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[Bookoo]

For you to think that AR will be the real deal, whereas VR isn't makes me think you've never played VR games.

That big 'ol list of negatives, yet AR has twice as many negatives.

And AR is probably in the stage that VR was in 5 years ago at this point.

However I think the obvious thing is they will eventually converge on the same device. You can use it to see virtual and real world objects or it will be able to render virtual items into your entire view.

 

[creatchee]

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

Until VR is no longer constrained to a headset, it will never even come close to mass adoption. Beyond that, they STILL need to figure out how to make consistently quality VR gaming experiences.

 

[michaelius]

The articls agrees with my opinions that VR will take long time to adapt to the casual masses, or may take another generation or two, worse case scenario. I hope developers stay in the game though, but understand if software for VR shrinks over time until VR becomes more mainstream. I think Sony rushed this thinking by being 1st in the market they'd get a head start and be dominant in the VR industry, well sales are slow and VR news is released in trickles. Guess we'll wait if Sony abandons VR as a gaming gimmick at E3. I still believe VR is great for non-gaming industries like education, science, military, medicine and even health and fitness, but gaming, don't really see it becomingthe norm their.

All signs are there - I was excited initially but then I looked at Sony events after E3 and the amount of support wasn't even at second half of Vita life levels so I decided to bail out. And unlike Vita PSVR doesn't have half of Japanese developers behind it to save us from being indie only machine.

Maybe E3 will prove me wrong but for now I feel like VR has Wii U level third parties support with Vita class first party commitment.

Also another thing is Sony greed - 400$ price would be much more acceptable if they packed everything into the box instead of waiting that we will buy Camera and 2 move controlers.

 

[kinggroin]

I get the apprehension, I get the doubt, I don't get the hate or desire to see it fail. Thankfully the last two are a minority of gamers.

VR taking off and hitting mainstream in great form can only serve to benefit the industry. I'm certainly rooting for its success.

 

[The Greek Freak]

There are definitely several people who were enthusiastically vocal about VR (Krejlooc comes to mind), but I think there's a lot of hyperbole thrown around about what the expectations were.

I got vicious messages on multiple forums when i described my initial vive experience as boring and unimpressive. Accusing me of being paid to post anti vr "propaganda" or that I was lying for attention. Someone on a different forum even doxxed me and called my wife's cell phone to scream how he was going to find her for what I posted. (Thankfully she laughed into the phone and offered to whoop his ass instead of feeling threatened.)



Only thing I can relate it to in terms of insane behavior is politics. Shit makes regular old console wars bs look nice.

 

[bachikarn]

Why even make a 3D comparison? That doesn't make sense. 3D was just a different method for viewing the same content on a flat screen. VR inherently offers new ways to play, interact with and experience things. They are in no way comparable.

Are motion controls a better example?

 

[Maligna]

Why would that be?

-cost
-space
-not widely available
-only single 'player' experiences
-no big content or system sellers
-lot's of complaints by users / reviewers
-immersion. I'm out current location which I don't like

It's not there yet... but companies are trying since 1993. Current available hardware isn't going to break through.
Maybe next round?

Till then, I'm not feeling or wanting it. I do hope you have fun with your hardware though.

Most of these are are either false or not as big of an issue as you think they are. Especially the bolded.

 

[The Greek Freak]

Most of these are are either false or not as big of an issue as you think they are. Especially the bolded.

Just because it's not an issue for you doesn't mean it's not an issue for alot of people.

 

[Angry Fork]

It'll become big when it's not like $800 for the best version. I want a Vive badly but that price is insane.

 

[Ruud_Luiten]

For you to think that AR will be the real deal, whereas VR isn't makes me think you've never played VR games.

That big 'ol list of negatives, yet AR has twice as many negatives.

agree, AR is still in their initial phase. But because it doesn't break my presence in reality I can see that this technique could be used much more versatile in the future.

