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Adam Orth no longer with Microsoft

W

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
UrbanRats said:
That was a joke with a friend.

He did say other stupid things, but getting fire over such little bullshit is excessive.
Click to expand...

Such little bullshit? His tweets made #1 on front page on Reddit. The same day Roger Ebert passed away. That's a feat. It spawned negativity around the next Xbox, which isn't even officially announced yet. This wasn't little at all
 
E

eznark

Banned
IcyRhythms said:
The guy got what was coming to him. Felt the pressure, and resigned. In this case it was no different than being fired. Adam Orth spoke poorly to people on Twitter and this is the result.

Extended thoughts on this AMAZING news

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OW1iYtTwXCk
Click to expand...

hahahahaha, what??

Or it could tell you how highly MS values gaming going forward. Or how highly it values any employee. Or a million other things that don't fit the narrative you're grasping for...
Click to expand...

This issue cost him his job. No matter how you want to frame it, that's the bottom line. Personally I'd be embarrassed to be so undervalued so maybe this is great news for his career. If he is worth a shit he can go somewhere where they value him.
 
B

blitzcloud

Banned
ElFly said:
Do you live there? Why Microsoft should be telling us that the towns where we live aren't up to their standards?

The person baiting him is not a Microsoft employee. The Microsoft employee said foolish things in public that made Microsoft look bad in the press.

This is not hard, you guys.
Click to expand...

I think there's a fair stretch of overreaction.

Why on earth would I live there as an answer to "you go live in"

"is not the same as saying: You lowly barbarians from non-city-centric states can't expect to have the oportunity of myself, the great sweet billy, living in your antiquated towns. I believe you should all cease to try to catch up with technology and accept that you're simply not worthy"

Which is what some people seem to understand from his message.
 
R

Reiko

Banned
upJTboogie said:
Unfortunately saying "just trolling lol" doesn't stop the bad press.
Click to expand...


And what a list...

shinra-bansho said:
Wow. 20+ more pages. Updated list, that you can replace the OP one with if you want shinobi.

Oh and yes, eventually even:

nothing_stops_this_train-9763.gif


Microsoft Press Release:
"We are aware of the comments made by an employee on Twitter. This person is not a spokesperson for Microsoft, and his personal views are not reflective of those of the company. We have not made any announcements about our product roadmap, and have no further comment on this matter."
Click to expand...
 
U

UrbanRats

Member
Wario64 said:
Such little bullshit? His tweets made #1 on front page on Reddit. The same day Roger Ebert passed away. That's a feat. It spawned negativity around the next Xbox, which isn't even officially announced yet. This wasn't little at all
Click to expand...

The tweet weren't all that big news, it's that people on the internet go overboard with everything.
It's the same reason every joke has to become a meme nowadays or why EA won "worst company in America".

So yes, the story became huge, but it wasn't warranted, is what i'm saying.
 
S

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
I think people should be nicer to each other. I think the root of the problem with the Orth tweets is that they weren't very nice, they were flippant and condescending ("deal with it", "why would anyone live there?"). I don't think he started from the assumption that people were legitimately upset, had real concerns. I think he mostly jumped to conclusions about others without giving them a fair shake.

I think Arthur's attitude on twitter is generally pretty poor and rude to others, and I think his ongoing campaign to complain about GAF rather than engage in constructive discussion is pretty rude--he has an account and can easily defend himself here or make an affirmative case for his words instead of sniping. I think most of the times where he's faced criticism here, even rude criticism or sometimes insults, it's been as a result of statements he's made that have been rude or judgmental or flippant.

I think the schadenfreude here and on many forums towards people in the industry is a mean at times. I think gravedancing in general is pretty crass, even if in some cases it is understandable. It'd be a better world if more people were happy and nicer to each other, and that has to start by being nice to people who aren't very nice. I think if someone is a negative influence in your life or you think they're a big jerk and a blowhard, you'll be happy if you learn to ignore them or go beyond them, you'll be happier. Worse than people who are bad influences and who generate unhappiness are people who relish getting angry at them rather than learning to let go and move on.

