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A Tale of Men and Gods and ...Ninjas? Devil Summoner Raidou (2) review

Bebpo

Banned
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Background
========================================================
Once upon a time there was this guy named Kazuma Kaneko. He drew some pictures like this:
char05.jpg

illust01.jpg


and later some pictures like this:
char09.jpg

illust07.jpg


Eventually after many years of working with Research & Development 1 at Atlus, he decided to try his hand at directing a game. This game was:
box-l.jpg


It was an attempt at taking the Shin Megami Tensei style aka. Megaten and transforming it into a mainstream friendly light-hearted action rpg. It also attempted to be an adventure game. It worked ok at both, but not great at either. The action was too simple, the adventure was a little slow paced.

Now a few years later Kaneko tried again with:
51gvuKUPjtL._SS400_.jpg

Raidou vs. Abaddon (more info on Abaddon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abaddon)

This time the game was exactly what Kaneko wanted: A mainstream action rpg that mixed great action with exciting adventuring all while being heavily seeped in the lore of Megaten.


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The Review
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The Megaten franchise has changed a lot this generation. Back in the day SMT was about gods and devils and following your own path whether it be LAW, NEUTRAL, or CHAOS, and encountering the consequences of your actions. During the PS2 generation though, the games have generally strayed away a bit. SMTIII Nocturne was still philosophical and allowed players to go down the 3 paths and end up at multiple endings...but the difference between the paths wasn't a major system in Nocturne. Digital Devil Saga had some interesting ideas, but was not this type of game. P3/P4 were completely different styles of stories, and Raidou 1 was just a lot of fun. This isn't to say they were bad games, no this has been a generation of amazing R&D1 titles. It's just that they've strayed away from what Megaten was built on.

Raidou 2 changes that. Raidou 2 is the closest Megaten game this generation to SMT1/2. It's all about a world with not only demons living their lives around you, but Gods and Devils and higher beings beyond even perception. It's about LAW,NEUTRAL, and CHAOS. It's about Lucifer, it's about questioning morals, and life itself. It's a well-written tale that makes you think like no other rpg this generation outside of SMT3 Nocturne.

Raidou 2's story is an interesting tale. A story that starts with a search for a missing man becomes a multi-layered plot concerning not only the individuals at hand, but larger powers as well. The cast, though small, is nicely developed and well-written. The game's primary antagonist Dan may go down as the next well known videogame character if enough people play the game. He's easily one of the best written characters in any game to date. He's very complex, likable, and has a nice character design as well :p

Fans of the Megaten franchise will be pleased to know that Lucifer is handled EXTREMELY well in this game (and no that is not a spoiler. If you can't figure out that the person you meet who has the BLOND HAIR and is named LOUIE is Lucifer, this might not be the franchise for you). Unlike Nocturne where he was handled alright, but maybe not the most satisfyingly (though I played the original SMT3, so I'm not sure how better developed he was in the expanded Maniacs that the US got), in Raidou 2 he is handled with the respect and allure that he deserves. I was 100% satisfied with his role in the story here.

When it comes to philosophical questions/choices if you thought that Nocturne or DDS had a bunch, you haven't seen anything yet. Raidou 2 is FILLED with player answers at every turn. Sometimes the questions will be minor things, sometimes you will have to make HARD decisions where there is no black and white answer. Unlike a lot of jrpgs, these questions actually mean something here. Depending whether you are LAW, NEUTRAL, or CHAOS sections of the game will change. You will encounter different bosses, have different conversations with people, gain different demons, and ultimately reach different conclusions. It's also great how the game actually cares about what you say. I was shocked 20 hours later to have a conversation with someone who brought up a response I said to them at the start of the game. Sure it's easy programming to just tell the game to insert (X) into the _____ in the sentence with X being your answer saved from far earlier. But it has a strong affect on the player to actually feel like what they choose matters.

