Generic dude as usual, I'm afraid. It's really my biggest complaint so far.
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2 months out, any excitement for Piranha Bytes' Elex?
- Thread starter Banzai
- Start date
Generic dude as usual, I'm afraid. It's really my biggest complaint so far.
Risen is absolutely amazing though. Gothic 3 with community patch is great as well, as for the rest, yeah. Shame, really, Risen looked like they were making a comeback and then 2 happened
Agent_4Seven
Tears of Nintendo
This and fixed.
But... maybe i'll buy the game when it's on deep deep deep deep sale.
P.S. Gothic 1 and 2 is one of the best RPGs of all time and the best PB games ever made. Everyone who thinks otherwise must eat a TV that looks like an apple.
Admiral Woofington
Member
Oof. Well hopefully they at least let me get varied armor including hoods and helmets. Don't care for bald marine guy.
How fucking hard is it to let me choose hair and beard at the very least.
texhnolyze
Banned
Wait, really? That baldy dude we've seen from the gameplay footage?
arts&crafts
Member
Played and beat Risen 3 a month or 2 ago and it is a very good game even with the jank. I am preordering Elex, I love euro-RPGs!
3 was pretty decent though and a sort of return to form. Really didn't like 2 and 1 remains the best (out of the Risen games) but 3 was a solid, fun game IMO.
Vincent Grayson
Member
I'm not saying "play COD". I'm just saying, when Witcher 3 is (collectively, though I wouldn't necessarily agree) the pinnacle of the genre, you play that for sure. But for me, I'd rather then play the best shooters, the best JRPGs, the best strategy games, card games, online MP games, etc before I would move on to playing worse games in the same genre.
Of course opinions on quality will vary, and I'm sure some people love these games more than any other titles in the genre, and that's fine. But when we acknowledge "I know these aren't great...", I just feel like "then why waste my time?"
Unfortunately. It's one of the things PB continues to mess up. They create nameless heroes that could be replaced by anyone but refuse to actually let us do so. Not even a female option.
It might be in part due to their studio size. They seem to want the main character to have a voice, so additional options would be a strain on the budget. I don't want to excuse them at all, though. These games NEED character creators.
I see where you're coming from, I do. But when you only play the greatest of the great (however subjective that is), you're gonna miss out on a lot of gems. I know Elex won't ever be celebrated as GOTY, but that doesn't mean that it's terrible or even bad. Less-than-great games often have a lot of good ideas to offer. Sometimes you have to be willing to overlook some shortcomings to get to them though.
Nevertheless, I can understand if you don't want to.
arts&crafts
Member
Im with Banzai on this one. I would rather play an average single player RPG than the best strategy, RTS, Card game or online MP game in history, It is just the genre I like and personally I enjoy them more than better games from other genres. Obviously everyone is different though, that is the beauty of gaming there are hundreds of games in each genre to choose from in any generation.
Actually I don't mind to have a pre-made character. Gothic's nameless hero had it's own unique personality (in the original German version at least).
I can't speak for Risen or Elex. I haven't played the Risen games, only saw a few videos of them and Elex isn't out yet. But it seems like they ran into the problem trying to redo the Nameless Hero, which worked well in Gothic, but doesn't work everytime. So they might be kinda dull.
Well the protagonist in Elex has at least a pre-history and a nickname as far as I remember. Anyway what I wanted to say is, that I'm not sure, if Piranha Byte RPG's really need a character creator. A premade character is fine. They should be just interesting and have some more personality. And probaly not look like a generic white dude to be honest.
True, premade characters can absolutely be fine. You won't ever hear me complain about having to play Geralt in the Witcher games.
But here? Yeah, the hero from the Gothic games had personality, but I don't think much of anything would have been lost if he had been replaced by a custom hero. Same for Arcania, Risen 1-2, Risen 3 (which had a new hero for some reason) and presumably Elex. But I guess we'll see.
waveuponwave
Member
Piranha Bytes still create some of the moat beautiful RPG worlds out there. They just have a hand-crafted feel to them that makes exploring really worthwhile.
That's why I'll check this one out eventually, just as I eventually bought Risen 3 for a few bucks, even though I thought Risen 2 was a turd with an abysmal excuse for a story.
Unfortunately it seems like aside from the graphic designers all the really creative people have left PB. Mike Hoge who was pretty much the creator of all the Gothic lore has left and it feels like noone with the same creative drive has filled his place.
PB really have two problems right now (aside from the technical issues that come with wanting to make 3D open world RPGs with 20 people in 2017). They have a very vocal hardcore fanbase in Germany that doesn't want them to stray an inch from the Gothic formula, but at the same time they can't seem to understand what made their own games so great.
