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[Gbraga]

I got tired of the climbing and it became predictable when a ledge or something was going to break or bend.

What's worse than being predictable is that, even if it wasn't, what does it matter? Nate will just grab what's below him automatically, what difference does it make? It just wastes time. This isn't interesting, the fact that the actions on the screen show danger doesn't mean the player is actually facing danger, that's just boring. I guess they just needed the controller to vibrate to make sure you're still awake.

You can see how having actual agency and facing a threat make a difference during combat. Platforming is a lot more involved during combat sequences because you're actively avoiding damage while you do it. You have to think and execute your moves very quickly in order not to die. But climbing in traversal, you just hold forward. Press X occasionally. Boost Sam up, wait a bit for the 40th box.

The characters make fun of it though, so I guess it's ok? ND is self-aware of how boring it is, but does nothing to change it, instead makes fun of how many times the player is doing the same uninsteresting crap, that only adds insult to injury.

"If I have to slide down rocks one more time..."

"Another box to push?"

*does it 80 more times*

¯\_(&#12484_/¯

 

[fernoca]

Obviously different people will have different opinions.

But I'd be willing to say that part of the disappointment the OP had was around playing the first 3 games (two of those been brand new to the OP), then the 4th game in such a short amount of time.

Uncharted 4 compared to U3 and U2 might feel a bit more mellow because it doesn't rely as much on bigger setpieces and spectacles. So, coming from that, to an adventure more focused on exploration and the characters might disappoint some.

 

[Gandalf]

I can certainly understand your thoughts, but for me, the changes worked. A 10/10 game in my opinion.

 

[Eidjinn]

Well... after I finished the game, I felt I was a bit crazy, thinking that giving this game a score below 9/10 would be difficult, but the disapoinment feeling was there...

Glad I'm not the only one. The one thing is: game is perfect balanced for me, I did thought they toned down a lot the gunfight, and loved that decision, the new characters were pretty awesome and story wise might be the one I like the most.

It's just that I can't point my finger to what is bothering me.

Maybe, maybe, the weak point would be the soundtrack: some moments deserved a more epic music, but it just wasn't there.

I remember playing Mass Effect, and the music really, really helped creating that "wow" moment.

 

[Messofanego]

Huh? And I thought it was the best one yet. The big action set pieces with the tower, armoured cars, car chase, combined with the best gunplay yet in the serie and the new stealth and grappling hook gameplay made it my favorite. The bow, upgrades and sandbox gameplay is better in RotTR and purely by gameplay I'd say UC4 are a tiny bit behind but in the end I still came away liking UC4 more. It's the perfect story driven action game. My GOTY so far for 2016.

All of that is just Madagascar. There were no other surprises in terms of setpieces.

 

[SlimySnake]

I hope Neil is reading this thread and dozens of others like these threads. People like the story in Uncharted games, but it's not the main course. They tolerate the platforming and slow sections, but the series is famous for its action, not introspective characters.

Also, those slow moments in TLOU worked because you were still rewarded for exploring those areas. I loved checking every single drawer and finding hidden upgrades. There is nothing to find here except for useless treasure.

They create these huge worlds and fill them with nothing. Why?

 

[dragonzdogma]

Obviously different people will have different opinions.

But I'd be willing to say that part of the disappointment the OP had was around playing the first 3 games (two of those been brand new to the OP), then the 4th game in such a short amount of time.

Uncharted 4 compared to U3 and U2 might feel a bit more mellow because it doesn't rely as much on bigger setpieces and spectacles. So, coming from that, to an adventure more focused on exploration and the characters might disappoint some.

I never played UC 1-3, so what If I liked the parts in U4 where there was mostly action,
you are saying that UC 1-3 is worth looking into?

I played the U2 collection ps4 demo and I thought it was janky and full of annoying scripted set pieces, that didn't allow for much game play creativity.

I guess that's one of the things I appreciated from uncharted 4, is how creative you can get in killing enemies, via rope swings, stealth, or going all out.

 

[Human Trashcan]

I hope Neil is reading this thread and dozens of others like these threads. People like the story in Uncharted games, but it's not the main course. They tolerate the platforming and slow sections, but the series is famous for its action, not introspective characters.

