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Final Fantasy XV EGX Livestream

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But they've kept repeating the "we've kept as much of Versus as possible" line to this day. You're interpreting their silence years ago over stuff they changed as them trying to hide the chances when it's likelier they were just silent because, well, FFXV & its finer details or even larger ones weren't something they were all that talkative about in 2014 and most of 2015 (and some of them weren't probably even fully locked down at that point...)

The way I see it is that a lot of Versus is still in FFXV's genes, from key concepts & storybeats to its visual style & gameplay ideas, but most of it has seen some changes as development has progressed (some already in latter Versus days, some post-XV/Tabata change). Some small, some bigger. They've had to make some changes to the story because they've condensed what was originally planned (or well, what had turned into a saga as development progressed) to be a story spanning 2-3 games into a single game, so that's probably where the biggest changes come from, but stuff like the initial attack on Insomnia, the theft of the crystal, Noctis going on a road trip with his pals to find a way to stop Niflheim's plans (whatever they are), a society of mechanisms vs. a society prosperous due to magic and stuff like those were things that were seemingly the major part of Versus' story as well.

A lot of the stuff they've removed/changed most drastically seems like stuff that would've made FFXV more convoluted had they tried to keep them in after the change to a single game. Stella's role seemed more ambiguous initially. She didn't seem like a foe, but neither was she a friend (at least at first). I dunno, from the whole (involuntary) confrontation on the streets of Insomnia, I got the impression Stella had her own shit she was going to do during the game (maybe she was intended to be a l'cie) and that would make her path cross Noctis' from time to time, eventually probably somehow connecting with the larger storyline & what Noctis is doing in a major way. FFXV probably just wouldn't have had time for something like that, as it seems laser-focused on Noctis' journey to becoming a king worthy of all that has happened to get him where he is.

My main point of contention is that the company line was "Versus is intact, Nomura's vision is intact" and then months and months later Tabata goes "Okay guys I was fibbing forget Versus" and it's pretty clear by comparing the two games that a great deal was altered under Tabata. However, on the whole your post seems extremely reasonable and I can agree with most of it.

And on that same token the vice versa needs to stop as well than

Amen. I think extremists on both sides should take a breath and just try to have a more measured conversation. XV is going to beg comparisons to Versus and even itself in 2013 and it's okay to discuss them, but there's no reason the other point of view can't be respected.
 

DrBretto

Banned
I really hope not at that point it's about xv right?

Yeah. No. That's definitely not going to happen. :p

Now, the review thread, on the other hand... When this game starts putting up low-to-mid 90's, I imagine the detractors will be quieted for a day or two. But if the OP doesn't have Stella *in the title*, I'd be surprised.
 
It's just pointless to complain about how the current game (which we haven't played), doesn't live up to a game we never knew much about and also never played.

Just be honest and say you prefer how the old trailers made it look. It's SE's fault for not making good trailers in the past few years.

No one is comparing the actual game, just some things that changed during the transition and that people preferred how they were before.
 
You sweet, naive child.

Versus XIII and Stella will always be "the one who got away" for a lot of people.
It's weird because on the other few sites I frequent no one really brings up versus whenever ffxv comes about the focus is on what ffxv is doing. There's a connection no doubt no one can erase that but every single thread? Come on, no better than when Kagari threatens to close a ffxv thread because you guys jumped the shark and start posting yaoi art and anime gifs and stuff because there's no new news.
 
Like Yuna.

But Luna has the personality of a robot with the emotion chip busted. There's no discipline, neither strentgh, just a robot executing commands from destiny.

Yuna may not be a great example because she was basically totally on board with feeding herself into a grinder before someone was like "Uh I dunno about that" but the point remains. I also don't think this robot thing can be determined from the small glimpses of Luna we've seen and a clearly coerced radio statement, but I'm starting to think you're not interested in that.

It's just pointless to complain about how the current game (which we haven't played), doesn't live up to a game we never knew much about and also never played.

Just be honest and say you prefer how the old trailers made it look. It's SE's fault for not making good trailers in the past few years.

