That version had Ultras though.
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Street Fighter V Beta 2 Thread: Welcome, future 21007s! Now on PC!
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That version had Ultras though.
CountBlack
Member
highkey best version of SFV
Razzorn34
Member
Agreed on Chun-Li. That version of her got me hype for the game. Instead of tweaking the new stuff, they decided to keep her boring. So, I could care less now.
DR2K
Banned
Well when a move is negative on hit it defies the logic of frame data. Does a move need to be "good"? No, but a move should never leave you open for 50% if it lands. That's just bad design.
Nothing about her Target combo was broken. It's applications were already limited. Now it's practically worthless pending any major discoveries. It really goes against the make the character the best they can be mantra in every way. Because it kills combo potential and options and makes the character less than what they can be. If it was doing too much damage there are ways of lowering damage and keeping its applications.
I can not tell you the viability of SFV Cammy. I can tell you Capcom is going to be in a really awkward position balance wise if they actually start designing the new characters to be the best they can be and keep up these types of nerfs all the way to Feb on the current cast.
Respectfully disagree. I wasn't interested in SFV at all until it's showing at E3. Pretty combos and camera angles doesn't decide the value of fighting games for me.
The Lone Dragon
Member
Yes, you do, because what I said wasn't difficult to understand.
Capcom is capable of making well made, lasting games. They proven it numerous times. USF4 is one of the most balanced SF games ever, and it has 44 characters.
And, here you are saying Capcom doesn't deserve credit, just because Cammy's close HK isn't good.
That's ridiculous.
Chun Li is like crack in current SF5. She is extremely fun, and I personally don't need long flashy juggles to make her so. She just feels really good to use.
Stone Ocean
Member
Chun is ultra underrated. She's fun as shit and super smooth, I'm seriously considering playing her instead of Mika, solid solid solid.
ãInaba Residentã
Banned
This version probably still had ultras so hell no
CountBlack
Member
She does look fun in the current version of SFV, but I can see her being nerfed (Ryu'd) back to normal.
Can't be having too much fun now.
I wish they kept this at least for Chun or this and this
Ryu was still boring ordinary man. I definitely liked the look of the China stage in that version more. The whole gauge situation definitely wasn't figured out so that's why Revenge meter was just a placeholder for whatever they were going for.
The game just feels.. so bland for me. Very barebones and it seems like they're pushing to make it even more plain.
Maybe they could add more CA's and make it 3s-esque; more than 3 bars, overlaying meter so it can be stacked (3 bars of meter on top of another 3 bars, so you can use ex moves and have super available)
Give characters another V-Trigger?
hitsugi
Member
I can definitely see this happening down the road.
I imagine it will have the same progression as SF4 to Super to Super AE etc
Year 1: Hotfixes on glitches/bugs and balancing along with DLC costumes, (maybe)stages and character releases
Year 2-3: I can see a major "Super" update being added to the game where they'll introduce 2nd CA's and a new mechanic or two to keep it fresh and to bring back any players that dropped it at this point.
Considering how close we are to the retail release. I doubt we'll see any major gameplay additions at this point other than making final adjustments to current moves we already know of.
Year 1: Hotfixes on glitches/bugs and balancing along with DLC costumes, (maybe)stages and character releases
Year 2-3: I can see a major "Super" update being added to the game where they'll introduce 2nd CA's and a new mechanic or two to keep it fresh and to bring back any players that dropped it at this point.
Considering how close we are to the retail release. I doubt we'll see any major gameplay additions at this point other than making final adjustments to current moves we already know of.
ShinMaruku
Member
Some people have been warped by sf4. >_>
in more ways than one. I feel like people are trying to put a triangle in a square hole as to their approach with SFV.
CountBlack
Member
Of course it looked super choppy as it was the first build that was shown off. I just preferred the specials Chun had in that version
excluding V-Trigger soul fist
More V-Triggers/Supers would definitely add more flare to the game, but you're right the core gameplay would still be boring. And yea, I've realized this game might not be for me as much as I'd like it to be.
I think more supers would be redundant especially in a game where meter doesn't stack but I definitely see the potential for multiple V-triggers, V-Skills, or both. It shakes up the core gameplay a bit because it adds variance to the way you play your character and how you carry out the match with them.
sixteen-bit
Member
Evil Ryu install incoming
Damn that CA did almost no damage back then.
After 7 years of people bitching about SF4 and calling it trash I never expected people to want the next one to be similar to it.
As for the 2nd CA vs. 2nd V-Trigger thing, I'm not sure what they'll do (if either). CAs don't seem specific enough for them to create a functionally different alternative. In SF4 you may choose damage vs. combo usage, ground super vs. anti-air, power-up super vs. regular super, etc. In SF5 all the CAs do a lot of damage, take a full bar, and can be combined into. Damage is so high across the board that an anti-air wouldn't shut down jumping if an EX anti-air could do comparable damage.
I guess the ideas for V-Triggers are endless but I feel some are already too similar that creating 44 unique ones (for a 22 character cast) would be difficult.
Which is the right way to go.
CountBlack
Member
I'm surprised they didn't make that or his MvC3 form his V-Trigger tbh.
I guess it would've been a lot like Necalli already.
Everything except for the stage looks better tbh.
I still don't know why they haven't added anymore stage transitions except for the China stage. Seems like something they wish they could've taken away but the backlash would've been harsh.
not Mika harsh
The Forgotten Waterfall stage seems to have something more to the far right, but so far it's only been a 1 part stage. Maybe it's story related?
I don't think they will make other V-Skill or V-Trigger for characters. At maximum, they will add functionalities to it, like make Chun-Li jump different an extra input id added (for example: back + v trigger could make a shorter jump).