 

[Graphics Horse]

The tech is too cool for me to make any definitive statements. And Valve together with Unity and Unreal have been making major strides to make it easy to develop for (theres a bug in the Unity code that needs urgent fixing though). But we should also be mindful that a lot of sci-fi never panned out, and not because it was technically impossible.

(That dinner scene had a hint of dystopian satire for a reason)

As long as VR constricts your view, I can never really see it take off in the mainstream. I think we have to wait until a decent mixed reality solution.

I think a 2 directional light field camera/display would solve a lot of Facebook's goals without the need for virtual characters or wearing anything on your head.
Like a metre wide half-cylinder you sit down in and can have meetings, family visits, doctors appointments through what feels like a real window into another place
Should be possible to prototype one today using 100 or so filtered phone screens and cameras, could be turned flat or into an inverted cylinder depending on the occasion.

 

[4Tran]

I think that VR is following the same technology curve that other devices saw. It still holds a lot of potential, and the next couple of generations of headsets should be a lot better than the current ones. To all the naysayers, I'm pretty sure that VR will be a dominant interface in the decades to come, both commercially and for gaming.

agree, AR is still in their initial phase. But because it doesn't break my presence in reality I can see that this technique could be used much more versatile in the future.

For commercial applications, AR will be big, but VR is much more suited for gaming purposes.

 

[Vigilant Gambit]

I dunno if the timeline is 3 years, but we're definitely moving along in VR a lot faster than I thought we would. I've been saying time and time again that VR won't truly come into its own until we have:

• Foveated rendering (preorders for an eye tracking addon that enables this on all Vive games start in China next month)
• Wireless (the TPCAST wireless solution is already out in China, and is apparently awesome)
• Inside-out, markerless tracking (IIRC the Hololens already has this, but also costs $3000)
• Lower cost of entry (foveated rendering will help out a lot with this)

All 3 of those technologies already exist, so it's just a matter of time for the cost to come down to an approachable range for most people. I predict that at around the same time, the developers that have already begun making VR games will have largely "figured out" the platform, so we'll start getting some of the best experiences (e.g. Valve's AAA vr stuff)

 

[awcarew]

Nobody cares anymore... this is the next 3D movies kinda thing.

People just don't want it... at home

Joke post? Half-Life 2 VR, Alien Isolation VR, and DOOM 3: BFG VR are hands down the best gaming experiences I've ever had in my entire life. The heck I don't want this in my home, lol... I truly can't imagine life without VR. This is everything I've dreamed about my entire life and it's finally here and it WORKS. The only hurdle now is getting AAA content out in the wild as most of the above games haven't worked properly since the Dev Kit days.

 

[ArtHands]

Are motion controls a better example?

I did a 180 circular sweep around me with the flamethrowers on each hand in both opposite direction (1 in front of me, 1 behind me) in Serious Sam VR yesterday. You can't do that without VR.

I dunno if the timeline is 3 years, but we're definitely moving along in VR a lot faster than I thought we would. I've been saying time and time again that VR won't truly come into its own until we have:

• Foveated rendering (preorders for an eye tracking addon that enables this on all Vive games start in China next month)
• Wireless (the TPCAST wireless solution is already out in China, and is apparently awesome)
• Inside-out, markerless tracking (IIRC the Hololens already has this, but also costs $3000)
• Lower cost of entry (foveated rendering will help out a lot with this)

All 3 of those technologies already exist, so it's just a matter of time for the cost to come down to an approachable range for most people. I predict that at around the same time, the developers that have already begun making VR games will have largely "figured out" the platform, so we'll start getting some of the best experiences (e.g. Valve's AAA vr stuff)

Microsoft is releasing $300 VR headsets this year for PC, and they claim these will have inside-out too. In addition you won't need a high end PC to power them.

 

[Diprosalic]

VR has too much potential to not succeed at some point. Maybe not with this generation of devices and maybe not for gaming but there's no doubt in my mind that VR will be a thing in the future.

 

[MR ARCADE FOREVER]

I agree it will be huge, when prices are affordable and the technology improves and games don't feel half baked with outdated graphics

 

[GuitarAtomik]

AR has the future; VR not... for gaming that is. VR is brilliant for the industry, virtual tours etc, but not for gaming. Too much hassle.