I feel like I'm in bizarro land reading threads like this because the action is the last thing I come to Uncharted for and I just can't fathom that people are seriously into these games for the shooting. It's bad! The shooting has always been bad, the encounter design in UC3 is some of the worst I ever saw, and it made me quit the game. I love UC4 but my least favorite parts are the last few chapters, where there are many shooty bits. It's just not a good shooter imo. I get liking the setpieces for the spectacle, but any time the game turns into a stop-n-pop cover shooter I groan. I like UC4 better because stealth and verticality add some more dimension to the gameplay, but towards the end of the game it becomes more Gears-like and dull.

 

[Messofanego]

What's worse than being predictable is that, even if it wasn't, what does it matter? Nate will just grab what's below him automatically, what difference does it make? It just wastes time. This isn't interesting, the fact that the actions on the screen show danger doesn't mean the player is actually facing danger, that's just boring. I guess they just needed the controller to vibrate to make sure you're still awake.

You can see how having actual agency and facing a threat make a difference during combat. Platforming is a lot more involved during combat sequences because you're actively avoiding damage while you do it. You have to think and execute your moves very quickly in order not to die. But climbing in traversal, you just hold forward. Press X occasionally. Boost Sam up, wait a bit for the 40th box.

The characters make fun of it though, so I guess it's ok? ND is self-aware of how boring it is, but does nothing to change it, instead makes fun of how many times the player is doing the same uninsteresting crap, that only adds insult to injury.

"If I have to slide down rocks one more time..."

"Another box to push?"

*does it 80 more times*

¯\_(&#12484_/¯

Videogame developers need to stop this self-aware garbage of inserting cute lines to excuse the flaws and repetition in their games. Parody in videogames doesn't work when you still have to do it. It wasn't funny in Eat Lead: The Return Of Matt Hazard, Sunset Overdrive, or any recent games that thought they were being clever, and it certainly doesn't work in Uncharted 4. If you're having to acknowledge the problems in your game, maybe you should have cut it in the first place. Save us the time.

 

[The Argus]

I liked the story a lot. But after playing Rise of the Tomb Raider it just felt so rooted in the past gen. I loved the semi open world design of Rise, had more fun with its combat and liked the crafting/ability level ups. Uncharted 4 just felt too linear and safe. 8/10 for me, as it was a beautiful ride but not something I'd do again.

 

[Lys Skygge]

All of that is just Madagascar. There were no other surprises in terms of setpieces.

I think in addition to the Madagascar chase, he/she was talking about the collapsing tower in Libertalia, and the armored truck at the end of the game. Both of which were fantastic set pieces.

Videogame developers need to stop this self-aware garbage of inserting cute lines to excuse the flaws and repetition in their games. Parody in videogames doesn't work when you still have to do it. It wasn't funny in Eat Lead: The Return Of Matt Hazard, Sunset Overdrive, or any recent games that thought they were being clever, and it certainly doesn't work in Uncharted 4. If you're having to acknowledge the problems in your game, maybe you should have cut it in the first place. Save us the time.

You spent a whopping 3-5 minutes in a 15 hour game pushing crates.

 

[AzureFlame]

I am dissapointed as well, the bad pacing, the setpieces, very bad climbing sections, a few gunfights and an empty big world.

Uncharted 2 is still the king.

 

[Messofanego]

You spent a whopping 3-5 minutes in a 15 hour game pushing crates.

The crate pushing and platforming with it happens at least 7 times throughout the course of the game, and each segment is a few minutes. Not just that, how many times a platform breaks after Nate steps on it and he'll comment to the effect of "oh no not this shit again".

I'll agree the Libertalia collapsing tower was awesome, though.

 

[Alienous]

I think in addition to the Madagascar chase, he/she was talking about the collapsing tower in Libertalia, and the armored truck at the end of the game. Both of which were fantastic set pieces.

I don't see what made the armored truck at the end a 'fantastic set piece'.

I can't remember if the collapsing tower was compelling or not; I've forgotten it outside of the 'boss fight', which isn't a good sign. It's no train level, certainly.

 

[Lys Skygge]

The crate pushing and platforming with it happens at least 7 times throughout the course of the game, and each segment is a few minutes. Not just that, how many times a platform breaks after Nate steps on it and he'll comment to the effect of "oh no not this shit again".

I'll agree the Libertalia collapsing tower was awesome, though.

I just don't think the crate pushing was that big of a deal.

As for the collapsing bridges; its been an Uncharted trope since UC1. I thought it was quite funny how self aware Nathan was of this, and how his brother commented on it as well. The journal entry where he listed the things that pirate bridges were made of gave me a laugh.

