LOL at the dumbass with the first post.
I'm so glad I was wrong
Probably nothing until fall then $349 with Destiny, Battlefront, GTS, and/or CoD bundles for the holiday.
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Digital Foundry - In Theory: Could Sony release PlayStation 5 in 2018?
- Thread starter Vashetti
- Start date
duhmetree
Member
With a plethora of games
FearlessBelgian
Member
And 2019 will be the best year for release a new Playstation , not 2018...
By doing the sane thing theyve been doing since mid the ps3 life cycle.... bring the games, and continue to be a worldwide console that has titles that appear to everyone
Ok, I think that means the next OS could take up to 125GB's! this is fun.
So if they go with 256GB's of Ram, they should be set!
Firmus_Anguis
Banned
A PS5 in 2018 seems a tad too early. Late 2019 would be appropriate, 3 years after the launch of the PRO and 6 years after the original PS4. That's quite perfect, I'd say. An extra year for an extra generational boost in power. I can't even imagine games on a PS5... Games on PS4 still blow me away!
While it seems nuts to type out. I could see next gen consoles going with either 64 or 128 GBs of ram as a way to curb the loading time issues that have been prevelant this gen. If an entire game could fit into ram, that could theoretically reduce loading times quite a bit while also freeing up some extra CPU resources.
Edit: im still expecting a late 2018/march 2019 launch with an announcement this E3 to deflate Microsofts scorpio announcement.
Edit: im still expecting a late 2018/march 2019 launch with an announcement this E3 to deflate Microsofts scorpio announcement.
Shin
Banned
Whenever it's revealed I hope they show it off like in the old days: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7UaDvIPpQnQ
Sony as a whole doesn't consider PS4 Pro as new generation, so we're working with 2013 but they can't piss off PS4P owners either.
Sony as a whole doesn't consider PS4 Pro as new generation, so we're working with 2013 but they can't piss off PS4P owners either.
the_darkness
Banned
1/5 PS4 owners would be pissed.
Shin
Banned
+- 2.000.000 at the moment that's peanuts really, they are pushing hard with sales & games though and even for that it's the base model.
Even most custom designed PlayStation's are the base PS4 model, on top of you have all the different colors where there's almost nothing on the PS4 Pro front.
During the last AMD conference call they (AMD) iterated that Zen will be in a semi-custom SoC in 2018 and on-ward.
Plus there's this from last year, so what the hell is going on?
AMD has already announced a "Mobile Ryzen Pro" variant down the line:
This is gonna be their Cat series (Bobcat/Jaguar/Puma) replacement most likely (laptops/consoles). 10W TDP wouldn't surprise me.
WCCFTech could be wrong or right, we'll see. Same with the other guy who claimed that Sony will go back to the discrete CPU/GPU route.
Who said that?
EDIT:
Ok just saw the rumour...
I just hope Vega 10 delivers some good performance (close to 1080Ti) and not around the 1080 as rumoured...
Shin
Banned
About that semi custom SoC AMD recently mentioned, as it turns out it's meant for Apple (2018).
PS5 might not have a Navi GPU simply because it might be too expensive at the time of it's launch. I'm guessing it will be Vega with features from Navi.
Essentially PS4/Scorpio is an RX 480 GPU, with 4 added CU's for Scorpio instead of the default 36.
Both are downclocked and running at 911Mhz (PS4P) and 1172Mhz (Scorpio) (94Mhz shy of it's max speed of 1266Mhz) respectively.
All Sony would need to do is get a good price on a Vega/Ryzen APU, add 4-6CU's to Vega 64 (68-70).
With the node shrink coming they should be able to push the clock speed to 1340Mhz+ (it's max is 1500Mhz+)
You'd have 70 (compute unite) * 64 (shader/stream) = 4480 (stream processors) * 2x 1340Mhz (instructions per clock) = 12TF
I came to this conclusion based on what Microsoft and Sony did with the RX480, the problem here is Vega's HBM2 setup it only comes in 8/16Gb variants.
If Sony does decide to take this route I wonder if we'll see a 16GB HBM2 + 8/16GB GDDR6/DDR5 setup for the OS/streaming assets or if they'll go all in with GDDR6.
