Its Quite Toasty
Banned
It has that upside but for someone without a god roll it only adds to the frustration of wondering was I beaten because of skill or perk RNG
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Destiny 2: "Last Call" Teaser, full trailer March 30 10AM PT / 6PM BST
- Thread starter AaronMT86
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It has that upside but for someone without a god roll it only adds to the frustration of wondering was I beaten because of skill or perk RNG
None of this makes any sense.
molnizzle
Member
This is true.
Though they've been pretty good about having god rolls (or nearly god rolls) available for purchase from IB vendor or in gunsmith drops. If you play long enough you'll eventually get something.
franklyshankly
Member
This is a thing in every MMO game with gear basically. Getting good gear so you can be at your best in PVP is most of the fun to me.
A agree that they don't, but there were plenty of points when there were - in both PvE and PvP.
PvP has been unplayable for me for a long while, but that was due to PvP specific changes rather than PVE stuff.
The core concept of Destiny is that your character is persistent across everything. There's 0 chance of them dividing them.
Its Quite Toasty
Banned
yeah but most arent skill based shooters
molnizzle
Member
...which is exactly what makes Destiny so attractive to many longtime MMO players like me. ;-)
MMO gear grind with Bungie shooter combat. Perfection.
franklyshankly
Member
WoW arena is very skill based (not a shooter of course), and still relies heavily on gear. Or at least it did last time I played which was a while back.
How so many people can think a game with that much aim assist and autoaim as Destiny has good gunpley is beyond me.
I played a ton of Destiny 1 and I am ready to return if they, like already said, seperate pvp perks from pve perks. The multiplayer in Destiny was always terrible to me, and once they started to get a balance going they ruined fun weapons for PVE.
Also give us more features right from the start, custom matches especially.
No Destiny 1 loading screen times.. god this game was annoying.
Their RNG system. They should have asked for a string of code from Blizzard, their RNG felt way more natural, often in Destiny I thought the game had like a magnet on stuff I already owned.
As long as Bungie doesn't tend to overstate again what this game is capable of I'll be happy, though Bungie tends to do that everytime.
I played a ton of Destiny 1 and I am ready to return if they, like already said, seperate pvp perks from pve perks. The multiplayer in Destiny was always terrible to me, and once they started to get a balance going they ruined fun weapons for PVE.
Also give us more features right from the start, custom matches especially.
No Destiny 1 loading screen times.. god this game was annoying.
Their RNG system. They should have asked for a string of code from Blizzard, their RNG felt way more natural, often in Destiny I thought the game had like a magnet on stuff I already owned.
As long as Bungie doesn't tend to overstate again what this game is capable of I'll be happy, though Bungie tends to do that everytime.
Its Quite Toasty
Banned
no problem with a grind I get the appeal just not in pvp.
I sincerely hope no one at Bungie actually feels this way because hahahaha no. For me, PvP is the absolute weakest aspect of Destiny. I'd rather play just about any other shooter on the market. PvE is where the game's strength is.
Seriously, I cannot stand PVP in Destiny. It does sometimes feel like they focus way too much on the PVP aspect, and I get why, but PVE is the only reason I'm interested in playing Destiny.
Separating weapons (or at least giving them PVP/PVE-only perks that you can swap out) would be great. I want my PVE to be over the top with no regard to PVP balancing.
murdochmystery
Member
Not much anymore. Blizzard now has set PvP talents, and class profiles that everyone is set to in instanced-pvp (so every rogue has for example 1million health and 2000 agility). I think an increase of 10 ilvls in WoW is now the equivalent to 1% more stats in pvp, or something like that.
Interficium
Banned
They're probably not chomping at the bit to make their flagship product "more like" a dying franchise.
I agree. PvP in Destiny has always been a shitshow with all the instakill weapons and abilities available, I want stuff to be insane in PvE though.
Its Quite Toasty
Banned
thats not happening because of the halo that bungie made. Just because the franchise is rocky now doesnt mean that taking ideas is a bad idea.
Whether you like PVE more or PVP more, you can't deny that the perks on armor and guns are for the most part extremely boring.
Then there's the 3 stats; Strength, Discipline and Intellect. Extremely, extreeemely boring and unexciting.
D2 needs to revamp this area of the game and make it all more compelling and intimate. I want to be excited when I get a loot drop.
Then there's the 3 stats; Strength, Discipline and Intellect. Extremely, extreeemely boring and unexciting.
D2 needs to revamp this area of the game and make it all more compelling and intimate. I want to be excited when I get a loot drop.
