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[LCGeek]

My father bought a new Samsung LED, so I told him to give me his old 29" Sony Trinitron, it's a KV-X2903E and has a RGB input, and front AV connectors, here it is with my SNES plugged in:

It's a bad pic, but you get the idea, I will try to make better pics later, also I don't know how to calibrate a CRT TV so the colors are not perfect

You can calibrate any machine just need a colorimeter and linux/windows to use the programs that can test a display color values. You can always go look for an avia calibration disc and take it from there.

The first method is the best way since it can account for the tv exact values and any external lighting influences.

 

[CrashPrime]

I am having the hardest time finding a damn 25-30" Sony TV. I've been on the craigslist hunt for weeks, and I've been checking the local thrift shops 1-2 times a week.

Do other brands even come close to comparing? I seem to see plenty of RCA, JVC, Orion, and even some older Toshiba's.

 

[LCGeek]

I am having the hardest time finding a damn 25-30" Sony TV. I've been on the craigslist hunt for weeks, and I've been checking the local thrift shops 1-2 times a week.

Do other brands even come close to comparing? I seem to see plenty of RCA, JVC, Orion, and even some older Toshiba's.

When I get my pc back I can post or link to a site that has tons of displays in the range you mention but also smaller that are perfect for the subject. My main brands for displays or tvs are necs, sony, and mitsubisihi when it comes from big names. Finding good sony crts tv or monitors is relly hard these days and in my experience I had an easier time with ebay than craiglist.

 

[kinggroin]

Any central Florida gaffers in here, I've got a Sony 30" HS420 HDCRT in excellent condition. Letting it go for free.

Hit me up

2x component 1x HDMI

 

[Baller. PhD]

Why do you need video switching on your receiver?

The answer to your question is no, there are no simple 2.1 receivers with video inputs. I also wanted just two-channel audio, and I ended up buying a Sony two-channel receiver.

I don't know, do I not? I'm not very knowledgeable on audio, I just know I have all my modern consoles plugged into my receiver via HDMI. Would a retro setup be different?

Also, I'm having a bitch of a time trying to find a KV-27FS120 in my area. Tons of FS100's but never any 120's. What's the difference? Should I just get a FS100? This'll mostly be used for SNES, N64, Genesis and Wii gaming.

 

[Zing]

I don't know, do I not? I'm not very knowledgeable on audio, I just know I have all my modern consoles plugged into my receiver via HDMI. Would a retro setup be different?

Also, I'm having a bitch of a time trying to find a KV-27FS120 in my area. Tons of FS100's but never any 120's. What's the difference? Should I just get a FS100? This'll mostly be used for SNES, N64, Genesis and Wii gaming.

If the TV itself has enough inputs for you, then there is no reason to have video switching on the receiver. Hell, you don't even need audio switching on your receiver. A single input amp would do just as well, since the TV has fixed line-level audio output.

The FS100/FS120 have:
1 s-video
2 composite
1 component

There is no practical difference between the FS100 and FS120. The only difference I have noticed is that the FS120 has SRS WOW audio. You can research that yourself to see if it matters to you. I always had it enabled, but I could live without it.

Both models have the same comb filter, screen, speakers, features, etc. They are essentially the same TV.

 

[sammy]

I'm sure it's already been mentioned here but I just have to give a should out to my Sony KD-34XBR960

It's a super awesome display with the hi-scan Super Fine Pitch technology new games look great on it also. 1080i looks really nice on the PS3. I got it about 7 years ago when I saw that it was the last dying breed of this tube technology. After a month spent lurking the AVSforums I was able to teach myself how to calibrate the thing and adjust for geometry/overscan.

Greatest TV I've ever had by a longshot, old console games look remarkable.

 

[CrashPrime]

I'm sure it's already been mentioned here but I just have to give a should out to my Sony KD-34XBR960

It's a super awesome display with the hi-scan Super Fine Pitch technology new games look great on it also. 1080i looks really nice on the PS3. I got it about 7 years ago when I saw that it was the last dying breed of this tube technology. After a month spent lurking the AVSforums I was able to teach myself how to calibrate the thing and adjust for geometry/overscan.

Greatest TV I've ever had by a longshot, old console games look remarkable.

Doesn't that TV upscale your old console inputs? I thought that was bad. Also, I was under the impression there aren't scanlines on HDTV tubes.

