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I kinda preferred Sakuraba's work in the tri-Ace games though.

Just wondering, storywise and characterwise... Xillia > Graces?
RPGCrazied
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(02-17-2012, 05:43 PM)
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Originally Posted by charlequin

Yeah, what's wrong with "Tales of Graces f |OT|" exactly?

I meant subtitle. I should've clarified. Sorry!
.JayZii
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(02-17-2012, 05:44 PM)
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I have never played a Tales game before and have only ever been mildly interested in the series. After looking up videos on the battle system though, I don't think I can put it off any longer. This looks really fast and fun and I'll probably be there on day one to pick it up.

Also, didn't John from 8-4 say they were the ones localizing this? If so, I guess its just another reason to jump into the series.
charlequin
Loving Husband. Caring Moderator. Secret Octopus.
(02-17-2012, 05:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dark Schala

My bf just read that and he just gave me this look (cuz he's a huge Sakuraba fan).

It's literally true though! Sakuraba has talked about how for a Tales soundtrack he is given significantly fewer resources and almost no time to work, so he winds up doing crappy sound programming and reusing shit. His work is much better (relative to whatever baseline opinion of Sakuraba one has) in Baten Kaitos, Valkyrie Profile, etc. because he has the resources to actually do the job.

Originally Posted by RPGCrazied

I meant subtitle. I should've clarified. Sorry!

I knew what you meant. :P

Originally Posted by .JayZii

Also, didn't John from 8-4 say they were the ones localizing this?

8-4 have traditionally worked on Tales in the US and as a result the Tales titles have some of the best JRPG localizations the English language has ever seen, so yes, I agree.
R_thanatos
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(02-17-2012, 06:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by charlequin

In Tales, I basically assume upfront that whenever there's a problematic element in the story, they will do it wrong. Racism? Dealt with in a painful and heavy-handed way. Romance? Ickified and weird. Kids? Annoying. Technobabble? Completely inscrutable and omnipresent. The best Tales can really manage narratively is to stay away from all this stuff and focus on elements that are hard to get wrong (and even then about the most they ever manage is 2/3rds of Vesperia, and that all still has Karol.)

I mean, I believe you that it's fine, but it doesn't take a lot to assume that a Tales game is going to have narrative elements that are so bad as to be actively offensive.

I believe that vesperia , xillia , rebirth doesn't follow this trend.
( believing as having played them )
Heck i don't see what was wrong between the racisms parts of Symphonia for example.
I do agree that they never did a romance properly.


You can sub in literally any non-Legendia Tales game and describe it with this. Rushed and underbudget tossed-off Sakuraba plus a legion of untalented cronies.

Yeah, what's wrong with "Tales of Graces f |OT|" exactly?

Given the lenght of some Tales ( abyss, symphonia, vesperia) i have a hard time to think they were in any waypossible rushed or anything of the sort . Original Graces,Xillia destiny2,legendia i can agree but making all of them in the same bag is unfair IMO given that they try a lot to be different in their systems ( and presentation ).

What does "untalented cronies" mean ??

Originally Posted by chickdigger802

The former.

Hasn't been a tales game in the states with dual audio. Not sure if there has been an actual confirmation though. I do feel tales english VA have been pretty solid from symphonia on.

You probably weren't around when i dismissed that idea myself in the previous Graces F thread then ..
Namco doesn't do this ... but they seems to do it for one title ... If they learned that this is requested enough for ni no kuni , i 'm just throwing the idea to see if anyone as a confirmation or not ... There is just a serious lack of communication about this game. ( from NB )

Originally Posted by DR2K

Well no Tales import gaf is too small. Xillia just has better (much) design and visuals to me.

6+ people is not enough to get a least a trend of opinions ?
Last edited by R_thanatos; 02-17-2012 at 06:40 PM.
luca1980
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(02-17-2012, 07:04 PM)
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Tales of graces | ot | show square enix what a jrpg should be!!
kayos90
Tragic victim of fan death
(02-17-2012, 07:05 PM)
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Just woke up. Ugh, what did I miss?

Originally Posted by DR2K

Is it really that bad or do you just not find it as good as Graces?



Well no Tales import gaf is too small. Xillia just has better (much) design and visuals to me.

