It's a better game than either
But it's not what the topic is about.I know right?!?! The people that have played them all agree with you of course ^_^ nobody who ever played both could possibly like league better!
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So why does League of Legends still have a larger playerbase than Dota 2?
- Thread starter ScOULaris
- Start date
It's a better game than either
But it's not what the topic is about.I know right?!?! The people that have played them all agree with you of course ^_^ nobody who ever played both could possibly like league better!
- So does dota. In fact,dota has more maps and modes.
- the secret shop has the items required for most of the best items in the game. Map control is a huge factor of the game, if you are stuck in your base, but still has a chance to comeback, do you risk it by going to the shop or not? Comebacks are way less likely to happen in LoL, so it may not make much sense to you (same thing about having no surrender)
- the limitation in this case is LoL (or your skill in dota). You can't select another unit to control in LoL (at least this was the case when I played and had to control tibbers by holding alt) while it is fundamental for some heroes in dota 2. You can press f3 as a hotkey for the courier. It will pick up any item in your stash, deliver it to you and go back to base.
No shit, the game is better because of it though. The fact that couriers force the controls to be worse the rest of the time you play dota is awful. but y'know, GOTTA PRESERVE THAT WC3 PRISTINE FEEL FROM 15 YEARS AGO! Makes sense, translate the controls from a game that is about controlling armies into a game that is about controlling a single hero. I find WC3 controls are optimal for fighting games as well.
EchoChamber
Member
My shitty laptop can run it.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I prefer Dota, but friends play League. Pretty simple choice.
lmao you need to calm down
i have played league for 1000s of hours and i know why some people like league better.
i didnt even say in the post that people that have played both games would like dota better than league?
i meant from both sides in my post, which is why i wrote either and not dota
HotS is (relatively) dead because:
1) Way too late to the party
2) Tried to out-League League with the removal of complexity, doesn't work, there has to be a set amount of complexity for players to feel like its worth investing in, League players had the same view of HOTS as Dota players had of League, that says a lot
3) Same business model as League, which is bad, because a player only has so many hours in a day and they can't grind League unlocks if they also have to grind HOTS unlocks, meaning less time "shopping around" as it were, meaning less chance of being retained
1) Way too late to the party
2) Tried to out-League League with the removal of complexity, doesn't work, there has to be a set amount of complexity for players to feel like its worth investing in, League players had the same view of HOTS as Dota players had of League, that says a lot
3) Same business model as League, which is bad, because a player only has so many hours in a day and they can't grind League unlocks if they also have to grind HOTS unlocks, meaning less time "shopping around" as it were, meaning less chance of being retained
Dota isn't about controlling a single hero. At least 30 heroes in the game relies on controlling other units, such as summons or illusions. Couriers don't force shit.
Imperfected
Member
I do wonder how much their (hilariously) late release cost them.
The rest of the games fall pretty squarely along the graph I'd chart to correlate character design with popularity, from Smite on the low-but-viable end to League on top, but I think HotS might be the singular outlier because of Blizzard's decision to release it ten years after they should have.
League is advertised and designed for casuals. I really don't think you can argue that. The mechanics are much more simplified and thus easier to learn. DotA is designed as a very competitive game and learning all the intricacies of the game (jungle,ancient stacking,courier control,very technical heroes, multi unit control, etc) is harder than those in league. They both accomplish what they set out to do well which is why they dominate the moba genre.
Arcanine55
Neo Member
I don't understand why the controls are worse because of it.
Unless you're only playing only Smash/EXVS these days, chances are your fighting game control schemes have been unchanged since the 90s, back when they were played on arcade cabinets.
This is just the most awful comparison you could bring up. Fighting games are proof there's value to be had in old, "antiquated" designs and controls "from 15 years ago".
Personally, I could never get into traditional fighters because I just lack the coordination, can't even do a QCF consistently, but I'm not going into fighting game threads arguing how Smash is superior to traditional fighters for getting it right and making fighting games more accessible for a larger amount of players.
What? In my pub games I dont even notice the courier, I just use F1,F2,F3, etc. I've only played about 20 games of LoL but controlling in both games with QWER and rightclicks feels the same to me. Individual courier control is like <1% of a match and with 5 players you don't have to be the one to do it, its usually just automated with shortcuts.
And if it were only about controlling one hero, motherfuckers like this wouldn't exist:
eh, i dont think league is going to take that hard of a dent in korea with overwatch being released tbh
wasnt it just more overwatch being played than lol at pc bangs?
i know it is the first time ever, but i still dont think it will matter
either way, you are right, i'm curious to see if there is going to be a lot koreans jumping ship
LordRaptor
Member
That and optimal Pepsi purchasing behaviour is to ocasionally press the coke button on vending machines to prevent others from buying coke
nephilimdj
Member
Thing is lol beat dota2 before dota2 existed, it was called HON
I laughed
My eyes couldn't roll any harder. The pushback from LoL players in here is ridiculous. Also, I remember this post from years ago that was posted on /v/. Make of it what you will:
You can say that so casually because Dota 2 e-sports is very very lucky that Koreans, who dominated Warcraft 3, Starcraft 2 and LoL, were not interested in the game.
Without these masters of APM, we don't know where it really stands.
MVP (korea team) is doing well enough that they can conceivably win TI6.
Then it's all ogre from there.
I'd play League if all the champs were unlocked for me. I hate unlocking champs. Hate it from the depths of my soul. I only have patience to play a few games per week now which is unsustainable if I want to try all the champions. To say the least of rune pages and whatnot.