I'm not sure I'd classify the conversation as "pointless". It's something SE brought on themselves by reusing the Versus concept and its assets without maintaining what interested many people in Versus in the first place, such as characters or gameplay.

Please don't take it as me being glib when I say that preferring Kingdom Hearts gameplay over Type-0 gameplay is alone enough reason to be critical of XV over Versus. We have a really good idea of how Versus played and would be implemented based on gameplay, trailers and the previous works of its director. We have similar examples from Tabata, plus two playable instances of XV that are pretty close to one another.
 

OrionX

Member
Poor Luna has so many expectations to live up to. She could whip all the Gods, slay the main villain herself and ride in on a white horse to save Noctis and people would still wonder what Stella would've done. xD
 

DrBretto

Banned
How?

I don't see people comparing battle systems and such (because they barely exist on Versus)

That's actually the same reason why people shouldn't be comparing Luna to Stella.

But, you know what I mean. Deep down, I have to believe you do. It's not just people comparing some features they liked to what is there now. There are ALSO people doing that, of course. But that's not what causes this rift every time. It's because of the blinders some people have on about it. And from the outside looking in, it's incredibly toxic.
 
Yuna may not be a great example because she was basically totally on board with feeding herself into a grinder before someone was like "Uh I dunno about that" but the point remains. I also don't think this robot thing can be determined from the small glimpses of Luna we've seen and a clearly coerced radio statement, but I'm starting to think you're not interested in that.

Yuna was not really on board, she was resolute into sacrificing herself, but not without pain and fear. That's actual strength, doing something you feel is right while facing your fears and your own desires. Luna dosn't have neither fear or desires.

Also let's agree on disagree on Luna, but I'll stop for now she has enough being a robot and being bitchslapped by villains.
 
The part you bolded was in reference to DP and Kagari's dismissal of every point I made because Tabata's statements out of context.



Sorry, trying to be quick, so don't take the shortness of the paragraphs to heart:

They don't need to be inherently contradictory. They can just be relatively contradictory to see that it's not the same premise.

Seeing the light is in reference to Noctis' ability to see when someone's going to die and all that, right? If so, that's been referenced recently as still in the game.

"My heart won't let go" could mean so, so many things.

My mistake on the point about Noctis' ability! Also, no worries, but I don't think I understand your argument all that well. You're saying that their meeting as children and their Versus' meeting don't need to be directly contradictory. "My heart won't let go" could mean a lot of things, yes. It doesn't definitively mean that she's only a distant memory at this point, but I think that's easily the most probable interpretation of those words, especially given that they directly follow a childhood memory. It might not directly contradict their current engagement, but the implication clearly does. I don't see how that's much different from your example about the potential/relative/implicit contradiction between the Versus trailers and the childhood meeting in the E3 2013 trailer. I don't think it's very reasonable to present such a thing as being concrete evidence of her character being overhauled, because that conclusion still relies on the assumption that those two plot elements will not fit together. On top of that, the conclusion that she was changed in all but name requires another assumption that Noctis memory and longing will fit with their current relationship.

The words of a company or a director are not absolute, but I don't really see how the actual content of the trailers supports your conclusion well enough to say that Tabata was lying.

I don't agree at all. PS3 was obviously not letting them do a lot of what they wanted to do with the game, so considering it was getting so late in the PS360 generation and despite taking even longer for the game to be developed, Nomura not seeing the project to the end and there being big changes in the story, I'm glad we are getting this FFXV and not a more restricted vision, even if that would have been (fully) Nomura's.

The biggest negative in all of this is Jun Akiyama's disappearance from the project. I was excited to see if he could reign in some of Nomura's crazy and improve and elevate Nomura's somewhat nonsensical (but often cool) style to a more grounded and better next level.

Well if they kept it VSXIII, we wouldn't be getting a PS3 version of FFXV. FFXV would have just been a different project from scratch. What we're getting now is still a restricted vision, just less restricted by hardware and more by the development cycle. I would have preferred a Versus that was limited by the hardware not only because it might have been more cohesive led by the same team from start to finish, but because I think it would have wasted less of SE's development resources and time. The game is more impressive than Versus in a number of ways, but it still took nearly a full dev cycle of 4-4.5 years to develop the current gen version, and it's still going to fall short of expectations people had for Versus.
 

