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[Resident_UA]

Yes you should because regardless of what their excuse is you as a consumer end up with a worse game.

It's like saying that I need to worry about the fact that Wendy's is adding another item to the menu because my burgers will get crappier. Not my problem. If we get shitty games the developers will loose customers. As they should.

Plus Fallout 4 already happened. If that didn't piss you off I don't know if anything that is going on with PS4K will be as bad...

 

[qa_engineer]

"NeoGaf poster qa_engineer: 'I'm not sure Colin Moriarty even exists'..."

Your posts are tripping me out, man.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Arent giant bomb and Eurogamer well connected

How come they havent chimed in on developer reactions

 

[Movalpolos]

So who do we think will have consulted with more Devs over this? Sony or Colins source?

^

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

"Most developers"?

This is going to look pretty stupid if Sony have a developer interview reel like they did when they announced the ps4 hardware.

I highly doubt they would push forward with this unless the major publishers were on board.

No shit the bit publishers will play ball with the market leader. That doesn't meant they are ecstatic about it.

Plus, this is talking about DEVELOPERS not publishers. EA could be on board sure but that doesn't mean the people actually making the games for EA as a brand are happy to be doing more work, in likely the same time frame, for no benefit to themselves.

And even if the big publishers were on board, the middle guys are the ones who really might feel the pressure from this. Budgets aren't going to magically increase.

 

[gofreak]

I want it.

+1

I'd live without it, but I don't have a Ps4 yet and I'd be totally happy to get a more up to date box when the time comes to buy one, especially in tandem with psvr. I can understand the concern of existing owners but I'm not sure who in the same position - a potential owner - wouldn't prefer the option.

 

[Bl@de]

Me too. Everyone I know want it or doesn't care. They're not raging about it.

Yep same here. Either they want one (enthusiasts) or don't care (play mostly on other plattforms). Nobody I know is angry ... But GAF is raging like always

 

[Kolx]

Never thought I'd see the day... lots of people in this thread complaining that games will have to spend MORE time in QA.

Actually QA is probably going to be less now since they have to work on 2 consoles so it's going to be worse not better.

 

[EatinOlives]

That should have silenced everyone, but c'est la vie.

Why should it? It's two developers who are expressing their interest, but there are also other devs on these threads who think it's a poor idea.

This isn't an open-and-shut case, and I wish people would stop trying to pretend there isn't a controversy.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I have a feeling that it's part of the long game for them if this is the first step towards a future where userbases are no longer fragmented with each new console release. The big win for them is no longer having to start from scratch with each "generation" in terms of user bases where games that are released early on in a cycle have lower sales potential.



I'm not disputing that.

It doesn't mean it's a good thing though.

Agreed.

Matt and GopherD seem to be on board with it as well.

That should have silenced everyone, but c'est la vie.

Well no, because of the Ice Cream effect at play as well.

 

[Bsigg12]

That worked out just swell for Quantum Break.

It was so easy that they didn't even bother to put a quit option in the main menu.

All things considered, it seems like wrapping an Xbox One game up as a UWP app seems like a pretty quick process. It's adding the underlying PC features to that package where things got messy.

 

[Maintenance]

Why should it? It's two developers who are expressing their interest, but there are also other devs on these threads who think it's a poor idea.

This isn't an open-and-shut case, and I wish people would stop trying to pretend there isn't a controversy.

This is the Xbox One reveal all over again.

 

[Wagram]

Considering Colin has been extremely negative on PS4.5 since it's reveal it doesn't surprise me that he has a so-called "source." I'm sure the extra dev time hasn't made most devs happy, but Colin has a reputation for making things sound as pessimistic as possible.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

I have a feeling that it's part of the long game for them if this is the first step towards a future where userbases are no longer fragmented with each new console release. The big win for them is no longer having to start from scratch with each "generation" in terms of user bases where games that are released early on in a cycle have lower sales potential.



I'm not disputing that.

It doesn't mean it's a good thing though.

Well, for a developer who may be unhappy about creating 2 versions of a game for effectively the same platform, yeah....it does.

