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[Zen]

"We understand that these four titles are a small selection of the launch titles for the next-generation Xbox."

You see that quote?

Also, you appear to have missed the part of the rumor "leak" that says the system reveal was delayed due to "specification updates" since the last leak.

We'll obviously because I quoted it to you after reading it. I didn't miss that part and most of those titles will be third party games also on PS4. As for specification changes, it's entirely possible that they were actually changing 'must be online to play games' since we got a huge amount of 'unless this has been changed in the 11th hour' qualifiers from recent leaks confirming online required to play games. They certainly don't have time for huge hardware revisions unless they want to launch much later and we've heard nothing to that affect.

So my point stands?

 

[ElNino]

Well fair enough, but a lot of people on this board would disagree with your conclusion and would probably rank Microsoft first party last out of the big three.

I'm well aware there are people who rank all three of them first for different reasons, which is my point. If someone already considers Sony's games to be preferable to Microsoft's (based on this gen), then chances are they were going to get a PS4 anyways regardless of what the next Xbox is.

For me, I generally prefer the 360 over the PS3 and I will likely add the next Xbox this year and then wait and see on the PS4.

 

[onQ123]

Believe in the great MikeR he is the Link!

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1713042&postcount=832

Random blurp...

I wouldn't count on any major hardware alterations "if" the Xbox next system is Jaguar centric. There's only so much custom-customization one can do within a 25 watt vanilla-envelope, without exceeding TDP and cost. Adding random chips on improving certain compute functions isn't an option either... defeats the purpose of competitive pricing and quicker turnaround times on smaller future designs.

If there was a "secret sauce" (hate that phrase), I wouldn't bet it around the current leaked specs/designs. I Bet MS has B/C in the cards though - don't you think? "IF" B/C is available at the hardware level, then I can see their hardware not being Jaguar centric. AMD GPU yes, the rest not so much. My two cents...

 

[shandy706]

No and no, by the way. I didn't miss that part and most of those titles will be third party games also on PS4. As for specification changes, it's entirely possible that they were actually changing 'must be online to play games' since we got a huge amount of 'unless this has been changed in the 11th hour' qualifiers from recent leaks confirming online required to play games. They certainly don't have time for huge hardware revisions unless they want to launch much later.

So my point stands?

We don't actually know for sure in either situation. I don't think anyone's point means a lot till the reveal.

I'm just not in that category though. I bought a Vita just for The Show, lol. I tend to buy any console, and drop it/sell it if I get tired/annoyed by it.

 

[lovegames718]

This add on is basically the other xbox everyone was mentioning that might be 99? I seriously dont see this add on as tackling bc as its still another piece of hardware you have to buy to be able to play games. The fact tht it is stackable does nothing for me and as it stands the new Xbox is and will not be bc. For that you just keep your xbod 360 and tuck it under or beside your new console.

 

[Zen]

This add on is basically the other xbox everyone was mentioning that might be 99? I seriously dont see this add on as tackling bc as its still another piece of hardware you have to buy to be able to play games. The fact tht it is stackable does nothing for me and as it stands the new Xbox is and will not be bc. For that you just keep your xbod 360 and tuck it under or beside your new console.

Well to be fair you could trade in your old 360 and get the addon for much cheaper than the MSRP. It might even enable some minor improvements by using some very surface level elements of hooking into the Durangos hardware. Depending on the price? It could be a nice idea.

 

[ragincajun77]

stackable?

OMG that brings back memories. I had that exact setup. 32x was such a miserable disappointment and one which I am still bitter about. Oops, didn't mean to derail the thread...

I truly hope this news is true as an always online requirement would be the Achilles’ heel of the Xbox brand.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

Being able to play offline is fantastic news.

Personally, I don't really care about BC very much, but I can see myself picking up the functionality if there's a good black friday sale.


Back on the hype train!

 

[Minions]

Spec bump please.

8GB GDDR5... so the consoles can be identicle in every way except the OS and Kinect vs PSEye.... Microsoft should stick with its current plan. If the prices are the same and the specs are the same, it is going to be a very borring generation.

 

[Reiko]

8GB GDDR5... so the consoles can be identicle in every way except the OS and Kinect vs PSEye.... Microsoft should stick with its current plan. If the prices are the same and the specs are the same, it is going to be a very borring generation.