The dialogue choices actually mattering goes a long way towards pulling the player into the game and making them really ROLE-PLAY, something you hardly see in jrpgs. Raidou 2's plot does sooooooooo much to bring the player into the game that I would say this is the most true role playing I've had in a jrpg during the PS2 generation.

What also pulls players into the game besides the fact that the story is good and the player is constantly making choices that matter, is the pacing of the story. Raidou 1 was a bit slow paced. You'd walk around the streets and talk to schoolgirls and investigate old houses, etc... etc... for a while. Raidou 2 ditches that. Once you get out of the really terrible and long tutorial intro, the main story starts and never stops until you are done. Outside half of chapter 6 which is a bit fillerish (boo R&D1), Raidou 2 is really an edge of your seat adventure on a grand scale of gods and men and ninja. It even expands the worldview of the Raidou universe with one of the other 3 Kuzunoha houses being a major part of the story.

Also fwiw, if you know the visual novels/anime Higurashi no Naku Koro ni, Raidou 2 is inspired a decent bit from it I would say.

So all that talk about the story, but what about the shallow battle system of the first?
1) It's deeper this time around. You have Devil May Cry 3 style movement of dodges and blocks to avoid enemies, different types of weapons with different combos, 2 demons usable at the same time, and most importantly full control over your demons like a turn baseed game. Oh and you have the ability to pull your demons next to you and make them invisible/invincible by holding L2. This means for the defensive side of playing when a boss throws out an attack you can hold L2 and then just concentrate on dodging DMC style with Raidou. Then on the attack you can just do it turn-based style with assigning commands (you can set a command to repeat infinitely as well). You hit the enemy weakness which stuns them and then you slash them and green MP balls come out and refill your MP. Repeat for battles.
2) It's still easy. I mean if you are terrible at gaming it could be hard, but if you're smart enough to use the right elements against the right weaknesses and hold L2 and dodge attacks, you're good for the whole game. Levels mean next to nothing, which is actually a huge plus because it means you can skip random battles (with a lower encounter item) and blow through areas whenever you don't feel like fighting. The fights are ALWAYS fun, which is important to note. The battle system is really enjoyable and boss fights are neat like action game bosses. BUT it is very easy and non-stressful outside a couple of bosses, so the hardcore players will still grief about it.

The fun of the gameplay is making demons, negotiating with demons which is back from SMT1-3 and a lot of fun for acquiring demons and items (no more mashing O to acquire demons like Raidou 1), and running through perfectly solid dungeons while beating up enemies with your demon buddies. Making demons and making new weapons from items demons give you when you level them is addicting as it always is in Megaten games.

The encounter rate is a bit high, but rate-lowering items cut your encounters down to ZERO for a whole moon cycle, so that counters it.

Speaking of MOONS. Depending on your luck stat, when a new moon roles around you may get a warning that a RIDER is coming. This means your next encounter you will be pulled down to hell by one of the four horsemen and you can either give them luxury goods to satisfy their lust for your death and escape, or you can fight them. If you choose to fight them expect very difficult boss fights. But if you beat one you are safe for the rest of the chapter when new moons role around. This is also a part of the story and not just a gameplay element.

Speaking of LUCK. The story is about LUCK and non-surprisingly it means much of the gameplay is based around your LUCK stat. This is kind of cool as I've never played an rpg where I cared about my luck stat. But here I was pumping my stats into there and there is a gameplay system where you can catch luck bugs and up your luck stat unless you release them. Releasing them starts a slot wheel that has nice bonuses like 2x exp or all critical attacks. Meanwhile you can run into unlucky slot roles in the game which can do...bad things. This is all part of the plot though and is well integrated.

Finally I want to say that although the gameplay is very fun from start to finish, this is the worst R&D1 final boss. The boss pulls some cheap bs which really ticked me off last night when I was finishing it. The boss is very beatable on first try, but if you are unlucky the fight can go for a loooooooong time. It's just an annoying fight.