I think empathy and modesty go hand-in-hand, and starting from a modest perspective makes it easier to empathize with others. It also functions as a great way of keeping a check on yourself, because if you're modest, chances are you'll be more able to understand when someone calls attention to mistakes you've made. I think having a personal filter and being able to self-censor and choosing to do so at times where your meanest, cruelest, rudest, or most judgmental instincts surface is a good thing. For the most part, there's a calmer, less rude way of obtaining the result you're hoping to maintain and for the most part, the person you're being rude to is probably not at their best either and if you give them the chance to calm down and articulate themselves a little better, they will.

I think you can be passionately convinced of something, and deliver pointed (and even personal!) criticism about something or someone, but in general conversations should start with empathy, the presumption of good faith, and trying to understand how someone's assumptions lead to their conclusions (even if you disagree with them). And if someone squanders that presumption of good faith, and defies even extraordinary attempts to empathize with them, and makes themselves visible in a way that you could never, ever ignore them, then whatever anger you feel at them will be justified in the end because you know you've done your best to give them a chance to explain themselves.

I don't think very many people come off very well in all this.
 
K

KojiKnight

Member
upJTboogie said:
Unfortunately saying "just trolling lol" doesn't stop the bad press.
Click to expand...

This... Recovering from this press cost Microsoft money. It cost them customers, it cost them money in bad PR, and it's awfully convienient that all of these new leaks have emerged right after this. It probably cost Microsoft having to divulge information early.
 
S

Spirit of Jazz

Banned
UrbanRats said:
He did say other stupid things, but getting fire over such little bullshit is excessive.
Click to expand...

He might have got fired for potentially commenting on an embargoed subject rather than (just) being rude of twitter. If you work at MS and have accesses to information they don't want to be released at that time you shouldn't publish information on the internet that could be interpreted as details about that information.
 
K

Kazuma Kiryu

Member
UrbanRats said:
Well that is MY take away from this.
If you have a job you even remotely care about, do not use Twitter.
Click to expand...

you can use twitter and facebook, you just have to be smart about what to post. work for a big company and wanna troll a little, have some fun? do it with a IM service or something, don't go around making public tweets. there, problem solved.
 
N

NathanMcMahon

Banned
Stumpokapow said:
I think people should be nicer to each other. I think the root of the problem with the Orth tweets is that they weren't very nice, they were flippant and condescending ("deal with it", "why would anyone live there?"). I don't think he started from the assumption that people were legitimately upset, had real concerns. I think he mostly jumped to conclusions about others without giving them a fair shake.

I think Arthur's attitude on twitter is generally pretty poor and rude to others, and I think his ongoing campaign to complain about GAF rather than engage in constructive discussion is pretty rude--he has an account and can easily defend himself here or make an affirmative case for his words instead of sniping. I think most of the times where he's faced criticism here, even rude criticism or sometimes insults, it's been as a result of statements he's made that have been rude or judgmental or flippant.

I think the schadenfreude here and on many forums towards people in the industry is a mean at times. I think gravedancing in general is pretty crass, even if in some cases it is understandable. It'd be a better world if more people were happy and nicer to each other, and that has to start by being nice to people who aren't very nice. I think if someone is a negative influence in your life or you think they're a big jerk and a blowhard, you'll be happy if you learn to ignore them or go beyond them, you'll be happier. Worse than people who are bad influences and who generate unhappiness are people who relish getting angry at them rather than learning to let go and move on.

I think empathy and modesty go hand-in-hand, and starting from a modest perspective makes it easier to empathize with others. It also functions as a great way of keeping a check on yourself, because if you're modest, chances are you'll be more able to understand when someone calls attention to mistakes you've made. I think having a personal filter and being able to self-censor and choosing to do so at times where your meanest, cruelest, rudest, or most judgmental instincts surface is a good thing. For the most part, there's a calmer, less rude way of obtaining the result you're hoping to maintain and for the most part, the person you're being rude to is probably not at their best either and if you give them the chance to calm down and articulate themselves a little better, they will.

I think you can be passionately convinced of something, and deliver pointed (and even personal!) criticism about something or someone, but in general conversations should start with empathy, the presumption of good faith, and trying to understand how someone's assumptions lead to their conclusions (even if you disagree with them).

I don't think very many people come off very well in all this.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, this.
 
U

UrbanRats

Member
Spirit of Jazz said:
I dare say he got fired for potentially commenting on an embargoed subject. If you work at MS and have accesses to information they don't want to be released at that time you shouldn't publish information on the internet that could be interpreted as details about that information.
Click to expand...

