I actually want an itx pc for the living room but cable management scares me.
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"I Need a New PC!" 2015 Part 1. Read the OP and RISE ABOVE FORGED PRECISION SCIENCE
- Thread starter Hazaro
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twdnewh_k
Member
It was upgrade time. My rig was as follows:
i7 930
6gb Ram
Gtx 680
2 normal HDD.
I had the following 2 choices given the budget I had:
1. Gtx 980
120gb OS drive
12 GB Ram
CPU cooler (h80i) to oc cpu to 3.8 or so.
2. Gtx 970
Mobo + i7 4790k
12GB Ram
They would both cost about the same. I went with option 1. Just want to know if it was a good choice.
i7 930
6gb Ram
Gtx 680
2 normal HDD.
I had the following 2 choices given the budget I had:
1. Gtx 980
120gb OS drive
12 GB Ram
CPU cooler (h80i) to oc cpu to 3.8 or so.
2. Gtx 970
Mobo + i7 4790k
12GB Ram
They would both cost about the same. I went with option 1. Just want to know if it was a good choice.
Seems like a fine choice to me. Socket 1150 / Z97 will be on the way out after this year, so holding off on the CPU and motherboard upgrade now means you get to upgrade to Skylake CPU and socket 1151 / Z170 motherboard later when they're out. The H80i is a capable cooler and you'll be able to reuse it with newer motherboards (Z170 motherboards should reuse the socket 115X mounting points).
twdnewh_k
Member
Thanks, it didn't seem like a good time for a CPU upgrade with all the skylake info and rumored dates.
Didn't think I could re-use the cooler, thanks for that good news!
With custom sleeved cables on a small form factor PSU with soldered wires and an overly large cooler for a case that small...
With the newest drivers it felt like the fps (in Far Cry 4) was a lot lower. So i reverted back to the previous Nvidia drivers. And i checked the GPU temp. Wait, 50 degrees celcius in idle mode? That cant be right! Well after some checkups it seems to be perfectly normal with the 980 Strix card because the fans dont spin before the temp reaches 60. All that work for nothing. I thought my GPU was faulty. 
With the newest drivers it felt like the fps (in Far Cry 4) was a lot lower. So i reverted back to the previous Nvidia drivers. And i checked the GPU temp. Wait, 50 degrees celcius in idle mode? That cant be right! Well after some checkups it seems to be perfectly normal with the 980 Strix card because the fans dont spin before the temp reaches 60. All that work for nothing. I thought my GPU was faulty.
So did you have low FPS problems?
Chinbo37
Member
I am helping my friend put together his first build. He of course wants to future proof as much as possible.
He already has a 1440 monitor at 60 hz refresh.
His budget (1600) puts him in GTX 970 territory. Can I in good faith recommend this card to him for use for the next 2 or 3 years? He is a console gamer who wants to skip this gen of consoles and wants to go to PC. I know the 970 is a fine card now but what about in 2 years, will the VRAM issue impact someone who doesnt use SLI and games at 1440?
He already has a 1440 monitor at 60 hz refresh.
His budget (1600) puts him in GTX 970 territory. Can I in good faith recommend this card to him for use for the next 2 or 3 years? He is a console gamer who wants to skip this gen of consoles and wants to go to PC. I know the 970 is a fine card now but what about in 2 years, will the VRAM issue impact someone who doesnt use SLI and games at 1440?
What's your build like? At $1600 (assuming USD) I think that's enough to get a GTX 980.
It seems fine now after reverting back to previous drivers.
Chinbo37
Member
I havent put together the whole build yet, I am waiting for my friend to pick a case he likes. But I am using the starting point of the 1450- build on the first page.
Using those averages adding a 980 would bring it to 1700, considering he also needs a mouse and keyboard.
NaDannMaGoGo
Member
Hey guys, I'm thinking about overclocking (am an OC-virgin yet) my i5 2500k finally and was wondering what's the best way to go about that and what common software will be of help.
MB: Gigabyte GA-Z68XP-UD3 Rev. 1.0
RAM: TeamGroup Elite Series DIMM Kit (ohne HS) 8GB, DDR3-1333, CL9-9-9-24 (TED38192M1333C9)
Already acquired CPU-Z, CoreTemps and CPUID HWMonitor. As far as benchmarks are concerned for testing, should I go with Prime95 or what's the current go-to software?
