-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Anyone else playing Botw and wish for trophies???
- Thread starter EhoaVash
- Start date
Milly Osworth
Member
Nope I didnt know and thats the problem.
I would have known if there was an achievement!
Clear all 120 shrines (25 points)
Progress 55/120
Reward: Hylian Motorbike
EdwardTivrusky
Member
Pretty much. I find most trophies and 'chievos bland and uncreative anyway but i'll look through the list to see if there's any that seem worth bothering with when i'm towards the end of the game.
BOTW though, i'm over 120 hours into it and only now starting to go for the story quests and not once have i thought that trophies would make it a better experience.
-Mutsukki-
Member
That kinda ruins it by a lot for me...
Besides, OS trophies rarely have tangible rewards to them. Though I guess this style is more like WoW like you said before.
But it wouldn't sit well with me. I like them in FFXIV because I'll live in that world for years to come, it wouldn't feel right in Zelda imo
(Also the point is not exactly knowing what IS the reward or that you're even getting one at all)
I know this sounds ridiculous but I really, really hope Nintendo retains the simplistic nature of its online services. All I want them to add is room & party chat with a better friends list presence. I hate the whole achievement and trophy systems as I genuinely think it cheapens games.
test_account
XP-39C²
Yes, just like adding in-game challenges can be hostile to people with strong OCD. Look at BotW with those 900 seeds being tied to 100% completion stats for example, but i dont see people complain about that in the same way. And thats just a recent example. Theres many games through history that has in-game challenges and stats. Would you argue that such things should be removed completely from games?
I agree that it can have a physcological effect like you mention, but i dont agree that it necessarily changes things in such way that you basically cant enjoy the game without hearing a ding sound. Do you feel this way? Of so, do you know the reason why? I think almost everyone on this board has good experience with the different achievement systsems across all the platforms, so you can say that they are conditioned/used to it. Does that mean that they're not able to enjoy older retro games and newer Nintendo games as much anymore because they dont get the rewards of achievements popping up? I'm sure there are some people, but i'm thinking about the majority of people.
Ultimately its up to each person to deside how much things matters, i'd say. I dont think this discounts what you're saying. I agree that it can alter how people feel/play in a smaller way, but that can be said about in-game challenges as well, like BotW, Smash Bros and Shovel Knight, just to take a few examples. If it becomes such a physcological problem for some, its a pity, but at least theres way to deal with that. I used to be more of an avid trophy collector, but now i dont care as much. I try to go for 100% if i enjoy it, otherwise i dont. If people enjoy doing it, why does it matter? If one feel that it alter your enjoyment of a game in a negative way, then that sucks. At least one guy in this thread said that he is like this, so then its understandable i think. But when talking about the system in general, i dont see why the focus is only on the negative side.
"Oh no this very dear character is about to die! Cue to the tense music! Cue to the great camera work! Closeuppppp...
DING! "Achievement unlocked: Dramatic Scene!"
And that 6 figures budget for writing, modelling, animating, directing that scene went instantly into the shitter.
And this is basically why I disable achievement instantly on every platform. Tip of the hat to Nintendo for not even attempting this behavioral-conditioning nonsense.
DING! "Achievement unlocked: Dramatic Scene!"
And that 6 figures budget for writing, modelling, animating, directing that scene went instantly into the shitter.
And this is basically why I disable achievement instantly on every platform. Tip of the hat to Nintendo for not even attempting this behavioral-conditioning nonsense.
JackBauer24
Member
I literally thought about this earlier today. Achievement/Trophies have ruined me on older generation games and ones without some type of reward.
-Mutsukki-
Member
Leafhopper
Banned
Yeah 500 hidden trophies.
test_account
XP-39C²
Do you have any examples of this? Especially regarding the conclusion being spoiled.
-Mutsukki-
Member
I don't unfortunately, I remember the situation, but not the specific game. I feel like saying Final Fantasy XIII, but I'm not sure if that's the case. (Not regarding spoilers, but them popping early)
test_account
XP-39C²
No worries, i was just curious. I dont think its common, at least not the spoiler thing. Some developers have also delt nicely with this. In Heavy Rain, i dont think that any trophies popped before the game was over. The Last of Us also had very few trophies during the first playthrough if i remember correctly.