I'm talking GPU TFLOP bump...

 

[Beer Monkey]

For that you just keep your xbod 360 and tuck it under or beside your new console.

Nah, just the controller clutter alone and not having to boot up multiple systems, change inputs, etc. to play multiple games makes it well worth it. Lots of us are going to trade our 360s for a Mini on day one.

I'm really impressed if this rumor/leak is true. They have come up with a way to make an add-on BC module economically viable. I doubt sales would be high enough to get retailers to stock it for more than a few months if it were only targeted to Durango buyers, but since the Mini is also a stand-alone settop box, they've got synergy and economies of scale keeping it viable. Brilliant!

 

[Poona]

This add on is basically the other xbox everyone was mentioning that might be 99? I seriously dont see this add on as tackling bc as its still another piece of hardware you have to buy to be able to play games. The fact tht it is stackable does nothing for me and as it stands the new Xbox is and will not be bc. For that you just keep your xbod 360 and tuck it under or beside your new console.

It's preferable to not having two clunky machines plugged in and having to power off one to use the other, and taking over more ports than they need.

The mega drive/genesis had an add-on of sorts that allowed for play of master system games. That was easier to use as you didnt need to have to power off one system to use another, and you didnt have them taking up more inputs than was needed. Same this time basically.

I've had a 360 since launch but I love what ms is offering. It's an add-on essentially for those who want to play 360 titles on the new Xbox. If you not interested in that you don't need to get it, but it makes things easier for me who will still want to play 360 titles and not have to worry about two different systems so much.

 

[Zen]

I'm talking GPU TFLOP bump...

I'd be surprised if they can manage it given the space/heat the 32 megs takes up.

 

[Roki6]

How are you supposed to use your existing boxed games with this? And does it have its own controller interfaces (the blurb does not make that clear)?

I know you just look for negative spin but i'll bite.

If you alraedy have boxed games it means you already own xbox (fat or slim), so if you upgrade it will be to Durango. What would be the point of upgrading from fat/slim xbox to mini? It would be a downgrade
So when you upgrade to Durango then you can buy mini (and sell fat/slim) and play boxed games (voa Durangomdisc drive)

How many people would mind playing their 360 games on an actual 360? And how is a stand-alone, cheaper 360 slim driving up the price for Durango owners? Outside of remote play for the audience that for some reason would prefer the add-on approach, the add-on is exactly identical to a 360 slim sitting next to the Durango, for everybody else who just want 360 BC.

Surely there will be a niche for this. Calling it a solution to the BC problem is a serious stretch of the imagination, though. It is literally another 360 slim that connects to Durnago, vis-a-vis a 360 slim which does not.

With separate x360 and Durango you would have:
- separate controlers
- use 2 hdmi ports
- 2 kinects if u use them
- takes more space
- switch inputs , maybe transfer profile, etc.

With Durango+mini addon:
- one controler
- one kinect
- unified interface. I guess you will not see any part of xbox interface, it will all be durango.

Basically you will interface only with Durango. Both virtually (GUI) and phyically (inserting discs, powering on, controller)

If the sell value of used xbox fat/slim will be the same or greater than the price of Mini then it is no brainer

 

[lovegames718]

It's preferable to not having two clunky machines plugged in and having to power off one to use the other, and taking over more ports than they need.

The mega drive/genesis had an add-on of sorts that allowed for play of master system games. That was easier to use as you didnt need to have to power off one system to use another, and you didnt have them taking up more inputs than was needed. Same this time basically.

I've had a 360 since launch but I love what ms is offering. It's an add-on essentially for those who want to play 360 titles on the new Xbox. If you not interested in that you don't need to get it, but it makes things easier for me who will still want to play 360 titles and not have to worry about two different systems so much.

Yes i understand that but its still an added cost. It may be more convenient for ppl (true indeed) but my point is its really not tackling bc per se. They are making you buy an add on which is like a mini system to play old games so in reality 720 isnt giving you bc. Yes they are offering a replacement of the origianl 360 to play old games but at a cost.

 

[Beer Monkey]

If the sell value of used xbox fat/slim will be the same or greater than the price of Mini then it is no brainer

On Craigslist you'll probably get more for your 360 and controllers than the Mini even costs.

On trade-in, you'll be bringing some cash for sure, but there may be launch trade-in promotions that will make it really cheap.

