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[Autoignition]

I think the reason Akachi's betrayal blindsided me is because it was too obvious. I was expecting the story to try to pull an actual twist, but by doing this after the stuff in Persona 4, it just doesn't feel all that surprising. By virtue of being the most obvious traitor, I considered him to be one of the least likely to actually be a traitor.

Akechi bothered me after his betrayal in how he suddenly went all anime-tropey. Manic grin, exposition dumps that would make a Bond villain blush, and motivations that didn't range very far outside the "ultimate power!" trope kind of sucked my interest in that story away, though the actual confrontation with him in Shido's palace was handled well enough.

The Lord is testing me.

What version of Persona 5 did you even play to reach a conclusion like that? I've heard a lot of lazy, reductionist views of Akechi's motivations, but this isn't even reductionist -- it's just not any part of his actual motivation at all. Like, at all. Akechi never lusted for power.

 

[Watch Da Birdie]

Oh, and have we figured out why the rival model in Ann's Confidant has her own portrait? She's the only Confidant-specific character to have this honor as far as I know and it's pretty odd, especially when someone as unique looking as Lala doesn't even get one.

 

[Isaac Otherworld]

Oh, and have we figured out why the rival model in Ann's Confidant has her own portrait? She's the only Confidant-specific character to have this honor as far as I know and it's pretty odd, especially when someone as unique looking as Lala doesn't even get one.

Because she's a pretty girl and we need to make sure all the straight male players get a good look at her.

Slightly related but why does Yusuke wear a hoodie with his swim trunks?

 

[StarCreator]

Because she's a pretty girl and we need to make sure all the straight male players get a good look at her.

Slightly related but why does Yusuke wear a hoodie with his swim trunks?

Why does Yusuke anything?

 

[Isaac Otherworld]

I thought for a long time Ryuji was going to be the traitor.

He somehow manages to activate your Meta-Nav on your phone remotely.

He's the one that wants to delve deeper into the scary castle.

When Kamoshidas guards are planning to execute Ryuji they make sure to take their sweet time brandishing their swords for 5 minutes, almost as if they're waiting for you to activate your Persona and don't really intend to kill him.

He manages to lock shadow Kamoshida in a cell which shouldn't even be possible.

He's really, really adamant about not saving Morgana from his cell.

He's so dumb that the idea of him playing dumb seems to make more sense.

He hates coffee, indicating he is a bad person.

Everyone else likes coffee including Aketchi indicating they are good people. It's a big thematic point of the game. Except Futaba. Accomplice?

All of these are points you could have worked into a Ryuji is the traitor alternate plot. The foreshadowing is far better and more subtle. Plus it'd be a big shake of the first bro archetype.

 

[Gorillaz]

I'm going to assume the model was actually going to be someone in the game important but they just scrapped it.

Yea i kept looking like why does she have her own animated pic for being in side story

 

[Watch Da Birdie]

I'm going to assume the model was actually going to be someone in the game important but they just scrapped it.

Yea i kept looking like why does she have her own animated pic for being in side story

I was wondering if she was gonna appear during the main plot somehow or if it was an SMT cameo I wasn't getting.

I remember reading apparently the room model used when you first meet Takemi as a maid was going to be the PC's original room which was in the same building as Makoto and Sae.

 

[Herr Starr]

The Lord is testing me.

What version of Persona 5 did you even play to reach a conclusion like that? I've heard a lot of lazy, reductionist views of Akechi's motivations, but this isn't even reductionist -- it's just not any part of his actual motivation at all. Like, at all. Akechi never lusted for power.

To be fair, that part of my comment was borne from the ridiculous conversation between Akechi and Shido towards the end, the one where they try to constantly one-up each other with how eeeeeevil they are. It's mostly Shido's motivations that fall into the ultimate power trope. Akechi has more complex motivations, but it also feels as if the writers didn't really know what to do with them in some cases, leading to the occasional feeling of Akechi being evil for evil's sake.

Regardless, Akechi is a much, much better villain than (Persona 4 spoiler)

Spoiler

Adachi

ever was (after the twist was revealed, anyway). That one was definitely an ultimate power trope.

