foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
Woo, been waiting for this
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Matthewmatosis: Super Mario 3D World review
- Thread starter chaobreaker
- Start date
The video does a great job in articulating why the game does so well in evolving and encapsulating the Mario franchise as a whole through subtle ways that might not be clear to everyone at first glance.
Still an incredible experience to go back to and relive due to how many options the game provides with its timeless design. It might not scream it's strengths as profoundly as the predecessors but it's in no way a lesser game.
Still an incredible experience to go back to and relive due to how many options the game provides with its timeless design. It might not scream it's strengths as profoundly as the predecessors but it's in no way a lesser game.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
When Galaxy came out, I think there was a lot of uncertainty when it came to the future of Mario. It was sort of a "where do we go from here?" moment for a lot of people. Galaxy pretty much took Mario to its logical conclusion, and it was hard seeing Nintendo dialing things back.
But that's what I like about 3D World...it goes to show you can actually come back down to orbit, and dial things down a bit while still having a great game. 3D World has a much more classic feeling to it than Galaxy does for me thanks to the larger variety of enemies, multiple playable characters, and back-to-the-basics gameplay with a lot of surprises still, not to mention I love how we got a return to the old-school 2D Art.
I think in the long run, 3D World will be looked back upon much more fondly than Galaxy is, and stay in people's memories alongside SMB3 and SMW.
But that's what I like about 3D World...it goes to show you can actually come back down to orbit, and dial things down a bit while still having a great game. 3D World has a much more classic feeling to it than Galaxy does for me thanks to the larger variety of enemies, multiple playable characters, and back-to-the-basics gameplay with a lot of surprises still, not to mention I love how we got a return to the old-school 2D Art.
I think in the long run, 3D World will be looked back upon much more fondly than Galaxy is, and stay in people's memories alongside SMB3 and SMW.
Stereogatari
Banned
Just played through modt of this last month. Will be a timely watch 
While we're talking about the greatness of this game, check out this video on the level design philosphy behind it. The folks at EAD continue to wow me.
Nocturnowl
Member
I think this was his best video of the series from an analysis standpoint, I also can't believe I never noticed how careful placement of small scenery details highlight certain spots in a discrete manner, I'll never look at those sprinkles the same way again.
SpiceMelange
Member
You see glimpses of the final boss fight and final levels.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
I'd say it's about as spoilery as a 3D World video could be. There won't be any surprises left if you watch it.
Definitely reminds me that the controls in 3D World did not feel as great as the Galaxy games. I would have loved having a fairly static angle with full analog control.
And as a note, while the visuals in 3D World are "simpler", I actually somewhat enjoy them more. I think Captain Toad shows off much better the things they can do with the style.
I felt like 3D World made concessions to make better multiplayer at the expense of single player. I still enjoyed my time playing it, though. I certainly enjoyed it more than Galaxy 2. That one never clicked with me.
EDIT: Also as a note, I just sat and watched the entire series. Hadn't seen them before.
And as a note, while the visuals in 3D World are "simpler", I actually somewhat enjoy them more. I think Captain Toad shows off much better the things they can do with the style.
I felt like 3D World made concessions to make better multiplayer at the expense of single player. I still enjoyed my time playing it, though. I certainly enjoyed it more than Galaxy 2. That one never clicked with me.
EDIT: Also as a note, I just sat and watched the entire series. Hadn't seen them before.
The only thing 3D World really dialed down was spectacle. True that zipping through space made for more spectacle, but it was at the cost of platforming gameplay; more time is spent watching. The most spectacle came from the sling stars, which amounted to little more than cutscenes. 3D World eschews some spectacle in favor of taking 3D Mario to new pure platforming gameplay heights while still maintaining very beautiful world with a great aesthetic. Sling stars are replaced with warp boxes that instantly take you to the next part of a level. While flying through space was cool, I have few qualms with them dedicating more content to gameplay.
I wish they did more with the Matter Splatter concept, though. That was really cool and fits well with traditional platforming.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
Another point that hurts Galaxy for me in terms of longevity is the Wii Remote being vital to the experience, it always seems when I wanna play a Wii Game the Wii Remote is dead, and I gotta remove the plastic covering and switch the batteries out.
