduced GPU power, but it's actually in handheld form where we find the smoothest experience.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/d...e-legend-of-zelda-breath-of-the-wild-face-off
Click to expand...
 
E

Equanimity

Member
ckaneo said:
I blame digital foundry for making people think the docked mode would run better when it was stating that there is no power in the dock.

Resolution increase means worse framerate everytime. And yes, I'm well aware about the clock speed and scaling rumors that were proven to be not entirely true.
Click to expand...

You do that. I hold Nintendo accountable for Zelda's shoddy performance in docked mode, I hope they're able to patch it soon.

That said, it's not a huge deal for me, I'm going to play it in portable mode.
 
H

Huge Succeeded

Banned
ironcreed said:
If this was not Zelda it would have been hammered.
Click to expand...

yeah it can't be highly rated because it's a solid game
after all there's never been a highly rated game that had performance issues that people were willing to overlook


seriously, shit's a gamefaqs console wars level sentiment. y'all can keep trotting it out as long as you like looking stupid
 
S

shadow2810

Member
Zelda on OLED TV vs portable with less frame drops... I think I will still go with docked mode.

And lol at all those salty comments.
 
C

Coketruck

Member
For whatever reason, I've never been able to notice frame rate drops unless a game goes into single digit slideshow mode. The drop from 30 fps to 20 fps never even registered for me. Not to say that it's not an issue that needs correcting, of course.
 
P

Painguy

Member
Basically a bandwidth issue. I wonder if they are using a higher gpu clock mode with lower bandwidth mode. Either way its obviously a wii u port so not surprised

Its like when NSMBU was 720p only.
 
T

Truant

Member
KojiKnight said:
Ideally they'd use adaptive vsync, but even triple buffering would be pretty easy to enable and wouldn't likely add enough lag you be a problem.
Click to expand...

I thought tripple buffering was pretty much an industry standard, and I don't see people complaining about lag for most stable 30/60 titles.
 
S

Soi-Fong

Member
hardcastlemccormick said:
It did affect the scores though, many reviews mentioned the performance issues and highlighted them as the major significant issue the game has.

I don't really get why folks are so hung up on the review score anyway. It's a throwaway number. Read the text, it's where the game is actually reviewed and quantified.
Click to expand...

Is it really a throwaway number when Nintendo has started to list all those "10/10?" It's not a throwaway number. That number matters otherwise you wouldn't see Nintendo pimping it out on their Twitter and such.
 
SRTtoZ

SRTtoZ

Member
pswii60 said:
Why can't fhey just output at 720p in docked mode if it isn't powerful enough for 900p? Or at least give the option.
Click to expand...

I'm sure they can but it wouldn't be a good look if their brand new 2017 console played the game at the same settings as their last gen Bomba console.
 
J

JBourne

maybe tomorrow it rains
Yeah, the framerate issues were immediately apparent when I watched the GB quick look last night. I wouldn't be able to tolerate that.
 
C

captmcblack

Member
Ehh, I'm sure it'll be patched - and if it's not, it'll be like all the other console games this gen on all the other machines with framerate/performance compromises.

I'll deal. It would be nice if they fix it, but I'll still play the game if they don't.
 
I

ironcreed

Banned
NotLiquid said:
Unless you want to change the narrative to "if this wasn't -popular franchise- it would have been hammered".
Click to expand...

That is essentially what I am saying. And I am sure the game itself is fantastic, but issues like this were obviously overlooked, else it would not be sitting at 98. The proof is in the pudding.
 
J

Jarmel

Banned
jett said:
Double-buffered vsync.

Br00TCn.gif


Means if the game drops a single frame, it will actually drop all the way to 20fps no matter what.

And I have no idea why only docked mode gets the framedrops. It doesn't seem to be GPU related since the framedrops are almost random in their occurrence.
Click to expand...

Pretty much guarantees the Wii U version is fucked. So seems like the Switch docked and Wii U versions are going to be chop city and the best way to play is the Switch portable.

Switch confirmed for a portable console after all.
 