 

[Dany]

Currently grinding Reaper to reach lvl 99.

So close!

 

[Marmaladefire]

I'm going to assume the model was actually going to be someone in the game important but they just scrapped it.

Yea i kept looking like why does she have her own animated pic for being in side story

The fact that they even did that stupid sub-sub plot at all "wow, this girl is a bitch to me! I like her spunk!" instead of spending time with Shiho before the last rank is annoying on it's own. I guess she could have been yet another broken hot girl social link that they didn't have time to include.

 

[Mediking]

The fact that they even did that stupid sub-sub plot at all "wow, this girl is a bitch to me! I like her spunk!" instead of spending time with Shiho before the last rank is annoying on it's own. I guess she could have been yet another broken hot girl social link that they didn't have time to include.

Wow... good point... why the heck wasn't Shiho more present in Ann's social link? I know she was in the hospital but c'mon...

 

[Dany]

Does...does akechi dab in his win pose!?

 

[TheBowen]

Because she's a pretty girl and we need to make sure all the straight male players get a good look at her.

Slightly related but why does Yusuke wear a hoodie with his swim trunks?

I always assumed he wore it because he hated the sun and didnt want to get burnt, thats why hes so pale.

And i did find it super odd that the girl got her own portrait, but i guess maybe it was to show she was good looking in comparison to ann ? IDK

 

[MagnetoWasRight]

A year ago, when someone complained about the voice actor switch for Igor in the Japanese version, someone else said "No spoilers but it's for a story reason." I knew from that that it wasn't the real Igor.

Wow, so if you miss a deadline, it reveals that Akechi is the traitor/killer. Glad I didn't watch any videos. I completely missed the pancake line because it's implied that the MC is talking the entire game, you just never hear anything he says unless you choose it.

 

[arturo2666]

A year ago, when someone complained about the voice actor switch for Igor in the Japanese version, someone else said "No spoilers but it's for a story reason." I knew from that that it wasn't the real Igor.

Wow, so if you miss a deadline, it reveals that Akechi is the traitor/killer. Glad I didn't watch any videos. I completely missed the pancake line because it's implied that the MC is talking the entire game, you just never hear anything he says unless you choose it.

Yeah, I have a friend that's going to be starting P5 soon and I know for a fact he's going to complain about Igor's voice every time we talk about it. And there's essentially no way to alleviate concerns over that without ruining the reveal.

 

[einer51]

I was livid when none of the characters outwardly made note of the pancake remark, and was certain from that point he was the traitor. I appreciated the reveal later, confirming the early cast weren't oblivious.

 

[PK Gaming]

The fact that they even did that stupid sub-sub plot at all "wow, this girl is a bitch to me! I like her spunk!" instead of spending time with Shiho before the last rank is annoying on it's own. I guess she could have been yet another broken hot girl social link that they didn't have time to include.

In that subplot's defense, it ends with Ann and Mika becoming friendly rivals, instead of pitting 2 girls against each other and demonizing the one who isn't the main character (like they did in P4 with Kashiwagi/Hanako). And Joker's such a non-entity, Ann basically does everything on her own.

Not bad at all.

 

[MagnetoWasRight]

Yeah, I have a friend that's going to be starting P5 soon and I know for a fact he's going to complain about Igor's voice every time we talk about it. And there's essentially no way to alleviate concerns over that without ruining the reveal.

Just say "I think the original actor was busy" or "The original Japanese actor died, so they changed the actor there, so they changed the actor here."

 

[StarCreator]

Just say "I think the original actor was busy" or "The original Japanese actor died, so they changed the actor there, so they changed the actor here."

I mean, it's not the first time Persona has recast a character (see Teddy and Chie) so it's not exactly outlandish to assume the same thing happened here.

 

[Marmaladefire]

In that subplot's defense, it ends with Ann and Mika becoming friendly rivals, instead of pitting 2 girls against each other and demonizing the one who isn't the main character (like they did in P4 with Kashiwagi/Hanako). And Joker's such a non-entity, Ann basically does everything on her own.