Fuck runes as well.
Then it's all ogre from there.
I'd play League if all the champs were unlocked for me. I hate unlocking champs. Hate it from the depths of my soul. I only have patience to play a few games per week now which is unsustainable if I want to try all the champions. To say the least of rune pages and whatnot.
Fuck runes as well.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Using a 4 year old copypasta
nice, you sure showed them. What's next, posting Morellos 5 year old thoughts on healers?
Schweinehund
Member
first to market, less of a learning curve, paywall encourages players to keep playing so they don't fall behind in champion unlocks.
here's what a dota pro said a long time ago about this very thing
now, the chances that korean league players migrate over to dota is pretty slim considering nexon shut down the dota servers in korea
it's really a testament to how good MVP.Phoenix is in dota considering how shitty their practice environment is to how good they are in dota
Do you apply this to other competitve games without a massive Korean presence?
TharpDaddy
Member
Übermatik;208030141 said:
I played Warcraft III and Dota for years and then played League and preferred it. I like League more despite putting thousands of hours into Dota and Dota 2. Now what? How do I fit into your reductive and silly statement?
RTS or ARTS of Blizzard origin.
Imperfected
Member
If preliminary performance in Overwatch carries through to tournament play, yes.
The only reason they aren't rompa-stomping CS:GO and Calladoody is, quite probably, because they don't give even a mouse-sized shit.
MotionBlue
Member
League has casual appeal, Skinner box, and consistent eSports.
ha!
ha!
not enough waifus.
And there you have it. A lot of my friends who are casual gamers play Dota 2 from time to time because they played Dota 1 in Lan Cafes.
They arent going to try to play LoL,Smite or any other Moba. They dont even care. Since Dota1 was quite a niche thing outside of places like Asia,EU where Lan Cafes are pretty big. LoL was for the most part the first Moba many people played. Sure there are going to be people who switched from Dota1. But Moba is the kind of genre , where people just stick with one game.
The fact that it has an easier learning curve is another big plus point. Until LoL goofs up and becomes complete shit , these numbers aren't changing.
You gotta chill, man.
Do you deny the substance of the post though? Granted it's 4 years old, but it's a valid point of view from someone who had more success in E-sports than a vast majority of this forum.
Dota 1 was huge worldwide, not niche and not just Asia.
Stone Ocean
Member
Competitive League has changed and evolved so much over the years that it might as well be a different game. It might have been the case at the time but nowadays? Nah.
Imperfected
Member
I see you've been paying close attention to my train of thought.
(And you're probably right.)
Mr Fahrenheit
Member
I'm not really a fan of either, but DOTA just bored me to tears, it's so god damn slow.
I've gotten tired of the whole genre years ago, but I've occasionally revisted them for a couple days at times. I don't like the carry mechanics (I don't like playing against timers and feeling progressively less useful after a certain point in the game), I don't like being forced into a specific undesirable role game after game, I don't like the toxic communities, I don't like the idea of having investing hundreds of hours into those stupid games to become somewhat passable at them, I don't like the lack of alternative game modes and maps
LoL is a little better than DotA in many cases with AP scaling, less micro (like no denials) and less overally confusing mechanics, but I'm ready for the evolution of this genre. I feel like the new generation of FPS mobas will eventually take over the torch in the near future
LoL is a little better than DotA in many cases with AP scaling, less micro (like no denials) and less overally confusing mechanics, but I'm ready for the evolution of this genre. I feel like the new generation of FPS mobas will eventually take over the torch in the near future
Abilidebob
Member
Calling EternalEnvy a pro was the funniest thing of this thread.
Nah becuse they are all gonna chase after Overwatch instead because that is the new, new hotness.
is he not?
thestopsign
Member
I'm with you. It is a genre that is complex enough as is. Adding more complexity isn't necessarily making something better. To me it becomes tedious and annoying rather than fun. There are over a hundred characters that you have to basically memorize. You have to know how they interact with other characters, what items to get on them, what combos to use, and how to effectively pick a role with them. Adding this on top of additional mechanical complexity isn't somehow making something better.
I mean there must a reason TF2 never caught on in Korea and Overwatch did. Also Japan. And China. Blizzard got a bunch of Japanese gamers to play a shootbang and it's also overtaken Pixiv, aka, JP DeviantArt.
Cute girls, man. Powerful.
And on that same thought most of Dota 2's girls are repurposed from janky WC3 models and just not that waifu-able compared to the likes of Ahri and DVa.
Not really. It all comes to all the hype that OW is receiving. Give it 6 months and we will see OW dies down in Korea.
A pro at hyperbole and throwing. An artist, some would say.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Like Stone Ocean says, that's just one person 4 years ago. The game is completely different now than it was then.
I'm sure there are pros who dislike actually playing the game. And that's fine that a game can garner a wide range of opinions from a wide swathe of different types of people.
So to refrain, is DotA 2 more complex? Yes. Does that make it better? Not at all.
Imperfected
Member
A medal from the 2011 WCG has about the same value as an EU-West solo queue border of the same color. Most of those guys can't even stay in Challenger rank in non-competitive regions anymore, and there's basically one that's still playing "professionally", as a dubiously-serious player on a losing team in an internationally-embarrassed region.
This is like pulling a quote from a guy who played football before pads when talking about the NFL.
Not enough strategic depth to keep players playing everyday
Not to mention esports won't take off. It's just too confusing to keep track for casual players and non-players.
Valve never tried to push TF2 in asian markets or as an esport. Waifus are distant to that.