V V

For commercial applications, AR will be big, but VR is much more suited for gaming purposes.

^^
This. AR will definitely have gaming applications, but I have a hard time thinking of AR games that wouldn't be better as fully immersive VR games. It would have to be something like Pokemon Go that actually utilizes your environment which technically would be more "hassle" since you'd actually have to leave the house to play.

AR will obviously have more commercial and mainstream application. It has the potential to be the next smart phone level paradigm shift. But VR will probably always be the better format for video games. At least for ones where you want to be immersed in another world anyway.

 

[mckmas8808]

I did a 180 circular sweep around me with the flamethrowers on each hand in both opposite direction (1 in front of me, 1 behind me) in Serious Sam VR yesterday. You can't do that without VR.



Microsoft is releasing $300 VR headsets this year for PC, and they claim these will have inside-out too. In addition you won't need a high end PC to power them.

Some of these people just don't understand what it's like.

 

[Clarkus Darkus]

I truly hope so, My VR experiences so far( Resi 7, Batman, Until dawn etc) have been fresh and exciting gaming experiences.

Even ones in Co-op like sportsbar VR was great and fun.

Rigs made me and friends feel like we were in the hunger games
Battlezone was fun, So was EVE

Gaming on TV will always have its place and be the first protocol, But it feels a major step back after playing in VR.

Outlast 2 wasn't as immersive playing on a TV coming from playing Resi 7 in VR.

The headset feels fine, It's the copious amount of wires that need to be resolved.

Love VR and i can only imagine the future games that could be had while playing with friends.

 

[B-Dubs]

The issue with VR isn't just a matter of tech, but of cost. Consider the fact that in order to use a VR headset you would also need either a computer or a game console.

Look at PS-VR.

The PS4 itself is like $300.

The PS-VR headset (alone) is $400 according to their website.

So that's $700 just to jump in, and that's not even counting the PS-move shit you need.

The PS-move controllers are $99 and the camera is $60.

That bumps the cost up to about $850. That's not even counting a game!

Keep in mind, that's just an example to demonstrate the crazy costs at play here.

Until that price point comes way down, it won't be anything more than a niche thing no matter how good the tech gets.

 

[Chezzymann]

Prices and form factor need to go down before it gets huge imo. When you can run a good quality $200 VR headset on a $300 computer then it might take off. Also they need to be much smaller, right now the goggles are huge and look stupid. Needs to be more like Cyclops' visor or something.

 

[Majima Everywhere System]

Of course it will take off some day. It's cool.

It will never take off with wires, big isolating headsets, with big computers to drive them.

When it's a pair of even funky looking glasses, then it's time.

 

[B-Dubs]

Of course it will take off some day. It's cool.

It will never take off with wires, big isolating headsets, with big computers to drive them.

When it's a pair of even funky looking glasses, then it's time.

At that point it's going to be all about cost. We could have that today and it still wouldn't take off due to the cost of entry. Until that comes down VR is doomed to fail. And this is coming from someone who wants it to succeed.

It needs to be packed in. Give me a computer or a game console at a decent price point and pack in one set of VR glasses, the sort you describe, and then it's arrived. So long as it's an expensive optional extra it won't be anything more than something cool your rich friend uses to show off.

Frankly, we're probably about 20 years early for it to even start being a thing.

 

[The Greek Freak]

Some of these people just don't understand what it's like.

Or they just didn't like it.

I've tried the gear vr that came with my phone 4 times (everytime left me feeling ill for 6+ hours even though I never get sick).

Only tried psvr once.

I had the dk1 i tried 20-30 times and never had the wow moment people talk about.

Tried the current occulus twice before I sold it on craigslist and a friend's vive a dozenish times while he was on his honeymoon.

After trying dozens of games, super hot vr is the only one I didn't consider straight trash and even that wasn't as good as the base game after the novelty wore off.