.JayZii

Banned
I'm not sure I'd classify the conversation as "pointless". It's something SE brought on themselves by reusing the Versus concept and its assets without maintaining what interested many people in Versus in the first place, such as characters or gameplay.

Please don't take it as me being glib when I say that preferring Kingdom Hearts gameplay over Type-0 gameplay is alone enough reason to be critical of XV over Versus. We have a really good idea of how Versus played and would be implemented based on gameplay, trailers and the previous works of its director. We have similar examples from Tabata, plus two playable instances of XV that are pretty close to one another.
I guess I say it's pointless because this conversation, and variations on it, have been done to death in almost every single FFXV thread. Of which there have been many. I suppose that's on me, and I should stop popping in on these threads every few pages because i could easily ignore it.

I just don't know what else is left to be said on the matter.
Poor Luna has so many expectations to live up to. She could whip all the Gods, slay the main villain herself and ride in on a white horse to save Noctis and people would still wonder what Stella would've done. xD
"Now they're just pandering. 'You-know-who' would have been much more grounded and realistic."

You-know-who is
Voldemort.
 
That's actually the same reason why people shouldn't be comparing Luna to Stella.

But, you know what I mean. Deep down, I have to believe you do. It's not just people comparing some features they liked to what is there now. There are ALSO people doing that, of course. But that's not what causes this rift every time. It's because of the blinders some people have on about it. And from the outside looking in, it's incredibly toxic.

We have enough idea of Stella role and portrayal on Versus to compare it and prefer it to her actual role on XV.

We didn't have a clue of the actual gameplay of Versus, outside of the action focused combat we didn't know shit.

Actually, if there was something fully defined on Versus was that, because we know that Nojima finished the script of the game at some point in development.
 

Ray Down

Banned
I guess I say it's pointless because this conversation, and variations on it, have been done to death in almost every single FFXV thread. Of which there have been many. I suppose that's on me, and I should stop popping in on these threads every few pages because i could easily ignore it.

I just don't know what else is left to be said on the matter.

There's isn't much to talk about seeing how we don't got full details on why the changes were made or really how originally everything was going to go down.

I think the fact we all have vague ideas on reasons for these just keep the talk around more and if we ever finally do get details it will all just end because it's finally out in the open.
 

Ferr986

Member
Aww man just wasted 30 mins fighting the Behemoth for nothing (lvl 32).

I could keep fighting him for hours if it was for me, but the AI allies keep dying, over and over, till I ran out of phoenix downs. Prompto especially is dumb as fuck.

At the end I gave up when he was at around 25% left.

Yuna may not be a great example because she was basically totally on board with feeding herself into a grinder before someone was like "Uh I dunno about that" but the point remains. I also don't think this robot thing can be determined from the small glimpses of Luna we've seen and a clearly coerced radio statement, but I'm starting to think you're not interested in that.

Atleast in Kingslaive Luna is close to being a robot personality wise. She have no personality whatsoever other than I just have to do what I have to do because that's what I've been told. Terrible character in the movie. That being said, let's see what happens in the game.
 
Aww man just wasted 30 mins fighting the Behemoth for nothing (lvl 32).

I could keep fighting him for hours if it was for me, but the AI allies keep dying, over and over, till I ran out of phoenix downs. Prompto especially is dumb as fuck.

At the end I gave up when he was at around 25% left.
Lol I could have told ya don't do it. I did it foolishly because I'm stubborn but that fight is terrible withotge platinum demo combat amoung other things can't wait to do it again in the full game tho.
 

Ferr986

Member
Lol I could have told ya don't do it. I did it foolishly because I'm stubborn but that fight is terrible withotge platinum demo combat amoung other things can't wait to do it again in the full game tho.

lol to be fair it wasn't that hard because I dragged him into one of those electric posts (mind you this is post-demo) so I could just climb up and heal (I feel that is broken as fuck btw lol, it heals so fast), but yeah his HP pool being insane + the AI being dumb and the camera spinning around like crazy didn't help me at all.