Not bad at all.

You're right, it could be a lot worse. In terms of entertainment, and also variety/trope subversion It's still pretty shitty all to lead to up "I'm going to be stronger for Shiho!" Because..that's already Ann's whole thing. Ann's social link is generally pretty boring, honestly, and it's pretty well known that there are a lot of idols and fashion magazine models that behave like Mika, which I assume the game was referencing. If so, they could have done better to actually critique the bullying, judging people by their looks, whatever then a revelation that didn't really amount to much besides "Wow, I should be more like this girl making my life hell!"

Spoiler

(Makoto probably would have tried to fight Mika)

There were so many places to go with Ann besides the "Lovers arcana is a hot dumb model." retread. Talk about how lonely it is to live alone all the time. About the after effects of being wrongly branded the school slut, about not feeling like she fits in anywhere.

Spoiler

About how she obviously is either lying about her ethnic percentages or dyes her hair faithfully in secret.

 

[PK Gaming]

You're right, it could be a lot worse. In terms of entertainment, and also variety/trope subversion It's still pretty shitty all to lead to up "I'm going to be stronger for Shiho!" Because..that's already Ann's whole thing. Ann's social link is generally pretty boring, honestly, and it's pretty well known that there are a lot of idols and fashion magazine models that behave like Mika, which I assume the game was referencing. If so, they could have done better to actually critique the bullying, judging people by their looks, whatever then a revelation that didn't really amount to much besides "Wow, I should be more like this girl making my life hell!"

Spoiler

(Makoto probably would have tried to fight Mika)

There were so many places to go with Ann besides the "Lovers arcana is a hot dumb model." retread. Talk about how lonely it is to live alone all the time. About the after effects of being wrongly branded the school slut, about not feeling like she fits in anywhere.

Spoiler

About how she obviously is either lying about her ethnic percentages or dyes her hair faithfully in secret.

As a follow up to her arc in the main narrative, it's definitely disappointing. I wasn't really fond of her desire to become an model either; it's such an incidental aspect of her character, so having her resolve to become the best model felt a little outside of left field. Her confidant is dumb fun though, and I enjoyed hanging out with Ann, but in retrospect it could have been a lot heavier.

 

[Marmaladefire]

Yep. I think a lot of people feel that way. Nobody wants to dislike Ann, or her confidant. I liked hanging out with her during study sessions, at diners, and especially with Ryuji a lot. She's a good character and a good concept that was done wrong by the writing. It might be just a level of reliability for me, but I think she would have been a great best friend character. An opposite gender best friend would be cool to see.

 

[benicillin]

The scenes dealing with Shiho and her romance arc were both really well done I felt, but I do kinda agree with criticisms about the rest of her arc, especially when she started as a very strong character.

 

[Isaac Otherworld]

Yeah, I have a friend that's going to be starting P5 soon and I know for a fact he's going to complain about Igor's voice every time we talk about it. And there's essentially no way to alleviate concerns over that without ruining the reveal.

A friend of mine also started P5 and also complained about Igor's voice.

I told him "Sadly the original Japanese voice actor died and they went with a different direction for the recast."

He seemed to buy that.

 

[Mediking]

Yep. I think a lot of people feel that way. Nobody wants to dislike Ann, or her confidant. I liked hanging out with her during study sessions, at diners, and especially with Ryuji a lot. She's a good character and a good concept that was done wrong by the writing. It might be just a level of reliability for me, but I think she would have been a great best friend character. An opposite gender best friend would be cool to see.

Yup. Ann is amazing. Early P5 is best P5. Early Ann is best Ann.

 

[Lunafreya Nox Fleuret]

I actually dont know who I like better between Ann and Makoto but at the end of my game Ann was max and Makoto 9 cause I got fucked over by the deadline for the point of no return. I didn't get to Makoto's rank 5 charm until like after Shido. I wanted to spend V day with Makoto for some reason... I felt so much for her towards the end of the game especially between her and her sister. The beach scene in particular looked like she had an interest in Joker a little bit to me and well there's also the clinging scene in Futaba's arc. Ann by comparison... never really shows she's interested in Joker or at least that's the impression I get.