Hell I'm more positive about vr than anyone i personally know who shelled out the money for a vive or rift.

So your bs "they don't know what it's like" cringey holier than thou attitude can get bent.

 

[mckmas8808]

Or they just didn't like it.

I've tried the gear vr that came with my phone 4 times (everytime left me feeling ill for 6+ hours even though I never get sick).

Only tried psvr once.

I had the dk1 i tried 20-30 times and never had the wow moment people talk about.

Tried the current occulus twice before I sold it on craigslist and a friend's vive a dozenish times while he was on his honeymoon.

After trying dozens of games, super hot vr is the only one I didn't consider straight trash and even that wasn't as good as the base game after the novelty wore off.

Hell I'm more positive about vr than anyone i personally know who shelled out the money for a vive or rift.

So your bs "they don't know what it's like" cringey holier than thou attitude can get bent.

It ain't holier than thou. IT'S THE TRUTH! Some people literally have never tried it. Some people are just sick and tired of others telling them that VR is "the" future. I understand why they can make people upset.

I never say VR is "the" future, but I do believe that it will be apart of our future to some degree. There's no reason to fight against that. VR will be here to stay for life. It's just a matter of how big will it get? Will it remain expensive? Will it forever be niche?

 

[Two Pikachus]

I don't think it will be all included in a single pair of glasses for a long time. Processors made of silicon can only get so small and we're nanometers from that point already. A tiny APU that can output double-duty high-resolution graphics with realtime tracking is a long way off. Not to mention there are heat considerations - the thing is on your head, after all - I think the best we can hope for right now is a wireless solution and less weight, but you'll still need a dedicated machine on which to play them.

Bring costs down, put R&D resources into streamlining and wireless and by the time it's good enough, graphics card to run these things will be even more affordable. Not that they aren't now. The 1060 is $150. I think AMD has an even cheaper option. But the HMDs themselves need to be a lot cheaper than the enthusiast cost.

 

[Tumle]

VR will feel quaint when real deal persistent AR takes over, and everyone who spent thousands on a dumbass isolation goggle setup will look even dumber than they do using it now.

Do you even know what AR and VR is?

You do know that they are quite different experiences right?
Your statement is almost as stupid as comparing AR and VR to 3D tv's..

 

[diaspora]

Of course it will take off some day. It's cool.

It will never take off with wires, big isolating headsets, with big computers to drive them.

When it's a pair of even funky looking glasses, then it's time.

This I think is the main thing. A headset you can slide your phone into or even connect your phone to is where VR lives or dies.

 

[VincentMatts]

Nobody cares anymore... this is the next 3D movies kinda thing.

People just don't want it... at home

It wont be huge in homes i agree. Maybe at theme parks at Disney or something, yes. Or even for some sort of training. But for games, i just dont see it.

 

[mckmas8808]

It wont be huge in homes i agree. Maybe at theme parks at Disney or something, yes. Or even for some sort of training. But for games, i just dont see it.

It's in homes right now! What are you even talking about?

 

[diaspora]

It wont be huge in homes i agree. Maybe at theme parks at Disney or something, yes. Or even for some sort of training. But for games, i just dont see it.

It might have a future in games wherein you don't need cables and shit for it. But that requires either being built around mobile or having wireless with ridiculously low latency and high bandwidth.

 

[VincentMatts]

It's in homes right now! What are you even talking about?

So was Kinect. No one cares.

It might have a future in games wherein you don't need cables and shit for it. But that requires either being built around mobile or having wireless with ridiculously low latency and high bandwidth.

We are veeeeery far from those days.

 

[Spyder_Monkey]

1) Ok... It can stand to come down a couple of hundreds.
2) And? Variety is the spice of life. What's wrong with it?
3) Subjective. Opinion. Don't state it as a fact. Some people find the software "very there and interesting" even as early as it is.
4) Huh? Seems to be on a similar playing field as even the Xbox & PS4 at the moment.