The various Wii Remote Mini-Games also sort of turn me off of replays, as I don't look forward to those. Mario 3D World had the Touch Screen levels, but those are far more manageable and add to the basic platforming experience (not to mention there's only like five or so?), as opposed to replacing it. Plessie is also a fun gameplay switch-up that I find is incorporated pretty seamlessly into the main experience, and I'm not opposed to seeing more levels utilizing him, or a new dinosaur pal, in the next 3D World.
The various Wii Remote Mini-Games also sort of turn me off of replays, as I don't look forward to those. Mario 3D World had the Touch Screen levels, but those are far more manageable and add to the basic platforming experience (not to mention there's only like five or so?), as opposed to replacing it. Plessie is also a fun gameplay switch-up that I find is incorporated pretty seamlessly into the main experience, and I'm not opposed to seeing more levels utilizing him, or a new dinosaur pal, in the next 3D World.
I like the Wii remote for the spin attack and using it to collect and shoot star bits is okay, but I thought stuff like the pull stars were the weakest part of the game and too frequent. I just want to run and jump around. I think the reason the touch screen stuff works better is because it complimented Mario's platforming rather than replacing it. You're still running around and jumping while doing it. 3D World very seldom takes control away or vastly changes the gameplay. It stays a Mario game through and through.
finally watched it. His mario 64 review was awesome, but it wasn't until his sunshine (which i still play sometimes) review that i noticed how talented he was at pointing out all the little touches and specially at describing the feeling of each game as a whole. He completely nailed shunshine and continued doing it with his following videos.
Another way of looking at it would be to say that i liked his videos because he was saying what i wanted to hear haha (while also showing me things that i hadn't notice)
Another way of looking at it would be to say that i liked his videos because he was saying what i wanted to hear haha
(while also showing me things that i hadn't notice)Green Mamba
Member
I haven't watched the video yet, but I always felt that 3D World had technically amazing graphics wasted on some pretty boring art.
Mr. Nice_Guy
Member
I was just listening the first Galaxy review today on a run, nice timing will watch now.
I don't get the desire to have all levels in a world have the same theme. Variety keeps things fresh. Definitely disagree when he said that it's not exciting to see what comes next because of the inconsistent themes. It was always interesting what kinds of worlds and mechanics they'd throw you into next.
I'm also surprised he didn't bring up any of the camera issues in multiplayer. I only played it single player, but I've watched people on youtube struggle a lot with it.
I'm also surprised he didn't bring up any of the camera issues in multiplayer. I only played it single player, but I've watched people on youtube struggle a lot with it.
Oh no. The art is great. Best Mario has ever looked. I'm not sure they can take the artstyle much further. It's literally Mario's art fully realized in 3D. Really all they need to do going further is make things more detailed. The only thing that detracts from the game visually for me is that most of the levels are floating in the sky. I think that was due to time constraints more than anything, though, since 3D Land avoided this by having the worlds extend down beyond sight. Given more time they probably would have taken care of stuff like that.
Well, look at NSMB. People complain about the world themes but honestly I've always found them to be unfounded. I mean, a world will be a desert world, yes, but it's hard to say it's right to complain about it being full of desert levels since no two levels play alike. The levels share visual aesthetics and the level gimmicks may or may not have to do with the world theme, but they hold ample variety in actual level design and gimmicks used. You might even say that adhering to world themes forces them to be more creative with level design since they can't just rely on visual variety.
entremet
Member
Very much so, unless you don't care about being surprised about the levels and end bosses, etc.
He mentions in these reviews, which are long form, that you'll be spoiled immensely.
They also work better once you played the game since he really goes into detail. It an almost 30 minute review.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
Fantastic review, as always. I expected him to be more critical, but it was a compelling analysis nonetheless.
I agree. It breaks the "immersion" for me. Same with the fact that the levels aren't themed after the worlds they appear in. If you can get past that, then 3D World has by far the best level design in the series.
I agree. It breaks the "immersion" for me. Same with the fact that the levels aren't themed after the worlds they appear in. If you can get past that, then 3D World has by far the best level design in the series.
I'm not even a Nintendo stan but even I have to agree with that whole heartedly. The Mario games are still a masterclass of their genre, and represent gaming as a whole admirably. If we can't rely on Mario to handle its shit, what can we rely on?
Refreshment.01
Member
i kind of get the impression the reviewer was trying to go against expectations with this review. He made a huge deal about the perceived simplification of the Galaxy games but kind of went easy with 3D World.