That i could understand.
But isn't the latest rumor about how the Durango doesn't require always on internet? So he was effectively expressing an unrelated opinion.
 
K

KiNeSiS

Banned
That hipster turd is Microsofts Jesus & they dare fire him. He was the douchebag sacrifical lamb who caused a shitstorm so big that Microsoft decided to rethink its NextGen policy perhaps we should thank him.
 
U

UrbanRats

Member
X

XenoRaven

Member
Sometimes I get fired. I will not get a job.

Honestly, I didn't want him to lose his job. An apology for being stupid would have been nice I guess. Hope he lands on his feet.
 
B

BurnOutBrighter

Banned
Duffyside said:
He didn't deserve to lose his job for what happened. He didn't even deserve a suspension.

I hate how powerful people feel because they can scream on the internet, and I hate how powerful companies make them by giving in. Had MS waited a month barely anyone would even remember his name.
Click to expand...

Nope.

No doubt he signed a contract with a code of conduct stating that his actions both in real life and online in social media are not to bring the company into disrepute.

He broke that when he insulted Microsoft's customers and people who live in "non-cities", causing a wave of outcry among gaming sites and damaging Microsoft's image. When people are literally saying "Fuck MS, I'm buying a PS4" directly because of his comments, that sure as hell counts as a breach of contract.
 
F

FStop7

Banned
If you work for a company that has invested hundreds of millions of dollars developing a new product, a company that makes you sign contracts telling you that you can be fired for disclosing any information (true or false) or otherwise commenting on an unreleased product without all kinds of approval... don't. talk. about it. Especially. not. on. Twitter.
 
S

SiskoKid

Member
Stumpokapow said:
I think people should be nicer to each other. I think the root of the problem with the Orth tweets is that they weren't very nice, they were flippant and condescending ("deal with it", "why would anyone live there?"). I don't think he started from the assumption that people were legitimately upset, had real concerns. I think he mostly jumped to conclusions about others without giving them a fair shake.

I think Arthur's attitude on twitter is generally pretty poor and rude to others, and I think his ongoing campaign to complain about GAF rather than engage in constructive discussion is pretty rude--he has an account and can easily defend himself here or make an affirmative case for his words instead of sniping. I think most of the times where he's faced criticism here, even rude criticism or sometimes insults, it's been as a result of statements he's made that have been rude or judgmental or flippant.

I think the schadenfreude here and on many forums towards people in the industry is a mean at times. I think gravedancing in general is pretty crass, even if in some cases it is understandable. It'd be a better world if more people were happy and nicer to each other, and that has to start by being nice to people who aren't very nice. I think if someone is a negative influence in your life or you think they're a big jerk and a blowhard, you'll be happy if you learn to ignore them or go beyond them, you'll be happier. Worse than people who are bad influences and who generate unhappiness are people who relish getting angry at them rather than learning to let go and move on.

I think empathy and modesty go hand-in-hand, and starting from a modest perspective makes it easier to empathize with others. It also functions as a great way of keeping a check on yourself, because if you're modest, chances are you'll be more able to understand when someone calls attention to mistakes you've made. I think having a personal filter and being able to self-censor and choosing to do so at times where your meanest, cruelest, rudest, or most judgmental instincts surface is a good thing. For the most part, there's a calmer, less rude way of obtaining the result you're hoping to maintain and for the most part, the person you're being rude to is probably not at their best either and if you give them the chance to calm down and articulate themselves a little better, they will.

I think you can be passionately convinced of something, and deliver pointed (and even personal!) criticism about something or someone, but in general conversations should start with empathy, the presumption of good faith, and trying to understand how someone's assumptions lead to their conclusions (even if you disagree with them). And if someone squanders that presumption of good faith, and defies even extraordinary attempts to empathize with them, and makes themselves visible in a way that you could never, ever ignore them, then whatever anger you feel at them will be justified in the end because you know you've done your best to give them a chance to explain themselves.

I don't think very many people come off very well in all this.
Click to expand...

Love this response.
 