That's why we get the same join-1-of-3-factions scenario, the same nameless hero, the same dumb humour again and again. The faction system in G1 and 2 was great because it felt like there was a moral weight to the decision and the faction you joined defined your place in the world. In their last games the factions just seemed like empty coloring. The gruff tone worked in G1 because it felt realistic for a prison colony, but at some point they decided everyone talking like some street thug defined their games and it just became a dumb gimmick. And so on
That's why I'll check this one out eventually, just as I eventually bought Risen 3 for a few bucks, even though I thought Risen 2 was a turd with an abysmal excuse for a story.
Unfortunately it seems like aside from the graphic designers all the really creative people have left PB. Mike Hoge who was pretty much the creator of all the Gothic lore has left and it feels like noone with the same creative drive has filled his place.
PB really have two problems right now (aside from the technical issues that come with wanting to make 3D open world RPGs with 20 people in 2017). They have a very vocal hardcore fanbase in Germany that doesn't want them to stray an inch from the Gothic formula, but at the same time they can't seem to understand what made their own games so great.
That's why we get the same join-1-of-3-factions scenario, the same nameless hero, the same dumb humour again and again. The faction system in G1 and 2 was great because it felt like there was a moral weight to the decision and the faction you joined defined your place in the world. In their last games the factions just seemed like empty coloring. The gruff tone worked in G1 because it felt realistic for a prison colony, but at some point they decided everyone talking like some street thug defined their games and it just became a dumb gimmick. And so on
I platinumed Risens 2 and 3 back to back a year or two ago. I won't be skipping Elex, though from what I've seen of it, I'm not confident PB have learned many lessons. Still, I like their brand of hard fantasy Euro-jank and pirate fantasy Euro-jank. I'm curious what they do with sci-fi.
Witcher 3 is Euro jank.
Sad Affleck
Member
Hell yes! Every Piranha Bytes games is interesting. Janky, yes, idiosynchratic, sure, but interesting and fun. The only PB game I didn't enjoy was Gothic 3 because I had the misfortune of trying to play it on release.
butman
Member
There are always exceptions.
Slackbladder
Member
This Elex looks very derivative. And I recognise the clumsy movement and controls from their other games. Still, if the price is right...
GavinUK86
Member
JustSomeone
Member
Tag quote would be in place here
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Please forgive me while I take a moment in this thread to enjoy the wonderful gift from the gaming community that is the word "jank".
Every time I read/hear it spoken aloud I get a warm fuzzy feeling inside and get all giggly. Such a fantastic word...
...and even better is that it's become an accepted term in game criticism and reviews. I love it.
On Topic: With Eurojank (*giggle*) games like this, OP, I'll wait for user-impressions before buying. I failed to do that with Lords of the Fallen and I hated that game.
Every time I read/hear it spoken aloud I get a warm fuzzy feeling inside and get all giggly. Such a fantastic word...
...and even better is that it's become an accepted term in game criticism and reviews. I love it.
On Topic: With Eurojank (*giggle*) games like this, OP, I'll wait for user-impressions before buying. I failed to do that with Lords of the Fallen and I hated that game.
LordBaztion
Member
I'm interested but I'm going to buy it after a couple of price drops.
Stiler
Member
You'd think after this long they would have developed better animation quality and things as a studio that's been around for a while.
On the flip side, you can say the same thing about Bethesda and their horrible animation that still plagues every game they make.
Looks like it can be a fun game to get once it's on a sale for like $20 or so.
On the flip side, you can say the same thing about Bethesda and their horrible animation that still plagues every game they make.
Looks like it can be a fun game to get once it's on a sale for like $20 or so.
eXistor
Member
I like Piranha Bytes and am mostly able to enjoy their games in spite of their problems (mostly technical issues and combat), but Elex does nothing for me. There's just too many other games that look better and I can't really fit it in anywhere. Maybe somewhere down the line, but I doubt it.
Moff
Member
I am a hardcore PB fan since gothic 2 and never stopped loving their games, even though all of them since G2 were heavily flawed. They just satisfy an itch no other developer does. I even enjoyed Gothic 3 and Risen 2, their worst games. I just love immersive games and PB games are very immersive, even Björn Pankratz said that if he is asked what kind of games he makes he answers "Immersive games". The factions, the rewarding exploration in handcrafted worlds, the dialogue. They do all of that in very unique ways.
I also think that Risen 3 was a massive improvement over Risen 2, and if they manage to improve that further I think I will be very happy with Elex, although I am not really sold on the fantasy/post apocalyptic/scifi mixup. We already know a few things they improved on, you can kill most NPCs again and there is a sophisticated punishment system in place for stealing and other misbehaving in towns. These might seem like small details but if you love immersive games you care about features like that.