Also, saw lots of Imperial ships flying over me, thaks fucking god no robots dropped lol
 
lol to be fair it wasn't that hard because I dragged him into one of those electric posts (mind you this is post-demo) so I could just climb up and heal (I feel that is broken as fuck btw lol, it heals so fast), but yeah his HP pool being insane + the AI being dumb and the camera spinning around like crazy didn't help me at all.

Also, saw lots of Imperial ships flying over me, thaks fucking god no robots dropped lol
Yea they added stamina to the hanging on posts thing. Your level is way lower than mine when I beat him tho lol I was like 65 I think. Should get some more levels if not for you the party. Pretty easy sleep at a camp and get the attack/poison/Xp bonus, fight at night(endless ships and goblins good luck) and sleep at the trailer afterwards(more Xp)... obviously I played that demo too much

Edit:feel you inu, im just done with that convo as a whole so I'll drop it here
 

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony
And on that same token the vice versa needs to stop as well than

People care about what they saw of the previous version of the project, which was clearly different. if they want to compare them, they have the right to do so. Nobody who does that is going to say these two games were the same.

Now if we're talking about my personal opinion? I personally believe that 15 should be analyzed in a vacuum and Versus should just not be brought up period anymore, because it leads to thread derailing like this. But there are people who don't think like that, and they have the right to voice their grievances about the journey of the project if they want to.

Poor Luna has so many expectations to live up to. She could whip all the Gods, slay the main villain herself and ride in on a white horse to save Noctis and people would still wonder what Stella would've done. xD

But, will she put on a better showing than Kingsglaive? Standing up to a sea dragon isn't going to be enough for some to make her the full female representative of this game. She needs to be shown in a far better light in game than she has pre launch.
 
Versus talk isn't going to stop. It won't stop when the game comes out whether the game is amazing, bad, or average. Because Square made the mistake of basically rebooting this game after years of teasers and trailers we have this situation. It's not going away.
 
I guess I say it's pointless because this conversation, and variations on it, have been done to death in almost every single FFXV thread. Of which there have been many. I suppose that's on me, and I should stop popping in on these threads every few pages because i could easily ignore it.

I just don't know what else is left to be said on the matter.

Ah, it'd be a shame if you started ignoring XV threads though. I'm sure when there's a bit more to talk about the Versus talk will be down to at least a dull roar. Also...

You sweet, naive child.

Versus XIII and Stella will always be "the one who got away" for a lot of people.

The bolded is, humorously, TOTALLY TRUE for me. I'd been waiting for Nomura to get the chance to develop a full, original Final Fantasy title for ages.
 

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony
Would FF15 as a game in terms of quality and fan appeal been better off with them fully canceling Versus officially like Kotaku reported all those years ago, putting Nomura on FF7R and KH3 and having Tabata start work on a new game from scratch? Quite possibly.

Would the game have come out at the time FF15 is coming out now? Not likely. Would shareholders have revolted because it would have shown the amount of time and energy spent on Versus with nothing to show for it being plain evidence of SE's mindfuck of logistical nightmares last gen? Yes it would have.

You have to balance the two on a scale.

We can tell that Tabata is obviously not happy about directing this game, its an 'obligation to the fans' as he says. Its not his original work, its not his original concepts he had to take and mold into something, anything, to throw out there to make use of it.

But this is what we have.

The bolded is, humorously, TOTALLY TRUE for me. I'd been waiting for Nomura to get the chance to develop a full, original Final Fantasy title for ages.

It seems like he's funneling a lot of his raging anger into FF7R, i think that'll have to be enough for now. Even though its not an original work technically, i think it'll be so different for a lot of people that it might as well be considered its own work.
 
I guess I say it's pointless because this conversation, and variations on it, have been done to death in almost every single FFXV thread. Of which there have been many. I suppose that's on me, and I should stop popping in on these threads every few pages because i could easily ignore it.