But if there was a real romance option i'd like it would be Sae over everyone else easily. She's greatly written and probably even the best character in the game for me. She's so damn good but I wanted more of her!

 

[Mediking]

I actually dont know who I like better between Ann and Makoto but at the end of my game Ann was max and Makoto 9 cause I got fucked over by the deadline for the point of no return. I didn't get to Makoto's rank 5 charm until like after Shido. I wanted to spend V day with Makoto for some reason... I felt so much for her towards the end of the game especially between her and her sister. The beach scene in particular looked like she had an interest in Joker a little bit to me and well there's also the clinging scene in Futaba's arc. Ann by comparison... never really shows she's interested in Joker or at least that's the impression I get.

But if there was a real romance option i'd like it would be Sae over everyone else easily. She's greatly written and probably even the best character in the game for me. She's so damn good but I wanted more of her!

You have excellent taste.

Sae is amazing. Truly should be a romance option in the next game.

I romanced Makoto because of various reasons. Valentine's day with her was amazing.

Ann is also great but I see her more as a best friend.

 

[Kalentan]

I will say while I did like the ending villain and all of that.

I do hope Persona 6 tries something like an Anti-Persona team or something. Rather than making the villain simply some god again.

Also maybe a fully open map with fast travel. Doesn't need to be a size of an open world or anything but would cool if you could walk from one place to the next.

 

[marmoka]

So yesterday, when I thought I was about to finish the game,... I fuse the twins and meet the real Igor. And still another dungeon...

The last archangel is hard as fuck! I couldn't beat him! I think I will have to go back to the Velvet Room door and recharge my energy everytime I beat an archangel, otherwise I'm done.

This game never ends or what???

 

[UnluckyKate]

I will say while I did like the ending villain and all of that.

I do hope Persona 6 tries something like an Anti-Persona team or something. Rather than making the villain simply some god again.

Also maybe a fully open map with fast travel. Doesn't need to be a size of an open world or anything but would cool if you could walk from one place to the next.

I really feel the entire true ending arc was rushed and out of touch / out of theme with the entire game

So yesterday, when I thought I was about to finish the game,... I fuse the twins and meet the real Igor. And still another dungeon...

The last archangel is hard as fuck! I couldn't beat him! I think I will have to go back to the Velvet Room door and recharge my energy everytime I beat an archangel, otherwise I'm done.

This game never ends or what???

its soon over

 

[cj_iwakura]

I will say while I did like the ending villain and all of that.

I do hope Persona 6 tries something like an Anti-Persona team or something. Rather than making the villain simply some god again.

Persona 2 and 3 had shades of that, The Masquerade and Strega, but you never fight either faction all at once.

 

[ReiGun]

I do hope Persona 6 tries something like an Anti-Persona team or something. Rather than making the villain simply some god again

I agree. I think the series has only scratched the surface of what you can do with an "evil" Persona-user.

I would like if P6 presented a scenario where the central theme is seen from different sides represented by different factions of persona users. One would obviously have to be antagonist, for the sake of game. But given that the series presents those who have access to their true self as noble (save a few like Akechi or

Spoiler

Adachi

), it would be interesting to turn that on its head and have the group you're fighting be just as "woke" but coming a things from a different angle.

 

[E-flux]

I have no idea who thought the way they handled akechi was a good idea, that Slink was so fucking bad how they showed it down our throat. The whole betrayal angle would have worked a lot better in my opinion if akechi would have joined you instead of yosuke in the madarames place, and that they would have made his s.link a normal one. At least that way you could have actually gotten attached to him instead of the clear as fuck bad dude.

The ending would have also been a shitload better if Mona would have gone away, it was such a cop out answer that they just believed in him enough for him to stay when everything else vanished. Plus, how the fuck did he steal a spark plug from the agency car or be able to fix that hunk of junk.

The ending as it is now was way too convenient, i kept waiting for something to go wrong and show that everything was fucked or something. In 4 the happy ending worked a lot better, this one i feel like it didn't earn it at all.

