The ink spots?
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Blade Runner 2049 |OT| Do Androids Dream of Electric Boogaloo? [Unmarked Spoilers]
- Thread starter Mr. Sam
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The ink spots?
KraftyKrankins
Member
I can't get this movie's ending out of my head. The sadness in Ryan's eyes in the end, the moment of "peace" he has before his death coming to terms woth not being able to find humanity in himself, his soul so to say... I wanna rewatch the movie now jist so I can pay closer attention to his character arc.
I thought she let him live because he was a "good dog", he was doing his detective job well and they could still have needed him to find the child. I mean he is the first person to find Deckard after 30 years. She had to hurt him to show who is the boss, but she needed him alive.
The pacing was perfect for me, I was on the edge of my seat the entire time. Tarkovsky discusses pacing and the sense of time in his book and his conclusion is that the the only thing a director can do is let time pass at the speed he or she subjectively feels is right. This means it won't work for every audience member. Some will feel in sync with the director's sense of time while other won't feel that at all. Of course, that's not an excuse for movies with actual bad pacing, but I don't think it's the case here, the movie is consistent in it's pacing.
Yeah, Twin Peaks for TV, Blade Runner for Cinema and Zelda: BoTW for gaming
What's the musical equivalent this year?I simply adore the love scene, the projection of K's own desire and ideals upon an other person. Isn't that the description of what love is for many people? Reality and ideas and how they will never completely match up.
Villeneuve definitely renders the world of Blade Runner through his own eyes. Brilliant set pieces with gorgeous visuals which evoke and maintain a great sense of unease, all things which Villeneuve excels at. Sparse, minimalist and sterile, this film establishes a very different atmosphere than its predecessor and while it certainly manages to stir feelings of alienation, it lacks the beautiful melancholy found in the original. A lot of this has to do with a soundtrack which comes nowhere close to supporting the film like Vangelis' did and the absence of claustrophobia, the mishmash of multicultural iconography, the sprawl and characters which do not posses or express well enough their barely contained desire for something more with the exception of possibly Joi make up the other missing pieces. They say it aloud in words (like the Lt.) or show it through tears but it's not felt. Speaking of Joi, while I did really enjoy this narrative thread and the visual storytelling in her scenes, I think 'Her' probably explored the same concept with much more care and plausibility. It was more human.
None the less, a worthy sequel to the original which attempts to explore the same themes in greater depth and succeeds in doing so sometimes (perhaps even most times).
Edit: The plot contrivances were bothersome but eh I can ignore them.
None the less, a worthy sequel to the original which attempts to explore the same themes in greater depth and succeeds in doing so sometimes (perhaps even most times).
Edit: The plot contrivances were bothersome but eh I can ignore them.
mine did (largest one in Berlin). I never asked for this
he'd have likely perished if it wasn't for the rebels, of which she had no knowledge of. The "still need him alive" thing is pure speculation, but I concede that you can reasonably come to this conclusion
I think the entire reason he helped Deckard at the end was to attain his humanity. As the film itself spells out, what could be more human?
NealMcCauley
Member
IIRC immune disorder, which was why she could never go off-world. Which makes the replicants' hopes she would lead the revolution kinda ironic IMO.
Oh yeah, but his fatal wound wasn't caused by her but by the projectile from the explosion. We don't know if she knew about it. From her perspective she just beat him up.
Sorry on mobile I deleted too much when I quoted.
FullMetalx117
Member
I watched it without seeing the first. I didn't feel lost at all, but yeah you're right, I care a whole lot more for K and Joi than I did Deckard/rachel. Just a fascinating sci fi universe. We def need more movies like these and I hope we get something more in this universe.
Haloid1177
Banned
I kinda felt that's what they told her so she'd stay put and be kept safe. Maybe I'm reaching.
KraftyKrankins
Member
Yeah this is the one thing everyone who hasn't seen the original yet will have to do it for. The Deckard/Rachel story is literally half the movie and I can't imagine enjoying it without being emotionally invested in it. My theater had a few people gasp when "she" showed up.
She zoomed in on him and said "Get up and do your fucking job," it was pretty clear that she was trying to help him move forward.
NealMcCauley
Member
I think (her dialogue was very quiet on my screen) she said the disorder was discovered when her adopted family was tested for off-world readiness.
I agree, the natural born replicant storyline wasn't that interesting and Joe's/Joi's scenes were some of the best in the film.
Also, whenever a replicant was killed in the original, the film went out of its way to highlight the event's sadness. This did the same but I think they brush aside nu-Rachel's death way too quickly.
Also, whenever a replicant was killed in the original, the film went out of its way to highlight the event's sadness. This did the same but I think they brush aside nu-Rachel's death way too quickly.