Splitting the market isn't about variety. Despite being billed as "new platforms," all three major headsets are accessories to your PC/PS4 because they need a PC/PS4 to work at all. Because they are niche, overpriced accessories, they're never going to reach 100% adoption, hell if we're being really generous it won't even reach 30% adoption. Since you have a smaller audience to work with developers now have to choose between making a traditional game for all or a VR game that, while cool, would have far less impact. This is splitting your market. It's also a problem the Kinect and Move initially had and you could see how well those went.

 

[diaspora]

So was Kinect. No one cares.



We are veeeeery far from those days.

Regarding wireless absolutely. At least mobile VR seems to be progressing at an OK clip.

 

[mckmas8808]

So was Kinect. No one cares.

So when I think of VR, I think of......

1. PSVR
2. VIVE
3. Oculus
4. Samsung Gear VR

Do you seriously think all four of those combined don't have a better future than the Xbox 360's Kinect? Have you even seen any VR virtual store? There are more games and better games within 1 year for VR, than there ever was for Kinect.

 

[diaspora]

So when I think of VR, I think of......

1. PSVR
2. VIVE
3. Oculus
4. Samsung Gear VR

Do you seriously think all four of those combined don't have a better future than the Xbox 360's Kinect? Have you even seen any VR virtual store? There are more games and better games within 1 year for VR, than there ever was for Kinect.

I think Gear VR/ Dream and VIVE have a future. The latter as being on PC offers a high performance albeit cumbersome (for now) experience while the former two is where everyone else is going to be. Oculus is in a weird place after joining facebook and PSVR is... lol.

 

[VincentMatts]

So when I think of VR, I think of......

1. PSVR
2. VIVE
3. Oculus
4. Samsung Gear VR

Do you seriously think all four of those combined don't have a better future than the Xbox 360's Kinect? Have you even seen any VR virtual store? There are more games and better games within 1 year for VR, than there ever was for Kinect.

I think VR and kinect are both the same ballbark, niche. Super fun at the beginning but the novelty quickly wears off.

VR to me is the equivalent of 3D tvs, only better. Most will wanna try it some of the time, but will never wanna play COD or madden that way all of the time. Its a novelty, not a replacement.

Edit: only saving grace for VR is porn.

 

[cakely]

I think VR and kinect are both the same ballbark, niche. Super fun at the beginning but the novelty quickly wears off.

VR to me is the equivalent of 3D tvs, only better. Most will wanna try it some of the time, but will never wanna play COD or madden that way all of the time. Its a novelty, not a replacement.

Edit: only saving grace for VR is porn.

Kinect sold well, but honestly, I don't think the technology actually worked. Gesture-based controls with it were spotty at best.

It was like a mouse without buttons. It was a pointing device without a "click", and that was a serious design flaw.

The big VR solutions are sound: they work as intended and there's nothing preventing some really excellent experiences from being designed around them.

 

[ElFly]

Since before consumer VR was a thing, even people poised to profit off VR like Riccitiello, Luckey, etc have voluntarily expressed that VR has a long, humble road ahead of itself.

In other words, get used to taking "Told ya VR would be a failure like 3D" comments in stride. If technology prevails, we'll have the last "told ya so."

on the other hand, VR may take off only when the technology massively changes until it is no longer recognizable, and you are left off having funded its development and enduring the huge, migraine inducing glasses and overpriced software

at that point the answer to the last 'told ya so' is 'thanks a lot, sucker'

 

[GuitarAtomik]

VR to me is the equivalent of 3D tvs, only better. Most will wanna try it some of the time, but will never wanna play COD or madden that way all of the time. Its a novelty, not a replacement.

It's not meant to be a replacement any more than mobile was a replacement for consoles. It's complimentary. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

on the other hand, VR may take off only when the technology massively changes until it is no longer recognizable, and you are left off having funded its development and enduring the huge, migraine inducing glasses and overpriced software

at that point the answer to the last 'told ya so' is 'thanks a lot, sucker'

Did people playing Atari games feel duped when the PS4 finally came along with games that were unimaginable back then? "Aw man. They tricked me in to having all that fun! I'm such a sucker!".