I don't see what made the armored truck at the end a 'fantastic set piece'.

I can't remember if the collapsing tower was compelling or not; I've forgotten it outside of the 'boss fight', which isn't a good sign. It's no train level, certainly.

I don't see how anyone can dislike it. I guess that's why it's called an opinion.

 

[fernoca]

I never played UC 1-3, so what If I liked the parts in U4 where there was mostly action,
you are saying that UC 1-3 is worth looking into?

I played the U2 collection ps4 demo and I thought it was janky and full of annoying scripted set pieces, that didn't allow for much game play creativity.

I guess that's one of the things I appreciated from uncharted 4, is how creative you can get in killing enemies, via rope swings, stealth, or going all out.

Well, the original trilogy is a bit more restrictive when it comes to taking down enemies and rely more on big setpieces and wowing people....the cruise, the train, the collapsing buildings, the collapsing terrains, the moving sands.

It still a great trilogy of games. So try the demos again if anything.

 

[RespectThySole]

those were amazing - first time I felt like i was playing a next generation game

What? The Nadine fights were basically playable cutscenes where you couldn't change anything. Maybe you enjoyed the graphics, but how was that the first time you felt like you were playing a "next gen" game?

The crate pushing and platforming with it happens at least 7 times throughout the course of the game, and each segment is a few minutes. Not just that, how many times a platform breaks after Nate steps on it and he'll comment to the effect of "oh no not this shit again".

I'll agree the Libertalia collapsing tower was awesome, though.

It looked nice, but was really short(like most of them) and not interesting mechanically. It was just more x pushing. Uncharted 4 needed more setpieces that engaged the player like the one in chapter 11.

I also hated that the second one didn't lead to anything exciting. Just as the tension was starting to build, they throw that terrible young Drake section at you.

 

[Moon_frogger]

Metal Gear Solid V was fantastic though. It definitely deserved its metascore.

I agree. Despite feeling compromised and unfinished in some ways I was fully engrossed from start to finish. the mission design melted my brain. I replayed each and every one of them so many times just to mess around and see what could be done differently. The story had some of the darkest moments, subtle characterization and emotional highs of the series. I get why people were disappointed with it for not being the metal gear game they wanted but for me it ended the series on a high note.

 

[Arkeband]

I recently beat UC4, here's how I think it compares to the others:

- Melee combat feels rewarding, unlike the forced melee segments in UC3, which devolved into punching a bruiser NPC for 30 seconds apiece.

- Shooting gallery segments are tougher (enemy AI is "shoot Drake in the face with 100% accuracy from Hard onwards"), but there's actually good hit detection and enemies act natural if they're shot. (In UC1-3, they barely flinch until they're dead, very unrewarding)

- Climbing is maybe too present, even though they added branching paths and even mixed it up halfway through with the spike, making climbing a two button process.

- Free roam sections are interesting - still very linear but night and day from the usual.

- Story feels more mature and taking a break from the supernatural helped focus on the characters. At some point, Nathan Drake being a genocidal maniac with total kill count in the literal thousands means there's a suspension of disbelief, and the story's aim sought to reel back in the cheese a little bit.

- That fucking epilogue man. Onions were cut.

Overall it was a memorable experience, and even though I might not recall something from it like Shangri-La, at least the writing was solid enough that I won't be looking back on it and going "wait, couldn't they have just spotted this from the air?"

I think for an Uncharted 5, it will need to take cues from the modern action-adventure trend of being semi open-world, and giving treasure finding an immediate meta reason to exist, like unlocking perks or something, if they go that far. Incentivize exploration, they make big beautiful worlds that the game can't wait to rush you through in search of the next bridge Nathan will hang onto for dear life (but we know he'll be OK)

 

[Lys Skygge]

What? The Nadine fights were basically playable cutscenes where you couldn't change anything. Maybe you enjoyed the graphics, but how was that the first time you felt like you were playing a "next gen" game?



It looked nice, but was really short and not interesting mechanically. It was just more x pushing. Uncharted 4 needed more setpieces that engaged the player like the one in chapter 11.

Other than the train in Uncharted 2 and the chase in Uncharted 4, what other setpiece in the franchise required more than pushing the stick forward and pressing X?

 

[Alienous]

I don't see how anyone can dislike it. I guess that's why it's called an opinion.