Right now, we POTENTIALLY have a situation where there will be 2 PlayStations and 2 Xbox consoles. Developers will only have to make one version of the Xbox game because of UWP. Devs may have to make 2 versions of the PlayStation game.

So yeah, you can see why they'd be pissed.

 

[Psychoward]

It's like saying that I need to worry about the fact that Wendy's is adding another item to the menu because my burgers will get crappier. Not my problem. If we get shitty games the developers will loose customers. As they should.

What kind of analogy is that lol, all I'm saying is if unoptimized games can be avoided, why not do that instead of forcing devs to double down? Yeah it sucks Bethesda games on console have shit framerates, and no there isn't excusing it but as a fan of their games I don't want to see even worse ports because they were forced to develop for another system.

 

[axisofweevils]

I can see why TBH. Jim Sterling did an excellent video about "crunch" this week. This will just make it worse.

 

[ironcreed]

Keep in mind some of the same developers were releasing their games cross-platform between PS3 and PS4, and 360 and Xbone. Activision, EA, Ubisoft, etc. all of them were doing it. And releasing those same games on PC too.

That's a lot more "work" than it would be for PS4 and PS4K.

I just think it is totally unnecessary and not needed. And surely devs would rather just work on PS4 and Xbox One instead of optimizing for two versions of the same system. But it looks like this is where we are headed and many also seem excited for it, so let the market decide.

As for me? I am good with the Xbox One and PS4 and see no point when these systems are still so young and will be getting all the same games. If nothing changes for me then I have no reason to want to shell out another $400. I'm good on hardware until a new gen starts, with the exception of NX. Which is the only system coming out that is actually new.

 

[Tookay]

So who do we think will have consulted with more Devs over this? Sony or Colins source?

I don't know. Did Sony consult with developers when designing the PS3?

(The answer is yes but it was still harder to develop for, so your appeal to authority is a fallacious argument.)

 

[DrROBschiz]

Considering Colin has been extremely negative on PS4.5 since it's reveal it doesn't surprise me that he has a so-called "source." I'm sure the extra dev time hasn't made most devs happy, but Colin has a reputation for making things sound as pessimistic as possible.

Hes also a legit professional that understands the medium

Im just trying to figure out if hes upholding the same standards and is just like fuck it im independent and can lean on his opinions and bias

 

[Goron2000]

But will these smaller studios be forced to develop two versions? The vanilla version will work on Neo.

Doesn't matter if you want to support it, you have to test on both. If you submit a game to Sony and it crashes on a PS Neo but runs perfectly on a PS4 they will still kick the game back to you and it will still cost $30,000 for each submission.

 

[RedAssedApe]

Arent giant bomb and Eurogamer well connected

How come they havent chimed in on developer reactions

ndas i'm guessing? aren't these considered leaks?

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

Did either Matt or GopherD, who I keep seeing being mentioned as "real devs," go into as much detail in their supporting rebuttals as SneakersSO did?

 

[DrROBschiz]

ndas i'm guessing? aren't these considered leaks?

Wait so its ok to leaks specs but leaking dev impressions crosses the line?

 

[thuway]

Has anyone here actually listened to the latest Gamescast, Colin spends the entire time overreacting, complaining, and failing to see how this could benefit anyone. His primary reason for concern: old PS4 owners insecurity complexes.

I really enjoy the guys and their commentary but this is one of those times where I have to cringe a little.

 

[Movalpolos]

This is the Xbox One reveal all over again.

Not even close.
Who else really believes this?
I'd like to know so I can just ignore your opinions from now on.

 

[Frillen]

I'm not liking the move Sony. By the time it's out it will only be 3 or so years before the PS5 is released. Why not just wait? Or will this delay the release of the PS5? If so, fuck Sony.

 

[Resident_UA]

What kind of analogy is that lol, all I'm saying is if unoptimized games can be avoided, why not do that instead of forcing devs to double down? Yeah it sucks Bethesda games on console have shit framerates, and no there isn't excusing it but as a fan of their games I don't want to see even worse ports because they were forced to develop for another system.