Meh, Aeana just got turned off by its battle system and how the game handles mechanics overall such as the shops. I liked Xillia and I think it's better as a game overall compared to Graces but Graces has a much more solid battle system. My copy of the game is collecting dust still, whereas it's fun to go back to Graces. Ugh
Last edited by kayos90; 02-17-2012 at 07:15 PM.
Datschge
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(02-18-2012, 12:14 AM)
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Originally Posted by Aeana

Tales of Eternia came before the split between Team Destiny and Team Symphonia. They were established with Tales of Destiny 2 (PS2) and Tales of Symphonia, respectively.

Correct, although there is still the neat tidbit that the typical "Team Destiny" project lead and main programmer (Kazuya Ishizuka and Ryuichi Ishizawa, also worked on ToD PS1) worked on Narikiri Dungeon while Eternia was led by later "Team Symphonia" project lead (Takashi Hasegawa) and otherwise consisted of later "Team Destiny" staff. ;)

Originally Posted by charlequin

You can sub in literally any non-Legendia Tales game and describe it with this. Rushed and underbudget tossed-off Sakuraba plus a legion of untalented cronies.

That "legion" is essentially limited to Tamura (unless you count the sound effects staff), and there are plenty people who like his stuff (e.g. "A Vow of Unity" and "Fury Sparks" in Vesperia) even though it's often decreasing overall consistency and quality of the soundtrack (which apparently was Sakuraba's job to ensure while Tamura got free reign to add anything if I interpret the insightful SEMO interview correctly, would perfectly explain tracks like e.g. "Lying in the Darkness" in Graces, that one track is sooo unbelievable terribad). As for Sakuraba's contributions to Tales I usually consider it as "fast food" while tri-Ace/tri-Crescendo and others often ask for "haute cuisine". I personally actually like plenty of the "fast food" as he's forced to do simpler pieces than usual (the lighter orchestral and piano pieces he's now doing everywhere essentially started in the Tales series). Really liking his town themes (e.g. Vesperia, Graces, Xillia). With Xillia finally being a solo effort the soundtrack became consistent and overall quality actually comparable to his non-Tales works, and I like it a lot for it. But I also think that after Eternia Sakuraba's contribution was constantly improving (while Tamura's got worse) which seems not to be a widespread opinion.
Thoraxes
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(02-18-2012, 12:20 AM)
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They should just hire me to do their music.
I would work for cheap, maintain the aesthetic, and evolve it in awesome ways.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
(02-18-2012, 12:23 AM)
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Originally Posted by Datschge

would perfectly explain tracks like e.g. "Lying in the Darkness" in Graces, that one track is sooo unbelievable terribad).

So bad.

This Graces dungeon theme was pretty bad too. I really dislike it, and it doesn't help that I spent a lot of time in that dungeon.

And yessss, you picked one of my favourite town themes from Xillia. So good. Xillia's soundtrack is quite mature and quite consistent on the whole. Admittedly, because I was grinding in a certain area, I got pretty sick of a few themes, but the soundtrack is great compared to Graces'. Though I wonder if he had more resources for Xillia's soundtrack given that it was an anniversary game.
Bel Marduk
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(02-18-2012, 12:27 AM)
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Tamura composed Vow of Unity, Fury Sparks, and Fighting of the Spirit? lol, how does he go from tracks like those to some of his other ones?

Graces has one pretty good dungeon track, but I'm not sure who it's composed by. Sounds like Sakuraba but I don't know: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-SrdaMWAGI
Datschge
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(02-18-2012, 01:09 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dark Schala

Though I wonder if he had more resources for Xillia's soundtrack given that it was an anniversary game.

It's significantly shorter than past Tales soundtracks, so probably told to focus on quality instead quantity while budget was still the same.

Also I found "From the Faraway Distance Towards Here" somewhat bearable, it actually has development and is atmospheric. "Lying in the Darkness" is a f-ing four seconds (!) three notes (!) lo-fi "melody" repeated for over two minutes (!) on the CD. x_X

Originally Posted by Bel Marduk

Graces has one pretty good dungeon track, but I'm not sure who it's composed by. Sounds like Sakuraba but I don't know: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-SrdaMWAGI

That one is typical Tamura (drum loops and modern synths). =) His current band (he's bass).
kayos90
Tragic victim of fan death
(02-18-2012, 01:49 AM)
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Originally Posted by Bel Marduk

Graces has one pretty good dungeon track, but I'm not sure who it's composed by. Sounds like Sakuraba but I don't know: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-SrdaMWAGI

Omg, I hate that song. So annoying especially when you spent hours there. Ugh...
The Praiseworthy
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(02-18-2012, 01:51 AM)
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What are these.... awful... tracks you are posting from Graces :\

God, this can't be true!