Scalpel Knight
Member
I really don't want achievements in this game but I realise why others do. For me they would probably detract from the game rather than add to it. I'm not about to find all 900 Koroks.
I feel like achievements can make some devs (not all but some) lazy. After all why make some ingame item or piece of lore for getting collectables when you can make an achievement much easier. And barely any game does anything interesting with achievements, the only exceptions I can think of are Portal 2 and Stanley Parable.
As a former achievement nut, I'm glad I don't worry about them anymore.
As a former achievement nut, I'm glad I don't worry about them anymore.
Double Donut
Member
Sigh. I just don't get how people can get so hostile over people enjoying achievements/trophies.
We get it lads. You're above our filthy casual IQ for accepting the evil Pavlovian brainwashing that the evil game companies use to give more meanings to the games we play. Christ.
We get it lads. You're above our filthy casual IQ for accepting the evil Pavlovian brainwashing that the evil game companies use to give more meanings to the games we play. Christ.
haha, i'm using the game guide, though.
I'm literally just, on a per region basis, marking all the seeds with the "leaf" stamp on my ingame map and then just collecting them, one by one, clearing my podcast backlog. - though i'm already dreading the moment where i'm stuck at 897 seeds, and not knowing which ones i missed. That's gonna be ... fun.
But from ~250 seeds (legit) up until now, that was roughly 25 extra hours i spent traveling the world. I've seen areas and 'biomes' i wasn't even aware existed. So, i'm still having a great time, exploring the world all over again.
Also, i'm buying every single piece of armor and upgrading all of them...
I think that specially in BotW, trophies aren´t needed and wouldn´t have added anything to the game. However they would´ve been a huge immersion breaker. The whole game is about exploration, physically (discovering new locations and parts of the map), mechanically (can I do this? What happens if I mix these ingredients?) and in other ways. The whole game is about you trying to get to new places, to find secrets, to go on quests and it already gives you nice rewards for it all (new weapons, recipes, korok seeds, locations, events, NPCs...). In a way, it´s like trophies have already been designed into the core of the game, so I don´t see any advantage on adding a pop-up to congratulate you on killing all Moldugas when there´s already an NPC who´ll give you an ingame reason to go after them and reward you, or on finding Korok seeds when Hestu will actually use them to expand your inventory, or on gliding more than 1000 meters when there´s already a minigame for that, or on killing Guardians when you´ve already wanted to do so since the first one you met one-shotted you (and also because they give rare materials you can use for other stuff)...or on climbing to the top of Mount Hylia because what happens there is more awesome than any trophy ever.
IMO more games should try to implement trophies this way. Get rid of immersion breaking pop-ups that congratulate you for beating the first tutorial and actually make it rewarding just to play the game. I think the Zelda team was aware of this as the final reward for collecting all seeds
is a call to people who play games with a checklist on one hand and to games that encourage you to do so.
Other types of games with more repetitive gameplay (like multiplayer games) may benefit from trophies, but IMO in-game rewards and missions are much, much better than trophies to a level that can´t be empahatised enough.
IMO more games should try to implement trophies this way. Get rid of immersion breaking pop-ups that congratulate you for beating the first tutorial and actually make it rewarding just to play the game. I think the Zelda team was aware of this as the final reward for collecting all seeds
(a golden turd)
Other types of games with more repetitive gameplay (like multiplayer games) may benefit from trophies, but IMO in-game rewards and missions are much, much better than trophies to a level that can´t be empahatised enough.
prag16
Banned
Well. That escalated quickly.
I made a little post-it note with "YOU ARE ENJOYING THE GAME" on it, which I stick in the corner of the screen for a few seconds every time I make a new discovery while adventuring, or cook a particularly kickass dish, or max out an armour set, or finish thoroughly exploring an area or one of the other things I decided to do just because it was just fun.
fvng
Member
Other people's ignorance doesn't excuse your own. This is childish logic, grow up and stop deflecting.
Telling people how they should play games is obnoxious, stay in your lane.