What are you talking about? You know how we can avoid "unoptimized games"? Just don't buy them. That's the only thing you can do as a consumer. Worrying about how the developer is allocating resources is insane. That's not something you should be worried about. That's their problem. For all you know Bethesda spent 5 days on PS4 port. Or maybe they had 100 people working on it for 5 years. Worrying about this is as insane as my Wendy's analogy.

 

[Midas]

Yep same here. Either they want one (enthusiasts) or don't care (play mostly on other plattforms). Nobody I know is angry ... But GAF is raging like always

Pretty much. But this will be interesting, to see how things unfold. Sony is obviously testing the waters and everyone is acting like it's some knee jerk reaction on their behalf. Might work, might be a failure. But I'm certainly not hoping for it to fail, which some weird people do.

 

[Scrotum Phillips]

I'm listening to PS i love you right now and Colin is railing against the stupidity of this thing, yet says that he will buy it because he has the money to do so. Great, me too.

I might seem insane to many of you out there, but i'll gladly spend some money on a console that makes what will be my 3-ish year old console run games better especially if it doesn't make my old games obsolete and i can still play with my friends. This is similar to how I occasionally spend money on a TV or a computer every once in a while. Change isn't always a bad thing.

 

[MogCakes]

Well no, because of the Ice Cream effect at play as well.

I googled that and all I got was brain freeze. What is the Ice Cream effect?

 

[GHG]

No shit the bit publishers will play ball with the market leader. That doesn't meant they are ecstatic about it.

Plus, this is talking about DEVELOPERS not publishers. EA could be on board sure but that doesn't mean the people actually making the games for EA as a brand are happy to be doing more work, in likely the same time frame, for no benefit to themselves.

And even if the big publishers were on board, the middle guys are the ones who really might feel the pressure from this. Budgets aren't going to magically increase.

That's a huge assumption.

At this stage it's impossible to say how much or little extra work would be needed to get a ps4 Neo version out the door.

Well, for a developer who may be unhappy about creating 2 versions of a game for effectively the same platform, yeah....it does.

Right now, we POTENTIALLY have a situation where there will be 2 PlayStations and 2 Xbox consoles. Developers will only have to make one version of the Xbox game because of UWP. Devs may have to make 2 versions of the PlayStation game.

So yeah, you can see why they'd be pissed.

And you're assuming Sony won't have all of this wrapped up within a single SDK because...?

 

[thelastword]

I'm curious to see the interviews after the thing unveils.

It's possible tons of developers are upset, but Colin citing one person speaking for an industry without any additional details isn't convincing me this is the majority opinion.

It's a statement I've made earlier in the thread as well, I'd really like to know who these devs are. When PS3 came out, Valve lashed out, we all knew it was Gabe, the Oddworld guys had some nasty things to say too, but guess what, Valve gave the PS3 the best versions of portal 1 and 2 on consoles. It's doubly hard for me to conceptualize the logic behind talk that "devs are not happy" because the NEO is clearly not exotic hardware, it's pretty much scaling your assets and code to take advantage of the beefier hardware or if you don't give a damn like these devs, just let the NEO brute force it, I guess in the end better NEO efforts will just outshine their offerings.

On the flip, when I hear devs cry because their games didn't do too well because of sloppy code or lacklustre efforts, I can't feel sorry for them either.

 

[XxRampage07xX]

Just outsource games like most 3rd party developers are doing then. I'm pretty sure Nixxes and Bluepoint are very happy by this news.

 

[Jonboy]

I have a feeling that it's part of the long game for them if this is the first step towards a future where userbases are no longer fragmented with each new console release. The big win for them is no longer having to start from scratch with each "generation" in terms of user bases where games that are released early on in a cycle have lower sales potential.

This. Exactly this.

There's definitely a long game here and I think you nailed it. 3-5 years from now we'll probably have 3 tiers at 3 different price points.

 

[Movalpolos]

Hes also a legit professional that understands the medium

Im just trying to figure out if hes upholding the same standards and is just like fuck it im independent and can lean on his opinions and bias

Legit professionals don't behave the way he does. Especially in their last podcast. That guy acts like a fucking child.

 

[burgerdog]

Are devs being forced to support it?

 

[Neuromancer]

His source was probably CliffyB who knows all developers and their opinions about everything.