There's a gulf between disliking it and thinking it's fantastic. I genuinely can't think of what would make something think it was fantastic. I'm not being facetious, I'm curious. I only recall it specifically because I thought it was unspectacular.

 

[matrixman92]

I honestly already forgot what happened in most of the game other than the ending. Didn't stick with me like uncharted 2 or TLOU

 

[SlimySnake]

I feel like I'm in bizarro land reading threads like this because the action is the last thing I come to Uncharted for and I just can't fathom that people are seriously into these games for the shooting. It's bad! The shooting has always been bad, the encounter design in UC3 is some of the worst I ever saw, and it made me quit the game. I love UC4 but my least favorite parts are the last few chapters, where there are many shooty bits. It's just not a good shooter imo. I get liking the setpieces for the spectacle, but any time the game turns into a stop-n-pop cover shooter I groan. I like UC4 better because stealth and verticality add some more dimension to the gameplay, but towards the end of the game it becomes more Gears-like and dull.

you are in the minority I'm afraid. Uncharted shooting has always been great, though Uncharted 1's waves upon waves encounter design was bad and the return of those waves of enemies in Uncharted 3 was unforgivable. That said, Uncharted 2 had some phenomenal shooting arenas and mixed in the enemies rather well. We spent hours playing the coop modes because the A.I and traversal were so good. it was unlike anything else out there. If you play uncharted like Gears i can understand why you might not like it, but thats playing the game wrong.

The setpieces are the biggest draw of this franchise and that's where U4 falters the most. There were TWO levels dedicated to the train in Uncharted 2. An entire chapter had you fighting the tank across a village. Same with the Helicopter in the Nepal levels. Uncharted 3 despite its shitty combat encounters jsut raised the bar in terms of setpieces. The Chateau burning chapter, the entire shipyard chapter culminating with an insane boat chase and then entire chapter on the boat sinking. Then the plane sequence and the convoy chase on the horse which topped the second game's convoy chase. they only managed to top the convoy chase. That's it. With all the horsepower available to them this gen. That's pretty lame.

 

[AndrewDean84xX]

I wasn't a fan at all. I didn't like the story, too much pointless climbing, lackluster combat and too long for its own good.

Top notch visuals on consoles, that's for sure. Everything else just fell apart for me. Halfway through the game, to help speed up the game, I lowered the difficulty and turned on auto aim. I was ready for it to end.

I feel like Uncharted 4 was a disservice to the series that should have ended with Uncharted 3.

 

[Horsemama1956]

Always found all aspects(shooting, adventuring etc) in the first 3(especially the first one) were mediocre thrown into a nice package. I don't think the franchise would've taken off like it did if it were multiplat.

Only extensively played the first 3 though.

 

[friskykillface]

Yeah I was a bit bummed that E3 spoiled the car chase after Sam since it was the big moment for the game for me

 

[Omnistalgic]

Best Uncharted hands down for me...I loved the pacing, and the highs and lows resonated much more IMO.

I took my time with it though. Little here and there for 3 weeks. Felt like reading a book...Dunno, guess it just rubs some differently.

Uncharted 3 is easily the weakest IMO...that gunplay was too annoying and i feel UC3 was trying to do what Uc4 succeeded in, telling a more intimate story.

 

[RespectThySole]

Other than the train in Uncharted 2 and the chase in Uncharted 4, what other setpiece in the franchise required more than pushing the stick forward and pressing X?

Off the top of my head:

The plane and ship from UC3. The caravan, collapsing hotel + helicopter boss fight, village with tank, and signpost from UC2. Plus the already aforementioned train which spans several levels itself.

Another problem with UC4 is that the short setpieces never lead to anything but more downtime. At the end of the collapsing tower we go to young Drake. Instead of having a nice shootout at the end of 11 we immediately shift to the boat. The jeep leads to downtime. Same with the armored truck, but I can excuse that one since that chapter was pretty hype. The setpieces in the other games are either interesting mechanically or they build into engaging action sequences.

The only other example of this in UC4 is the elevator in chapter 17 and considering the game's length in comparison to the previous games, that's a real shame.

 

[Lys Skygge]

There's a gulf between disliking it and thinking it's fantastic. I genuinely can't think of what would make something think it was fantastic. I'm not being facetious, I'm curious. I only recall it specifically because I thought it was unspectacular.