Yes i understand that but its still an added cost. It may be more convenient for ppl (true indeed) but my point is its really not tackling bc per se. They are making you buy an add on which is like a mini system to play old games so in reality 720 isnt giving you bc. Yes they are offering a replacement of the origianl 360 to play old games but at a cost.

Nah, it gives the effect of BC. Once you integrate the Mini with your Durango you'll never even have to touch the Mini. You'll forget it's even there.

 

[lovegames718]

It's preferable to not having two clunky machines plugged in and having to power off one to use the other, and taking over more ports than they need.

The mega drive/genesis had an add-on of sorts that allowed for play of master system games. That was easier to use as you didnt need to have to power off one system to use another, and you didnt have them taking up more inputs than was needed. Same this time basically.

I've had a 360 since launch but I love what ms is offering. It's an add-on essentially for those who want to play 360 titles on the new Xbox. If you not interested in that you don't need to get it, but it makes things easier for me who will still want to play 360 titles and not have to worry about two different systems so much.

On the flip side of that if it is cheaper than an xbox 360 slim and you arent an xbox 360 owner i can definitely see the benefit in this option.

 

[Ingeniero]

I can't wait for the official reveal, it's gonna be glorious.
MS has very smart people working on the Nextbox, I'm sure they have big guns ready

 

[Vormund]

Well it comes at a cost but then again putting a 360 SoC in every Durango comes at a cost.

If this turns out to be true I think MS have done a brilliant way of handling the situation given the architecture change. I also wonder if this is a toe in the water for a digital download only console.....

 

[Poona]

Yes i understand that but its still an added cost. It may be more convenient for ppl (true indeed) but my point is its really not tackling bc per se. They are making you buy an add on which is like a mini system to play old games so in reality 720 isnt giving you bc. Yes they are offering a replacement of the origianl 360 to play old games but at a cost.

Well if it was built into the next Xbox instead it would be more expensive. I wouldn't mind paying for it, but there'd probably be some who would be like 'I buy new systems to play new games - if I want to play old games I play it on old systems, so I don't need the added cost.'

So those that don't want the added cost can just get the next Xbox, those who want the ability to still play their 360 games on the new Xbox can pick up this add on.

 

[Beer Monkey]

I also wonder if this is a toe in the water for a digital download only console.....

DING DING DING.

This theoretical Mini initiative has many facets. They are killing lots of birds with one stone. They are trying out an "online only", "digital delivery only" system but they aren't shoving it down your fucking throat. If you don't want that you can just buy a 360 Slim. They aren't forcing DD-only on anyone, but they are giving them the option.

 

[Kill Your Masters]

8GB GDDR5... so the consoles can be identicle in every way except the OS and Kinect vs PSEye.... Microsoft should stick with its current plan. If the prices are the same and the specs are the same, it is going to be a very borring generation.

If we have two very similar consoles it will be all about services and games as selling points, so I'm all for parity on this one.

 

[Anton668]

holy shit? I was right?!?!

I was just kidding!

 

[paskowitz]

I really do not see how this is BC. If the BC add on is the same/similar price as a used 360 then that is no different than buying a PS2 and a PS3 now.

After 3 generations of consoles, I still do not understand why people do not keep their old consoles. Why would you get rid of your PS2 or PS3 or Xbox or 360? Trade it into Gamestop? Lol, that is a great deal... Private party for a little more, just so you can buy two launch titles? Really? Just keep it.

 

[EagleBurnn]

I also wonder if this is a toe in the water for a digital download only console.....

It's only a matter of time before buying entertainment physically dies down. In 20 years, everything will be digital. Might as well get in the race early.

 

[Beer Monkey]

I really do not see how this is BC. If the BC add on is the same/similar price as a used 360 then that is no different than buying a PS2 and a PS3 now.

After 3 generations of consoles, I still do not understand why people do not keep their old consoles. Why would you get rid of your PS2 or PS3 or Xbox or 360? Trade it into Gamestop? Lol, that is a great deal... Private party for a little more, just so you can buy two launch titles? Really? Just keep it.

I like getting laid, so I'm not going to have like 20 consoles and 100 controllers lying around my living room.

 

[Hilbert]

I really do not see how this is BC. If the BC add on is the same/similar price as a used 360 then that is no different than buying a PS2 and a PS3 now.