H

hardcastlemccormick

Banned
ironcreed said:
Common sense is all one requires to see it. Other games have the screws put to them over such issues, but Zelda is a darling and you cannot convince me otherwise.
Click to expand...

I mean, this performance is comparable to basically every Xbox 360 game on the market, including many exclusives. Have you gone back and played a Gears of War game on the original hardware? Or Halo Reach? They're smooth where it matters, but generally those games are pretty uneven.

I don't recall anyone making a big fuss about the performance of those games in any reviews. But then I can't remember the last time a game's technical performance made a difference to the critical reception, aside from maybe Assassin's Creed Unity?

Soi-Fong said:
Is it really a throwaway number when Nintendo has started to list all those "10/10?" It's not a throwaway number. That number matters otherwise you wouldn't see Nintendo pimping it out on their Twitter and such.
Click to expand...

Wow, marketing talks about stuff that doesn't matter? Call me converted! Not.
 
M

Marmelade

Member
Docked performance is straight up bizarre.
As they said you could run through one area at 30fps just fine and then do the exact same thing and get 20fps, that doesn't make sense
 
B

bomblord1

Banned
They couldn't figure out a reason why and mentioned its not entirely that frequent and seemingly random.

I guess that's worth noting the game is not running at 20fps a majority of the time.
 
T

The Xtortionist

Member
RoadHazard said:
Except the GPU clock increase in docked mode theoretically means it should be able to up the resolution while keeping the same level of performance. For some godforsaken reason that's not happening. Memory bandwidth seems the most likely culprit, which means this console (handheld) is gonna be shit for resolutions over 720p.
Click to expand...

Mario Kart 8 for Switch runs at 1080/60 docked and 720/60 undocked. Wonder if Zelda has some specific issue that's hampering performance.
 
P

phanphare

Banned
PackAPunchedMick said:
Lol. I stand corrected, but it certainly doesn't help the case of "it's ok, because Zelda". :p

Looks like a quick port job, this certainly won't be the norm going forward.
Click to expand...

well the "it's ok because Zelda" argument is pretty dumb

so yeah

ironcreed said:
That is essentially what I am saying. And I am sure the game itself is fantastic, but issues like this were obviously overlooked, else it would not be sitting at 98. The proof is in the pudding.
Click to expand...

literally every review I read or watched mentioned the framerate issues so clearly those issues weren't overlooked. it's just an amazing game.

keep pushing those alternative facts tho
 
P

Pie and Beans

Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
Trying to sell this thing as a home console was a huge mistake. Messaging is important from the start and Nintendo chose to forgo "HOLY SHIT THIS THING IS THE MOST POWERFUL PORTABLE EVER!" headlines in favour of "It's the worst home console on the market".
 
Dsyndrome

Dsyndrome

Member
Hope this gets fixed quickly, I don't plan on playing this in portable mode the majority of the time. Odd that there's no real reason for the drops.
 
R

Ridley327

Member
I guess the Zelda team spent most of their time optimizing portable mode. It's weird to see this kind of disparity when compared to Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, which is not only a big resolution upgrade in docked mode from the Wii U version, but they also eliminated the frame pacing issue to go along with it. Different scales between Zelda and MK8, sure, but still.
 
H

Huge Succeeded

Banned
Why did GTA get such rave reviews on PS3 and 360?

OH IT MUST BE BECAUSE IT'S GTA

and literally no other reason! It got high ratings SOLELY because it's called GTA. If it was called Violent Carjackers, nobody would have given it a second look. It'd be 88 on metacritic right now.
After all, look at those performance issues!


morons.
 
RoadHazard

RoadHazard

Gold Member
ckaneo said:
No, because Nintendo never stated that the clock speeds were absolute. I'm pretty sure we just hearmd another report that you can set the portable clockspeed to docked levels.
Click to expand...

No, that was about bumping the handheld clocks by 25% or something, not all the way up to docked clocks.

Nirolak said:
Handheld sounds like the way to go:
Click to expand...

Which is not acceptable. This is a game most people will want to play on the TV, not on a tiny handheld display. Nintendo is selling this as a home console (even though we all know that's BS), and it should never be allowed to perform worse in that mode.
 
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