Commendable job covering all aspects of the game, i was expecting him to touch the multiplayer aspect superficially yet it was the complete opposite. Only thing he missed to comment about that i can remember now are the Mii Ghosts, which are a great incentive to promote competitive play even in single player.
He seems to have a sweet spot for Sunshine and 3D World.
Commendable job covering all aspects of the game, i was expecting him to touch the multiplayer aspect superficially yet it was the complete opposite. Only thing he missed to comment about that i can remember now are the Mii Ghosts, which are a great incentive to promote competitive play even in single player.
He seems to have a sweet spot for Sunshine and 3D World.
Boss fights are a huge downgrade from Galaxy, that chapter in the Mario series kind of spoiled me and made expect decent boss fights in Mario games XD
i do understand what you are saying and agree. However, i don't think the touch screen aspect works as you said it does. Having total control over the pointer and star spin without compromising any of the move set or taking finger time, is something that Galxy does better than the touch screen function in 3D World. The things you talk about are segment and mechanics more designer driven than an inherent aspect of the type of input method.
You get both visual variety and level design/gimmick variety in 3D World. I dunno, it only ever occurred to me as a positive when I'd find a Mario Kart speed boost level in the ice world or a Plessie sand surfing stage in the Bowser world. Kept things fresh and less formulaic.
On the other hand, I don't think NSMB gets criticism for having consistently themed worlds. It's more that they're the same themes we've seen countless times in mario games, and the NSMB games being so similar looking compounds the issue. At least in 3D Mario the presentation is bumped up quite a bit, and the games change in art style just enough that they don't feel like retreads.
Eh, I disagree. Maybe a minor downgrade if anything. Megaleg and Kingfin are really the only ones that stand out to me as beyond 3D World. Galaxy having just an extended version of the same Bowser fight you did 2 times already for a final boss was kinda disappointing, whereas 3D World had a very unique final boss. I'd put the rest of the bosses at the same level.
The point is that most of the wiimote stuff in Galaxy takes away control of Mario and completely changes the gameplay; most notably pull stars, which are abundant. I already said that the spin was great and general pointer use were great. The spin, though, isn't really comparable the touch screen stuff, as that could have been mapped to a button and is something Mario himself does as opposed to the pointer/stylus doing something to Mario/the environment. When you are asked to tap on a block or blow into the microphone you are still in full control of Mario as you do that.
3D World thankfully is very limited in how much it asks you to use the touch screen, but there are plenty of opportunities to use it yourself. This review shows a good one where you can use it to activate the switch blocks rather than having to run over every single one. Blowing into the microphone also comes in hand for revealing secrets or bypassing certain enemies that can't be harmed otherwise.
I didn't mean to imply that 3D World doesn't have variety in level design. However the NSMB games have more variety, and it may be that keeping consistent world themes is a part of that. The level design has to vary more greatly because of it.
And of course there are people tired of just the themes themselves, but some say things like "I'm sick of desert levels." I'd ask what is a desert level? Since no two levels are alike how can we really prescribe a type to levels beyond aesthetics. World 2 in 3D World is a desert and there's no reason why Shadow Play Alley couldn't have been inside a Pyramid, Really Rolling Hills couldn't have been the exact same level but with desert textures instead of grass or making it look like an oasis, or Puffrod Peaks couldn't have had more of an arabian look to it. They can still keep up visual variety and world consistency at the same time.
Mr. Nice_Guy
Member
Love the prescription for fun analogy, fits it's perfectly. Great finish to this set of reviews, eagerly looking forward to what he does next.
Please be a Bloodborne video
I agree with most of what he says. Decreased movement options were somewhat disappointing and the bosses were just okay. I liked Hisstocrat, Motley Bossblob, and the final boss, but the rest were just meh, especially Boom Boom and Pom Pom who I was already sick of seeing halfway through 3D Land.
The only thing I don't agree with is that I like the level variety in each world, 6 or 7 desert/ice levels in a row would have been miserable. I can understand why he prefers the levels to match the world they're in but it's not worth the monotony and repetition it creates.
I also thought the game started out pretty slow with the first 6 worlds being very hit or miss but I guess he liked the stellar end worlds so much he was fine with giving the opening worlds a pass.