If there are any especially good articles on overclocking that CPU that would be helpful too. Thanks in advance.
edit: Am aiming at roughly 4GHz. Getting my new cooler in the next couples days (Thermalright HR-02 Macho Rev.B)
MB: Gigabyte GA-Z68XP-UD3 Rev. 1.0
RAM: TeamGroup Elite Series DIMM Kit (ohne HS) 8GB, DDR3-1333, CL9-9-9-24 (TED38192M1333C9)
Already acquired CPU-Z, CoreTemps and CPUID HWMonitor. As far as benchmarks are concerned for testing, should I go with Prime95 or what's the current go-to software?
If there are any especially good articles on overclocking that CPU that would be helpful too. Thanks in advance.
edit: Am aiming at roughly 4GHz. Getting my new cooler in the next couples days (Thermalright HR-02 Macho Rev.B)
Use this as your bible. Lots and lots of information there. What CPU cooler do you have?
The prices on the front are more a guideline than anything else. I can often spec out builds with equivalent performance with quality parts for a bit cheaper. Do you mean most of the parts have already been bought?
Good to hear. Sometimes the latest drivers can lower game performance, usually unintentionally from the graphics drivers being changed to better suit other games.
Chinbo37
Member
Nothing has been bought yet. Just the monitor. Once he picks a case I will list the whole parts list and ask for additional help.
Thanks a lot.
NaDannMaGoGo
Member
Aight, that's a lot of useful information, thanks. Already edited the cooler into the comment (Thermalright HR-02 Macho Rev.B).
Kind of a follow up question to my previous questions. I'm reconsidering the nh-u9b cooler as it seems a bit of a tight fit for the Hadron. I looked at the suggested one in the OP (AXP-100) but could not find one for sale where I live. So I've looked at three alternatives which (apparently) give similar performance to the AXP: Arctic Cooling Freezer 13, CoolerMaster Hyper TX3 EVO and the Noctua NH-L12. Thing is though some websites peg these three as pretty close (within 2-4 degrees of each other) while others report a larger difference. Which one would be the best buy (I understand the Noctua's the best in performance but if the other two are not that far off I'd rather get those)?
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Looks like simplicity and a little more money will get things done. I would do a mini build but it's a low priority vs yearly GPU upgrades. This year was my "tick" in setting up a new rig with all the bells and whistles which will serve me for the next 2-3 years at minimum. Next year will be nearly unlimited budget for high end GPU's.
This is the pic I meant to post but it doesn't really impress vs having the protective film off but I'm not quite ready to remove that from the side panel.NoRéN;152545664 said:
Lockjaw333
Member
Even a stock i5 2500K is nowhere near a bottleneck for games out right now.
I have a GTX 970 and with my 2500k at stock 3.3 ghz vs. overlocked at 4.5ghz i saw zero difference in framerates. I have my 2500K at 4.0 ghz with a negative offset for the time being. If I need to go higher for Witcher 3, which lists the 2500K as minimum CPU (I call BS on that), then I will.
Your 2500K at 4.5 vs a 4690K at 3.5 I would say is probably about the same for gaming. From what I've seen no reason to upgrade from a 2500K yet.
We wait kennah
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
I'm torn over an upgrade, I have a bit of money put aside and have an itch to buy new toys.
Intel Core i5 4440
Gigabyte H87M-HD3
8GB DDR3 1600
120GB Samsung 840 EVO
3TB WD RED
650 Corsair semi-modular PSU
24" iiyama 1080p IPS Monitor
My 7950 killed itself and was out of warranty so I've just been using the integrated GPU.
I have about £400 and can put another £50 on top if it was worth it.
I saw the Dell U2515H 1440P monitor and I really like it but I don't know where to spend my money.
Do I blow most of the money on a GPU or get the monitor and put £150-200 towards a second hand GPU?
If a GPU would be best which would be the best way to go. At the retailer I prefer to use I can get a used 8GB R9 290X for £300 or a new 4GB 970 that has black PCB and has a zero coil whine guarantee for £290.
Intel Core i5 4440
Gigabyte H87M-HD3
8GB DDR3 1600
120GB Samsung 840 EVO
3TB WD RED
650 Corsair semi-modular PSU
24" iiyama 1080p IPS Monitor
My 7950 killed itself and was out of warranty so I've just been using the integrated GPU.
I have about £400 and can put another £50 on top if it was worth it.
I saw the Dell U2515H 1440P monitor and I really like it but I don't know where to spend my money.
Do I blow most of the money on a GPU or get the monitor and put £150-200 towards a second hand GPU?