I am also excited to play with real modern ranged weapons in this game, and as always magic of course, which has always been very cool in PB games. The jetpack is also a great feature in an exploration heavy game. I just hope the melee combat is good this time, they absolutely failed in that in Risen 2 and 3, I just never cared much because I never play melee.
I will probably play as the scifi faction (Templars) first, but the other factions have cool designs and interesting special abilities as well, so unless it's the worst PB game ever I will probably do 3 playthroughs.
I also think that Risen 3 was a massive improvement over Risen 2, and if they manage to improve that further I think I will be very happy with Elex, although I am not really sold on the fantasy/post apocalyptic/scifi mixup. We already know a few things they improved on, you can kill most NPCs again and there is a sophisticated punishment system in place for stealing and other misbehaving in towns. These might seem like small details but if you love immersive games you care about features like that.
I am also excited to play with real modern ranged weapons in this game, and as always magic of course, which has always been very cool in PB games. The jetpack is also a great feature in an exploration heavy game. I just hope the melee combat is good this time, they absolutely failed in that in Risen 2 and 3, I just never cared much because I never play melee.
I will probably play as the scifi faction (Templars) first, but the other factions have cool designs and interesting special abilities as well, so unless it's the worst PB game ever I will probably do 3 playthroughs.
I think the problem may be the same for both. Apparently Bethesda Game Studios changed very little since the Morrowind days. Didn't grow too much, if at all, and the team was mostly the same, especially the leads. I suppose the same may be true for PB, being a very small studio.
However, some new blood is essential from time to time.
Compare it for example to CDP, which grew enormously from TW to TW3, and every game has been better than the last.
While Piranha Bytes games haven't improved at the level of pretty much anyone else, I still keep an eye on those, as they have certain charm and through elements that are sorely missed in other RPGs (which is the worse tragedy).
Yes, none of the recent titles are at the level of Gothic 1 or 2. But Risen 1, was good -just not great. And while Gothic 3 was a mess (never finished it), still had some fun with it. Plus, having healthy B-C developers is always a good thing.
I'm really curious to see how they will handle the fly/shooting aspect, since their games & map design tend to have a certain cadence, that may not translate well. Thankfully, ELEX is not charging full price in my zone so -unless it's an unmitigated disaster-, I will purchase it.
My only concern, is that there isn't that much recent media released; hope we get the goods in the upcoming weeks.
Yes, none of the recent titles are at the level of Gothic 1 or 2. But Risen 1, was good -just not great. And while Gothic 3 was a mess (never finished it), still had some fun with it. Plus, having healthy B-C developers is always a good thing.
I'm really curious to see how they will handle the fly/shooting aspect, since their games & map design tend to have a certain cadence, that may not translate well. Thankfully, ELEX is not charging full price in my zone so -unless it's an unmitigated disaster-, I will purchase it.
My only concern, is that there isn't that much recent media released; hope we get the goods in the upcoming weeks.
Vincent Grayson
Member
Don't get me wrong, I'm sure I'll play this one at least a little, as I have their other games. I'm just not "excited" about it.
I have a real hard time not buying and playing most open world RPGs, even the shitty ones.
waveuponwave
Member
Agreed about Risen 1. They decided to play it safe after the Gothic 3 bug debacle, but as a result it felt too much like a Gothic rehash, down to the bandits in the swamp and the lizard people.
As to Gothic 3 it's kind of hilarious how broken it is even after all the fan patches. Triggering one of the major story-relevant boss fights teleported me and the boss into limbo a mile above the map the first dozen times I tried.
And even ignoring bugs whoever had the idea to let you fight against the whole population of every city on the continent with 2 or 3 vulnerable KI companions to win the 'revolution' deserves to burn in hell
Edit: There's still a big fan project in the works that aims to revamp the story of Gothic 3 (Gothic 3 Story project). But in a sad way it seems they fell victim to the same gigantomania that plagued PB with that game and instead of fixing the most egregious story flaws they decided to redo the whole game. At this point I doubt it'll ever come out.
Jag
Member
I agree with all of this. I became a big PB fan from Gothic and loved the Risen games, warts and all. Wasn't even aware of Elex, but will most likely be a day 1 purchase for me. I'm constantly looking to scratch that Risen itch and most games don't do it.
I recall hearing about it a few years ago. And I can understand it, because you can see the potential of the game as a whole.
ELEX world is supposed to be even larger than Gothic 3 (1.5x I think). And that's my major concern: the best PB games were all relatively small and focused. I love exploring. Finding hidden paths, caves and trinkets is my jam. But at some point, it just becomes too much padding. I no longer have the time to deal with those kind of games.