 

[Audioboxer]

Has anyone here actually listened to the latest Gamescast, Colin spends the entire time overreacting, complaining, and failing to see how this could benefit anyone. His primary reason for concern: old PS4 owners insecurity complexes.

I really enjoy the guys and their commentary but this is one of those times where I have to cringe a little.

That's what a lot of people seem to have, forgetting their PC counterparts already 60FPS it up over them on a daily basis right now.

It'll be the same when the PS5 launches and FIFA x is much better on it, than on a PS4. Someone somewhere is always enjoying some more graphical sprinkles than you.

 

[kiguel182]

The only problem I have with the PS4.5 is that it isn't clear is happening. There are people buying a PS4 now expecting a usual console cycle and will be caught with their pants down.

If Sony wanted to go with faster update cycles they should've been clear about it from the start.

And if they want to do this from now on they really need to be clear about it. With phones at least you know when they update. Consoles need to do the same or else consumers just won't trust them.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Did either Matt or GopherD, who I keep seeing being mentioned as "real devs," go into as much detail in their supporting rebuttals as SneakersSO did?

Bummer this is non specific

Its commenting on the idea of iterative consoles not the reality given to us by the leak

We cant surmise whether the tools sony supplies and the change in specs actually makes it easier or harder.

On paper it looks like the hardware is the same breed but beefier. Same CPU, faster ram but same type, and a doubled up and improved GPU of the same product. All of it packed onto a smaller board?

Im no expert but i would love to hear from one

 

[AstroNut325]

devs don't want it, consumers don't want it, what are you doing Sony ?

I'm a consumer and I want the PS4K.

 

[nib95]

So you've proven my point then. Because the Xbox One version doesn't have a quit option either.

The Xbox One version does have a quit option though...

 

[OsirisBlack]

Are devs being forced to support it?

to a certain extent yes.

devs don't want it, consumers don't want it, what are you doing Sony ?

I'm buying one as a consumer so.... I guess one consumer wants one.

 

[Psychoward]

Are devs being forced to support it?

Apparently

 

[DeepEnigma]

Has anyone here actually listened to the latest Gamescast, Colin spends the entire time overreacting, complaining, and failing to see how this could benefit anyone. His primary reason for concern: old PS4 owners insecurity complexes.

I really enjoy the guys and their commentary but this is one of those times where I have to cringe a little.

Exactly. As I said before, I listen to them all the time now since discovering them last Fall from a thread on here, not going to agree all the time, but this was the first time I cringed hearing Colin latch on to the "Ice Cream" explanation.

However, the point still stands, he has sources (in which I will not dispute because I do believe him), I want to know the number of developers and how many are AAA/Indie/etc..

Leaving it open like that was definitely bias supportive.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Legit professionals don't behave the way he does. Especially in their last podcast. That guy acts like a fucking child.

Well thats the thing

Hes being raw and honest and emotional. Likely due to the freedom his indepent medium now affords

Which is why i questioned his claim as are several other people on here.

 

[IbizaPocholo]

And what have to say the developers to the pc gaming with thousands of configurations?

 

[family_guy]

Will devs complain when they have to make games for NX, a completely different system with different dev tools?

 

[Psychoward]

Will devs complain when they have to make games for NX, a completely different system with different dev tools?

That'll have a different install base and won't be restrained by its previous console so no.

 

[Audioboxer]

The only problem I have with the PS4.5 is that it isn't clear is happening. There are people buying a PS4 now expecting a usual console cycle and will be caught with their pants down.

If Sony wanted to go with faster update cycles they should've been clear about it from the start.

And if they want to do this from now on they really need to be clear about it. With phones at least you know when they update. Consoles need to do the same or else consumers just won't trust them.

You don't say at your console launch btw guys in 3~4 years we'll have something better, please wait.

For what it is worth anyway, from October 2015 probably 1 year+ before this launches - http://ps4daily.com/2015/10/sony-is-considering-giving-ps4-a-performance-boost/

The rumours started a while back for a reason, Sony said they were considering it. I think that's a decent amount of a heads up to possibly expect something on the horizon.