Other things:
-You have TONS of sidequests available. Most of these are like Persona 3 where there is a written request for an item and if you have it you can trade it for the reward. A dozen are real story sidequests where you go and do stuff.
-Game is about 35 hours without sidequests.
-There's a good amount of locations you get to visit.
-There is a hard mode called KING mode when you beat it and it has some major changes.
-The game is a direct sequel to the first PS2 Raidou, but the story is separate and you don't need to have played the first one. There are some goodies for those who've played the first game.

Graphics - Game is a low budget PS2 game and looks like it. That being said the art design is A++++++. Going back to a Kaneko game after the two years of Persona shows that even though you thought Persona had great art design, Kaneko's is still leagues better. Kaneko is one of the best game artists with an impressive imagination and it shows in Raidou 2. It's also cool that all the demons (like Raidou 1) have been retextured so unlike Persona 3/4 they aren't just copy & pastes from Nocturne/DDS. A lot of the demons look completely different and it's often a really neat take on them. It makes you look forward to battles in new areas so you can see what the old-but-new demons look like. Character designs are top notch. The new characters, Dan, Akane, Geirin, Nagi are on par with Kaneko's great Raidou, Narumi, Tae designs.

Sound - Pretty good. Honestly, it's not the most exciting Shoji Meguro soundtrack but it works. My main problem is that there just aren't a whole lot of tracks. Adding to that, a half dozen or so of the tracks are just reused from PS2 Raidou 1. There's some good music for sure, but I'd put it below the Persona 4 soundtrack which he just did recently.


Overall
Story: 9.5
- The best written Megaten this generation (or maybe tied with Nocturne; nocturne has that more epic basic tale of a few individuals whereas Raidou 2 has TONS of dialogue and very developed cast/story like a novel) and one of the most interesting rpg stories that covers human-sized drama and how the greater powers watch and interact as humans face them. -.5 for having a lot of Japanese style REPETITION lines. You see this in many Japanese games/anime where they say something like FIVE TIMES @_@. But the actual lines are excellent and story is.

Graphics: 8 - Great art direction, terrible tech. PLEASE COME TO THIS GENERATION R&D1.

Sound: 8 - Good, but not great soundtrack.

Gameplay: 8.5 - Excellent dialogue choices that make you feel like part of the story. Fun battle system. Addictive demon obtaining. But really easy.

Replay value: 8 - Path splits mean you'll need to play again or youtube for the other side. A handful of meaningful sidequests. Short but not too short quest at around 30-35 hours.

Overall: 9/10 - When talking up Raidou 2, Kazuma Kaneko said that Raidou 2 would feel like Raidou 3, as in a huge improvement from the first game. Well, he was right. While the first PS2 Raidou felt like an experiment to make Megaten work as an accesible action rpg, Raidou 2 is the real deal and a game that truly belongs in the upper echelon of quality that great Megaten titles are placed in. Hopefully we have not seen the end of Kuzunoha Raidou the 14th, as a Raidou 3 with even further improvements would be very welcome.

Though not perfect and definitely not challenging, the story elements and enjoyable gameplay of Raidou 2 made it the best rpg I've played this year. Even in a year where Persona 4 & Tales of Vesperia (both great) were released.
 
Very nice review...I didn't realize that we got so many dialogue choices in this game...I absolutely LOVED the first one, so I can't WAIT for this game to get its ass over here.
 

MechaX

Member
So old Louis Cypher returns?
And is handled ...pretty well?

In the Maniax version of Nocturne,
it pretty much boiled down to "Lucifer is right! ... We're not giving you YHWH's side of the story this time, since SMT II confirmed that he is a major douchebag
. If it handles things better than SMT II and SMT: Nocturne, then I'm actually very, very pleased. Moreover, I like how it seems like the alignments take the forefront once again, which is something that I've really missed from SMT games. Sure, Nocturne had Reasons, but they were either waaay too black-and-white for my tastes or were just damn right ridiculous. It has been since SMT I and II were alignment really mattered in a jRPG, and I'm happy to hear that Raidou 2 does the same.

