Starscream is basically Cobra Commander if Serpentor was there from the beginning.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bq1_6D9QS9Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bq1_6D9QS9Y
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Starscream got away with so much
- Thread starter Daingurse
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Because Beast Wars it's a sequel G1. The characters are descendants from the Autobot and Decepticons who time-traveled to earth during the period the G1 Transformers were in stasis on earth. So not only the show had heavy references to G1, the interaction with the past "relics" of the Autobot-Decepticon war were heavy plot points.
BW Megs was basically following the will of G1 Megs, who left instructions of a time-travelling based plan to either kill the Autobots during the stasis period or killing the proto humans, who would play a role in ending the war with the Autobots victory. At first he tried to avoid messing with the time stream, but when he began running out of options, he went back to the original plan.
This couldn't possibly be more wrong.
lol forgot how funny that was.
"It was an accident!"
Beast Wars Optimus and Megatron almost were the original G1 characters, they actually flip flopped on that call a few times before the show came out. When it did begin to air they weren't sure what to do so they basically ignored saying what was the case, by the time the second season came around they had a good idea what to do and so began to craft things out in advance and really flush out the characters in depth with the BW Optimus and Megatron merely bearing the names of each sides originals.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
This?
But they were supposed to be. When Beast Wars started the show was an unofficial reboot, with Primal and Megs being reinterpretations of their G1 counterparts. It was only from season 2 that the showrunners decided to make them homages. None of the G1 references start up until season 2.
Watch Transformers Prime.
Seriously, for all those people crowing about G1, watch it.
That makes sense I guess. I remember BW fondly, but I can't remember the plot for the life of me. The parts I remember were the annoying rat, Tarantulus being a boss,
Dinobot's sacrifice
I'll still consider BW as a seperate entity in an alternate universe, since the toy lines didn't interest me at all. Mechanical or bust.
While the rest of this is true, Starscream's episode is in season 1 (episode 21, Possession). He also makes a cameo in Cheetor's dream in episode 3, The Web.
I think up until Possession it was basically just left open as to whether it was a continuation or a reboot, but they must have decided it at some point during season 1.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
Haven't seen Beast Machines in years so I can't remember why it went so bad off the rails. All I remember was Primal was trying to make Cybertron organic or some bullshit like that. Also that they morphed rather than transformed.
My memory is failing me. Could have sworn that ep was in season 2. Thanks for the reminder.
My memory is failing me. Could have sworn that ep was in season 2. Thanks for the reminder.
Fucking this.
Transformers Prime is the first genuinely great Transformers show in a good long while. And G1 has aged horribly. Even as a nostalgia piece, it's laughable.
It's actually a very good show on its own. People just hate it because it messes up some of the Beast Wars characters personalities and the concept of Primus wanting the Transformers to be technorganic is completely unlike anything else in the franchise.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
The technorganic thing really bothered me - I remember being philosophically opposed to the whole idea. Correct me if i'm wrong, wasn't Primal the only Maximal pushing hard to do it?.
I also remember liking Megatron way more than Primal in that. I always liked him in Beast Wars, but in Beast Machines his character totally eclipsed Primal's. They made Primal seem like a nutcase on a crusade nobody but him gave a shit about.
My problem with Beast Machines is that early on, they found a fruit bearing tree. Eating the fruit made them become animalistic, and it was generally depicted as being a bad thing. The tree was destroyed at the end of the episode, and it left some sort of smoke cloud or grease stain in the shape of a skull, driving home that yes, the tree was bad.
Optimus spent the rest of the series trying to cultivate an orchard grown from seeds from the fruit of this tree.
Just... What?
Optimus spent the rest of the series trying to cultivate an orchard grown from seeds from the fruit of this tree.
Just... What?
DeaconKnowledge
Member
First time I ever yelled "Nooooo!" for anything.
Also, I also found it funny that despite being massively urgent Primal doesn't help Rhinox with the door.
That speech of his was epic.
Definitely one of the best things and the whole scene was a massive holy shit with all the Autobots and Transformers laying around in the ark waiting to be activated which would lead to the original cartoon. And then.....he comes before Optimus Prime...charges his weapon to maximum and blast him in the face causing reality to come undone and a new time line to begin.
