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Why DMC3's Vergil is the Best Rival in Gaming (Also Free Copies of DMC4 PC)

GuardianE

Santa May Claus
Since the reveal of Vergil in DMC4SE, I thought this was a good opportunity to take a look back and dissect why Vergil is one of the most celebrated rivals in gaming history from a design standpoint:

M4IM949.png

Vergil is often considered one of the greatest rivals in gaming, and I don't think this was an accident. A great deal of meticulous thought went into the Dante/Vergil relationship.

Key features of a good rivalry:
*Visual juxtaposition
*Rival acts as impetus/barometer for growth
*Regular, evenly paced encounters with proper escalation
*Rival shares similar, but distinct moves/gameplay

Obviously, this post will contain DMC3 spoilers.

I consider Dante/Vergil to be a paradigm of a videogame rivalry. Vergil is executed so well because he works as a development mechanism for both Dante and the player.



VISUAL JUXTAPOSITION:
-Complementary/opposite color pairs in CMYK color model: Red vs. Cyan
-http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/19/SubtractiveColor.svg/400px-SubtractiveColor.svg.png
-Body Language: Aloof vs. Stoic
-Clothing: Casual vs. Formal
-Speech: Loudmouth vs. Reserved
-Weapon: Broadsword vs. Katana

Some of these are admittedly obvious, but the dichotomy is one that works well on a very superficial and transparent level. There is no mistaking the clash of ideals between the two just by looking at them together. And this is important in establishing things early, in release and marketing, and in brand recognition and mascot establishment.

Also, each character's signature weapon name stands in opposition to each other. Rebellion vs. Yamato, which means "large, great" and "harmony" in kanji.




RIVAL ACTS AS IMPETUS/BAROMETER FOR GROWTH:
When we are first introduced to Dante, he lacks motivation and shares no reverence for his family. Although half demon, he is in denial of this side of him and spends his days devil hunting. However, Vergil from the outset is obsessed with his demonic side, his father's power, and struggles with the desire for more. It is his interactions with Vergil (and partially due to Lady's influence as well. You are meant to draw parallels to Lady's disfunctional family) throughout the game that pushes Dante to grow as a person. By the end, Dante accepts Vergil as his brother, accepts Sparda as his father, and understands that he has to take responsibility for both of their actions because that's what being part of a family is. And part of being human is accepting that demonic side of himself.

And so, Itsuno establishes the development of Dante's character through this rivalry. This runs concurrent to Dante's development in combat.

Vergil acts as a gauge by which you measure your skill, both as Dante and the player. Vergil is way better than you from the outset. The intro of the game shows Dante's defeat at the hands of Vergil. The remainder of the game has you chasing after him. During the first duel, Dante loses. The second fight is interrupted and ends in a draw. By the third battle, Dante finally wins. It cements that Dante has finally trumped Vergil is strength and you have grown as a player.


These fights frame the development of Dante's combat ability, and act as a testing ground for what you have learned.




REGULAR, EVENLY PLACED ENCOUNTERS WITH PROPER ESCALATION:
Each duel with Vergil is spaced 6-7 missions apart (with a total of 20 missions):

Mission 7
Mission 13
Mission 20

This proper pacing allows each fight to sink in. You don't get tired of facing Vergil, not only because he's vastly different in each battle, but also because the encounters are spaced apart properly. And they're not spaced so far apart that you lose sight of him as your end goal. He's constantly on your radar. It's a perfect balance. Three also feels like the optimal number of fights to establish the central character's growth. In Mission 19, they further have a special Dramatic Battle segment where Dante and Vergil fight side by side, setting up the final duel in Mission 20.

Each Vergil encounter also escalates appropriately, and in tandem with Dante's growth. Vergil matches you and Dante every step of the way:

Mission 7- No Devil Trigger for either character. Vergil has one weapon, Dante has three.
Mission 13- Vergil & Dante both have Devil Trigger (gains health regen/armor in DT). Vergil shows that he can unlock new Devil Arms. Vergil performs weapon switching towards the last half of the fight.
Mission 20- Vergil realtime weapon switches mid combo constantly. Vergil has super Devil Trigger moves.