After reading the rest of the review, I'm kinda relieved; Raidou 1 wasn't a bad game by any means, but rather a slight misstep along side of the more fantastic R&D1 games at the time (Nocturne, DDS1 & 2, and jRPGs from many other companies). But I'm wondering, exactly how are the detective elements handled in the game? Does Raidou still utilize different demons for different investigations, or does the story follow a more 'linear' story-focused approach?

Regardless, great, informative review. Seems like Atlus really did take most of the complaints about Raidou 1 to serious heart.
 
by "goodies" for those that've played the first game, do you mean like, being able to catch a story reference, or does it search your memory card for a save from the DS1?
 

Bebpo

Banned
kiruyama said:
by "goodies" for those that've played the first game, do you mean like, being able to catch a story reference, or does it search your memory card for a save from the DS1?

Gameplay goodies - If you load your save from the first one, when you run into any demon you had in the first one they'll recognize you and instantly join. No negotiation necessary. Which is almost like cheating since demons are jerks and negotiating is hard >_<


Story-wise - There are cameos/references ;P
 

Reilly

Member
Still pissed the soundtrack isn't available for retail. >:-(

I'm sure Atlus USA will ruin the box art with another red bar at the bottom once they announce they're brining it over.
 

Bebpo

Banned
Also I don't remember Raidou 1 that much, but I think you could get into battles anywhere like Nocturne? In Raidou 2 there aren't battles outside of dungeons.

MechaX said:
So old Louis Cypher returns?
And is handled ...pretty well?
Well, he's a young kid in this one. But it's Lucifer through and through and yeah, I think he's handled really well.

But I'm wondering, exactly how are the detective elements handled in the game? Does Raidou still utilize different demons for different investigations, or does the story follow a more 'linear' story-focused approach?

There's a lot less detective work in this one. You still have the 8? types of demons and they each have their own map ability useful at spots here and there. Ice guy freezes you so hot areas don't burn you, ice guy freezes lakes, electric guy lights up dark areas, strong guy breaks rocks in your way, etc... you know which demon you need when you have an obstacle in your way and you use them. You can still read minds, but it's not a major part. I think you do it once, maybe twice total for the story. They really seem to have cut most of the fat in the adventure part and you're basically just following the plot, running through dungeons, and answering questions. It's very linear but it makes for good pacing. I felt the first one dragged too much at the start.
 

Yaweee

Member
Reilly said:
Still pissed the soundtrack isn't available for retail. >:-(

I'm sure Atlus USA will ruin the box art with another red bar at the bottom once they announce they're brining it over.

Atlus' hands are tied. The orange-ish bar at the bottom is mandated by Sony. From what I've heard so far, the stand-out tracks are Talk and Everyday Detective Agency. I agree that it's a bit of a step down from P4's music, but, hey, pretty much everything is and will be.

The review makes the game sound awesome. It's nice to see them incorporating a lot of mechanics/features from the mainline SMT series.
 

Carmilla

Banned
*OHMYFUCKINGGODBBQWTF*

I have played every single Megaten game out there (main entries in the series and most spinoffs, save most of the nintendo titles) and ever since Nocturne I have been praying, ON MY FUCKING KNEES PRAYING, for a return to form...a return to SMT.

With this single review Bepo you have just made this title my most anticipated title of this and next year (Baring some miracle Kingdom Hearts PS3 announcement.)

WOW

*Fangasim*

There will be MUCH suffering in Gilder if this game is not released in the West.
 
Are you kidding? You never played Maniacs? One of the biggest additions by far to Maniacs is the scenes in which
Lucifer (indirectly) explains the significance of the events that are happening around you.
At the risk of having you review material you already know, you should check out this Let's Play and find the links to the various videos. The new Maniacs scenes start with this update and occur every several updates. And the new ending following this sidequest unlocks is pretty awesome in a fist-pumping sense.