PuppetMaster
Member
This. Halo fans should stick to Halo. Bungie does not need them. They have a new viberant community now for Destiny. While Halo's community is in decline.
josecitoxnyo
Member
What.
There is not a single weapon in any FPS in the market that is more fun to use than Fatebringer/imago Loop.
And that's all because of the combination of looks and Outlaw + Firefly.
If your point is to say that there is a lot of useless perks that need to be reworked, we totally agree on that one.
One could argue that stat simplicity and emphasis on player skill over knowing what 10 different stats to stack and balance out is what gives game a lot of that mass appeal.
PuppetMaster
Member
molnizzle
Member
I certainly would.
...there's also a hell of a lot of depth to those relatively "simple" stats. Those that've really gone down the competitive rabbit hole in Destiny realize that.
That said, there are definitely a bunch of useless perks that badly need to be reworked.
Complicated
Banned
Destiny PvP might as well not have existed. I played a few hours then never touched it again. Reminded me of the throwaway multiplayer modes single player games were doing for a while to combat used game sales.
Destiny has simple stats by the design and illusion of perk depth for gear. Most of them and combinations of them are trash. When you have played game for a while it becomes obvious that there is e.g. one rocket launcher that is vastly superior to others.
I have 1000+ hours clocked on Destiny. Try again.
I can deny all of that actually.
The simplicity is what gives the game the appeal that it has and it has quite a bit of depth under the surface.
Looking forward to seeing what they show, I enjoyed a lot of Destiny, but god did the story and general flow suck of the basic game single player. I loved the universe they were building, but there was no real meat to it, just characters that did nothing, things that happened that were never explained, the whole having to go to the website for any more info from those cards was also a ridiculously lame way to do it, it felt like the game was missing half of its content. I stopped playing after the original game, nearly got the first DLC but everyone said it was terrible and a waste of time, so I stopped completely. I wish I could have been into it more for the expansions but the pull wasn't there after the disappointing SP.
So yea, I am looking forward to seeing what they do with the second game. Going from some videos the expansions looked like they got more interesting and did more story stuff with characters, hopefully they continue that trend in this sequel. Do we have any idea if they will bring over characters from D1? I know it was rumored that they were going to start fresh again, but I haven't had time to read the whole topic to see if it was answered already.
So yea, I am looking forward to seeing what they do with the second game. Going from some videos the expansions looked like they got more interesting and did more story stuff with characters, hopefully they continue that trend in this sequel. Do we have any idea if they will bring over characters from D1? I know it was rumored that they were going to start fresh again, but I haven't had time to read the whole topic to see if it was answered already.
SPACECADET
Member
here's hoping for more longevity in PvE in the second game.
molnizzle
Member
That's fine if you don't like it, but this is wrong. There are entire podcasts devoted to Destiny PvP. Destiny is generally in the top 10 most viewed games on Twitch each weekend specifically because of Trials matches. PvP is just as important as PvE in Destiny. Arguably more important.
ShinMaruku
Member
I am of two minds about Destiny. If the game goes more in the MMO mold I am out. I fell out of love with mmos and anything that resembles them too much sours me. But if this keeps the rpg trappings and keep the gun play good, I think I will dig the game.
It's far too simple for my tastes and there's a real lack of choice because of it.
The 3 elements, Void, Arc and Solar need a revamp as well.
It's pretty clear that they've kept PVE perks limited so PVP balance isn't thrown out of window, but that just hurts PVE and makes it more boring.
How you would revamp them?
Edit: Agreed about PvE getting shit on for PvP's benefit. That trend started early on into Y1 and kept going.
Agreed. It would be nice if elements had effects or properties of some sort instead of just match the colors. Fire could add damage over time, void lower defenses, etc. At least do something to spice up the elements. You could synergize that with new build options and such to let people come up with a more diverse play-styles. Right now, they're just another thing to collect because of reasons. "I need void because I might run into a void dude." There's nothing really interesting about that.
Complicated
Banned
Podcasts and twitch views are your argument for why Destiny PvP is good? Really? I don't even know what to say to that.
Just a quick brainstorm: I would give them additional PVE properties, like Solar can have an added burn effect, Arc can stun or jump to another nearby target, void can slow enemies.
Completely agree.
The rolls on the guns don't seem all that impactful unless its something like firefly or explosive rounds...this is one area that they could borrow heavily from Borderlands.