RIVAL SHARES SIMILAR BUT DISTINCT MOVES/GAMEPLAY:
Though similar, each character's movesets are completely distinct, with only a few shared moves: Stinger, Killerbee/Starfall, Helm Breaker.

Even when both characters use the same weapon, Beowulf, the weapon behaves differently.
-Different ground combo
-Different speed KillerBee/Starfall
-Dante can charge attacks for additional damage
-Different base strength

Other similarities between Dante (player) and Vergil (boss):
-Both share Devil Trigger (armor/health regen)
-Dante has guns for long range, Vergil uses Summon Swords
-Vergil can realtime weapon switch
-Vergil can defeat Devils to obtain Devil Arms
-Vergil can teleport like Dante's Airtrick
-Vergil can parry like Dante's Royal Guard
-Vergil and Dante can clash when certain attacks meet
-Vergil is also the only enemy/boss that can put Dante in a juggle combo with Upper Slash or Summon Swords.
-Vergil taunts you upon player death

But even with these similarities, the way that each brother fights further crystallizes the differences between them. Whereas Dante has extravagant movesets with endless variety and utility, Vergil has a smaller and less flamboyant movset, with raw strength and range focused on efficiency. Itsuno and co. were very mindful of each character, and how their personality shows through their combat style. They play against each other, and each complete a half of a whole.

A good rival isn't a simple clone of the protagonist, but one that has their own strengths, weaknesses, and tendecies that show clearly in battle.

So what are your thoughts? What makes a strong rival?




DMC4 GIVEAWAY:

In celebration of the announcement of DMC4SE, I am giving away the following PC Steam copies of DMC4. Just follow the simple instructions and PM Modbot:

ModBot said:
Instructions for participants:
I am giving away 15 Steam keys. To enter this giveaway, send a PM to ModBot with any subject line. In the body, copy and paste the entire line from the message below that corresponds to the game you want. (if you include more than one game, you will be blocked from entering). Confused? Watch this GIF tutorial or ask for help.

ModBot Basics:
- This is a giveaway for the thread url: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=952993.
- This giveaway has a manual blocklist. The giver has identified members who abuse giveaways and restricted them from participating.
- I really appreciate thank you messages, but please send them to me (GuardianE, not ModBot!) via PM instead of in thread.
- Do not trade keys you win off-site to enrich yourself. Don't try to claim games you have no interest in collecting or playing. Don't claim games to give them to friends off-site.
- If the key is already taken you will not receive a reply. Replies may take a minute or two.

Rules for this Giveaway:
- This is a free for all! You can enter for multiple games on the list below. Send an individual PM for each game you'd like to win.
- If you won a game from ModBot in the last day, you are not eligible for this giveaway.
- This giveaway is a raffle. The winners will be selected by random draw 24 hours after the draw was created. Any games not claimed after that point will be given away first come first serve.


Devil May Cry 4 #10 -- MB-C0FBD8C7D1C8BD4E - Taken by Mengy. 147 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 -- MB-6C59B9C8F869576D - Taken by skLaFarebear. 131 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #11 -- MB-48BE748672B216DF - Taken by chronomac. 128 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #14 -- MB-D089EEFDDFA994F9 - Taken by Revas. 121 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #4 -- MB-94E9C071AF581E1A - Taken by Alfebit. 124 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #5 -- MB-A068F534526D7153 - Taken by Atraveller. 122 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #6 -- MB-FA39100C9282C736 - Taken by efyu_lemonardo. 135 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #7 -- MB-8FAC151A856C7B9D - Taken by Maragidyne. 137 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #12 -- MB-A9821BD908087066 - Taken by -MD-. 131 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #13 -- MB-75F7AB0053E02808 - Taken by Jadax. 133 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #2 -- MB-D26D56055A5897BF - Taken by Accoun. 127 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #3 -- MB-3E1D1609DF9F412D - Taken by swx. 114 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #8 -- MB-918954623C34F94C - Taken by Elija2. 136 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #9 -- MB-6397BF9297AFADEE - Taken by Kyou. 115 entrants total.
Devil May Cry 4 #15 -- MB-9A6D7DE0B836A394 - Taken by Kuroyume. 120 entrants total.