KraftyKrankins
Member
True, but also at one point he thought he could be human, didn't he? That's why he had a breakdown when the Memory Maker told him he's having someone else's memories.
that was when the car crashed near the orphanage, before he found Deckard. We're talking about the scene where Deckard tries to flee with his car and it's blown up, and she takes out K from behind after the shot the goons
itsbenoclock
Member
The film was alright, story wasn't at all interesting for me but eh, don't have strong feelings either way. But my goodness, turn the sound dial down ffs, came out of the cinema with a headache from all the BWWWWWAAAARRRR sounds constantly.
tonysidaway
Member
According to the New Yorker review the tests are based on the following fragment of verse from the 1962 novel Pale Fire by Vladimir Nabokov.
Cells interlinked within cells interlinked
Within one stem. And dreadfully distinct
Against the dark, a tall white fountain played.
Remember the Voight-Kampff test of the novel and the first film? That looked at physical reactions to shocking stimuli (in the context of a society in which birds, reptiles and mammals are nearly extinct and harming them is taboo) to measure the degree of empathy felt by the subject. Here the mechanism is probably similar, measuring response time, but they're testing a known replicant using the same standardised stimuli and responses, hence the baseline.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/10/16/blade-runner-2049-the-mysteries-deepen
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pale_Fire
Yes but this was well before he learns the truth that he is not the child from the One-Eyed lady
I saw it in Atmos and I'm glad I brought ear plugs.
I fucking loved this. Makes me wish I had seen it in IMAX.
Lights and Waves
Member
La La Land, Drive, Blade Runner, The Notebook, Blue Valentine
Ryan Gosling has made so many good decisions.
Ryan Gosling has made so many good decisions.
tonysidaway
Member
There are two (or more) people in a human relationship, and they converge to accommodate one another. Joi's lack of autonomy is fairly pronounced, and this is signalled somewhat by the fifties clichés in some of the projected imagery. She's just not there. It's all in Joe's mind.
Saw it in an Atmos and thought this was great (but yeah there's not much more to the score).
Haloid1177
Banned
I kinda wanna know the timeframe of when she found out. Any other movie I take stuff at face value but Blade Runner I just can't even though I probably should.
Vyse The Legend
Member
That's right. She is told that she has a compromised immune system.
nu-Rachel's death is treated like nothing, because she is a fake. She's a soulless replicant, one that could be manufactured again. So, her death is meaningless, and treated as such.
Also, Ana de Armas was BRILLIANT in this movie. Like holy shit.
This is 100% right. The Replicants wanted K to KILL Deckard, so that he would not lead Wallace and his people to the child.
Instead, K died fighting for what he wanted, his mission, to unite Deckard with his daughter. It was a brilliant twist and character moment, and it made the fight in the submerged vehicle much more impactful, because I did not know if K wanted to kill Deckard or save him.
Ah, that makes more sense.
AuthenticM
Member
Can you do that please? I checked the WB press site but you need a ID and password to get in.
I really want the highest quality possible of that shot.
I need to see this again
Yeah. Saw it in an Imax and the score was pissing me off. Hans Zimmer just doesn't fit in the Blade Runner universe, it was so distracting and annoying. Really brought down the whole experience for me.
I agree and the interesting thing about the billboard scene isn't the fact that she is fake (K already knew that beforehand), but the line "hear what you want to hear". She was the one who convinced him he was human, it's confirmation bias, he needed to hear what he didn't wan't to hear, that he is just a replicant. Through that he found his own humanity, he didn't need to be human biologically or having a "soul".
Which is a Very Bad Thing when you're supposed to care about replicant/natural-born human relations, yet the most emotionally-resonant scenes revolve around a toy. It's all terribly tone-deaf (the scenes were nicely done, but yeesh).
The sound mix was seriously bizarre. Turning up the volume of those classic moody themes isn't going to magically turn them into dramatic action score.
There's no such thing as a soulless replicant. That had more to do with her being a gimmick and not a character.
Insane Metal
Member
Seeing this tonight, can't wait.
Kenzodielocke
Banned
Just like the original, maybe even more, this movie has a lot of themes, allegory's and callbacks, that need time to sink in. I love it so much more after a day watching it, where I thought it was good, right after I left the theatre.
Inferno313
Banned
11:30 AM tomorrow can't get here fast enough, fuck!
Exactly. The idea of any replicants being disposable (from an audience POV) goes completely against what the films are about. While nu-Rachel served her purpose well, it did come across as a short gimmick.
the audience isn't supposed to see the replicants as soulless, it's showing that wallace treats them that way, no?