If a GPU would be best which would be the best way to go. At the retailer I prefer to use I can get a used 8GB R9 290X for £300 or a new 4GB 970 that has black PCB and has a zero coil whine guarantee for £290.
Hoooolllllddddd
My computer is a glorified media server on a 1366x768 TV and I only play old games on it anyway.
I'd upgrade my i3 but 3770s or 2600s are too expensive still and I'm not putting a K CPU in my H67 motherboard.
also 60fps makes me nauseous
The 970 is still a great card if you're happy to accept in reality it's only a 3.5GB card.
The 290X is solid, but new cards from AMD probably aren't far away.
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
I'm not concerned with the whole 3.5gb/0.5gb fiasco. The new AMD cards are unlikely to be around £300 so I don't fancy waiting for them, besides surely a 390/390X or whatever they end up being would be super overkill for 1080p?
1080p screen real-estate is bugging me, I don't want to go dual screen or 4K but the Dell monitor interests me.
Pretty good choices, i would get the 3TB Toshiba ACA model as its just a Hitachi but rebranded. Also it is 7200rpm vs the WD Red 5400rpm.
PSU i would also chose the Seasonic G 550 if you can fit it in the budget
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/550w-seasonic-g-series-hybrid-modular-80-plus-gold-1x120mm-atx-psu
Save some money and get the Crucial MX100 SSD.
2nd hand GPU is fine, 2nd hand GTX 780 or 970 maybe.
Otherwise GTX 970, R9 290X, R9 290 are good options.
I think 8GB is pushing it, very likely that any card today using 8GB will not cope with the load, nor will it in 2 years. Different to the 970 3.5-4Gb issue.
At 1440p you'll want a GTX 970/980 or an R9 290/290X, and I don't know if you can fit both one of those cards and the 1440p monitor into your upgrade budget. Are there any specific games you play that you'd like to see a good performance boost in? The 7950 is a rebadged R9 280, for comparison and reference.
If you don't really have an issue with the way your current 1080p monitor works, then the R9 290 4GB, R9 290X 4GB, or the GTX 970 will be fine. 8GB of VRAM is not needed for 1080p or even 1440p gaming, both of which peak at 3~4GB of VRAM usage at highest settings right now. The 8GB VRAM on those graphics cards is usually meant for 4K gaming.. when you can have two of those R9 290X 8GB in crossfire to guarantee a high enough framerate.
The Powercolor PCS+ R9 290 (£200) represents the best bang for your buck right now. If you don't mind spending more, then the MSI Twin Frozr R9 290X Gaming 4G (£270) is the next step up. If you value features like Shadowplay or have a preference for Nvidia graphics cards, then the GTX 970 at £290 is alright, it'll generally perform close to the R9 290X and sometimes even beat it, depending on the game.
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
Thanks for the advice everyone.
I could probably stretch to £200 for a GPU new or second hand with the £250 1440p monitor.
Would the 4GB 290 be powerful enough for 1440p?
I'm not bothered about AA, 2x FXAA is usually good enough for me.
I could always sell my 1080P monitor as well to put towards graphics.
I could probably stretch to £200 for a GPU new or second hand with the £250 1440p monitor.
Would the 4GB 290 be powerful enough for 1440p?
I'm not bothered about AA, 2x FXAA is usually good enough for me.
I could always sell my 1080P monitor as well to put towards graphics.
Some games youll probably not be able to max out to get 60fps, but i dont see it being a huge trade off.
The AMD cards scale a bit better than Nvidia as resolution increases too.
My only issue is that AMD are set to release new GPUs very soon, and although the rumour is that the 380/380x will be rebranded 290/290x, its likely close to the release the price will fall as retailers clear old stock.
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
I don't mind waiting a little bit, if I can sell my old monitor for £50 or something £250 should be able to get me a second hand 290X or something?
Get a 290X or pony up for a 980. Both are already faster than the 970. Both will increase their lead over the 970 as time goes on since they have superior memory configurations. I know some people still go for the 970, but while it is a good performer it does not justify its price premium over faster or equal 290 cards, and if you have the budget a 980 is king and always recommended.
As in, you either value price-to-performance (290 or 290X easily beat the 970 on this metric) or you simply want the best and will pay a premium for it (980). 970 offers nothing when compared that way, and will undoubtedly age worse than the other cards.