Great to hear this game improves on the previous one, and that it focuses on the topic of demons interacting with humans. That was always the most interesting MT theme in my eyes. EDIT: also no battles outside of dungeons = sold

MechaX said:
In the Maniax version of Nocturne,
it pretty much boiled down to "Lucifer is right!"

Well, not so much that
he's right, but that he's in opposition to what we believe to be wrong. I think that, aside from the "this is how the story goes" mood of the True Demon ending, the judgment of whether Lucifer's desire to end the cycle of rebirth and force the universe to eventually end is a good idea is up to the player.
 

Reilly

Member
Yaweee said:
Atlus' hands are tied. The orange-ish bar at the bottom is mandated by Sony. From what I've heard so far, the stand-out tracks are Talk and Everyday Detective Agency. I agree that it's a bit of a step down from P4's music, but, hey, pretty much everything is and will be.

The review makes the game sound awesome. It's nice to see them incorporating a lot of mechanics/features from the mainline SMT series.


See, I think DS2's soundtrack is better than P4. P4's is boring.

And why would Sony mandate a bar at the bottom of the boxart? They've been releasing games for the last eight years with extra content inside and I've never seen or heard about this. The Japanese non-limited version has a soundtrack included and there's no bar on that, either.
 

Bebpo

Banned
Also I gotta say that Japanese buyers got screwed! Most people obviously went for the + version of the game that came with SMT3 "Chronicle Edition" because no one knew what was new in the edition and some people didn't own Maniacs because it's pricey rare in Japan. So everyone shells out $90 and it turns out it's just Maniacs with Dante replaced with Raidou.

MEANWHILE people who only payed $65ish for the regular version got the soundtrack and better cover art. I may have to double dip eventually and buy the standard version. Grrrr...
 

Carmilla

Banned
Bebpo said:
Also I gotta say that Japanese buyers got screwed! Most people obviously went for the + version of the game that came with SMT3 "Chronicle Edition" because no one knew what was new in the edition and some people didn't own Maniacs because it's pricey rare in Japan. So everyone shells out $90 and it turns out it's just Maniacs with Dante replaced with Raidou.

MEANWHILE people who only payed $65ish for the regular version got the soundtrack and better cover art. I may have to double dip eventually and buy the standard version. Grrrr...

It may seem trite, but is the dialog the same I wonder?
 
Devil Summoner: Raidou Kuzunoha has one of the most amazing box arts ever. The second one...not so much; it's pretty bad, actually. I do like that the guy with wings and the red sky represent the Japanese flag.
That's what I think of it, anyway.

Thanks for bolding :D That caught my eye--especially the one that says battles are always fun, as that's a huge plus.
 

Teknoman

Member
I've always wanted to play this sub series in the megaten universe but was discouraged by talk of the first game. By the sound of that review, i'm going to have to snag it as soon as Atlus brings it NA side.
 

Carmilla

Banned
Teknoman said:
I've always wanted to play this sub series in the megaten universe but was discouraged by talk of the first game. By the sound of that review, i'm going to have to snag it as soon as Atlus brings it NA side.

Do we know that it's actually coming out here. In that interview that 1up did with the localization team at Atlus they seemed to hint at another Radiou coming stateside.
 

Volcynika

Member
Carmilla said:
Do we know that it's actually coming out here. In that interview that 1up did with the localization team at Atlus they seemed to hint at another Radiou coming stateside.

I wouldn't doubt it being localized much, considering Atlus USA makes sure that we don't forget the PS2! Though I'm not completely sure of how well the first Raidou was received over here.
 

Carmilla

Banned
Prime crotch said:
If this comes out on the US or Europe should I play Raidou 1 to get the story or I could just jump in?