Multiples CAs, I don't want it to be honest. People would end up using the best out of two in most cases.
Regarding the specials mentioned in the first showing of the game, as a Chun-Li player, I would like them back because it would be fun. But after beta 2, I would say Chun-Li doesn't need them. In beta 1 she felt rather incomplete, but in beta 2 was much, much better.
I would love to have the aerial hazanshu though, I think it's a really cool move and the combos people could come up with would be fun.
Multiples CAs, I don't want it to be honest. People would end up using the best out of two in most cases.
Regarding the specials mentioned in the first showing of the game, as a Chun-Li player, I would like them back because it would be fun. But after beta 2, I would say Chun-Li doesn't need them. In beta 1 she felt rather incomplete, but in beta 2 was much, much better.
I would love to have the aerial hazanshu though, I think it's a really cool move and the combos people could come up with would be fun.
CountBlack
Member
SF4 has had the highest entrants consistently for the last 7 years tho, somebody out there likes it
The damage from CA's aren't that high IMO. Laura's CA doesn't do much damage especially. Even without scaling the damage is medioce.
In the first beta I would've said that damage across the board was high, but they've been consistently nerfing that damage and combo potential. (S/O's to Ryu/Vega/Ken/Nash and soon to be R. Mika)
Yeah the absence of stage transitions since the very first one is really weird. Wouldn't be surprised if some stages get something different till the game's release tho.
They may be saving stuff like that for the final release.
CountBlack
Member
ShinMaruku
Member
It has legacy and the money in the last few years is a big contibutor. If there was no 500K numbers would be less.
That's what i have been trying to tell some people about SFV.
DR2K
Banned
What you stated has no relevance to my statement. I gave a solid example of a serious design flaw and somehow you twisted it into me saying Capcom can't balance a game. It's a leap of logic that holds no merit.
I'd call USFIV well balanced for what it's worth, still has flaws and balance inconsistencies. Healing Elena, those are always fun. (Said no one ever)
DryEyeRelief
Member
No confirmation but if I had to take a guess, before the month is over.
ShinMaruku
Member
USF4 is balanced only by vitrue that it's had years of iteration. How the game launched and how it is now is very different.
CountBlack
Member
and it'd still dwarf the competition in numbers tbh
I've been healing since day 1 and have found it fun ever since
Teknopathetic
Member
"USF4 is balanced only by vitrue that it's had years of iteration. How the game launched and how it is now is very different."
While this is true, I think people underestimate just how much broken stuff was in Vanilla SF4 because the game hadn't been figured out yet. Infinites, unblockables (that hadn't been discovered yet), vortexes (that hadn't been yet discovered), character potential (that hadn't been discovered yet). I keep repeating it, but Sagat would've been dropped to middle tier if Vanilla was still played for another year or two. He really wasn't that good.
While this is true, I think people underestimate just how much broken stuff was in Vanilla SF4 because the game hadn't been figured out yet. Infinites, unblockables (that hadn't been discovered yet), vortexes (that hadn't been yet discovered), character potential (that hadn't been discovered yet). I keep repeating it, but Sagat would've been dropped to middle tier if Vanilla was still played for another year or two. He really wasn't that good.
Spinosaurus
Member
Is there any place where I can find out more about this? I find it really interesting.
Teknopathetic
Member
"Is there any place where I can find out more about this? I find it really interesting."
All of those are things that would eventually shape Super, AE, and AE2012. The vortex set play, the various unblockables, the strength of characters people had kind of ignored in Vanilla like Seth, Gen (who got completely eviscerated in Super when only 2 players were playing him), Fei Long, or Sakura. If you look for videos Vanilla SF4 of Yeb or Jibbo you'll see what was capable with Gen before they drastically changed him.
All of those are things that would eventually shape Super, AE, and AE2012. The vortex set play, the various unblockables, the strength of characters people had kind of ignored in Vanilla like Seth, Gen (who got completely eviscerated in Super when only 2 players were playing him), Fei Long, or Sakura. If you look for videos Vanilla SF4 of Yeb or Jibbo you'll see what was capable with Gen before they drastically changed him.
DR2K
Banned
You have no soul.
Healing is VERY fun when you're the one doing it, specially when you can hear the other dude fuming on the microphone.
CountBlack
Member
don't worry I can heal it back
KhalilSyncere
Member
Ha! Yeah, that's why I never got too deep into frame data mechanics and whatnot. Just seemed like overkill, unless I suppose if you're going to be a serious tourney level player. Even then, may not be totally necessary, 9 times outta 10 I can look at the moves and animations and can see what works and why what beats what anyway. The better the game animates, the less by-the-numbers technical data you need to know to be able to figure this shit out really.
Gen, Fei, Sak were not in vanilla SF4. They were in the console release, which was almost 7 months after the original arcade game. Kind of splitting hairs here, but I feel like it should be mentioned. Gen changed the most, but remember that his only reversal was EX Oga, which sucks.
BTW Sagat would never have been mid-tier in (either) version of Vanilla, no matter how long the game ran for. You should refresh your memory when it comes to how ridiculous he was; advantaged knee pressure loops, far stand LK being cancellable, stand HK doing all it's damage at the tip range, Tiger Shots giving float juggle + doing more damage, 180 damage uppercuts, jump MP having like 25 active frames, 1100 health, etc. Seth + Akuma (+ maybe Abel) were able to contain him but Sagat benefited from the unblockable Ultra glitch more than most of the cast.
Holy Order Sol
Member
make it a light blue glow pls
On that note, did they fix the hitboxes on some moves (i.e. Ryu's cr. forward) so it more closely matches the visual point of contact? That threw me off in the last beta. Some pokes had deceptively less range than one would've thought.
which I find ironic because people complained about depth in vanilla way back then.
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