Ally1987
Member
So I just installed the Cooler Master Hyper TX3 Evo in my pc (was kind of a bitch, those push in pins suck ass, there is always one that doesn't want to cooperate) and my cpu temperature in dragon age (skyhold to be precise) dropped from 95 C to 65 C. If I run occt, my temperatures rise to about 80 C before stabilizing. This is probably a good result, right?
65 on average load seems alright to me. I assume OCCT stresses AVX which would explain it going up to 80°C. And yeah, push pins are horrible.
NaDannMaGoGo
Member
I have to give some praise for EVGA's customer support. Roughly 3 weeks ago my EVGA GTX 560ti went bust, as I got increasingly more graphics artifacts and crashes (resulting in BSODs). It was never perfectly stable in the years beforehand but the issues were few and far in between before this.
That card was pretty much on point 2 years 11 months old. I recalled registering it on EVGAs website and gaining an extra year warranty.
Long story short, an hour I go I got a replacement card, that being a EVGA GTX 660 (the completely basic model).
That is fricking great, especially since I really wasn't keen on buying a new one currently. Also thankfully my ears can rest easy now, as I could finally take out my old ATI4830 with it's 2pin fan @_@.
This 660 was slightly bent at the outputs and I had a bit of a tough time screwing in the slot screws, but I got one in without putting much strain on anything and it sits rather tightly now. The 660's fan makes a slightly annoying sound (dunno if that's normal or that fan isn't in perfect condition anymore (after all that's not a new card) but either way, no big deal, especially since it's really low volume (so far when idling anyways).
The extra performance boost over my 560ti is a nice to have of course!
That card was pretty much on point 2 years 11 months old. I recalled registering it on EVGAs website and gaining an extra year warranty.
Long story short, an hour I go I got a replacement card, that being a EVGA GTX 660 (the completely basic model).
That is fricking great, especially since I really wasn't keen on buying a new one currently. Also thankfully my ears can rest easy now, as I could finally take out my old ATI4830 with it's 2pin fan @_@.
This 660 was slightly bent at the outputs and I had a bit of a tough time screwing in the slot screws, but I got one in without putting much strain on anything and it sits rather tightly now. The 660's fan makes a slightly annoying sound (dunno if that's normal or that fan isn't in perfect condition anymore (after all that's not a new card) but either way, no big deal, especially since it's really low volume (so far when idling anyways).
The extra performance boost over my 560ti is a nice to have of course!
Where was that reported? I thought they were going to be all new cards with the massive 300w TDP and stacked memory or whatever.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
I'm sure your rig isn't going to be low end anytime soon
And you have that damn GSYNC piece.
On a side note, I run Arma 3 between 30 and 90fps. I shouldn't expect much given the engine and I'm now running the game at 1440p with everything maxed.
I haven't even overckocked the CPU or GPU's.
Read it on the thread on Gaf, but as i said it was rumoured that only the 390/390X is using the new memory style too. Can never really be sure about these things till release either way.
So far there are only rumors of Hawaii (290X) being rebranded for their second tier in the 300 series. It's pretty much known that a beefy high end chip with stacked memory is coming which might be the 390X. Rumors flip flopped so many times now that we don't even know how their new (and possibly not so new) cards will be branded.
Rebranding Hawaii to combat 970/980 for another generation doesn't seem like a good idea to me though. The 290s are already dirt cheap and they use a bigger and more power hungry chip, so their margins are probably already extremely low. Like you said, time will tell.
Update
The store called today and told me to deliver the rig back for new tests and to change the broken parts without any further costs for me
I also told them to keep both the cooler and the vga off the case after installation, or i might as well go for a 2 hou drive and pick it up myself at this point, just to be sure
The store called today and told me to deliver the rig back for new tests and to change the broken parts without any further costs for me
I also told them to keep both the cooler and the vga off the case after installation, or i might as well go for a 2 hou drive and pick it up myself at this point, just to be sure
I'm sure your rig isn't going to be low end anytime soon
And you have that damn GSYNC piece.
On a side note, I run Arma 3 between 30 and 90fps. I shouldn't expect much given the engine and I'm now running the game at 1440p with everything maxed.
I haven't even overckocked the CPU or GPU's.
I have a 4930k with a single Titan Black. I am but a shell of my former self and I am dissapoint
I'm in the MJ White Sox phase of my PC career
I don't know how you can even get out of bed into your sports car some days
Lockjaw333
Member
I've seen you say that a few times now, but I wouldn't say the 290x is faster than a 970. On some games it beats the 970 in benchmarks, but on many games the 970 beats it, at least at 1080p. I would hazard a guess that the 970 beats the 290x in more instances than it doesn't. The story changes at higher resolutions though.