t1418796526z1.png

Right+back+at+ya+b+tch+game+devil+may+cry+4+can_a942db_4381297.gif


You can enter as many of these as you want, but you'll only win one of them. Good luck!
 

Bronetta

Ask me about the moon landing or the temperature at which jet fuel burns. You may be surprised at what you learn.
I came for the free game
 

catmario

Member
My wallet is already opening to DMC and 4SE.

Uhhh.... How to join giveaway?

PM to modbot? or.... I dunno :{

Anyway... I'll join giveaway.
 

Toxi

Banned
Are there any other great rivals?
DMC4 GIVEAWAY:

In celebration of the announcement of DMC5, I am giving away the following PC Steam copies of DMC4. Just follow the simple instructions and PM Modbot:

WAITING ON PM FROM MODBOT; Give me a sec. Sorry!

You can enter as many of these as you want, but you'll only win one of them. Good luck!
oh come on
 

SolVanderlyn

Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
DMC5 was announced?
 

Dahbomb

Member
Dah Gawd

The Greatest of All Time

The Legendary Dark Slayer

The Son of Sparda

You will not forget this devil's power


Vergil is going to double the potential sales of DMC4SE. Like someone said earlier... Vergil is Capcom's trump card in making fans double dip on games (DMC3SE, UMVC3, DmC DLC and now DMC4SE)... and god damn it is fucking effective.


My two cents on why Vergil is a great rival for Dante.

It really has to do with how well DMC3 hypes up each encounters and builds it up. The opening cutscene is Vergil cutting up Dante which confuses the player into thinking whether it's a dream or is it a foreshadowing. Finally that scene happens and it plays out exactly as that opening cutscene... the player gets beaten up but the fight unlocks Dante's DT so you are like "oh yes, next time I see Vergil I am going to pop my DT and whoop his candy ass!"

Well the 2nd encounter comes in and it turns out that Vergil has been collecting Devil arms of his own. You fight him now with his Beowulf but when you pop your DT, he pops his own. He was holding back on the first encounter because he didn't NEED to use his DT. Now the fight is more even yet intense but right when it's starts to heat up it's interrupted for story reasons (normally I would bemoan this but the cutscene that follows is godlike). So now this fight is put on hold but it's still at the back of your mind... you want to kick his ass for the first beating he gave you.

Enter the 3rd battle right after Vergil assists you in beating another boss. Now Vergil has another sword and he is not holding back. He throws everything at you and you are fighting at the edge of hell. Vergil turns on XF3 and goes ham on you with Helm Breaker. It's hard at first because Vergil can combo you out of no where but you persevere and finally beat him. Suddenly you realize that the reason you wanted to beat up Vergil doesn't exist anymore... you now respect him as an equal. Another time, another place this fight could've gone differently. When Vergil drops you kinda feel sad that this is the last time you will see him in this form where he retains such character.


DMC3 built up this rivalry so well that it retroactively makes the Nelo Angelo fights in DMC1 even more dramatic. The final encounter with Nelo Angelo is epic because of this and his "demise" even more heartfelt. When I first beat DMC1 and beat Nelo Angelo 3 I thought it was a very cool fight but didn't have any emotional weight behind it... after beating DMC3 and playing it again I felt it. That is the mark of a very good prequel, it enhances the original work beyond the intended design. Strangely enough when Mundus says to Dante "again I must face a Sparda" he is also including Vergil in the statement even though when we first hear him state it we thought "oh he is talking about Mundus".