 

[Pociask]

I'm sure it's already been mentioned here but I just have to give a should out to my Sony KD-34XBR960

It's a super awesome display with the hi-scan Super Fine Pitch technology new games look great on it also. 1080i looks really nice on the PS3. I got it about 7 years ago when I saw that it was the last dying breed of this tube technology. After a month spent lurking the AVSforums I was able to teach myself how to calibrate the thing and adjust for geometry/overscan.

Greatest TV I've ever had by a longshot, old console games look remarkable.

After checking the link, I saw this:

weight: 196 lbs.

That's a monster!

 

[sammy]

Yea, it's a damn beast. Thing is HUGE!

The TV does upscale but old games look wonderful, and Virtual Console games look good in progressive scan. I have old AV and S-Video cables for my consoles. Sega Saturn games look really good on the CRT and so do SNES games. PSP games look outstanding too on it.

The scan-lines are vertical how the CRT's project, something like that. Like I said it's been 7 years since I did the research and knew about this kind of stuff (currently I'm trying to learn more about LED 120Hz screens so I can save up to buy one)

I don't have a way to upload photographs but if anybody is interested PM me and I can get some good pics.

 

[Zing]

Doesn't that TV upscale your old console inputs? I thought that was bad. Also, I was under the impression there aren't scanlines on HDTV tubes.

Yes, there are no scanlines and all inputs are scaled to 1080i.

 

[jbueno]

The TV does upscale but old games look wonderful, and Virtual Console games look good in progressive scan. I have old AV and S-Video cables for my consoles. Sega Saturn games look really good on the CRT and so do SNES games. PSP games look outstanding too on it.

That TV is actually perfect for Wii, 360 and PS3 content since CRTs handle the custom resolutions much better than fixed res displays, IMO it is perfect for anything between 480p and 1080i. Nowadays I can´t stand how those systems look on LCD/LEDN/Plasma HDTVs or monitors, specially on 1080p sets, PC gaming has spoiled me lately it seems.

I´d still prefer an SDTV for VC content at 240p, unless you have lots of N64 titles which are converted to 480p but display 480i on a SD set.

 

[Ramune]

I've seen these Olympus branded Trinitron monitors at work and wondering if they would make good game monitors. I ask because their connections are not like the usual, and apparently they just....toss them when they upgrade to new equipment! :O

 

[Seik]

Well it could be okay for NES/SNES/GEN & co. via co-axial, but co-axial is inferior to your usual A/V cable to begin with. So the choice is all yours.

So many inputs yet no standard video input.

There seems to be an S-video input though, there's something good to do with that if you have the cables.

 

[Zing]

I see a video input, but it uses a BNC connector instead of RCA. I'm sure there are adapters.

 

[dark10x]

Well it could be okay for NES/SNES/GEN & co. via co-axial, but co-axial is inferior to your usual A/V cable to begin with. So the choice is all yours.

So many inputs yet no standard video input.

There seems to be an S-video input though, there's something good to do with that if you have the cables.

Those are BNC connectors (not coax). That monitor can do pure RGB no problem.

 

[tkscz]

This damn thing is fucking amazing. It not only makes classics look great, but because it has an HDMI port AND supports up to 1080i, it makes new games (especially Wii games) look incredible. If you can find it, grab it!

 

[Ramune]

Well it could be okay for NES/SNES/GEN & co. via co-axial, but co-axial is inferior to your usual A/V cable to begin with. So the choice is all yours.

So many inputs yet no standard video input.

There seems to be an S-video input though, there's something good to do with that if you have the cables.

I have S-Video for everything but the NES and Genesis. I'll probably end up getting a S-Video modded Genesis soon and look up how far the NES can go.

Those are BNC connectors (not coax). That monitor can do pure RGB no problem.

That's what I thought!
I'm on a serious retro kick and would like to update my retro consoles with the highest video they can produce. I've seen conversion cables (VGA to BNC, SCART to BNC), so my thoughts would make these a pretty good retro monitor. Not that I lack a tube as my roommate has a Sony KV-34HS40ON HD Tube next to my Panasonic LCD. Seems to work well enough, I like to have backup options, since we'll eventually have to part ways.

 

[CrashPrime]

This damn thing is fucking amazing. It not only makes classics look great, but because it has an HDMI port AND supports up to 1080i, it makes new games (especially Wii games) look incredible. If you can find it, grab it!

Pretty awesome that you're happy with it. My only complaints about the HD-CRTs is that they don't have scanlines, they usually upscale poorly, and they don't work with lightguns. I have a Toshiba that has HDMI and will do 1080i as well. The picture on it is so flipping good compared to even mid-range LCD/LED's that it's quite hilarious how quickly we threw away the technology. Funny you mentioned your Wii. I too have my Wii hooked up to it ... and it makes Wii games look way better than they should.