Edit: Also, the time management is completely broken in this one, for like half of the game i could do 3 things every evening if it involved dungeon delving. And one other thing that annoyed me was the arbitrary time limits every month, for most of the months it would have worked a lot better that instead of a solid time they would have used the same thing as in the last month, where instead of a solid date the timer just said "few" when the police were about to catch you.

 

[Raging Spaniard]

Just beat the game, loved it and started reading the thread ... I wasnt expecting open spoilers for other Persona games too

 

[Curufinwe]

A year ago, when someone complained about the voice actor switch for Igor in the Japanese version, someone else said "No spoilers but it's for a story reason." I knew from that that it wasn't the real Igor.

That person is a jerk.

 

[Rapscallion]

Just beat the game. Came in at about 80 hours.
Didn't max out all the social links, but did a good amount of them.

..And now I'm suffering from the post persona blues. I don't think I was engageg with a group of characters since...maybe Persona 4. Really terrific game with a great cast of characters. Hopefully we get another game sooner than 8 years this time. Wouldn't even mind a story sequel (though it certainly doesn't need it).

 

[marmoka]

After 106 hours and 3 months playing it, I finally completed the game last night. I loved it, but the game is too long.

I've got some questions about NewGame+, related to social stats and confidants. I would like to know if all confidant levels begin from scratch, or do they have the same level as when you finished the game. Same with social stats (knowledge, proficiency,...).

If not, being able to get the maximum rank in all confidants and social stats has to be impossible in a single game. I know many of you could make it, but I'm not a Persona veteran.

I could get the maximum rank with Ryuji, the doctor, the reporter and the fortune teller. Obviously Morgana, Sae, Akechi and Igor too. I wanted to get the maximum rank with Mishima, Makoto and Haru, but I didn't have enough time. I don't care much about gun shop guy or the chess board player. I didn't even unlock the speech guy arkana. Becoming confidant with them in the new game would be nice.

Whatever, my life is empty right now.

 

[Brakke]

Social stats carry over. Confidants reset but some abilities persist (I think it's only if you MAX it, I got a few items from MAX links at the end that said they'd let me use whatever skill in NG+).

It's frustrating how close I got to complete on first playthrough. Got top social stats, MAX all party memebers, but I had like 6 levels left on other links when I finished. Sort of kills my ambition to do a NG+ since I don't have any major blind spots from NG.

Sun Confidant is one of the best. Loved that No Good Tora.

 

[Autoignition]

The ending as it is now was way too convenient, i kept waiting for something to go wrong and show that everything was fucked or something.

THANK YOU. I was yelling about this a few months ago, but everyone called me crazy. For a "true" ending, it just doesn't feel right. It was way too convenient.

 

[E-flux]

THANK YOU. I was yelling about this a few months ago, but everyone called me crazy. For a "true" ending, it just doesn't feel right. It was way too convenient.

I was hoping for a bitter sweet ending, because persona games especially 2 and 3 did them so well, hell even 4 had kind of an bittersweet ending when you leave your buddies behind. 5 ended like an episode of anime, somehow Sae and the gang managed to free you, your magic cat comes back, fixes your car and you drive away to your next adventure.

One possible ending i would have enjoyed would have been when Sae visits you in jail, instead of getting out she would inform you that something went wrong and you had to be the scapegoat, or the ending could have worked as it is now if similar to P3 and the "desperation" month you'd spend some time in the jail before you would get out. The ending has all the ingredients of being good up until you defeat the final boss, it's a shame that they went the way they did. I thought that the igor bit was really good.

 

[UnluckyKate]

THANK YOU. I was yelling about this a few months ago, but everyone called me crazy. For a "true" ending, it just doesn't feel right. It was way too convenient.

Yeah shit hits the fan and then everything is good out of the blues it felt so weird... But i was too tired of the last stretch of the game I wanted to finish.

 

[marmoka]

How about a car accident with the caravan falling down the bridge. The other car responsible of the crash could be from the central intelligence agents.

That would be... I don't know how I would feel.