I don't know what to tell you, man. I thought it was exhilarating. My heart was racing, I was on the edge of my seat, and I had a big fat smile on my face. It was fantastic. The whole game was fantastic.

 

[Omnistalgic]

Also don't get the set piece crave, I was over them after the second Uncharted lol. After 3 games now, I've had enough of action set pieces, the ones here are fantastic btw...people would be talking about that jeep scene just like UC2 if they didn't show it before release. And I'm sure the huge amount of fans that don't bother with forums and media were just as blown away. When this game ramps up, it surpasses all the previous games.

I can just see myself replaying this one the most out of any of them. Only UC2 comes close and TLOU still better.

 

[Gbraga]

All of that is just Madagascar. There were no other surprises in terms of setpieces.

The one later

Spoiler

trying to get away from the rocket launchers and ending with the 2x1 fight against Nadine

was awesome.

Spoiler

Too bad these fights are so tedious and have no way of making them go faster by triggering certain things earlier.

Are we spoiler-tagging stuff here, btw?

Videogame developers need to stop this self-aware garbage of inserting cute lines to excuse the flaws and repetition in their games. Parody in videogames doesn't work when you still have to do it. It wasn't funny in Eat Lead: The Return Of Matt Hazard, Sunset Overdrive, or any recent games that thought they were being clever, and it certainly doesn't work in Uncharted 4. If you're having to acknowledge the problems in your game, maybe you should have cut it in the first place. Save us the time.

Completely agree.

Reminds me of the whole Far Cry 3 as a parody discussion. I definitely see what they were trying to achieve with the story, but it doesn't change the fact that the gameplay still consists of the exact same boring stuff they were criticizing.

 

[keltickennedy]

I also felt like the pacing was a little off with the game. Though I really enjoyed it, I was hoping for a little more action from an Uncharted game. Also a little more options if going heavier stealth. For example, the ability to throw stones or something and cause more distractions. Having more abilities to help direct and fool with the AI, rather than just waiting for an opening in their patrol routes.

 

[UrbanRats]

Videogame developers need to stop this self-aware garbage of inserting cute lines to excuse the flaws and repetition in their games. Parody in videogames doesn't work when you still have to do it.

So fucking true, not just videogames either (one of the issues i had with Kingsmen, but that's a whole can of worms).
The cleverness of self-aware, meta-commentary is way overrated.

 

[T.Slothrop]

My main complaint is that it was just too damn long. I think a lot of my gameplay annoyances were amplified by the length. Don't get me wrong, every section had amazing parts, but it sort of wore out it's formula by the end.

 

[Gbraga]

The best bit of exploration in the entire game was finding the shipwreck in At Sea. It wasn't anything major, and in the end it was just another useless collectible treasure, but at least it was something cool to find through exploration, instead of searching every nook and cranny of a huge box only to be rewarded with a "Press L3 for us to tell you where to go" prompt.

 

[QuantumBro]

I think the biggest problem is that Naughty Dog just made another Uncharted game, and most people were expecting something next gen from the series. The whole game is very by the numbers and feels like ND was just phoning it in so they could work on other projects.

Especially after seeing something like the new God of War at e3, Uncharted 4 is a disappointment. Graphics aside, it doesn't feel very different from 2 & 3 and even feels like they've regressed from TLoU. Which is fine for your average developer, but if you're considered the best of the best, that's not enough.

I also feel the hyperbolic praise also hurts Naughty Dog. Uncharted 4 is a game with plenty of flaws, but if the majority of people are saying it's a nearly perfect game and dismiss anything that seems like a criticism, it's only going to hurt Naughty Dog as a developer in the long run because there's no reason for them to improve if everything they make is called perfect before it even hits store shelves.

I also read shit like this...

You're not the only. The only memorable thing for me where the fight scenes with Nadine, those were beautifully crafted.

those were amazing - first time I felt like i was playing a next generation game

...and wonder what game they were playing. Both scenes are essentially get your ass kicked enough so the story can continue on. They even strip a mechanic (dodging), so there is nothing you can do about it. It's the worst kind of interactive cutscene.

 

[RespectThySole]

The best bit of exploration in the entire game was finding the shipwreck in At Sea. It wasn't anything major, and in the end it was just another useless collectible treasure, but at least it was something cool to find through exploration, instead of searching every nook and cranny of a huge box only to be rewarded with a "Press L3 for us to tell you where to go" prompt.