Granted, they're like a bajillion pounds to move. Sad that we haven't gotten a technology that looks this good in the smaller package.

I have seen a pretty good stream of HD-CRTs on craigslist locally, and all for great prices ... it's the damn SD-CRTs I am looking for. Nobody is parting ways with higher end SD-CRTs these days. I'd imagine those who would normally get rid of them assume them to have no value.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Pretty awesome that you're happy with it. My only complaints about the HD-CRTs is that they don't have scanlines, they usually upscale poorly, and they don't work with lightguns. I have a Toshiba that has HDMI and will do 1080i as well. The picture on it is so flipping good compared to even mid-range LCD/LED's that it's quite hilarious how quickly we threw away the technology. Funny you mentioned your Wii. I too have my Wii hooked up to it ... and it makes Wii games look way better than they should.

Granted, they're like a bajillion pounds to move. Sad that we haven't gotten a technology that looks this good in the smaller package.

I have seen a pretty good stream of HD-CRTs on craigslist locally, and all for great prices ... it's the damn SD-CRTs I am looking for. Nobody is parting ways with higher end SD-CRTs these days. I'd imagine those who would normally get rid of them assume them to have no value.

Try yard sales in your area if you're desperate. You might be surprised.

 

[pje122]

Pretty awesome that you're happy with it. My only complaints about the HD-CRTs is that they don't have scanlines, they usually upscale poorly, and they don't work with lightguns. I have a Toshiba that has HDMI and will do 1080i as well. The picture on it is so flipping good compared to even mid-range LCD/LED's that it's quite hilarious how quickly we threw away the technology. Funny you mentioned your Wii. I too have my Wii hooked up to it ... and it makes Wii games look way better than they should.

Granted, they're like a bajillion pounds to move. Sad that we haven't gotten a technology that looks this good in the smaller package.

I have seen a pretty good stream of HD-CRTs on craigslist locally, and all for great prices ... it's the damn SD-CRTs I am looking for. Nobody is parting ways with higher end SD-CRTs these days. I'd imagine those who would normally get rid of them assume them to have no value.

Would you consider a Sony KV-36XBR400 an HD or SD CRT?

 

[sixteen-bit]

It's 1080i. It's an HD CRT

 

[CaptPete]

Ramune, grab one of those Olympus monitors! Those old Pro CRT monitors are awesome! You just need a couple BNC to RCA adapters:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000V1R97U/?tag=neogaf0e-20

...or go a little more upscale:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001TKFIOI/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Don't bother going to RadioShack for something like this, they're 5-10x more expensive there!

I was so bummed out and sad when my Commodore Amiga 1084 monitor crapped out a couple years back. I thought it was great at the time, but they're still $$$ on eBay, so I started looking around for an alternative.

I was able to find a Panasonic BT-H1390Y 13" monitor for $20 and it's light years better than the 1084 ever was! It handles NTSC, PAL and SECAM natively. It's got 750 lines of resolution (which is a mixed bag really, but the Amiga looks awesome in interlaced mode). It's got a back panel very similar to the Olympus there and can handle RGB/Component, Y/C, Composite, etc. Has an aspect ratio control button so that you can do an analog `squish' for 16:9 content. These things went for almost $1600 when they were new! Everything I've thrown at it, from my old 8-bit computers, the Amiga in PAL RGB or my Xbox/PS2/GameCube look amazing.


Steve

Well it could be okay for NES/SNES/GEN & co. via co-axial, but co-axial is inferior to your usual A/V cable to begin with. So the choice is all yours.

So many inputs yet no standard video input.

There seems to be an S-video input though, there's something good to do with that if you have the cables.

 

[AndresON777]

Inherited an old 27 inch sony trinitron from like the 90's. Might not be a trinitron but it's a nice looking sony. Will probably pick up some old systems soon.

 

[Zing]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the original Trinitrons, the tubes with the vertically (but not horizontally) flat screens in regards to image quality. They are, however, severely limited in inputs.

 

[Trojita]

I was just wondering how Emulated games look on a HD CRT? Do they look as good as playing the original system, better, or worse?

I know HD CRT's still display old school games great because of the way the technology works with not relying on fixed pixels. I'm not sure about a PC output to the TV though.

 

[Trojita]

I'm about to pick up a XBR960 tomorrow.