I just don't know what else is left to be said on the matter.

"Now they're just pandering. 'You-know-who' would have been much more grounded and realistic."

You-know-who is
Voldemort.
I did this for a good while actually my will was too weak unfortunately and the tgs trailer pulled me into a thread
 

DrBretto

Banned
My mistake on the point about Noctis' ability! Also, no worries, but I don't think I understand your argument all that well. You're saying that their meeting as children and their Versus' meeting don't need to be directly contradictory. "My heart won't let go" could mean a lot of things, yes. It doesn't definitively mean that she's only a distant memory at this point, but I think that's easily the most probable interpretation of those words, especially given that they directly follow a childhood memory. It might not directly contradict their current engagement, but the implication clearly does. I don't see how that's much different from your example about the potential/relative/implicit contradiction between the Versus trailers and the childhood meeting in the E3 2013 trailer. I don't think it's very reasonable to present such a thing as being concrete evidence of her character being overhauled, because that conclusion still relies on the assumption that those two plot elements will not fit together. On top of that, the conclusion that she was changed in all but name requires another assumption that Noctis memory and longing will fit with their current relationship.

The words of a company or a director are not absolute, but I don't really see how the actual content of the trailers supports your conclusion well enough to say that Tabata was lying.

Respectfully, you actually bring up a few of the fallacies that lead to this in the first place. Please don't take me pointing these out as me making fun of you, it's just to help you understand, and absolutely not to insult.

When you say that it's easily the easiest interpretation of that line, you're using that conjecture to support a different conjecture. And that's, in a nutshell, how misinformation spreads. I'm going to give you an example and hope I don't ramble on too much, but it's a relatively complex concept that's difficult to explain.

Imagine, for a minute, a public figure wrongfully accused of something. Let's, for the sake of argument, say it's a prominent football player accused of underinflating footballs. Totally random example! lol. And this player, during his press conference looks all nervous. So, the public at large sees this nervousness as confirmation of guilt. And you have two bits of information: A person is accused of a crime, and a person, when speaking about the crime is acting nervous.

So, what's the easiest thing you can attribute that nervousness to? Guilt, of course. So, now you have these two vague points supporting each other in this conclusion. The case I'm obviously referring to was far more complicated than this, but keeping it simple for the sake of discussion. The problem with this is that the two bits of information support each other, without anything tangible to anchor them. Like, in this case, the fact that the science proves that the balls were never actually deflated in the first place.

I'd say a lot of the people are completely unaware they are doing this, so it's not an insult to anyone's intelligence, but when you explain to someone that the speculation about the football deflation is irrelevant because the science tells us there was no crime in the first place, and the response is always akin to "well, then why was he so nervous during the press conference??", that's called post-facto justification and it's the main ingredient in witch hunts.

This may sound unrelated to this game, but it's really not. In a nutshell, this is what's gone on here for a long time. You did it just now by introducing your interpretation of the "My heart won't let go" line as evidence that that's what it refers to. It's self-reinforced in your mind because it seems to fit the other conjecture. The bottom line here is that "My heart won't let go" is as ambiguous as someone being nervous at a press conference.

I've studied this sort of thing for years. It has always fascinated me. And you can spot the signs easily once you get a good grasp of it. Clear as day. In my opinion, the same ingredients that make up a witch hunt are in play. And this is indistinguishable from scapegoating as well. Both are happening to Tabata and it's incredible grating to read it over and over again.



Now, sorry for rambling there, but to your point about them meeting as children or not, that meeting is presented as them meeting for the first time. It's actually a fundamental ingredient to the original premise. The idea that they could have met as kids when the original premise was completely different is a great example of a post-facto justification.