One hell of a cliff hanger.
YES that was exactly it. Thanks. I dont know what I was searching but I kept on getting shitty youtube fan highlights of the newer movies.
He was cheering him on!
Deified Data
Banned
Best Starscream I'll agree with, but Prime Megatron has the charisma of an old boot.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
Rattrap is the reason Beast Wars stuck for me.
If there's one thing the Autobots are always missing, it's dissention. The Autobots in G1 were always in perfect harmony unless the script calls for it. Rattrap was the first to consistently question his own, and flat out refuse to carry out orders. He was the Maximals' Starscream. Underrated character.
darkiguana
Member
This is a bit off topic, but after finishing Transformers Prime(awesome show by the way), I have been interested in Transformers Graphic novels. What is a good place to start? The only TF comics I have read are the DW reboot from years ago. I never read any of the 80s comics or any of the more recent stuff. Thanks.
That was one reason I hated the BM version of him. They took everything he was and made him a coward who needed approval. Also his design was atrocious. I swear he was suppose to be a kid like character which really did not work with that voice.
PS....he's showing up in the comic version of Robots in Disguise so you might want to take a look. Waspinator has already appeared in one comic. They even had a certain sharkbot from the old RID cartoon show up!
Conrad Link
Member
I literately just watched these 2 episodes yesterday (been on a huge G1 kick), when I saw a part in the real episode the first thing I thought off was the hilarious The Rude Awakening of Optimus Prime clip.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUW2SxW6MYA&t=19m32s
I remember loving the episodes so much, we use to run round at school pretending the 'plague' was real and if they grabbed your arm or whatever you got infected and went crazy. :lol
As for Starscream, well look how quickly Scourge decided to dethrone Galvatron after he got even a sniff of power (when he had the Matrix). I guess that was the idea, they're the bad guys and they don't really care about loyalty etc (other than Soundwave/Shockwave type awesome guys). As soon as they think they can beat him its like OK SAY I'M THE LEADER NOW BITCH lol.
I did get the feeling Megatron enjoyed having Starscream around so he could laugh at and shit on him, even though Starscream was ALWAYS taking shots at him. Even when Megatron did finally get sick of it and actually did something about it (Bruticus episodes) somehow Starscream would fail and yet weasel back in.
He is kind of loveable in a what a dick sorta way. I still laugh at this part so much.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dj_HF3rXlBQ&t=20m00s
"Do it yourself!" hahaha, such a dick.
Dion Blaster
Member
I love that Beast Wars is canonically part of Transformers, when I was a kid I just thought it was its own thing. Had some of the coolest character designs (and by extension, toys) ever.
Silverbolt
Transmetal Megatron
Dinobot
Rhinox
Transmetal Turantulus
Quickstrike
Waspinator
Escape Goat
Member
would it really matter? people are just going to discuss random transformer minutiae.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
All of the major shows,
Examples of the toylines (don't go nuts or the OP will be 3 pages long)
recommended reading - the comics and novels
You could also talk about the games I suppose but to be quite honest until the Transformers game for the PS2 most of them have been garbage. WFC and FOC should get a mention though, since they're part of the rebooted continuity.
Fuck yeah, Silverbolt was the shit.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
I've heard a lot of people boosting those comics. I was completely turned off of the comics after reading IDW's first run. Megatron Origin for example was a visual mess that was stupidly paced.
Other IDW comics I read had other problems. Completely superfluous humans, plots that go absolutely nowhere, Prime sacrificing himself at every possible opportunity, it was just a big mess.
Have they fixed things? I don't want to be disappointed again.
More than Meets the Eye is great. Last Stand of the Wreckers was also a great story.
Dude, new writers. Two awesome GREAT writers at that. Art styles for each that are very nice and doesn't have the Megatron art issue which was widely complained about. NO HUMANS. Take place on Cybertron and off that involving other species but no humans. It's all about the bots trying to start over after the war is over. What you say, the war is over?! YES!!! Only we all know getting over a war (let alone one millions of years) is easier said then done and there are many things that stand in the way of true peace and accepting a new status quo. One of the great new agents of change is that a lot of bots who didn't join either side or up and left return and they are not fond of either side since each wrecked the freaking world in the first place.