Am I crazy?

I'm not sure yet 100% if it will fit into my car. I'll be taking it to my parents house.

I also have a Sony KV-32FS320 in my old bedroom at my parents house. Haven't used it in awhile. Is that considered the best 4:3 sub-hd television?

 

[Jay Sosa]

Managed to get a SONY Trinitron for free (with 100hz and PIP). Holy smokes that thing is heavy. Before that I used an old Panasonic for old school gaming which is the same size but I can easily carry without any help.

Seems to be that model:

(KV-29FX60D)

 

[Reiko]

I was just wondering how Emulated games look on a HD CRT? Do they look as good as playing the original system, better, or worse?

I know HD CRT's still display old school games great because of the way the technology works with not relying on fixed pixels. I'm not sure about a PC output to the TV though.

It looks better.

I'll post some examples.

 

[Reiko]

Battletoads in 480p, Emulated on a HDTV CRT

Crystal clear with no blurring.

 

[Trojita]

Thanks

I'm picking up the XBR960 for $250 tomorrow.

 

[inner-G]

I'm looking at pics on craigslist, is there an easy way to tell which Sony CRTs support progressive scan?

Do they look any different on the exterior?

 

[Trojita]

I'm looking at pics on craigslist, is there an easy way to tell which Sony CRTs support progressive scan?

Do they look any different on the exterior?

Not really. You need to look up the model codes.

 

[Tain]

I was just wondering how Emulated games look on a HD CRT? Do they look as good as playing the original system, better, or worse?

I know HD CRT's still display old school games great because of the way the technology works with not relying on fixed pixels. I'm not sure about a PC output to the TV though.

Thing is, every HD CRT I've seen (not a huge number, admittedly) still upscales 240p and 480i sources. I'm not sure where the thought that HD CRTs don't upscale comes from, but I can't buy it. The ones I've seen look better than an LCD, sure, but are miles from an SD CRT or a high resolution emulated image with a decent CRT-styled filter. And they absolutely can (and almost always do, I'd imagine) have input lag, like any other kind of HD display.

 

[Trojita]

Thing is, every HD CRT I've seen (not a huge number, admittedly) still upscales 240p and 480i sources. I'm not sure where the thought that HD CRTs don't upscale comes from, but I can't buy it. The ones I've seen look better than an LCD, sure, but are miles from an SD CRT or a high resolution emulated image with a decent CRT-styled filter. And they absolutely can (and almost always do, I'd imagine) have input lag, like any other kind of HD display.

Anyone else know the answer to this? I was pretty sure that HD CRT's do not have scalers because they aren't needed. The HD CRT shoots the amount of lines that are needed and the details in each line and that is it.

If it is how you say, a 480p television set would be upscaling a 240p signal and making it worse, no?

 

[Tain]

Yeah, I'd guess that a 480p set would be interpreting a 240p signal as 480i and deinterlacing it. Just a guess on that, though. I've only seen 1080i HD CRTs, and they've all upscaled 240p signals. I'm not sure why that's the case, since as you said it shouldn't be necessary.

 

[Reiko]

Thing is, every HD CRT I've seen (not a huge number, admittedly) still upscales 240p and 480i sources. I'm not sure where the thought that HD CRTs don't upscale comes from, but I can't buy it. The ones I've seen look better than an LCD, sure, but are miles from an SD CRT or a high resolution emulated image with a decent CRT-styled filter. And they absolutely can (and almost always do, I'd imagine) have input lag, like any other kind of HD display.

Nope. HD CRTs suffer from no input lag.

 

[Foxix Von]

You can adjust pretty much all geometry except horizontal bowing. In other words, if your horizontal lines are curving up or down, there is nothing you can do.

From my experience, do be wary of the WEGAs. I've got a 27" and although the picture is great, geometry is an issue with mine. Significant bowing among other things. It still looks better than playing on an HDTV without a doubt. It's just something to be aware of with theses sets.

Mine also had some horrendous overscan problems which I was able to correct, although some of the bowing did worsen slightly. I'd be tempted to try and find a replacement if I wasn't so happy with it.

 

[Big Papa Husker]

Anyone have one of the HD WEGAs? How do older consoles look? I might try to get one. I think this is the model I found...

 

[Foxix Von]

Anyone have one of the HD WEGAs? How do older consoles look? I might try to get one. I think this is the model I found...

I opted on passing on the HDTV sets if only for the fact that light gun games won't work on them. Which I figured if I'm setting up a retro gaming station I might as make sure it's compatible with all my old games. Mmmmm.... Duck Hunt.