Vapor chamber cooling, 7nm/7nm+, and depending on the memory used we could see a more compact system (it really depends on the memory banks used, 1, 2, 4 or 8Gb's).
As for CPU I'm guessing Ryzen 7 (second generation Zen core, so Zen 2) 8core/16threads around 3.2Ghz up to 3.5Ghz, be it the mobile counterpart or not.
This all is in theory, but based on what the Vega architecture really is (it certainly is an interesting architecture): https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/amd-vega-gpu-specifications/#architecture
PS5 might not have a Navi GPU simply because it might be too expensive at the time of it's launch. I'm guessing it will be Vega with features from Navi.
Essentially PS4/Scorpio is an RX 480 GPU, with 4 added CU's for Scorpio instead of the default 36.
Both are downclocked and running at 911Mhz (PS4P) and 1172Mhz (Scorpio) (94Mhz shy of it's max speed of 1266Mhz) respectively.
All Sony would need to do is get a good price on a Vega/Ryzen APU, add 4-6CU's to Vega 64 (68-70).
With the node shrink coming they should be able to push the clock speed to 1340Mhz+ (it's max is 1500Mhz+)
You'd have 70 (compute unite) * 64 (shader/stream) = 4480 (stream processors) * 2x 1340Mhz (instructions per clock) = 12TF
I came to this conclusion based on what Microsoft and Sony did with the RX480, the problem here is Vega's HBM2 setup it only comes in 8/16Gb variants.
If Sony does decide to take this route I wonder if we'll see a 16GB HBM2 + 8/16GB GDDR6/DDR5 setup for the OS/streaming assets or if they'll go all in with GDDR6.
Vapor chamber cooling, 7nm/7nm+, and depending on the memory used we could see a more compact system (it really depends on the memory banks used, 1, 2, 4 or 8Gb's).
As for CPU I'm guessing Ryzen 7 (second generation Zen core, so Zen 2) 8core/16threads around 3.2Ghz up to 3.5Ghz, be it the mobile counterpart or not.
This all is in theory, but based on what the Vega architecture really is (it certainly is an interesting architecture): https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/amd-vega-gpu-specifications/#architecture
digitaltrance
Member
This is one of the reasons I am a PC gamer. Upgrade when you want down scale in the interim.
Shin
Banned
Could, but I don't think we'll be jumping 16x in memory this time, it makes no sense, is overkill and just bumps the price unncessarly.
dano1
A Sheep
Well you better get used to every 3. Because you will find out at e3 the PS5 will be coming out within 3 years of the PS pro. Unless you're not counting that?
Yeah, honestly pretty much this. Not expecting, or even want a new console until 2019, maybe even 2020.
Graphics Horse
Member
Anyone have the context or original source for this quote? I find it hard to believe they'd let that slip when they were so non-specific in the past.
Lagspike_exe
Member
Anything less than Zen 2/3 + Navi @ 14-16 TFLOPS + at least 32GB of RAM in 2019/2020 would be dissapointing. That would be a true generational leap with excellent 4K performance and a huge jump in FX fidelity and game complexity.
Aces&Eights
Member
If games keep coming out and looking like Horizon Zero Dawn I would be content with my Pro for quite a while. That said, I'm a framerate whore, so, if they released a model that gave me locked 60 with the same visual fidelity, I would buy it day one. Even if that day was tomorrow.
Hairsplash
Member
IMO, Possible if they integrate a ryzen and the "hd580" of the ps4pro...and increase the clock speed to 3.2Ghz.
but even if they were doing that, common wisdom says that a new IC takes 16 month to produce and design... then they will need 6 month to design the console, then another 6 months for the OS, and another 6 months for game design... so that is 3 years after the ps4pro release which would be november 4,2019... at the earliest...
of assuming they started work on the ps5 after the ps4pro...
Good post, but the above is what is available today. I don't think anyone is thinking it'd ship this year. If it ships 2018, 2019, or even 2020 HBM2 could have higher density or more layers.
Additionally, Vega is only using 2 stacks, Fury used 4, AMD could probably do a 4 stack, or heck maybe 8 stack if someone (sony/MS) wanted to pay them for the semi-custom work. The imposter would be ridiculous, but it could probably be done.
Shin
Banned
There's a Vega 20 with 32Gb HMB2 on it's way forgot to mention that, but HMB2 price and production is yeah...