The only thing I don't agree with is that I like the level variety in each world, 6 or 7 desert/ice levels in a row would have been miserable. I can understand why he prefers the levels to match the world they're in but it's not worth the monotony and repetition it creates.
I also thought the game started out pretty slow with the first 6 worlds being very hit or miss but I guess he liked the stellar end worlds so much he was fine with giving the opening worlds a pass.
I mostly agree with the review but disagree on some points.
First, I feel the game is much less stiff than the review implies. Progression is indeed stiff since levels are mostly linear and level progression doesn't leave much choices either. However, every level feels like a small playground where you can do so much stuff. The game has many easter eggs and little tricks that you can do if you search hard enough. Most levels also have more than one path to beat them, particularly depending on what powerup you are carrying. Powerups, in fact, really open the game since you can carry them everywhere. This gives you a lot of freedom to play the game however you want. For example, that stage where you guide those green platforms can be completely "broken" with the tanooki suit. Same goes for that one level with the giant ant enemies.
Second, while I agree that this game takes many things from other games, I disliked that he claimed it doesn't innovate much. There are several new "gimmicks" in this game and he shouldn't have dismissed them and say that only the Cherry and Cat Suit are new. As a disclaimer, I didn't play 3D Land so maybe I'm wrong!
And finally, I'm not sure what point he was trying to make with the music. An orchestra isn't immediately better than a big band. Orchestral "epic" music isn't better than "playful" jazz. It's silly to label one style more ambitious than the other when both games have outstanding soundtracks and I'd even say 3DWorld's is way more experimental. You have some orchestral tunes, some jazzy tunes, synth heavy tunes, some rock-ish songs and even a japanese themed one.
First, I feel the game is much less stiff than the review implies. Progression is indeed stiff since levels are mostly linear and level progression doesn't leave much choices either. However, every level feels like a small playground where you can do so much stuff. The game has many easter eggs and little tricks that you can do if you search hard enough. Most levels also have more than one path to beat them, particularly depending on what powerup you are carrying. Powerups, in fact, really open the game since you can carry them everywhere. This gives you a lot of freedom to play the game however you want. For example, that stage where you guide those green platforms can be completely "broken" with the tanooki suit. Same goes for that one level with the giant ant enemies.
Second, while I agree that this game takes many things from other games, I disliked that he claimed it doesn't innovate much. There are several new "gimmicks" in this game and he shouldn't have dismissed them and say that only the Cherry and Cat Suit are new. As a disclaimer, I didn't play 3D Land so maybe I'm wrong!
And finally, I'm not sure what point he was trying to make with the music. An orchestra isn't immediately better than a big band. Orchestral "epic" music isn't better than "playful" jazz. It's silly to label one style more ambitious than the other when both games have outstanding soundtracks and I'd even say 3DWorld's is way more experimental. You have some orchestral tunes, some jazzy tunes, synth heavy tunes, some rock-ish songs and even a japanese themed one.
Refreshment.01
Member
That's just one boss fight 3D World has over the Galaxy games, that final one. The rest don't come even close. Galaxy series has the best boss fights in ane Mario game. Here's a refresher:
Galaxy 1:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KELFYCIJrM4
Galaxy 2:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mtn75w1SjeQ
Now let me explain my point again. What you say is not related to input method but what the designer chooses to do.
There isn't anything preventing (save designer's decision) to have the same touch screen interactivity in 3D World by using the the Wii Remote sensor instead of the touch screen. You could use the Wii Remote pointer to stop enemies, touch icon blocks, tap platforms etc while having the advantage over the touch screen because while doing so all the abilities are retained. With the touch screen you can move and crouch but not jump. Only advantage of the touch screen is increased precision but this is not critical in 3D World.
Related to the above and speaking about the Star Spin, is just not about substituting a button with a motion. Is about having that move available independent of what other things your fingers might be doing. With the Wii Remote you can be jumping, controlling direction, moving and star spining at all times.
citroen-e402
Member
The commentator's voice seems familiar, maybe I watch his previous videos. I really enjoyed the game, went back and played the levels with more vigour, and found that I had more fun when fully engaged (well, duh!).
Astral Dog
Member
I love the spin attack of Galaxy, made killing enemies fun, among other things and also helped the boss battles to be a bit more dynamic.
Unfortunately these controls are impossible after the Wii and 3D World lost something on the transition, it was a one in a lifetime thing.