Check them out, it's worth it.
One of the new things about the books is that they show you how Cybertron use to be, the issues with the world that lead to the world, various customs and what some did before the outbreak of war. It really is world building in every sense of the word and bots from other TF properties can show up but they're not necessary the same attitude wise. You'll see some bots that have their own quirks, likes, dislikes and friendships.
To be honest there is a human in the wreckers book but she's likeable. Yes it's true. Impossible sounding I know. Trust me I know, I hate humans in TF stuff. Start with the wreckers and if you like that, check out the first RID TPB and go from there which sets up the new status quo in a tale that can be only called....The Death of Optimus Prime and no it's not what you think.......or the inevitable resurrection.
There are shocks. There are twist. There are turns. And there are deaths.
Shit happens and you will feel sad for some that die who you probably didn't even heard of before.
Really enjoyed this one. Transformers comics are so fucking brutal too, really puts into perspective how powerful they are.
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
Same, rattrap is what made me love Beast Wars as much as I did but I absolutely despised Beast Machines and remember nothing from it except how they butchered the hell out of rattrap. I hated everything about it because of that.
All I remember about Beast Machines is Rhinox is a Tank and I had the toy.
Boogalogist
Member
I'm an old school guy here...only watch G1 as a kid.
Looking back, I find that the Decepticon camp was much more enjoyable to watch than the Autobot camp. You have comedy in Starscream and Megatron. The show would've lost a lot of spark without Starscream's character.
Also, in G1....4 million years passed since they crashlanded on earth. And Shockwave, who was left in charge of Cybertron...is still not leader of Decepticon? Like, "Oh yeah, I can't seem to contact Megatron for 100 years. I'll just continually run Cybertron like before." This guy is the epitome of loyalty!
Oh yeah, I'm in team Soundwave. A good lackey is a lackey that has his own lackeys! Soundwave and his guys could take on Devastator! That guy is invaluable!
Looking back, I find that the Decepticon camp was much more enjoyable to watch than the Autobot camp. You have comedy in Starscream and Megatron. The show would've lost a lot of spark without Starscream's character.
Also, in G1....4 million years passed since they crashlanded on earth. And Shockwave, who was left in charge of Cybertron...is still not leader of Decepticon? Like, "Oh yeah, I can't seem to contact Megatron for 100 years. I'll just continually run Cybertron like before." This guy is the epitome of loyalty!
Oh yeah, I'm in team Soundwave. A good lackey is a lackey that has his own lackeys! Soundwave and his guys could take on Devastator! That guy is invaluable!
I still can't believe that one episode where the Decepticons got drunk on energon. That was great.
That was pretty funny. Thundercracker falling off his rock then Megatron just being completely tanked, talking about the good old days lol
Made a TF community OT. Huzzah.
Tizoc
Member
G1 Megatron in the 80s cartoon was shit; they would be near victory and Megatron would call for a retreat, and majority of his forces were freakin' useless and directionless idiots.
This is now offically canon for the G1 animated series.
D.Lo
Member
The problem with Beast Wars, TF Prime, TF Animated (urg - they're all animated), Bayformers, and everything else not based on the G1 designs is that the robot designs and art styles are just consistently terrible.
G1 was animated like crap as well, all four seasons, but the designs themselves were just fantastic. And of course there is the one shining light of the movie. All major characters were awesome designs that while based on outdated vehicles/tech still look cool today. And it's not just nostalgia, because most of the other crap from the same era hasn't held up.
Beast Wars is the worst, it's conceptually awful, and looks like garbage. The writers made a good show of it, and I can see the appeal because of this. But it's tainted from the top by looking so bad and being about stupid random animals with incredibly stupid names.
G1 was animated like crap as well, all four seasons, but the designs themselves were just fantastic. And of course there is the one shining light of the movie. All major characters were awesome designs that while based on outdated vehicles/tech still look cool today. And it's not just nostalgia, because most of the other crap from the same era hasn't held up.
Beast Wars is the worst, it's conceptually awful, and looks like garbage. The writers made a good show of it, and I can see the appeal because of this. But it's tainted from the top by looking so bad and being about stupid random animals with incredibly stupid names.
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