This is what I thought too.
Plus the idea of the first replicant birth having major health issues would hurt the story to me.
The only time I thought the pacing was ridiculously slow was the "reveal" of him finding the horse in the factory, and proving his memory was a real one. The minute you saw it was the same place you knew what was coming but they really dragged that moment out as if when he found the horse it would be a big surprise to the audience. I can't imagine anyone being surprised at that.
Sure, he wanted to show that epic moment for that character but that impact could still have been shown to the same extent in a more snappily paced reveal. It really was dumbfounding to me how they dragged that moment out.
Sure, he wanted to show that epic moment for that character but that impact could still have been shown to the same extent in a more snappily paced reveal. It really was dumbfounding to me how they dragged that moment out.
Nonsense. The original didn't dwell on Leon or Pris's deaths
Vyse The Legend
Member
The whole point is that a "toy" exhibits a degree of humanity that you start to believe she is not one. You empathize with her, with K and their romance. That's what makes the scenes after Joi's death even more of a gut punch when you see that yes, she was just designed to adapt to K's desires. K (and audience) realizes that she was just a sophisticated set of algorithms.
That's the fundamental question at the core of the entire film. Do/can replicants have souls? K thinks you have to be natural born to have one. The other replicants think it's more about how you feel and act, dying for something of your own choosing, aka free will. They don't prescribe one's ability to have a soul to being natural born -- all the natural born replicant shows is that they can not only be human but also rise above them.
Also, not sure what was such a "gimmick" about her. She plays an important role throughout the film as the person who birthed a natural born replicant, and then comes in as a way to tempt Deckard. The temptation is so strong that he has to lie to reject it ("she had green eyes"), and look away from her being killed.
The audience is supposed to make their own judgments. You could side with Wallace or with the replicants. The whole point is that it's ambiguous--cause you get glimpses of true humanity from the replicants, as well as moments where the illusion breaks (Joi's death).
What's not ambiguous in that scene is that she is a fake, and we know it. You could decide then whether or not you think her life means anything. Wallace doesn't so he quickly disposes her. Deckard can't watch, but the audience is forced to.
NealMcCauley
Member
The replicants' plan in the Blackout short has a lot more weight now.
andythinkpad
Member
Saw it last one. Not a huge fan of the original Blade Runner. I like the new one better.
I think for the new one, 1st and 3rd acts are too long. The 2nd act is great. I love everything between Ryan Glosing and his "Cuban Felicity Jones" digital girlfriend, their relationship feels real and it's something you can root for. It feels more natural and developed than the AI love story in "Her". Being a big general scifi guy I love big ideas like this.
Last act there is too much action. I don't even know why there is a fight scene between Gosling and Ford except maybe the director wanted to add all those fancy holographic stuff in the movie. The fight scene between Gosling and that evil Sherlock Holmes woman is also too long. They just keep knifing each other forever.
I really don't like the score. It's overly distracting. During the factory funnel scene where he discovered the horse all I could think of was "why does the score sound like air raid bombing runs?" I generally like half of Zimmer's stuff. I even listen to his concert on youtube a lot. I didn't know Zimmer scored it until later. He totally went off the deep end IMO.
7/10
I think for the new one, 1st and 3rd acts are too long. The 2nd act is great. I love everything between Ryan Glosing and his "Cuban Felicity Jones" digital girlfriend, their relationship feels real and it's something you can root for. It feels more natural and developed than the AI love story in "Her". Being a big general scifi guy I love big ideas like this.
Last act there is too much action. I don't even know why there is a fight scene between Gosling and Ford except maybe the director wanted to add all those fancy holographic stuff in the movie. The fight scene between Gosling and that evil Sherlock Holmes woman is also too long. They just keep knifing each other forever.
I really don't like the score. It's overly distracting. During the factory funnel scene where he discovered the horse all I could think of was "why does the score sound like air raid bombing runs?" I generally like half of Zimmer's stuff. I even listen to his concert on youtube a lot. I didn't know Zimmer scored it until later. He totally went off the deep end IMO.
7/10
Holy fuck Wallace was creepy.
I thought it was brilliant. The most human characters were both artificial.
I thought it was brilliant. The most human characters were both artificial.
Vyse The Legend
Member
Yup, and that's the entire point.
He tells Deckard that, if he helps Wallace lead them to the child/key to reproduction, he can have anything he wants. Rachel is the #1 thing Deckard would want.
KraftyKrankins
Member
Listening to the score again. This is the very definition of a soundtrack that exists just so there's some music in the background. Not a single memorable theme in it. I'd have taken a complete rip-off of Vangelis instead of this.
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