Playing games and looking forward to challenges created within the game is not a wrong reason. Nobody cares that you dont enjoy the challenges that many trophies offer to the player. Calling them 'participation ribbons' reeks of someone who is out of touch, you might as well tell me to get off your lawn. Mind your business about how other people enjoy their games, especially if it doesn't impact you.
Cipher Peon
Banned
Movies may not give trophies, but I still keep metadata on the movies I watch, because I catalog literally everything I consume ^^
While not the same, I set my own goals into consumption and checklists so that helps. And while the same could be done for games, games are inherently more interactive, therefore I'd want my internal metrics to be cataloged by the system!
fvng
Member
Depends on the trophy, many trophies are incredibly challenging and require mastery of the gameplay by the player. How is that not rewarding? And why would you force your definition of rewarding on other players?
If someone gets the Tactical Challenger trophy in Vanquish, that is a god tier mastery of game and 100% precision, that that is incredibly difficult, tell me how obtaining that trophy wouldn't be rewarding?
Milly Osworth
Member
I think people here don't seem to understand achievements/trophies are great for casual players. You can achieve small goals. If you have the time to play Zelda for 200 hours and turn every rock then that's fine, but lots of people don't have that time or desire.
It is but after having done all the dungeons, the memories,exploring the entire map, a lot of shrines( I'm at 80+ ) atm I'm getting a little bored getting the same weapons/arrows from chests and places over and over. Trophies could have extended the challenge made the game even more rewarding after even hundred hours spent.
fvng
Member
Many are not for casual players, i'm not going to fault someone for not having the time to look for every audio log in a game (Bioshock) but I'm also not going to tell someone that they're wasting their time for finding all of them, especially since it means having a fuller understanding of the backstory/lore. A reward for taking the time to do that is fine, rewards in games are literally part of game design.
their arguments are predicated on trophies not being challenging, which demonstrates how out of touch and unfamiliar they are with them.
Panthalassic
Member
I really don't care for trophies/achievements either way. If I get one in a game I usually go "cool" and then forget about it like 5 minutes later.
This is not tied being a casual gamer or something like that. It is more a thing of character, since this is what decides where your feeling of reward will come from.
Even casual gamers are able to set their own goals and can feel rewarded by playing the game itself. The last generations just taught many gamers to inherit artificial goals from achievements, instead of being rewarded by good game design or stuff like that.
There is a reason why you get flooded by rewards and unlocks in Call of Duty titles.
fvng
Member
This is not tied being a casual gamer or something like that. It is more a thing of character, since this is what decides where your feeling of reward will come from.
Even casual gamers are able to set their own goals and can feel rewarded by playing the game itself. The last generations just taught many gamers to inherit artificial goals from achievements, instead of being rewarded by good game design or stuff like that.
There is a reason why you get flooded by rewards and unlocks in Call of Duty titles.
Why would you think people who cared about trophies didn't appreciate or want good game design?
How are they great for casual players? Getting a korok seed is a small goal and you can then increase your inventory space, providing ACTUAL incentive for the player. Not just checking a box for comparing epeens.
breakfuss
Member
Mannnnn they got some of y'all hooked good. Whoever came up with trophies is a genius lolol.
SillyEskimo
Member
Absolutely.
SillyEskimo
Member
There's a reason why they've been standard practice in pretty much every video game except Nintendo for the past decade. People really do seem to enjoy them.
Scrotum Phillips
Member
This thread is so bizarre to me. You can turn off notifications for trophies/achievements very easily. They will never pop up or notify you if you don't want them to.
If you strongly don't care about trophies/achievements, then why would you start caring about them all of a sudden? Just keep playing how you want to. For those that enjoy them, there's now this option. Tons of people enjoy these on other platforms, tons of people ignore them and everyone is fine with it.
If you strongly don't care about trophies/achievements, then why would you start caring about them all of a sudden? Just keep playing how you want to. For those that enjoy them, there's now this option. Tons of people enjoy these on other platforms, tons of people ignore them and everyone is fine with it.
I have other platforms and I hate achievements for non score based games. They cheapen the experience. big time.
fvng
Member
this is a meaningless post since it's not a response to anything I said