HOW AWFUL!!!!
kayos90
Tragic victim of fan death
(02-18-2012, 01:52 AM)
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Originally Posted by The Praiseworthy

What are these.... awful... tracks you are posting from Graces :\

God, this can't be true!

HOW AWFUL!!!!

Yeah, Graces music is like from the SNES era. And not in a good way, rofl.
bigmit3737
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(02-18-2012, 01:57 AM)
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I have the Japanese version of this, which I have yet to start!
I look forward to playing along with you guys.
Dark Schala
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(02-18-2012, 01:58 AM)
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Originally Posted by The Praiseworthy

What are these.... awful... tracks you are posting from Graces :\

God, this can't be true!

HOW AWFUL!!!!

I've said several times before that Graces doesn't have a very good soundtrack. D:

The instrumentation isn't awesome either. The samples... Well, I try looking at it this way, at least they aren't like Sonic 4's atrocious samples because Senoue doesn't know how to do synth well.

Originally Posted by kayos90

Yeah, Graces music is like from the SNES era. And not in a good way, rofl.

Ohhh, that's harsh.

I'm very disappointed that the ending version of the theme song had poor instrument sampling (the percussion) as well, since I was expecting more out of that.
PixyJunket
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(02-18-2012, 02:02 AM)
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Originally Posted by charlequin

You can sub in literally any non-Legendia Tales game and describe it with this. Rushed and underbudget tossed-off Sakuraba plus a legion of untalented cronies.

Indeed. Music has always been the Tales series weakest point.

And well, the weak point of almost every game I've played with Sakuraba's "magic touch."

Although, the one game his work (apparently) shined in (Valkyrie Profile?), I have yet to play.

Now Tales of Legendia? SUPER AMAZING SOUNDTRACK. Go Shiina is love.
Datschge
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(02-18-2012, 02:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by The Praiseworthy

What are these.... awful... tracks you are posting from Graces :\

Even "Lively Lake Shore"? =(
vic2020
Junior Member
(02-18-2012, 02:07 AM)
The terrible soundtrack, along with the off-putting character designs(I especially loath the the look of the blue haired guy) led to me cancelling my pre-order. I like Sakuraba's music in VP/SO/RoF but in ToGf its completely dull. I would buy this if only it had custom soundtrack support...
kayos90
Tragic victim of fan death
(02-18-2012, 02:15 AM)
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Originally Posted by vic2020

The terrible soundtrack, along with the off-putting character designs(I especially loath the the look of the blue haired guy) led to me cancelling my pre-order. I like Sakuraba's music in VP/SO/RoF but in ToGf its completely dull. I would buy this if only it had custom soundtrack support...

That stinks. Graces has probably one of the best combat systems in all RPGs this generation. There's only a handful that I prefer more. You're missing out.
R_thanatos
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(02-18-2012, 02:21 AM)
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sakuraba in vesperia / xillia was very good ...

I haven't played Graces F yet ( the only tales of missing in my collection [yeah i have played all the others including GBAs ] ).. this is gonna be a fun ride.
Dark Schala
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(02-18-2012, 02:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by vic2020

The terrible soundtrack, along with the off-putting character designs(I especially loath the the look of the blue haired guy) led to me cancelling my pre-order. I like Sakuraba's music in VP/SO/RoF but in ToGf its completely dull. I would buy this if only it had custom soundtrack support...

This is unfortunate, because the "game" part of the game is extremely fun and it definitely makes up for any of the tiny presentation shortcomings that the game features.
The Praiseworthy
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(02-18-2012, 02:33 AM)
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Originally Posted by Datschge

Even "Lively Lake Shore"? =(

Just heard it.... not bad!

Originally Posted by vic2020

The terrible soundtrack, along with the off-putting character designs(I especially loath the the look of the blue haired guy) led to me cancelling my pre-order. I like Sakuraba's music in VP/SO/RoF but in ToGf its completely dull. I would buy this if only it had custom soundtrack support...