After 3 generations of consoles, I still do not understand why people do not keep their old consoles. Why would you get rid of your PS2 or PS3 or Xbox or 360? Trade it into Gamestop? Lol, that is a great deal... Private party for a little more, just so you can buy two launch titles? Really? Just keep it.

Perhaps you will change your mind after 6 generation of consoles? I cannot physically keep everything around from NES onward. Something has to give.

 

[dAnthraxxx]

Well it comes at a cost but then again putting a 360 SoC in every Durango comes at a cost.

If this turns out to be true I think MS have done a brilliant way of handling the situation given the architecture change. I also wonder if this is a toe in the water for a digital download only console.....

How great would it be if the main Durango unit doubled as a Steambox?

edit: .... supposedly running a version of Windows 8, so why not Steam?

 

[Miles Quaritch]

It's ridiculous for some to believe Edge can do no wrong. Even after the GI tweet on them apparently using scans without GI's permission.

The same goes as well for VGleaks.

Every website is subject to failure.

Oh absolutely. It's funny looking back how much people were invested in those EDGE rumours being absolutely accurate and there being little room for them being wrong.

I ever argued that that EDGE either misunderstood or were given out of context only to be greeted with a barrage of posts claiming that they were right about PS4, etc, etc, etc. Even pointing out that MS used the same terms before the 360 launched was met with dismissal or claims of 'it's different this time'.

As I said, it's funny looking back.

 

[EvB]

DING DING DING.

This theoretical Mini initiative has many facets. They are killing lots of birds with one stone. They are trying out an "online only", "digital delivery only" system but they aren't shoving it down your fucking throat. If you don't want that you can just buy a 360 Slim. They aren't forcing DD-only on anyone, but they are giving them the option.

They've got over 500 retail games available Digitally and about 500 Arcade titles also, that's quite a lot of content.

 

[MoeB]

michael pachter was right. microsoft will win the next gen.

 

[Rebel Leader]

How timely this 'rumor' came in...

Anyway glad that we got this out of the way IF this rumor is true compared to the previous ones.

always online: 20+
offline: 2


those are not good odds

 

[MAX PAYMENT]

First to have BC is the first to receive my money.

 

[paskowitz]

I like getting laid, so I'm not going to have like 20 consoles and 100 controllers lying around my living room.

Perhaps you will change your mind after 6 generation of consoles? I cannot physically keep everything around from NES onward. Something has to give.

First, I didn't realize BC was about saving space. Wow, I never thought of it that way...

Second, lets hyperbolothesize (hyperbole+hypothesize) about the future, that should lead to sound reasoning.

Sounds like neither of you have ever been to Crate & Barrel or The Container Store or live in very small homes.

I guess my anger is more directed towards those who sell their old consoles and then complain when new ones do not have BC. The (lack of) logic behind that is just mind numbing.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

always online: 20+
offline: 2


those are not good odds

Were there 20+ rumours or simply one or two that were repeated ad-nauseum?

 

[Vexxan]

As much as I like the idea of stacking consoles, buying this 360 mini to get BC seems like a really odd idea and it sounds like a weird workaround...and I bet it wouldn't be that cheap either.

 

[Rebel Leader]

Were there 20+ rumours or simply one or two that were repeated ad-nauseum?

repeated and then "confirmed" by sources

Well, they both are now.

 

[GazzaScotland]

BC is just a great thing to have one way or another in winning new consumers to who didn't have the previous system. "Hey look, you can buy this and have access to hundreds of (cheaper) games right off the bat".

 

[Miles Quaritch]

repeated and then "confirmed" by sources

Well, they both are now.

I've been following this pretty closely, I hadn't realised they were "confirmed" by sources. Who confirmed those early rumours?

 

[Heysoos]

I've been following this pretty closely, I hadn't realised they were "confirmed" by sources. Who confirmed those early rumours?

"Confirmed" by the sources who spread this rumor. Unless I remember it wrong.

 

[Hilbert]

BC is just a great thing to have one way or another in winning new consumers to who didn't have the previous system. "Hey look, you can buy this and have access to hundreds of (cheaper) games right off the bat".

Some people like to play games from the past too. I go back to prev generation games a lot. I still need and want to play persona 4.