O

Oddduck

Member
ShockingAlberto said:
Other victims of the internet under Arthur Gies definition:

Judge Richard Cebull, a disgraced judge that was forced to resign after sending e-mails joking that Barack Obama's father was a dog.

e2AC11J.png


The Steubenville Rapists, who recorded their crime on video which leaked on to the internet (at least Gies isn't alone on thinking this is someone else's fault?)

e2AC11J.png


Anthon Weiner, former Representative who tweeted his penis to a young lady, which he absolutely would not have done if not for twitter existing and women on twitter being hot. Shame on you, internet.

e2AC11J.png
Click to expand...

I can't quote this enough. Very well said.
 
E

ElFly

Member
blitzcloud said:
I think there's a fair stretch of overreaction.

Why on earth would I live there as an answer to "you go live in"

"is not the same as saying: You lowly barbarians from non-city-centric states can't expect to have the oportunity of myself, the great sweet billy, living in your antiquated towns. I believe you should all cease to try to catch up with technology and accept that you're simply not worthy"

Which is what some people seem to understand from his message.
Click to expand...

People may be overreacting but that's what you get when you are trolling. If you don't want the overreaction, don't troll.

What you are forgetting is that MS is deliberately keeping absolute radio silence about their next console. It's absolutely impossible that Orth didn't get the message that talking about Durango is verbotten.

So he committed two sins here actually: breaking radio silence and making dumb comments about customers publicly.
 
M

Mlatador

Banned
What did we learn from all of this?

Don't use Twitter! It's dangerous to express your opinion through it, mostly because everyone is listening...
 
M

Momentary

Banned
I don't see what was wrong with him getting fired. People who work for a business where they have rules in place to stay tight lipped about projects they are working on know that leaking information out to the public is grounds for automatic termination. He divulged information about a project Microsoft was working on to the general public and now people are surprised that he got fired and they're blaming a forum over it?

Are there people really that naive that work in the gaming industry that they don't know that stuff like that can cost people their job?

In my line of business, if I willingly give information over to the other "competitor", I get executed. Sucks that he lost his job, but I don't feel sorry for him due to him knowing better about confirming a feature on a product that was not yet known to the public.
 
R

R_thanatos

Member
Just saw the news ...

This just prove you can't say anything on the internet if you have responsabilities (or under them )

On a personnal note i'm happy by the result :

iNu8ez6uw1UzX.gif
 
S

Spirit of Jazz

Banned
UrbanRats said:
That i could understand.
But isn't the latest rumor about how the Durango doesn't require always on internet? So he was effectively expressing an unrelated opinion.
Click to expand...

If that's the case then it led to the public assuming the worst about a situation and resulted in negative press over nothing. It was an opinion that a man in his position shouldn't have expressed.
 
N

Nibiru

Banned
He seems to be quite the elitist and has the right obnoxious viewpoints to land him another job in a big corporation. They love people like him.

This happens in business all the time these guys get loud and cocky and are canned for pr reasons and then 6 months later they get even better jobs because they are just the type of slimy team player they are looking for. Someone with the "right" belief system.
 
D

DaBuddaDa

Member
Starphoenix said:
Am I the only one that believes he was more in trouble for talking about Nextbox and less for his comments themselves?
Click to expand...

I think it's the opposite. Microsoft is more concerned with their customer relationship being tarnished by rude comments. Orth never directly said anything about Xbox, even if it was perhaps loosely implied.
 
CassidyIzABeast

CassidyIzABeast

Member
Zefah said:
If that were all it was, he wouldn't have been fired.
Click to expand...

He got fired because the story reached enough news outlets that it mattered. He became an embarrassment to the company and not just himself. If it just stayed within the GAF > Kotaku > GAF cycle, he probably wouldn't have been fired. But once the "Microsoft's creative director says deal with it" articles started popping up everywhere for the non-core gamer to see. He had to be fired.
 
P

Paches

Member
Stumpokapow said:
I think people should be nicer to each other. I think the root of the problem with the Orth tweets is that they weren't very nice, they were flippant and condescending ("deal with it", "why would anyone live there?"). I don't think he started from the assumption that people were legitimately upset, had real concerns. I think he mostly jumped to conclusions about others without giving them a fair shake.

I think Arthur's attitude on twitter is generally pretty poor and rude to others, and I think his ongoing campaign to complain about GAF rather than engage in constructive discussion is pretty rude--he has an account and can easily defend himself here or make an affirmative case for his words instead of sniping. I think most of the times where he's faced criticism here, even rude criticism or sometimes insults, it's been as a result of statements he's made that have been rude or judgmental or flippant.