Oh no!

The gameplay is so fun, you are missing it :(
kayos90
Tragic victim of fan death
(02-18-2012, 02:33 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dark Schala


Ohhh, that's harsh.

I'm very disappointed that the ending version of the theme song had poor instrument sampling (the percussion) as well, since I was expecting more out of that.

Yeah, that was a bit harsh. Hm... It's not absolute crap but it doesn't sound like this gen. I guess that's the Wii's fault though.
Midou
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(02-18-2012, 02:35 AM)
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Got Graces F pre-ordered, never been let down by a main-line Tales game.
Negator
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(02-18-2012, 02:37 AM)
Tales music as a whole is pretty forgettable. I can't even remember any tracks from Vesperia.
vic2020
Junior Member
(02-18-2012, 02:38 AM)

Originally Posted by Dark Schala

This is unfortunate, because the "game" part of the game is extremely fun and it definitely makes up for any of the tiny presentation shortcomings that the game features.

Is the battle theme in the demo unique to the f arc? Those tracks posted above are much better than what I heard in the demo or listened through on youtube. I do really like this track as a battle theme over the demo version http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crqoPRqHvnU
RPGCrazied
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(02-18-2012, 02:40 AM)
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I guess I'm just a Motoi whore. I love all his music. Sure he has a few bad tracks in his OSTs, but they're a lot worse out there.
kayos90
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(02-18-2012, 02:43 AM)
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Originally Posted by vic2020

Is the battle theme in the demo unique to the f arc? Those tracks posted above are much better than what I heard in the demo or listened through on youtube. I do really like this track as a battle theme over the demo version http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crqoPRqHvnU

I forget where it's in but I believe it's in the main arc...
Ultratech
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(02-18-2012, 02:49 AM)
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Originally Posted by kayos90

I forget where it's in but I believe it's in the main arc...

I may be wrong on this, but isn't that the Battle Theme for the last dungeon or whatever (someplace close to the end)?
SatelliteOfLove
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(02-18-2012, 02:53 AM)
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Originally Posted by Negator

Tales music as a whole is pretty forgettable. I can't even remember any tracks from Vesperia.

I only remember three, but they are excellent: 1 2 3 All town themes, too; the rest simply didn't exist for me once they stopped playing. It was like Xenosaga Ep.1 that way.

And yes, Sakuraba usually phoning these in with a few greats sprinkled in, as described above. I'm more used to him snatching my attention by progging out thusly.
Cedric
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(02-18-2012, 02:56 AM)
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I find that, apart from some battle themes, Tales of music isn't really good... Which is weird since Sakuraba has great music in games like Valkyrie Profile. Within the Tales series, I think Symphonia (Like a Glint of Light, Fighting of the Spirit & Fatalize are awesome) and Phantasia have the best tracks.

I can't think of any good battle themes apart the ones I mentioned. Meaning of Birth is good, though I don't like it as much as before.
Bel Marduk
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(02-18-2012, 03:00 AM)
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Originally Posted by kayos90

Omg, I hate that song. So annoying especially when you spent hours there. Ugh...

Really? :/ I think that's one of the few good songs from Graces.

Originally Posted by SatelliteOfLove

And yes, Sakuraba usually phoning these in with a few greats sprinkled in, as described above. I'm more used to him snatching my attention by progging out thusly.

Sakuraba is pretty good with prog. There's one great prog track from Valkyrie Profile 2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RC_WAtbgG0

I like his stuff in RoF too. He should do more prog rock stuff.

But ultimately I want to see him try his hand at a new Baten Kaitos game if it gets made. I'm not sure if he can keep the same quality as the first two but who knows.
Dark Schala
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(02-18-2012, 03:03 AM)
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Originally Posted by Ultratech

I may be wrong on this, but isn't that the Battle Theme for the last dungeon or whatever (someplace close to the end)?

You're right.

To the poster with the original question, Future Arc has its own set of music not on the soundtrack (for obvious reasons), yeah. The costumes' battle themes aren't on the soundtrack either.

Originally Posted by Cedric

I can't think of any good battle themes apart the ones I mentioned.