Imagine it's some time before the 2013 E3 trailer was revealed and all anyone knows is what's gone on with the original Stella trailers (including that they have just met for the first time, as evidenced here - http://web.archive.org/web/20100316...nal-fantasy-versus-xiii-nomura-interview.html - "Famitsu: Can you explain what is happening in the scene from the images released?"
"Nomura: The scene takes place at a party. This is the first time they have met each other.") . If you were to float the possibility that they had actually met as kids after it was explicitly stated that the premise is that they have met for the first time, you would be run off the board. The justification ONLY makes sense if you look back on it from today and connect the new dot to the old dot. Conjecture in general isn't a bad thing, BTW, just when it's being used as an argument or justification. It's like adding two variables without a constant.

Having "Stella" and Noctis meet as children is already a major departure from the original premise. But more than that, it PERFECTLY fits what is currently the Luna character as it is today. Through and through. That is as close to proof as you are going to get that the female character in the E3 2013 Trailer MUST be Luna in all but name.
 
Would FF15 as a game in terms of quality and fan appeal been better off with them fully canceling Versus officially like Kotaku reported all those years ago, putting Nomura on FF7R and KH3 and having Tabata start work on a new game from scratch? NoQuite possibly.

Would the game have come out at the time FF15 is coming out now? Yes Not likely. Would shareholders have revolted because it would have shown the amount of time and energy spent on Versus with nothing to show for it being plain evidence of SE's mindfuck of logistical nightmares last gen? The job of a shareholder is to revolt Yes it would have.

You have to balance the two on a scale.
Why?

We can tell that Tabata is obviously not happy about directing this game Have you asked him?, its an 'obligation to the fans' as he says HUH?. Its not his original work, its not his original concepts he had to take and mold into something, anything, to throw out there to make use of it.He's the director of the game and he gave credit to nomura about the overall creation of the characters and world.

^_^;
 

OrionX

Member
But, will she put on a better showing than Kingsglaive? Standing up to a sea dragon isn't going to be enough for some to make her the full female representative of this game. She needs to be shown in a far better light in game than she has pre launch.

Oh I agree, I've been kinda concerned with how she's been presented so far too. My point was just that she'll likely be heavily scrutinized no matter how she turns out. But yeah, it's not that I need her to be some kinda beast mode warrior, I just hope there's a little more to her story than, "Must help Noctis. Must fulfill destiny. Beep boop bop," and getting beaten down just to give Noctis motivation and development.
 

Mcdohl

Member
We need a community thread for VersusXIII.

I'm not against the original vision, in fact, I've defended it at times over Kingsglaive, but it's getting pretty annoying to see this discussion on every XV thread.

And actual XV talk gets buried.
 
It seems like he's funneling a lot of his raging anger into FF7R, i think that'll have to be enough for now. Even though its not an original work technically, i think it'll be so different for a lot of people that it might as well be considered its own work.

It is really nice that VII:R seems to have a lot of Versus' DNA in its combat systems, and I believe we'll see a lot of what Nomura might have done for XV utilized in what's implemented in his new project. VII:R has too much already set in stone though as a matter of its source material, so Nomura can't stretch his creativity too much which is why I'd really have preferred he get to see his own project to the end and have it judged on its merits. A lot of what's still cool about Noctis' gameplay in XV came from Nomura's concepts for him and his combat design, and I hope he gets to take his own original crack at things again down the line.

Probably not though since he'll be an old man by the time he finishes VII:R.
 
We need a community thread for VersusXIII.

I'm not against the original vision, in fact, I've defended it at times over Kingsglaive, but it's getting pretty annoying to see this discussion on every XV thread.

And actual XV talk gets buried.
Ffxv community thread was turned down doubt a community thread for a cancelled/unused? Game would be allowed either
 
We need a community thread for VersusXIII.

I'm not against the original vision, in fact, I've defended it at times over Kingsglaive, but it's getting pretty annoying to see this discussion on every XV thread.

And actual XV talk gets buried.

If it is the community section, sure. Didn't Modbot shut down the other one posted in the main gaming section, telling the creator to "get over it".
 

DrBretto

Banned
We have enough idea of Stella role and portrayal on Versus to compare it and prefer it to her actual role on XV.

We didn't have a clue of the actual gameplay of Versus, outside of the action focused combat we didn't know shit.

Actually, if there was something fully defined on Versus was that, because we know that Nojima finished the script of the game at some point in development.