The 290x is a better price to performance in horsepower and does have a full 4GB memory configuration. I went with the 970 because of a preference for Nvidia drivers and graphical effects, and also how cool and efficient it runs.
I've pushed the 970 past 3.5gb and havent seen any negatives. Mordor was using 3.8ish and was running perfectly. Not doubting that its an issue, especially at higher resolutions, but I haven't seen it yet. For a cooler and lower power draw card with newer architecture and DX12 support, along with Nvidia drivers and effects, I took the gamble. Amazon also refunded me 20% after I chatted with support about the false 4GB advertising, so I effectively got it for the price / lower of a 290x.
The R9 290, on the other hand, is an insane value to me, and I almost went that direction. 5% less performance for way less, I actually ordered an MSI 290 for $250 but ended up cancelling it.
So, have you already retired #23 then?
It's gonna be all weird when you come back again with a new number. I spose the only way to do that is by going AMD on the graphics card, right?
Yep.
You're insane dude! I can't get over how powerful my rig is with a 4970k and titan black. Like it runs literally everything maxed out @ 60fps. I love this thing.
I've even dabbled in downsampling, but having a messed up hud/menus is messing with me.
Well he has to buy a sports car first.
I thought he had a chevy cooooohhhhh.... I see
A few points to note. Most aftermarket 970 reviews are compared to reference 290X. A reference 290X hits its peak 95 C temp quickly, and throttles. An aftermarket never reaches this temperature, and provides better performance. Most aftermarket 290s perform inbetween a reference 290 and 290X even if not OC'd because of this. And most 290X's perform far better than you might think.
This 290X at stock is only 5% overclocked compared to a reference 290X. Yet it is 20% faster because it runs at that 105% the entire time, where the reference 290X hits 95 C quickly and drops clocks below 100% (see the PCS at stock is only 5% faster clocks, you can ignore OC results).
https://www.techwarelabs.com/wp-content/gallery/pcs-290x-8gb-1/shadowofmordor.jpg
Secondly, I tend to consider recent game releases the most because they are either more likely to be played, or more demanding on average. In 10 games released in 2014, most in the fall, even a reference 290X is superior to a 970 at 1080.
http://gamegpu.ru/images/remote/htt...rds-game_2014-video-test-games__2014_1920.jpg
And, the poster in question stated its for a 1440 build. 970 vs 290X at 1080 is debatable, and if you consider that 970 overclocks further, that res may still favour a 970 user who is aggressive with their OCing. But at 1440, it's pretty cut and dry.
For example, TPU is often highly cited. They use reference 290s in their reviews. Even with throttling, in the latest GPU average from TPU the 290X is only 1% slower than a 970 at 1080. I would never doubt for a second that the 290X is throttling in some games, and would be faster with aftermarket vs aftermarket.
http://tpucdn.com/reviews/Gigabyte/GTX_960_G1_Gaming/images/perfrel_1920.gif
You will get better OC headroom from the 970, so it's a pretty fair comparison at 1080 when you consider better OC from 970 vs non-throttling aftermarket 290X actually giving proper performance. But if at 1440 even a throttling 290X is beating a 970, I wonder if better OCing would be enough for the 970 to catch up?
http://tpucdn.com/reviews/Gigabyte/GTX_960_G1_Gaming/images/perfrel_2560.gif
Maybe. I would say stock vs stock on aftermarkets 290X is definitely faster at 1440 and, according to most new games, even better at 1080. With OCing, who knows. Maybe it was a bit presumptuous, but I'd still say that for the user I was replying to (1440 user) that the 290X is the faster card on average. And from brand agnostic users, I still hold that 290, 290X, and 980 make the most sense right now because you either want a good bang for the buck, or you want the best.
970 meets a niche for CUDA or G Sync users, 3D Vision, etc users that want to save some cash over the 980, but unless you really need these things it doesn't make sense for the average user (amazon giving you a rebate was worth it, you essentially paid the same price as a 290X, which I can understand favouring the 970 at 1080 if the cards are the same price since you can never go wrong with lower power consumption and heat distribution, though the false advertising still leaves me sour so I'd probably still go AMD in your case, but to each his own).
AliceInJam
Member
Just got my new build in the mail! Going to start building tonight, wish me luck!
lordfuzzybutt
Member
Just got my new build in the mail! Going to start building tonight, wish me luck!
Good luck. Looks like it's gonna be a solid build.
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