Herp Derpington
Member
You clearly aren't up to what's big with the game if you actually believe that. This seems like such an uninformed thing to say that I'm thinking you just said it to see what kind of rise you can get out of people. Nerfing weapons for PvP that affect PvE by extension show just what the crucible means to Bungie. It's half the damn game for crying out loud.
molnizzle
Member
...yes? There are many who like it. Like, a shitload of people. Saying that it "might as well not have existed" is flat-out wrong. PvP is responsible for a great deal of Destiny's continued success. Like... probably most of its continued success. People aren't still playing the game years after release to run the same braindead story missions over and over again. PvP is a huge aspect of the game.
I feel like these conversations just turn into hyperbole and reactiveness when people make it about "be more like [some other game]." But citing other games as examples is fine, and it doesn't mean Destiny would become less like Destiny if it adopted them. Games refine their mechanics between sequels all the time. That's kind of the point of sequels.
Stuff like movement speed and gun accuracy are a huge part of what gives an FPS its feel, though, so I don't blame you all for being wary. The Halo community has had these conversations for years now, with each iteration feeling different than the one before. It always brings out a lot of strong opinions, hah.
I don't think you have much to worry about. I guess it depends on what you mean by "MMO mold" though.
Destiny's PvP feels very good to play. It controls well and feels fluid to play, even for 30FPS FPS game. Map design is solid and imo has less shitty maps than most MP FPS games out there.
It has issue of being very meta driven, e.g. blinkshotty or handcannon, and those dominate PvP for months at the time.
True, but not like even those would make elements that much more interesting imo. Would spice them up tho.
Difference is that in Destiny it's more controlled what weapon can get what where in Borderlands it's what ever so most stuff you get is pure trash. You have to farm even more to get those combos that work well.
Edit:
For me Destiny PvP would stop being Destiny PvP if it moved to direction where everyone is bunnyhopping around and spraying from hip with 100% accuracy.
Agreed. The guns don't feel different or unique enough. Yes, there are differences between them, and some of them are cool, but for a game like Destiny, I want to be able to find weapons that have over the top perks that I can unlock.
Looking Destiny's content, how could anybody view Destiny as prioritizing PvP? Much more content exists on the PvE side. To hamstring it for the minimal PvP content is self-defeating.
Complicated
Banned
I'm just going by context, but you seem to think this is a good thing. I do not. Making the main game less fun to balance a mediocre 30fps multiplayer mode is suuuuper dumb in my opinion.
I don't think Call of Duty multiplayer has been good for several years either, and it is still wildly popular. I'm just fine with more casual multiplayer games being more popular than hyper-competitive games.
I disagree with all of these things. It has lots of auto-aim and bullet magnetism which makes it accessible to a lot of people.
The 7 month exotic handcannon meta was EXAUSTING to play in. If you didn't have Thorn, The Last Word or Hawkmoon, you were basically handicapped.
The most fun I had with Destiny PVP was at launch when basically everything was OP, but the Suros Regime was the MOST OP.
The Salt Life
Banned
Yeah except how many pvp games are accessed with an an ever changing world?
Bungie said since the beginning the game will always be changing, and change it has.
Month 1 Destiny is different from The Dark Brlow which was different from House of Elves, which was changed even more in The Takrn King.
The people who stuck around saw that change.
molnizzle
Member
Bungie designed the game to be played continuously, like an MMO. After a month or two (if that) of burning through all the PvE content you'll be done with it and move on to another game. The people who stick around are there for the PvP. They probably still run their Nightfall each week and maybe even a raid—but just to stock up on infusion fodder for their PvP gear. PvP is what has kept the same people playing during the long stretches between the major expansions.
Bungie's attitude in how they approach balance reflects this. PvP is clearly the priority, and PvE often suffers as a result.
Exactly what I was thinking. They could let players choose elements for their specials and such as well. It'd be cool to have a hunter tether that debuffs, or has flaming tendrils, or stuns everyone in the area. Obviously they've already made these choices, but D1 felt so limited and narrow in scope in a lot of ways, it would be really cool to see them open up some of these systems that felt kind of half-assed in D1.
What are those hyper-competitive FPS games? C-S and.... maybe OW? Nothing else comes to mind personally.
Also feel free to disagree. For me Destiny is only console FPS in which I have actually enjoyed PvP and I played quite a bit Halo on 360 back then.*
*I'm PC gamer primarily
Ah the memories
Mythoclast was also super crazy in PvP for a while.Good times
Complicated
Banned
Almost every major PvP game that has released in the last few years has had ongoing updates that change balance and game meta, so I'm not sure what you mean. That by itself does not make a thing good.
I think you are greatly overestimating how many people play PvP. A lot do, but it isn't the premiere end-game content as you make it sound.
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