Here are some from Tales of Xillia:
School Costume DLC Battle Theme
Daring Sword
That Sword, Dancing Magnificently
Indomitable Fists That Know No Equal
My Sword Shall Open the Way
That Fist, Blinking Decision

Final boss theme is good too.
kayos90
Tragic victim of fan death
(02-18-2012, 03:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dark Schala

You're right.

To the poster with the original question, Future Arc has its own set of music not on the soundtrack (for obvious reasons), yeah. The costumes' battle themes aren't on the soundtrack either.


Here are some from Tales of Xillia:
School Costume DLC Battle Theme
Daring Sword
That Sword, Dancing Magnificently
Indomitable Fists That Know No Equal
My Sword Shall Open the Way
That Fist, Blinking Decision

Final boss theme is good too.

I like Milla's 3rd Battle Song. Probably my favorite one out of all the normal battle themes.
Aeana
Medal Princess
(02-18-2012, 03:08 AM)
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I can't remember a single song from a Tales game post-Eternia. :|
Seda
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(02-18-2012, 03:09 AM)
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Originally Posted by Aeana

I can't remember a single song from a Tales game post-Eternia. :|

Not even Karma?
Meccanical
Banned
(02-18-2012, 03:09 AM)
Now that I think about it I don't remember a single song from Symphonia, Vesperia, or Abyss.

Huh.
SatelliteOfLove
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(02-18-2012, 03:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by Aeana

I can't remember a single song from a Tales game post-Eternia. :|

Surely you jest!
Dark Schala
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(02-18-2012, 03:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by kayos90

I like Milla's 3rd Battle Song. Probably my favorite one out of all the normal battle themes.

I think all of Milla's battle themes are quite refreshing for the series since we usually get stuff heavy with prog or synth most of the time. It's kinda too bad I started the game with Jude's side first from a musical point of view; but from a narrative point of view, it's good that I started the game with Jude's side to get a better idea of the narrative. Dual protagonists in Xillia was a nice concept, but I don't think it was executed very well in some respects.

But with that said, I like Jude's later two battle themes a lot, especially his third one. But the victory theme in that game is so... well, I don't like it, lol.
Aeana
Medal Princess
(02-18-2012, 03:11 AM)
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Originally Posted by Seda

Not even Karma?

I'm not including the OP music, of course.
RPGCrazied
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(02-18-2012, 03:12 AM)
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I guess my ears are easily amused.
Bladenic
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(02-18-2012, 03:12 AM)
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I ADORE the school battle theme. It's seriously amazing, it's quite a shame it's not even in the actual game.
Seda
the worst pokemon
(02-18-2012, 03:13 AM)
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The ToS/ToA/ToV songs that I can remember off the top of my head.

Flanoir
Halure
Meltokio
ToS Battle Theme 1
Ossa Trail
Karma (and Meaning of Birth)
ToS Final Dungeon
ToS mini game music (doot doodoo doot doot doot.....catchy)
Edge of a Decision (Abyss battle theme 2)
Fury Sparks (Flynn Duel)

Probably many more. I actually seem to remember most of Symphonia. That's to be expected though as I've gone through the game about 15 times.
Rpgmonkey
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(02-18-2012, 03:15 AM)
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I remember a bunch of songs from Rebirth, Symphonia, and Destiny 2.

I actually really like the soundtracks in those three. Good amount of variety and Rebirth in particular has some songs that are a little different for a Tales game, but they worked really well.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
(02-18-2012, 03:15 AM)
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Originally Posted by Chris25

I ADORE the school battle theme. It's seriously amazing, it's quite a shame it's not even in the actual game.

I like the Xillia one so much that I... uh, bought the school costume for it. I didn't fall for the Kratos End of a Thought costume, though.

I think it's way better than the Graces one: Tales of Graces f School DLC Battle Theme
daffy
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(02-18-2012, 03:17 AM)
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Wow, I never even remember the music. its amazing you all know the names and stuff.
Verelios
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(02-18-2012, 03:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by Rpgmonkey

I remember a bunch of songs from Rebirth, Symphonia, and Destiny 2.

I actually really like the soundtracks in those three. Good amount of variety and Rebirth in particular has some songs that are a little different for a Tales game, but they worked really well.

Yes.

Also, Eternia was pretty good in that regard.

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