 

[VincentMatts]

It's not meant to be a replacement any more than mobile was a replacement for consoles. It's complimentary. It doesn't have to be one or the other.


Did people playing Atari games feel duped when the PS4 finally came along with games that were unimaginable back then? "Aw man. They tricked me in to having all that fun! I'm such a sucker!".

Mobile is different. People carry those around when not at home at their console or pc. So its a portable entertainment device. Thats not the case with VR.

 

[babyghost853]

Nobody cares anymore... this is the next 3D movies kinda thing.

People just don't want it... at home

Speak for yourself, many people do. If there's one thing I learned over the years, it's that people will downplay the value of anything that's not on their system of choice. And that will change rapidly with more systems being VR capable. The only thing really holding back VR right now is price of entry, it's stuck in a weird place where cheap headsets don't really do it justice, and headsets that are good enough are too pricey for the mass market. Once the issue of price of entry is sorted, there won't be anything to hold it back. Haters will just have to shut up at that point.

 

[Bookoo]

Most of these are are either false or not as big of an issue as you think they are. Especially the bolded.

Yea there are a decent amount of multiplayer titles right now so not sure why that made the list.

However even though I love VR stuff I tell my friends to just wait for Version 2. Luckily they didn't really listen to me and 1 got a Rift and the other got a Vive and now I have "real" friends to play games with.

 

[What A Time To Be Alive]

imo it just needs to get cheaper and more accessible. i think the concept is great and the mass would love it buts still stuck in that enthusiast range right now where most cant access it unless they go to somewhere that vr is variable to the public.

XXX

 

[Tain]

From a critical standpoint? From a video game enthusiast's standpoint?

Kinect reached its peak on day one with Dance Central. A timing-lax music game that unreliably detected your body's pose. Beyond that, it was generally a laggy zero-button mouse. VR had more value than Kinect even in the DK1 days. On day one of the launch of consumer VR devices last year, VR had a better lineup than the PS4 or Xbox One launched with, and the library keeps growing.

I can't imagine sincerely comparing the two, just like I can't imagine considering the fucking iPhone to be the bar for whether or not a technology is considered successful from a financial standpoint.

 

[ArtHands]

Mobile is different. People carry those around when not at home at their console or pc. So its a portable entertainment device. Thats not the case with VR.

What's to say VR wont become a standalone mobile model? Facebook already showed off a early "Santa Cruz" prototype few months back which wont need a smartphone/PC. Go google it.

Some of these people just don't understand what it's like.

Playing Serious Sam VR makes me feel bad for those who are hating VR because they thought it is going to replace traditional 2D gaming.

 

[Bruce Springsteen]

I will never be interested in VR unless the head gear reaches the point where it is not biggest that wearing a regular pair of glasses


so we are about 10 years away from that

 

[Bookoo]

Of course it will take off some day. It's cool.
It will never take off with wires, big isolating headsets, with big computers to drive them.
When it's a pair of even funky looking glasses, then it's time.

I find the "isolating" criticism the most ridiculous one to pop up especially on a gaming forum. It sounds like something my parents would say about video games in general. Many people sit in dark rooms with headphones off basically cut off from the rest of the world. I don't see how VR is that much of a leap.

Also how exactly will a funky pair of glasses make it any less isolating than current VR headsets if they are producing the same effect? I would argue it almost less isolating because you actually obtain the feeling of presence and immersion when in a multiplayer scenario.

 

[GuitarAtomik]

Mobile is different. People carry those around when not at home at their console or pc. So its a portable entertainment device. Thats not the case with VR.

That's not the point I'm making. My point is it's not supposed to be a replacement for traditional gaming. People are doing that with stuff like RE7 and Fallout 4 because it's the easiest approach right now and still produces cool results. But ultimately, the strength of VR gaming is making new types of games you can't play any other way. You're not going to play Madden or CoD in VR the way you do now because they'd be fundamentally different games, so those traditional ways of playing would still exist because there'd most likely still be a market for them even if the VR way is successful.