Safe to say that games like RDR2, GTA6, FF7:R, HZD2, DStranding & TLoU2 might get a cross generation treatment.
Safe to say that games like RDR2, GTA6, FF7:R, HZD2, DStranding & TLoU2 might get a cross generation treatment.
VincentMatts
Member
They could but i dont see it happening. I definitely wont be buying one. I just got a pro.
AyraSutoraifu
Member
They don't need too. Though MS are in their bubble believing so.
BotoxAgent
Member
Why do that when the PS4 is doing great?
I Own a pro and will purchase scorpio and to be honest cant wait for ps5. More than happy with the revised release schedules, especially if the games library is compatible.
Well such games would almost certainly be rapidly released for Ps5 as well - assuming a similar architecture is used then the momentum of titles on PS4 can help to provide a great Ps5 launch lineup
Negotiator
Member
I wonder if games like Uncharted 4 could receive a "PS5 patch" that would unlock 1080p60 for the Campaign.
I keep forgetting the thread says 2018. Then I kept thinking this is 2018....
Still, 2019 seems more believable. Maybe an announcement in 2018. But not the PS5 itself.
Shin
Banned
Three years after Pro and six years after the original PS sounds like a perfect time to me.
Sony could have waited 1 more year like MS did with Scorpio, Pro would have been beefier.
They didn't though, most likely PS5 development was in full swing already and a launch year planned.
Off-topic: had they waited 1 year more they could have gotten cheaper parts, plus improvements on 16nm FinFet.
It's probably why MS could reach 1172Mhz on the clock speed compared to 911Mhz on Pro, plus MS was smart enough to go with vapor chamber cooling to make it all come together.
Why? We have no idea what Navi is... Could be a Polaris class GPU.
EDIT:
Also, about HBM, i think we can pretty much forget any illusion of inclusion of HBM in a next-gen machine. Costs structure & logistic are, it seems, a killer. The appearence of GDDR5x & 6 and their capacity to reach high bandwidth are enough imo and they are vastly cheaper (thing of paramout importance for the whole BOM).
Would be weird to post the next Playstation right after you just released the PS4 Pro. That would be like if tomorrow when the Scorpio is revealed, Microsoft ends the conference with "GET READY FOR THE NEXT GENERATION OF XBOX NEXT YEAR!"
Does feel like it is too soon to be discussing things on that at the moment. A few years down the line maybe, but not this or next year.
Does feel like it is too soon to be discussing things on that at the moment. A few years down the line maybe, but not this or next year.
Hashmal_Bringer_of_Order
Member
I just got a PS4 last Christmas. 2018 is way to early considering current development cycles and they might as well wait longer for the hardware gap to improve.
We don't know how much HBM will cost in 2019 though and there's a cheaper HBM2 variant on it's way that's simpler to produce. It's much too early to make any definitive statements on HBM or GDDR6.
We know basically 2 things about Navi. "Scalability" and Next Gen Memory, only AMD knows exactly what that actually means though. But I'd say that scale-ability implies that it's scalable across both low-end and high-end. (and I suspect they mean multiple GPU dies in one package, one GPU die across their whole range of GPUs but more of them.)
With Scorpio Xbox One X (Scorpio) being $499, there's certainly no pressure on Sony to release PS5 before November 2019. As far as hardware, 2019 seems feasible, but I'm wondering how developers will feel given that development times are so long for current gen games. That said, 95% of comments seem to be fore either for 2019 or 2020.
2018 is way too soon, while 2021 is too far away, an 8 year cycle, like what Microsoft had from Xbox 360 to XBone, is too long.
2018 is way too soon, while 2021 is too far away, an 8 year cycle, like what Microsoft had from Xbox 360 to XBone, is too long.
Shin
Banned
Special event again in January 2019, full release in October/November 2019 sounds good to me.
Just hope 12TF is doable around that time, it's all I want and 4k/60 being mandatory from the start.
PS4 games behind upscaled/checkerboarded at a system level and native BC, that would be golden.
Just hope 12TF is doable around that time, it's all I want and 4k/60 being mandatory from the start.
PS4 games behind upscaled/checkerboarded at a system level and native BC, that would be golden.
Dr. Black Jack
Member
When did DF start dealing in theories?
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