You missed my point three times in a row (and you're the only one talking about gameplay, I'm not even sure what that's coming from). You can certainly look at the VS trailers and decide that that's the version of Stella that you'd prefer. What I'm saying is that that is not what is being disputed. If people present it like that, this isn't a problem. The problem is people's blind faith that this character was preserved properly in the original VS script in the first place. Especially when there's a fair amount of evidence suggesting that it really may well not have been.

I'm referring both to the character, and the whole story, BTW. Because I do believe there's actually quite a bit of information supporting the idea that many of the things being put out there as Tabata's meddling are likely to have actually been the crux of the original VS story. The only thing different being the belief in the person at the helm.
 

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony

So your saying that an original game by Tabata would not have possibly been better than what we're getting now? By what measure?

Also, while a shareholder's job is to react, SE obviously did not want to deal with the fallout of what it would do to their investor confidence to cancel this game they had more than half a decade in the making, hence why they re-purposed it.

My point of saying that you have to balance the two on a scale is that there were going to be pros and cons to whatever choice they made, either making a brand new game or going with reusing Versus assets, and they chose the one they thought most prudent.

I would not need to ask Tabata if he's happy getting the brunt of anger by fans for working on the initial premise of something he did not create and characters he did not originally make.

It is really nice that VII:R seems to have a lot of Versus' DNA in its combat systems, and I believe we'll see a lot of what Nomura might have done for XV utilized in what's implemented in his new project. VII:R has too much already set in stone though as a matter of its source material, so Nomura can't stretch his creativity too much which is why I'd really have preferred he get to see his own project to the end and have it judged on its merits. A lot of what's still cool about Noctis' gameplay in XV came from Nomura's concepts for him and his combat design, and I hope he gets to take his own original crack at things again down the line.

Probably not though since he'll be an old man by the time he finishes VII:R.

I believe Nomura's exact words were 'if we wanted to make the same game, i would not have been brought on to direct it"

There will be changes, as long as the characters he originally designed are there and the story is somewhat recognizable, i don't think they really are in a situation where their hands are tied when making changes.
 
I believe Nomura's exact words were 'if we wanted to make the same game, i would not have been brought on to direct it"

There will be changes, as long as the characters he originally designed are there and the story is somewhat recognizable, i don't think they really are in a situation where their hands are tied when making changes.

I mean I'm sure they'll take some liberties, but for the most part a lot of these characters are clearly defined in ways that'll make it hard for Nomura to be original with them. Likewise, world elements such as materia, mako, etc. are already well-defined. I think most of the stuff they're talking about here will be in the form of gameplay systems like action combat and or expansions on unexplored areas of VII. Meanwhile I think Nomura's at his best when he's behind the concept of something completely new.

I still think he's the man for the job on VII:R though.
 
Yuna was not really on board, she was resolute into sacrificing herself, but not without pain and fear. That's actual strength, doing something you feel is right while facing your fears and your own desires. Luna dosn't have neither fear or desires.

Also let's agree on disagree on Luna, but I'll stop for now she has enough being a robot and being bitchslapped by villains.

Categorically false. Even in the movie, it was made clear what her fears and desires are. The game itself will go more in depth in regards to that. What her desires and fears are and what needs to be done for the world is another matter altogether.
 

Tyaren

Member
In the meantime lets have some awesome gifs! :D

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How can there be so much love to detail and perfection to animations like this during gameplay? O:

Also...

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Lol
 
Versus talk isn't going to stop. It won't stop when the game comes out whether the game is amazing, bad, or average. Because Square made the mistake of basically rebooting this game after years of teasers and trailers we have this situation. It's not going away.

Let's be 100. Even if this game was called FFXVI and used none of the content from the canceled game, people would still bring it up. People are just in love with Nomura, his trailer directing and the "what if..." based on the little bit of concepts we have. Nothing more to it than that. The fact XV uses a lot of what that concept had is just a way for fans of canceled game to be able to talk about it without coming across as people living in the past who always like to bring up this canceled game in XV threads. *shrug*
 
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