Social stats carry over. Confidants reset but some abilities persist (I think it's only if you MAX it, I got a few items from MAX links at the end that said they'd let me use whatever skill in NG+).

It's frustrating how close I got to complete on first playthrough. Got top social stats, MAX all party memebers, but I had like 6 levels left on other links when I finished. Sort of kills my ambition to do a NG+ since I don't have any major blind spots from NG.

Sun Confidant is one of the best. Loved that No Good Tora.

Thanks. Right now I don't feel like starting a new game after this. Perhaps will leave it for later, who knows when.

 

[Antiwhippy]

What they do is that like with anyone who owns a van, they discover acid and start "exploring" their palaces during their acid trip.

Also now that I think about it, owning a van and having an actual talking animal makes them more scooby doo than the investigation team lmao.

 

[TokiDoki]

Just finished it at 110 hours, to me, not only I don't mind the length, I would love it to go on forever.

The final scene wasn't really bittersweet , but I like how everything was pretty much resolved and everyone , especially MC was "freed" . This is important because the whole thematic revolved around imprisonment and its really kind of satisfying , especially how MC looked towards the camera in the end .

And the ending theme is freaking amazing .

 

[Flame Lord]

I was hoping for a bitter sweet ending, because persona games especially 2 and 3 did them so well, hell even 4 had kind of an bittersweet ending when you leave your buddies behind. 5 ended like an episode of anime, somehow Sae and the gang managed to free you, your magic cat comes back, fixes your car and you drive away to your next adventure.

One possible ending i would have enjoyed would have been when Sae visits you in jail, instead of getting out she would inform you that something went wrong and you had to be the scapegoat, or the ending could have worked as it is now if similar to P3 and the "desperation" month you'd spend some time in the jail before you would get out. The ending has all the ingredients of being good up until you defeat the final boss, it's a shame that they went the way they did. I thought that the igor bit was really good.

Sounds like you wanted it to be bittersweet for the sake of being bittersweet. Everything went had a logical conclusion. Why throw in something to make it sad for no reason?

 

[psynergylover]

Does...does akechi dab in his win pose!?

Nah, but he does some wild ass Micheal Jackson impersonation!!!

 

[E-flux]

Sounds like you wanted it to be bittersweet for the sake of being bittersweet. Everything went had a logical conclusion. Why throw in something to make it sad for no reason?

It was not logical at all for mona to survive and everything going so smoothly as they did.
It felt like they played fast and loose with the cognitive bs explanation why mona was able to stay in the real world. Maybe if the ending would have had a bit more meat to it that we would have seen the struggle of getting the mc out but that part honestly felt rushed.

And it wouldn't have been for no reason, hell it would have suited a lot better than the overly happy anime ending we got. The whole jail part is completely pointless in the current game, you spend like a minute in there and you get out and live goes on. I'm not asking for an eclipse to happen, but this was way too neat.

 

[Dantis]

That moment when you realize he would have been the main character if only Yaldabaoth hadn't fucked his shit up. Poor babe never had a chance.

Goro is a prick because of Goro, and the way the game tries to frame it otherwise is frustrating, and frankly, badly written.

 

[Triggs]

And it wouldn't have been for no reason, hell it would have suited a lot better than the overly happy anime ending we got. The whole jail part is completely pointless in the current game, you spend like a minute in there and you get out and live goes on. I'm not asking for an eclipse to happen, but this was way too neat.

I disagree that the jail part is pointless; it's the necessary thematic conclusion. Despite losing access to the metaverse, the phantom theives are still able to enact change in society, even if it's comparatively small to their previous feats. It's why Sae makes a big deal about how hard everyone had to work and come together. It's to show that continuing to fight is both necessary and possible even without metaverse shenanigans.

I'll grant that persona 5 is an extremely optimistic game at the end of the day, but I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Especially given how relevant it is; a game about a group of people fighting to change change society and succeeding was an extremely welcome message given the current political climate. Persona 5 is a better power fantasy than most games, and I mean that in a good way.

 

[Lunar15]

Months after the game, my opinion has soured on a few small things, but I still think the ending is extremely strong.