 

[DDayton]

Does anyone here have one of the Panasonic Tau crt sets?

I got one for free but something is off with the 1080i screen settings. I'm trying to get settings info from someone with a properly calibrated set so I can get a working baseline for image settings.

If you have one and would be willing to copy down some data from the service menu, I'd be much obliged.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Nope. HD CRTs suffer from no input lag.

Incorrect. When scaling low-res source, of course they do.

 

[Trojita]

Incorrect. When scaling low-res source, of course they do.

But they don't scale as far as I know.

 

[Reiko]

Incorrect. When scaling low-res source, of course they do.

Scaling? CRTs don't have a fixed resolution...

 

[Mobius 1]

I'd love one, and they can always be found for dirty cheap, but I have nowhere to setup these monsters.

 

[cryptic]

What model of trinitron do you think this is?

http://westernmass.craigslist.org/ele/3466981560.html

 

[Ramune]

Ramune, grab one of those Olympus monitors! Those old Pro CRT monitors are awesome! You just need a couple BNC to RCA adapters:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000V1R97U/?tag=neogaf0e-20

...or go a little more upscale:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001TKFIOI/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Don't bother going to RadioShack for something like this, they're 5-10x more expensive there!

I was so bummed out and sad when my Commodore Amiga 1084 monitor crapped out a couple years back. I thought it was great at the time, but they're still $$$ on eBay, so I started looking around for an alternative.

I was able to find a Panasonic BT-H1390Y 13" monitor for $20 and it's light years better than the 1084 ever was! It handles NTSC, PAL and SECAM natively. It's got 750 lines of resolution (which is a mixed bag really, but the Amiga looks awesome in interlaced mode). It's got a back panel very similar to the Olympus there and can handle RGB/Component, Y/C, Composite, etc. Has an aspect ratio control button so that you can do an analog `squish' for 16:9 content. These things went for almost $1600 when they were new! Everything I've thrown at it, from my old 8-bit computers, the Amiga in PAL RGB or my Xbox/PS2/GameCube look amazing.


Steve

Glad this got bumped or I would have missed this. That's awesome what your able to do with that Panasonic. The mention of those systems you have hooked up to it make me drool! I can't find a site with specs for this Olympus though. Seems its a Sony monitor, but manufactured by Olympus for the US. I can only imagine that it would be similar to your Panasonic in most ways. And thanks for the link to the BNC adapters too! Now to see when they'll have one at work they're willing to part with eventually....and with sites like MonoPrice, RadioShack has been obsolete in my eyes for a while now. ^_-

 

[Johnny]

Scaling? CRTs don't have a fixed resolution...

Most HD CRT displays handle 240p sources differently than SD CRT displays, often displaying a 480p image or what have you, which requires extra processing and induces lag as a result. They're ideal for ED and HD content, but you're better off with an SD set for SD content, in my opinion.

 

[Reiko]

Most HD CRT displays handle 240p sources differently than SD CRT displays, often displaying a 480p image or what have you, which requires extra processing and induces lag as a result. They're ideal for ED and HD content, but you're better off with an SD set for SD content, in my opinion.

As a gamer who has played Battletoads on NES (A platformer that requires split second timing) I have not noticed any input lag or blurring compared to how I played it on a LCD.

The game looks better in 480p. Or shall I say 540p mode.

 

[dark10x]

As a gamer who has played Battletoads on NES (A platformer that requires split second timing) I have not noticed any input lag or blurring compared to how I played it on a LCD.

The game looks better in 480p. Or shall I say 540p mode.

You're talking about running emulators.

An HD CRT does not handle 240p content nearly as well. I actually replaced my HD CRT with an SD model for this very reason. There *IS* processing that happens when the TV is fed 240p or 480i content. Input lag is present but so minimal it would be impossible to notice in most cases. What IS noticeable, however, is the loss of image quality when using such sources. 240p content appears very sharp while the image is still but begins to blur while in motion while true 480i content suffers from even more artifacts. It's not terrible by any means but it is slightly distracting. These CRTs cannot handle 15khz signals natively despite the fact that CRTs lack a fixed pixel display. There is processing and line doubling involved.

I definitely prefer the appearance of retro games on a real SD CRT over anything else. A 480p emulated image on an HD CRT is definitely attractive as well, but it just doesn't look the same. The second best solution would be an XRGB scaler coupled with a good display which is similar to what you're doing with an emulator.