Agreed. It didn't mean much, but it's preferable over the worthless sparkling treasures with no lore or even a description behind them. You'd expect an improvement here over previous games with exploration becoming a bigger element. They went with the TLoU template, but didn't make the exploration as interesting as it is in that game.

 

[WeAreStarStuff]

Many people feel the same you do OP (including myself.)

I've been trying to play through again so that I can platinum the game like I did all three previous titles, but it is painful. So many levels I'm walking around picking up missed trophies and there are just no encounters or anything exciting; it's almost insufferable.

 

[Spinluck]

Uncharted 4 is a perfect example of great gameplay = / = great game.

It was by far the worst game in the series (and the least fun), despite the godly mechanics.

Biggest disappointment of the generation for me, I hated how the game metaphorically berated me for finding the previous games fun.

It absolutely shits on the first one which wasn't even a good game.

 

[NullPointer]

Agreed with both of these posts. Everytime I read these threads I get the impression that people had some kind of set piece and gunfight quota that they were expecting the game to fill and when it didn't it became mediocre and dissapointing.

The previous games had more firefights, more often, with more intensity, and the climbing and exploration and coversations were the cooldown between those action segments.

UC4 is a reversal of that formula, which is why I think we're seeing so much criticism for the pacing.

It looks like if you were the kind of player who thought there was too much combat in the series you'll probably love UC4. But if you just wanted more Uncharted, and more refined Uncharted, UC4 might not be your cup of tea. As somebody on the latter end there, UC4 was interesting, but I don't think its a great Uncharted, even when it has so many elements of the previous games. It's got a lot of great ingredients, but the mix is off, and cooked on a low heat.

 

[RespectThySole]

+
The endless climbing and boring characters hurt too. Elena was refreshing, but isn't really a major part of the game until she's a companion in chapter 17-20. Sully was barely there and seemed like a shell of himself. I guess he is older, but still. Nadine was the typical strong female type who basically just shows up to kick your ass twice. Rafe was better, but I didn't feel like the boss fight was necessary. Thematically great, but Rafe is a panzy and I couldn't care less about fighting him. Felt like they threw the boss fight in just because it's a game The biggest thing though is that Sam just wasn't an interesting companion and we spend the majority of the game with him. I wish that the Mafia actually got involved and Sam didn't lie, at least we would've got something more entertaining.

 

[Ascenion]

It absolutely shits on the first one which wasn't even a good game.

The only reason I slightly agree with this is because UC4 is a hybrid of UCDF and UC3 with the entire second half from like Chapter 12 on being a massive call back to UCDF just done better narratively/presentation wise. It is however far less fun than UCDF because the majority of UC4 is passive rather than active gameplay.

 

[Gbraga]

Uncharted 4 is a perfect example of great gameplay = / = great game.

It was by far the worst game in the series (and the least fun), despite the godly mechanics.

Biggest disappointment of the generation for me, I hated how the game metaphorically berated me for finding the previous games fun.

I agree with your overall point, but I'd take it in a direction that I personally find more interesting to discuss:

great mechanics = / = great gameplay.

There's a lot more to gameplay than just how your character controls. When you control Ezio in the loading screen of Assassin's Creed, that's not enough to judge Assassin's Creed's gameplay.

Most of Uncharted 4's problems are directly tied to the gameplay, even though gunplay and movement are top tier.

I feel like when people say, usually in a negative way, that a game has "great gameplay but bad everything else", they're actually putting a lot of gameplay stuff in "everything else", and only considering the core mechanics as gameplay.

When they say it in a positive way too, I didn't think MGS V was boring just because of the story, it's the gameplay I take issue with. Snake controls perfectly, but am I supposed to shrug off the boring mission design, terrible bosses, F2P upgrade stuff and all of that game's problems as "it's just the story, who cares"?

+
The endless climbing and boring characters hurt too. Elena was refreshing, but isn't really a major part of the game until she's a companion in chapter 17-20. Sully was barely there and seemed like a shell of himself. I guess he is older, but still. Nadine was the typical strong female type who basically just shows up to kick your ass twice. Rafe was better, but I didn't feel like the boss fight was necessary. Thematically great, but Rafe is a panzy and I couldn't care less about fighting him. Felt like they threw the boss fight in just because it's a game The biggest thing though is that Sam just wasn't an interesting companion and we spend the majority of the game with him. I wish that the Mafia actually got involved and Sam didn't lie, at least we would've got something more entertaining.