Another thing that was great about Vergil... he kept Dante in check. He beat up Dante in DMC3 and he beat up Dante in DMC1 (both first encounters). Vergil's existence in DMC makes sure that Dante is not "OP"... he is beatable. Ever since Vergil has not been in the scene Dante has been too strong for his own universe and has remained unchallenged. There is a lack of tension in fights and the cutscenes, even a lack of motivation to get stronger to beat a stronger opponent.

These among other reasons is why fans clamor for Vergil's return. He injects the seriousness to the series that serves as a good foil to Dante's flippant behavior. Vergil is a walking reminder to Dante that this is what he could've been if he embraced his demonic heritage more. And of course he can lay the smack down on Uncle Dante once and for all.

Did I mention how sick his VA is in DMC3? The intent behind his taunts in the fights is so clear that it engages you further into the battle. "THIS IS THE POWER OF SPARDA!" "YOU ARE NOT WORTHY AS MY OPPONENT" "NOW I AM A LITTLE MOTIVATED!"
 
Great post man. Gotta agree that Vergil is definitely the best rival in any video game. I really don't know what I can add, but other than the fact that you need to hate your rival. And he also needs to be a challenging rival, otherwise smacking him all the time would just make him someone that just keeps getting in your way.

I also really like Vorkken and how he's handled in W101 as your rival. In the same way, easy to hate. Very opposite, but similar to Wonder Red and
three fights with him using his own "unlimited form" in his last encounter with you.

And ok, I get it. I'll replay DMC3 soon and beat it on DMD mode.
 
Anyone else notice that Dante and Virgil are kinda like Inuyasha and Sesshomaru. Both are fathered by a great demon. Both inherit swords from said father. They fight each other many many times. Blah Blah Blah.
 
I agree so hard. I didn't feel like Lumen Sage in Bayonetta 2 (whom everyone compares to Vergil) was nearly as good. I needed one more fight with him, then maybe. Jeanne and Jetstream Sam are solid.

I want to say Riku in Kingdom Hearts 1 is a pretty good rival. Watching a friendship slowly deteriorate, with the battles starting as a fun pass time, and escalating to battling for the fate of a world. Works rather nicely. Plus contrasting visual styles and outfits. Even they're fighting styles and personalities are very different. Sora fights with Keyblade as a heavy, two-handed weapon. Riku uses Soul Eater as a one-handed, finesse weapon. Hell, even dark vs. light.

And as someone mentioned, Vorkken. What a damn manimal.
 

dorkkaos

Member
I agree that Vergil is one of the best rivals in gaming. Though, i'd put Blue from pokemon up there as well. Being constantly reminded that he is one step ahead of you, you guys also both started in the same city, etc. Just...damn. He infuriated me growing up haha.

Does Zero count as a rival to megaman? :O
 

blurr

Member
I'm gonna make a point to play all those DMC games as soon as I get my controller. I did play DMC 3 and 4 a bit but I couldn't complete them.

Um, how do I join the giveaway?
 

TWILT

Banned
Yeah, Vergil's still the best for me. Every single fight with him was just so memorable.

"You are not worthy as my opponent!"

Blue from Pokemon is still a very close second to me. Someone who's always seemingly one step ahead of you and is constantly smug in your face, and when you finally beat him in the Pokemon League...that feeling was awesome.
 

Astral Dog

Member
I have to say, i liked him a bit more as Nelo Angelo, im not sure why, maybe because i started DMC 3 inmediatly after finishing DMC 1, the latter left more of an impression.

He is great on both games of course, i also liked how he upgraded after each battle on cutscenes.
 

Leynos

Member
I still prefer the Mario/Wario rivalry as Wario is such a cock-sure asshole, and damn near indestructible. Plus, he always gets a laugh out of me.
 