Unfortunately these controls are impossible after the Wii and 3D World lost something on the transition, it was a one in a lifetime thing.
Throwaway123456789
Member
Leafhopper
Banned
I am not sure I get what you mean.
I'm well aware of Galaxy's bosses, but 3D World's are mostly in the same league apart from Megaleg and Bonefin. Hisstocrat, Motley Bossblob, King Ka-Thunk, Prince Bully, and Boss Brolder are great and on par with Dino Piranha, King Kaliente, Bugaboom, Topmaniac, Bouldergeist, Major Burrows, and Baron Burr. The only disappointing bosses in 3D World are Boom Boom and Pom Pom. They really should have made them able to at least get one attack off per hit.
The NSMB games have more variety than 3D World? I never got that impression personally. One level to the next in 3D World is often completely different in every way, from looks to gameplay to music. Music is another thing to consider. Often levels that share the same visual themes also share the same or similar music. You won't often get repeating themes in 3DW. Don't understand how you're keeping visual variety by coloring Shadow Play Alley and Really Rolling Hills to make them look more desert-y. They may not look exactly alike but they're no longer as distinct as they once were.
At the end of the day I just don't care that much about world consistency unless Nintendo were to go all out with it and connect the levels together in a meaningful way. Make it open world or have the stages share/revolve around distinct, important landmarks. Simply grouping like-themed stages together or coloring stages to look similar doesn't do anything for me.
edit: I don't even particularly like the idea of an open world pure platformer, but such a game would at least have the benefit of a nice cohesive world.
I loved how seamless the Wiimote integration felt in the Galaxy games. I could be running around and casually collecting starbits at the same time. It was all so natural, like the Wiimote was designed with Galaxy in mind. Also really liked the motion control minigames like the rolling star ball and the manta ray.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
Mario Galaxy had some cool bosses...
But overall, I think 3D World has the best representation when it comes to both new and old enemies alike, and making them all fit together seamlessly.
Galaxy, and even Sunshine and 64, sort of was weird as a lot of classic enemies had some pretty weird re-designs, and usually the new enemies made for those games stuck out. I think 3D World had a nice balance between familiar and new.
But overall, I think 3D World has the best representation when it comes to both new and old enemies alike, and making them all fit together seamlessly.
Galaxy, and even Sunshine and 64, sort of was weird as a lot of classic enemies had some pretty weird re-designs, and usually the new enemies made for those games stuck out. I think 3D World had a nice balance between familiar and new.
Davey Cakes
Member
Is the timer worse than the original SMB games?
I mean, in one case you can see the complaint as not adapting to the times. On the other hand, did we not play games with timers as kids ourselves? Did we not adapt and get better within the constraints willed by the developers?
Nintendo trying to restore the ways of the old times does not seem like a bad thing necessarily.
And it's not like all their games try to rush the player. Captain Toad (as an example because it uses the 3D World engine) has no time limits probably because Nintendo realized it best works as a relaxed puzzle game where you need time to figure out the puzzles.
Linear platformers seem more about getting better and faster at traversing the level design.
But, just for my opinion as a Mario veteran, 3D World's time was zero issue most of the time.
LOL
He really loved the mario galaxy 2 video xD
Also, strange that he didn't mentioned the shell surf and the roll ....
Yes.
But if you played the last mario games like galaxy and 3d land you know what to expect.
He really loved the mario galaxy 2 video xD
Also, strange that he didn't mentioned the shell surf and the roll ....
Yes.
But if you played the last mario games like galaxy and 3d land you know what to expect.
Maybe he didn't know about it. Whenever I post this gif it blows a surprising amount of minds:
AzureTranquility95
Banned
Want to replay this with my friend so bad. This was one of the best co-op experiences I've ever had.
EVER.
EVER.
Maybe he didn't know about it. Whenever I post this gif it blows a surprising amount of minds:
You can do that?!??
Belgian Dude
Member
You can do that?!??
If I ever make a RTTP about 3D World in the distant future its definitely going to be "Yes, you can slide around in the Koopa Shells"
I didn't know about this, the Spin jump and the "super ground pound" for the longest time. And this in particular is awesome.
The ground pound jump can be pretty useful since ground pounding usually leaves you vulnerable. I also used the spin jump a lot.