We'd get a really cool villain if they combined Nadine and Rafe into a single character. Or if Nadine had more interest in the search than she does, and her collaboration with Rafe was more passionate. The way it is, she literally only exists to punch people. It's Lightning V2, with all the punching Snow shit.

Elena was definitely the best part of the whole thing, but, as you said, severely underutilized.

I really really want to know how the original game was gonna be. Hopefully some of the actors end up talking about things they shouldn't in the near future.

About the Mafia stuff, it's funny that, before the game came out, I was really hoping they wouldn't make it a dumb cliche twist of Sam being a villain and whatnot, but the story was so boring and anti-fun in this game, that I wish we got a dumb cliche story that at least allowed for some fun to be had, and for Elena to be a major character throughout the entire game.

We spend most of the last Uncharted game ever with the worst character in the series. Thanks, ND.

 

[R_thanatos]

once I try to remember epic moments from this saga, only U2 and U3 will come into my mind.

I will certainly remember the BEST car chase of the saga .
Chapter 11 is one hell of a gem for me
In my top 3 of the entire saga best moments

 

[RespectThySole]

I agree with your overall point, but I'd take it in a direction that I personally find more interesting to discuss:

great mechanics = / = great gameplay.

There's a lot more to gameplay than just how your character controls. When you control Ezio in the loading screen of Assassin's Creed, that's not enough to judge Assassin's Creed's gameplay.

Most of Uncharted 4's problems are directly tied to the gameplay, even though gunplay and movement are top tier.

I feel like when people say, usually in a negative way, that a game has "great gameplay but bad everything else", they're actually putting a lot of gameplay stuff in "everything else", and only considering the core mechanics as gameplay.

When they say it in a positive way too, I didn't think MGS V was boring just because of the story, it's the gameplay I take issue with. Snake controls perfectly, but am I supposed to shrug off the boring mission design, terrible bosses, F2P upgrade stuff and all of that game's problems as "it's just the story, who cares"?

Spot on. MGSV had great mechanics, but problems with all of the above and the useless open world. Yeah, the story was disappointing, but I would've forgiven it, if there were less flaws elsewhere. My biggest problem with MGSV wasn't the story at all. That being said I still think MGSV was more fun to play overall than Uncharted 4.

Uncharted 4 has great movement options in combat and the gunplay is improved, but the gameplay outside of that(climbing, setpieces, puzzles, exploration) and the frequency of these encounters in comparison to the above weaker elements leaves a lot to be desired. The pacing just doesn't allow it to feel like a great action game since the weaker and slower elements are given the focus(no sustained tension) and since the other aspects of the game aren't great it doesn't feel like a great adventure game either. It's basically part watered down action game and part half-assed adventure game.

The best part of the game is the presentation, but even there the characters are pretty bleh aside from Elena. Rafe is alright, but I would've liked to see a villain who wasn't a complete ass and could match Nate's wits. He couldn't find the next step in finding the treasure when it was was right under his nose for 15 years and he's not a threat physically either so I'm not really satisfied on that front even if the characterization was well done.(i.e rich brat is good at fencing)

Edit: Just seeing your above post. Yup. Combining Nadine and Rafe would've been great.

 

[YankeeDonB]

We'd get a really cool villain if they combined Nadine and Rafe into a single character. Or if Nadine had more interest in the search than she does, and her collaboration with Rafe was more passionate. The way it is, she literally only exists to punch people. It's Lightning V2, with all the punching Snow shit.

Heh, I thought literally the same thing. Cool character design, but no depth and basically no personality beyond "tough."

She loses hundreds of the mercenaries under her command during the game and this has apparently 0 effect on her emotionally. Hard to take her seriously as anything other than a generic baddie given that, despite her "oh screw it" moment at the end.

And I didn't feel Rafe was any better. Like, I get that he's a trust fund kid who's worried he doesn't measure up, but why did that lead him to a Quixotic life of rune excavation and funding mercenary armies? Why not just buy a fast car, do a lot of coke, and run his father's business into the ground? Would certainly have had a lower body count.

I think a good villain in a character driven story like this needs to be a well developed character with a meaningful and well illustrated history with the protagonist who has recognizable and believable motives.

A Nate v Sam treasure-hunt-off might seem a little cliche, but if well executed would have at least grounded the antagonist and the core character conflict.