Dah Gawd

The Greatest of All Time

The Legendary Dark Slayer

The Son of Sparda

You will not forget this devil's power


Vergil is going to double the potential sales of DMC4SE. Like someone said earlier... Vergil is Capcom's trump card in making fans double dip on games (DMC3SE, UMVC3, DmC DLC and now DMC4SE)... and god damn it is fucking effective.


My two cents on why Vergil is a great rival for Dante.

It really has to do with how well DMC3 hypes up each encounters and builds it up. The opening cutscene is Vergil cutting up Dante which confuses the player into thinking whether it's a dream or is it a foreshadowing. Finally that scene happens and it plays out exactly as that opening cutscene... the player gets beaten up but the fight unlocks Dante's DT so you are like "oh yes, next time I see Vergil I am going to pop my DT and whoop his candy ass!"

Well the 2nd encounter comes in and it turns out that Vergil has been collecting Devil arms of his own. You fight him now with his Beowulf but when you pop your DT, he pops his own. He was holding back on the first encounter because he didn't NEED to use his DT. Now the fight is more even yet intense but right when it's starts to heat up it's interrupted for story reasons (normally I would bemoan this but the cutscene that follows is godlike). So now this fight is put on hold but it's still at the back of your mind... you want to kick his ass for the first beating he gave you.

Enter the 3rd battle right after Vergil assists you in beating another boss. Now Vergil has another sword and he is not holding back. He throws everything at you and you are fighting at the edge of hell. Vergil turns on XF3 and goes ham on you with Helm Breaker. It's hard at first because Vergil can combo you out of no where but you persevere and finally beat him. Suddenly you realize that the reason you wanted to beat up Vergil doesn't exist anymore... you now respect him as an equal. Another time, another place this fight could've gone differently. When Vergil drops you kinda feel sad that this is the last time you will see him in this form where he retains such character.


DMC3 built up this rivalry so well that it retroactively makes the Nelo Angelo fights in DMC1 even more dramatic. The final encounter with Nelo Angelo is epic because of this and his "demise" even more heartfelt. When I first beat DMC1 and beat Nelo Angelo 3 I thought it was a very cool fight but didn't have any emotional weight behind it... after beating DMC3 and playing it again I felt it. That is the mark of a very good prequel, it enhances the original work beyond the intended design. Strangely enough when Mundus says to Dante "again I must face a Sparda" he is also including Vergil in the statement even though when we first hear him state it we thought "oh he is talking about Mundus".


Another thing that was great about Vergil... he kept Dante in check. He beat up Dante in DMC3 and he beat up Dante in DMC1 (both first encounters). Vergil's existence in DMC makes sure that Dante is not "OP"... he is beatable. Ever since Vergil has not been in the scene Dante has been too strong for his own universe and has remained unchallenged. There is a lack of tension in fights and the cutscenes, even a lack of motivation to get stronger to beat a stronger opponent.

These among other reasons is why fans clamor for Vergil's return. He injects the seriousness to the series that serves as a good foil to Dante's flippant behavior. Vergil is a walking reminder to Dante that this is what he could've been if he embraced his demonic heritage more. And of course he can lay the smack down on Uncle Dante once and for all.

Did I mention how sick his VA is in DMC3? The intent behind his taunts in the fights is so clear that it engages you further into the battle. "THIS IS THE POWER OF SPARDA!" "YOU ARE NOT WORTHY AS MY OPPONENT" "NOW I AM A LITTLE MOTIVATED!"

picard_clapping.gif


I agree well put.
 
I love vergil in DMC3 because he felt like Nelo Angelo was in DMC, or like Hercules in Gow3. They all felt like one on one, fair battle. It's not about dodging huge ass AOE from a building sized boss and cutting his feets. They were about almost doppelgangeresque battles.

Also Vergil is amazingly classy and everyone wanted to be him
 

Astral Dog

Member
I agree so hard. I didn't feel like Lumen Sage in Bayonetta 2 (whom everyone compares to Vergil) was nearly as good. I needed one more fight with him, then maybe. Jeanne and Jetstream Sam are solid.