I think the schadenfreude here and on many forums towards people in the industry is a mean at times. I think gravedancing in general is pretty crass, even if in some cases it is understandable. It'd be a better world if more people were happy and nicer to each other, and that has to start by being nice to people who aren't very nice. I think if someone is a negative influence in your life or you think they're a big jerk and a blowhard, you'll be happy if you learn to ignore them or go beyond them, you'll be happier. Worse than people who are bad influences and who generate unhappiness are people who relish getting angry at them rather than learning to let go and move on.

I think empathy and modesty go hand-in-hand, and starting from a modest perspective makes it easier to empathize with others. It also functions as a great way of keeping a check on yourself, because if you're modest, chances are you'll be more able to understand when someone calls attention to mistakes you've made. I think having a personal filter and being able to self-censor and choosing to do so at times where your meanest, cruelest, rudest, or most judgmental instincts surface is a good thing. For the most part, there's a calmer, less rude way of obtaining the result you're hoping to maintain and for the most part, the person you're being rude to is probably not at their best either and if you give them the chance to calm down and articulate themselves a little better, they will.

I think you can be passionately convinced of something, and deliver pointed (and even personal!) criticism about something or someone, but in general conversations should start with empathy, the presumption of good faith, and trying to understand how someone's assumptions lead to their conclusions (even if you disagree with them). And if someone squanders that presumption of good faith, and defies even extraordinary attempts to empathize with them, and makes themselves visible in a way that you could never, ever ignore them, then whatever anger you feel at them will be justified in the end because you know you've done your best to give them a chance to explain themselves.

I don't think very many people come off very well in all this.
Click to expand...

People who argue in favor (or in defense of?) Always-On systems seem to always argue from this point that concerns people bring up against it aren't real issues. Mainly, internet coverage as a whole, especially the US. Luckily, I live in a spot with high speed internet, but Comcast still shits the bed once a week or so, and sometimes for an extended period of time where I have to call them and get them to do some magic on their end to get my modem fixed up.

Also, you seem to do a lot of thinking!
 
F

famousmortimer

Banned
SiskoKid said:
Are you arguing that tendencies don't consistently bubble up on GAF? I think it's pretty disingenuous to say people who point to GAF as a whole don't have a leg to stand on because GAF isn't a singular entity with a singular opinion.

I love reading GAF for the up to the minute news in the industry. But it's depressing reading many threads because more often than not it's highly negative and cynical. And to turn around and say someone can't point to GAF as a whole and should instead single out dozens, if not hundreds, of individuals instead is pretty unrealistic.

A community is an entity unto itself and like Orth the people here represent GAF as a whole. If negative tendencies are the norm then that's what they're talking about when they discuss GAF as a whole.

That's just my two cents.
Click to expand...

Of course tendencies pop up. That's what happened here. Adam Orth said some truly stupid stuff and the vast majority of people who posted about it on GAF said that it was stupid.

But there have also been people who post here and get 3 negative replies and freak out that "GAF are a bunch of assholes" as if those 3 people are the mouthpiece for this whole organization.

And then there are others who generally speaking have a good rapport with folks on GAF but then starts saying stupid stuff and get called on it by other individuals here. And then they keep saying stupid stuff and keep getting called on it and the entire time have absolutely no abilities of self awareness to figure out why any of it is happening. And they, of course, also blame "GAF."


I come here for the news first and the humor second and the everything else in a distant third. I agree that many threads have been negative and cynical. I bought a 3DS, Vita and Wii U at launch - believe me, I know what it feels like to have an entire forum telling you that the thing you like is a piece of shit. But the thing is... that's not GAF. That's certain people on GAF. If you keep digging you will find the coolest bunch of guys in the Vita thread. Same with the WII U and 3DS threads (or nintendo download threads) that have been popping up lately. Every opinion on every single thing exists here. Hell, the majority of the world is operating currently under the assumption that Defiance is a piece shit. At the same time we have a small group in the OT that are enjoying the game and having great conversations about it.


So saying "GAF hates the vita" because there are many anti-vita threads is silly. Because I know plenty of gaffers that don't and they post about it on *GAF*. This is why generalizations are a waste of time in arguments like this.
 
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