 

[Ascenion]

Heh, I thought literally the same thing. Cool character design, but no depth and basically no personality beyond "tough."

She loses hundreds of the mercenaries under her command during the game and this has apparently 0 effect on her emotionally. Hard to take her seriously as anything other than a generic baddie given that, despite her "oh screw it" moment at the end.

And I didn't feel Rafe was any better. Like, I get that he's a trust fund kid who's worried he doesn't measure up, but why did that lead him to a Quixotic life of rune excavation and funding mercenary armies? Why not just buy a fast car, do a lot of coke, and run his father's business into the ground? Would certainly have had a lower body count.

I think a good villain in a character driven story like this needs to be a well developed character with a meaningful and well illustrated history with the protagonist who has recognizable and believable motives.

A Nate v Sam treasure-hunt-off might seem a little cliche, but if well executed would have at least grounded the antagonist and the core character conflict.

Well Rafe has a massive inferiority complex. You got his motivations down but you missed the point a bit. His interaction with Sully during the auction explains it all. Yeah he's got money but it isn't his money. He wants to get the fast car and the coke but he wants it on his own. So by I'm assuming using his families connections he looks for a massive treasure to make a name for himself so bam Avery.

Spoiler

The main villain issue is while he fails at finding Avery, Nate finds 2 lost cities and El Dorado, but walks away with nothing. Rafe sees that as a waste and begins to feel inferior to Nate thinking he'd have done it better. Lo behold Nate pops back into the Avery search and immediately does his Nate magic and finds it under Rafe's nose further disenfranchising Rafe in his own mind.

Rafe is a great villain because of his bitter resent meant towards himself exhibited through his unwarranted hate for others. Rafe is a damn brilliant character if you can relate. He's truly the anti-thesis to Nate the very opposite of started from the bottom now we here.

 

[neurosyphilis]

The tower set piece is probably my favorite of all the Uncharted games. So fucking awesome.

-d0hv

 

[QuantumBro]

Well Rafe has a massive inferiority complex. You got his motivations down but you missed the point a bit. His interaction with Sully during the auction explains it all. Yeah he's got money but it isn't his money. He wants to get the fast car and the coke but he wants it on his own. So by I'm assuming using his families connections he looks for a massive treasure to make a name for himself so bam Avery.

Spoiler

The main villain issue is while he fails at finding Avery, Nate finds 2 lost cities and El Dorado, but walks away with nothing. Rafe sees that as a waste and begins to feel inferior to Nate thinking he'd have done it better. Lo behold Nate pops back into the Avery search and immediately does his Nate magic and finds it under Rafe's nose further disenfranchising Rafe in his own mind.

Rafe is a great villain because of his bitter resent meant towards himself exhibited through his unwarranted hate for others. Rafe is a damn brilliant character if you can relate. He's truly the anti-thesis to Nate the very opposite of started from the bottom now we here.

If only he was smart enough to check underneath the cathedral in the fifteen years between buying it and Drake coming back.

Alternatively 90% of the conflict could've been avoided if Sam hadn't made up his stupid lie and just convinced Drake to join him and Rafe.

 

[NullPointer]

The tower set piece is probably my favorite of all the Uncharted games. So fucking awesome.

The crumbling tower set piece? Because all I remember from that is climbing a rope while being shot and sprinting as everything is on fire and crumbles.

So, basically Tomb Raider 2013.

There was the Nadine fight afterwards, but I didn't enjoy those as you feel so absolutely constrained in controls and outcome.

Don't mean to piss in anybody's cheerios for those who really enjoy those kinds of wow moments. I guess for me the wows have to hook me in with gameplay first, or at least offer a more organic blending of gameplay and constrained cinematic. It can be a fine line.

Alternatively 90% of the conflict could've been avoided if Sam hadn't made up his stupid lie and just convinced Drake to join him and Rafe.

The set up for the whole thing is an unjustified and unresolved whopper of a lie, followed by another lie as Nate keeps things from Elena for no reason. Sam is an epic asshole, followed up next by Nate, and its pretty bonkers to think that they live happily ever after when they've killed hundreds for that lie. Throw in the space magic that teleports Elena to the cliffside Nate falls off, and the muddled justification for Nate having to go it alone for his brother in the end because of a short wall, and I really don't get the accolades for the story.

I don't need a great story to enjoy games, but if we're going to pin the success of game upon its stellar story and characters (as this game gets spoken about here) I just don't see it.