I want to say Riku in Kingdom Hearts 1 is a pretty good rival. Watching a friendship slowly deteriorate, with the battles starting as a fun pass time, and escalating to battling for the fate of a world. Works rather nicely. Plus contrasting visual styles and outfits. Even they're fighting styles and personalities are very different. Sora fights with Keyblade as a heavy, two-handed weapon. Riku uses Soul Eater as a one-handed, finesse weapon. Hell, even dark vs. light.

And as someone mentioned, Vorkken. What a damn manimal.

Balder is
awesome, i agree you needed a fourth battle with him, it would fit at the very end, although it kinda happens on
the first game
. the Bayonetta games are kinda incomplete without each other.
 

GuardianE

Santa May Claus
I agree so hard. I didn't feel like Lumen Sage in Bayonetta 2 (whom everyone compares to Vergil) was nearly as good. I needed one more fight with him, then maybe. Jeanne and Jetstream Sam are solid.

I want to say Riku in Kingdom Hearts 1 is a pretty good rival. Watching a friendship slowly deteriorate, with the battles starting as a fun pass time, and escalating to battling for the fate of a world. Works rather nicely. Plus contrasting visual styles and outfits. Even they're fighting styles and personalities are very different. Sora fights with Keyblade as a heavy, two-handed weapon. Riku uses Soul Eater as a one-handed, finesse weapon. Hell, even dark vs. light.

And as someone mentioned, Vorkken. What a damn manimal.

Vorkken fits a lot of my criteria as well, from what I understand. I haven't played a lot of KH past the first one, so I'm not entirely sure how he and Sora work as a rivalry beyond KH1.


I agree that Vergil is one of the best rivals in gaming. Though, i'd put Blue from pokemon up there as well. Being constantly reminded that he is one step ahead of you, you guys also both started in the same city, etc. Just...damn. He infuriated me growing up haha.

I actually think that Blue/Gary from Pokemon is a really well done rival overall. He's always one step ahead, and you keep hearing about his conquests as you travel across the world.
 
I haven't played a lot of KH past the first one, so I'm not entirely sure how he and Sora work as a rivalry beyond KH1..

Its more of a friendly rivalry like the beginning of the first. Nowhere near the intensity of the later parts of the first game when they actually hated each other.
 

NEO0MJ

Member
You reminded me that I need to fnish DMC3. I dropped it when The Evil Within and bayonetta released and didn't come back for it.
 

Kyou

Member
DMC4 was my first and only DMC game(I know I know) but it was still fucking amazing, I really look forward to seeing what they fix and the Vergil stuff
 
Vorkken fits a lot of my criteria as well, from what I understand. I haven't played a lot of KH past the first one, so I'm not entirely sure how he and Sora work as a rivalry beyond KH1.

I'm referring specifically to Riku and Sora in KH1. That's really the only game where they're rivals.
 

Soulflarz

Banned
You reminded me that I need to fnish DMC3. I dropped it when The Evil Within and bayonetta released and didn't come back for it.

This is why you play games one at a time. It also cuts down on frivolous purchases. For example, if you know you wont finish a JRPG for 3 more weeks, and the pre order bonus isnt notable for the new game you want, wait till you need it. It could be half off in under a month (hell, I got COD for $30 ps4 new 4 days after launch, beat it, sold for $45)
 

Kagutaba

Member
I always thought Saren in Mass Effect was a very successful foil and rival to Commander Shepard. Saren being a mirror image of a renegade Shepard, a ruthless and pragmatic Spectre, trying to save the galaxy without realizing the extent of his corruption by the Reapers.
 

Dahbomb

Member
That Vergil 3 theme is one of the GOAT DMC tracks.

Actually fuck it I will go there... it's one of the best tracks in gaming.
 
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