From what is said, the connections between the two are mostly cosmetic. There seem to be loose ties with characters who pop up in the story and in true Atlus fashion SMT easter eggs are thrown around.

If you do happen to have Radiou 1 save data however it looks like it aids you in the Demon Negotiations.
 
Never finished the first one, but i'll give this a try. Love me some SMT.

And yes please, Atlus, how bout a Megaten for the HD consoles. Overdue at this point. Hopefully with some new monster designs they'll gladly whore out for the whole generation.
 
velvet_nitemare said:
And yes please, Atlus, how bout a Megaten for the HD consoles. Overdue at this point. Hopefully with some new monster designs they'll gladly whore out for the whole generation.

It's a sure thing, just give it some time. One question I have about the path Raidou chooses or rather you. Do you feel as if you're being punished for choosing one over the other? Or perhaps its more like Nocturne where your choices were encouraged to be your own?
 

Carmilla

Banned
Urban Scholar said:
It's a sure thing, just give it some time. One question I have about the path Raidou chooses or rather you. Do you feel as if you're being punished for choosing one over the other? Or perhaps its more like Nocturne where your choices were encouraged to be your own?

This is a good question. I know that in Nocturne there wasn't truly any punishment for choosing one path over another....well, save for not seeing the "true" ending.

I am extremely excited that the handling of Luci is done so well. I was beginning to think I was the only one who noticed the drop in quality of his role in past series.
 

suzu

Member
Thanks for your review. Now I really want to play this...

Still need to finish the first one though.
 
Carmilla said:
This is a good question. I know that in Nocturne there wasn't truly any punishment for choosing one path over another....well, save for not seeing the "true" ending.

I am extremely excited that the handling of Luci is done so well. I was beginning to think I was the only one who noticed the drop in quality of his role in past series.

I take a little issue with the moniker of "True Ending" for the Maniacs ending. I always thought it was just another ending. Sure they re-released the game with the added content and a whole dungeon to go with it, but would it have been much different than, say, without being able to side with your friends or Hikawa and all the interaction that entailed? Probably a weak comparison, but that's the way I saw it. :\

If the reports of Raidou 2 being THAT good are true, then this'll be the game that makes me dig up my PS2 for one more romp on that ol' thing.
 

Bebpo

Banned
Urban Scholar said:
It's a sure thing, just give it some time. One question I have about the path Raidou chooses or rather you. Do you feel as if you're being punished for choosing one over the other? Or perhaps its more like Nocturne where your choices were encouraged to be your own?

You're not punished for which path you pick. Each has their own benefits and which is the better ending is arguable.
 

Carmilla

Banned
ShinoguTakeruKoeru said:
I take a little issue with the moniker of "True Ending" for the Maniacs ending. I always thought it was just another ending. Sure they re-released the game with the added content and a whole dungeon to go with it, but would it have been much different than, say, without being able to side with your friends or Hikawa and all the interaction that entailed? Probably a weak comparison, but that's the way I saw it. :\

If the reports of Raidou 2 being THAT good are true, then this'll be the game that makes me dig up my PS2 for one more romp on that ol' thing.

I suppose its biased on my end >.< I played Nocturne and then Maniacs and I found the additions it brought to the story just absolutely blew me away. After playing Nocturne (original) I was sucked full force into the SMT world and so many of the older titles had deep connections and narratives
about YHWH and Lucifer
. Playing through maniacs was an odd sort of return to form for me and the fact that it added to the basic plot.
 

windfish

Member
i got the first game becauce of the OP a few days ago - thanks for that, the game is awesome even with its flaws! hope some puplisher will bring raidou 2 over europe soon!
 

Abel

Member
I wonder what ending will be considered canon then :)

Usually they go with the Neutral ending, but guess we'll have to wait and see :D
 
But thanks for the excellent review!

I loved the first Raidou (finished it this past June) and can't wait for this one, whenever it may eventually drop.
 
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