I picked up LotF after wtching a dev video. I had played previous Souls games and didn't really care for them. But I enjoyed LotF despite what the overall impression.
Never played Risen but enjoyed the Gothic games. This setting is right up my alley so far from videos I've seen. I'll pick it up after graduation regardless of reception unless the gane is completely borked or doesn't run well on PC.
didn't even know this game existed. Consider me interested although it looks like it will continue the negative trend of recent PB games
granted I haven't played Risen 2 and 3, but it seems like the look of the main character is a pretty good indication for the quality of the game - the blander /spacemarine-like he looks, the worse the game is. Yeah, I know it's not an exact science but so far it has been accurate.
I think the problem with PB's games is that they try to stick to their formula while at the same time go with the market in creating more open and bigger worlds. But that completely fails to recognize what made Gothic 1 and 2 great. It wasn't a huge open world, it was a carefully guided sense of progression. Both games are actually quite linear and only slowly unfold before you. Gothic 3 was a mess because it completely lacked any direction, there was no "common theme" (although the german lack of a "roter Faden" would be more accurate).
I think they are somewhat stuck in the "bigger means better" trap. Since the industry needs big world maps, they gotta have one too. Doesn't matter if the small map of even Gothic 1 felt better then most open worlds out there.
I'm not too confident in Elex, but I try to keep an open mind until I get to play it.
granted I haven't played Risen 2 and 3, but it seems like the look of the main character is a pretty good indication for the quality of the game - the blander /spacemarine-like he looks, the worse the game is. Yeah, I know it's not an exact science but so far it has been accurate.
I think the problem with PB's games is that they try to stick to their formula while at the same time go with the market in creating more open and bigger worlds. But that completely fails to recognize what made Gothic 1 and 2 great. It wasn't a huge open world, it was a carefully guided sense of progression. Both games are actually quite linear and only slowly unfold before you. Gothic 3 was a mess because it completely lacked any direction, there was no "common theme" (although the german lack of a "roter Faden" would be more accurate).
Nevertheless Gothic 3 was actually quite enjoyable once you left Myrthana and headed for the dessert or the mountains.
I'm not too confident in Elex, but I try to keep an open mind until I get to play it.
There were several threads about what made Gothic 1 and 2 so great, there are lots of fans, lots of people who consider these games (particularly 2) some of the best RPGs ever made. It's really saddening that they don't seem to be able to do this again.
I too had a good time with Gothic 3 (I actually never ran into a bug even at release). The only thing I really didn't like was the opening hour and the size of the map, it was just to big. What made 1 and 2 so good was the small, enclosed map, congruent with the scenario, and that these maps were filled with surprises what made exploration worthwhile and meaningful.
They should remake these games. I'd kickstart the shit out of a remake of G2.
Still, I'll pick up Elex sincerely hoping that it's remotely close to the first Gothic games.
I felt that for single player RPGs at the time, both G1 and (especially) G2 had pretty sizeable open worlds, but I completely agree with your point.
Saw this video in my list, it talks a bit about ELEX combat options:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH1pe24yQqg
(GAF gets a passing mention). I also wonder if the game will be delayed to next year. Mainly because the lack of new videos/information. Either way, hope they add several magic-throwing animations, because having only one will get stale pretty fast.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH1pe24yQqg
(GAF gets a passing mention). I also wonder if the game will be delayed to next year. Mainly because the lack of new videos/information. Either way, hope they add several magic-throwing animations, because having only one will get stale pretty fast.
Yeah, magic and gun animations are looking rough. Still, the options alone might make up for it. Good video.
Alexander DeLarge
Member
Very excited, got the collector's edition on pre-order. Even their post-Gothic games have a charm to them despite their flaws and I'll happily support anything they do.
I hope ELEX puts them back on the map though... I'd really like to see them grow into a bigger, more successful company.
I hope ELEX puts them back on the map though... I'd really like to see them grow into a bigger, more successful company.
D
Deleted member 471617
Unconfirmed Member
Looks good but the combat looks clunky as hell. Where's the fluidity? Can easily see this game bombing since it's scheduled to release October 17th which is a horrible spot and I can also easily see this game getting delayed to early 2018 which if in January or early February would probably be a better idea as opposed to sending the game out to die.
It's a Piranha Bytes game. They have their fanbase and sells will be fine enough, but won't get them out of the niche, I guess.The game just lacks mainstream appeal in my opinion. A later release wouldn't change that.
Also the clunky animations are also quite common for Piranha Bytes... But to be fair. They are quite a small team and do them without any motion capture as a base.