I have hooked up to my TV: Wii, 360 PS3, Dreamcast, Media PC. But I have instant access to my library of:
NES, SNES, Genesis, Saturn, Dreamcast, Xbox(as supported by 360 BC, all mine work fortunetly), PS1, PS2, PS3, Gamecube, PC games. And I return to these often. I love BC and emulators.

 

[pr0cs]

First to have BC is the first to receive my money.

QFT

 

[ultim8p00]

always online: 2, repeated ad nauseum
offline: 2


those are not good odds

That's actually what it was. Fixed for you.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

"Confirmed" by the sources who spread this rumor. Unless I remember it wrong.

Okay, that makes sense.

 

[tw1164]

I'm a little confused by the add on box. Is it connected to your LAN or is it a usb3/thunderbolt like device. If it's all LAN based wouldn't that add a lot of latency?

 

[Brashnir]

First, I didn't realize BC was about saving space. Wow, I never thought of it that way...

Second, lets hyperbolothesize (hyperbole+hypothesize) about the future, that should lead to sound reasoning.

Sounds like neither of you have ever been to Crate & Barrel or The Container Store or live in very small homes.

I guess my anger is more directed towards those who sell their old consoles and then complain when new ones do not have BC. The (lack of) logic behind that is just mind numbing.

It's not only physical space, but it's also about inputs to connect devices. In my current setup, I'm using all the HDMI ports on my receiver and my TV. If I want to add another console to the mix, I need to disconnect something. The most convenient thing to disconnect would be the console it's replacing. BC would allow me to continue playing my current library without having to juggle cables all the time.

Otherwise, my options are to buy a new receiver with more inputs (hundreds of dollars), or a new TV with more inputs (thousands of dollars) or some sort of input switch, which is yet another box and set of cables to deal with.

I'd happily pay $100 for a BC Dongle for PS4 or 720.

I'm a little confused by the add on box. Is it connected to your LAN or is it a usb3/thunderbolt like device. If it's all LAN based wouldn't that add a lot of latency?

If the thing exists, I imagine it either connects via USB or it connects through some special port on the console.

 

[shandy706]

I like getting laid, so I'm not going to have like 20 consoles and 100 controllers lying around my living room.

Ha!

You have other problems if that stops you. I met my wife and her friends when they were in a sorority at Clemson. Guess what I and those girls socialized over in 2005/2006....

Beer, pizza, pool, and Halo sessions. I literally fell in love with my future wife playing her copy of Halo on her Xbox.

 

[bj00rn_]

$150 to play your old games? Okay.

How many posts like this have we had in this thread..It's not that hard to read through the thread and find the consensus:

0$ to play your old games: Keep your Xbox 360..

The mini is (from this particular rumor) probably not just a 360 without the drive, but an full-fledged stand-alone "AppleTV-box+" and more than likely comes with better software and interface, and possibly faster hardware to fit.

Again: Only rumours..

 

[jaypah]

Ha!

You have other problems if that stops you. I met my wife and her friends when they were in a sorority at Clemson. Guess what I and those girls socialized over in 2005/2006....

Beer, pizza, pool, and Halo sessions. I literally fell in love with my future wife playing her copy of Halo on her Xbox.

yeah, my wife saw my profile picture of me holding up a sign that said "will rap for video games" and decided to send me a friend request. That was in 2005. We got married last month and have every current gen console (and WiiU) plus a PC under the TV and we play together all the time.

 

[Beer Monkey]

Ha!

You have other problems if that stops you. I met my wife and her friends when they were in a sorority at Clemson. Guess what I and those girls socialized over in 2005/2006....

Beer, pizza, pool, and Halo sessions. I literally fell in love with my future wife playing her copy of Halo on her Xbox.

I'm a divorced professional. My apartment literally looks like it is out of architectural digest. Exposed brick walls, real hardwood floors, granite counter tops, the works. Sorry but piles of consoles and controllers in my living room just doesn't really fit with my desired aesthetic. And yeah, the first time girls see my apartment, they usually say 'wow' aloud. And no, not really looking for a wife.

What's wrong with trying to keep the clutter down? And booting up and logging up a new system with a new controller every time I switch between playing a 360 game and a Durango game, that's just inefficient and tedious.

I guess if I lived in my mom's basement like some gamer dudes I definitely wouldn't give a shit.